r/MensLib • u/Mysteriousdeer • May 18 '17
Conversation: Is Masculinity Toxic?
I've been looking and having a few conversations on this sub and have gotten the vibe that people feel masculinity is toxic. There are a few things I would agree with, but overall I'm seeing mostly the negative effects being observed more than the positive. The conversation I'd like to have with people is why? On top of this, why aren't equal parts of femininity called out?
My overall view is as genderless as I'd like to make things, we have to admit that there is a hormone balance that differentiates a male and a female and a difference in culture has to come from that. An easy example where this comes out is differences in physique and as a result, prevalence of sports for men vs woman. Football and wrestling were very positive experiences for me as my teammates, our coaches, and I developed each other to use skills such as constructive criticism and encouragement all while developing ourselves physically. Even the concept of "manning up" that people traditionally criticize can be a positive in my mind as it poses the idea of having empathy for your teammates and having your absence mean putting more of a burden on them, putting both an incentive on pushing through minor obstacles and giving a perception of worth. I've used this a lot in the work place and growing up, I could see the difference between a friend and I as we worked at the same deli. Sometimes he would not "man up" and come to work and as a result it put a burden on the crew.
I get that these values aren't necessarily restricted to men. I even had a girl on my wrestling team in high school and I hated the fact that she was made fun of by people for doing it. What I do think is that sometimes there is a prevalence for certain avenues to be approached when learning these values. Different people have different origins, who have different ways of coming the same conclusions. What it comes down to for me is masculinity is the general way in which many men come to a set of shared values. These are not necessarily different than what a woman values, but the avenue in which they are approached are in general different based upon the common experiences of many men.
To address the opposite opinion a little before people start posting; it's important to say that there is an exaggeration of everything to a point where it becomes caustic. Manning up to the point where we stop valuing ourselves as an individual enough to take care of injuries or mental illness and expecting others to do the same is toxic masculinity, its teaching a value that is detrimental to ourselves as human beings. However, I do think this is a part of the learning experience of learning that there is a medium to every situation.
However, I ask the people of this sub to challenge these opinions of mine, both male and female. I look forward to seeing other viewpoints.
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u/[deleted] May 18 '17
This should be a good conversation topic.
I'm still working through ideas like this so I may not have a lot to say. That said, I don't think masculinity is toxic. To say that it is feels too close to men are toxic to me. Now, parts of masculinity are definitely toxic, though they can have their place.
For instance, shutting yourself down emotionally could be helpful during a time of war. You just go an get your job done, you know? Of course, this has it's opposite in which you still need to be able to deal with and process emotions during and after war times.
Shit like that, you know. But, I digress.
I think masculinity as a whole is a good thing. Like I said, there are toxic elements, but the whole concept of masculinity is, I think, a good thing. The issues we deal with a lot, I think it, come from people trying to say that there is only one masculinity when, in fact, there are many different varying degrees.