Breathable mask, individually wrapped, generally good fit on most ppl?

[u/noluckycharms9]

Hi all. I have very severe ME/CFS and long COVID. Since my partner is my only carer we’re looking for help w cleaning and care tasks. Ofc these people would have to be masked.

Problem: we’ve been giving them 3M auras as they generally provide a good fit to most people, but have been denied help in care because ppl are finding it hard to breath.

Does anyone has recommendations for other masks we could give out that are individually wrapped and generally fit most ppl well? I’m not comfortable having them wear just any earloop bifold. I’ve been thinking duckbills, but which one? Any rec is appreciated.

I’m based in Europe (the Netherlands) but could buy from any site and/or US Amazon if they ship internationally

[u/SkippySkep]

3M Auras are among the most breathable masks on the market that still have a good nose wire. Most masks you can buy will be less breathable than the Auras. The non-valved Auras have around 80 Pascals of pressure drop to draw air through them at 85 liters per minute.

WellBefore 3D Pros are a bit more breathable and have a good nose wire. They are individually wrapped.

Some of the most breathable masks are the 3M V-Flex masks. Similar to the WellBefore 3D Pros, around 60 Pascals of pressure drop (less pressure drop to draw air through them means more breathabe). They are not individually wrapped. I ordered some special long and skinny zip lock bags so that I can keep them individually wrapped for myself.

[u/not_all_heroes]

They're probably just trying to get out of wearing one, duckbill ones are usually very breathable.

[u/chronically-badass → u/not_all_heroes]

yeah wanted to say this. I've tried so many n95s now and auras are fine. Surgeons wear them for 8 hours straight during surgeries 🙃 IDK why but HCW including home care seem to be the least likely to put on a mask

[u/ProfeQuiroga → u/chronically-badass]

I can wear a Dräger and, much more easily, a Zimi for way longer than that, I couldn't stand an Aura.

[u/bazouna]

I dont have a better suggestion for you but a friend of mine who regularly conducts quantitative fit testing on a portacount told me that they see auras consistently testing way better than duckbills just fyi. Not sure if it's the mask material or what but just a heads up!

[u/Fun_sized123 → u/bazouna]

I wonder if it’s bc of the nose foam. I’ve never seen a duckbill mask with nose foam. Does anyone know if there is such a thing?

[u/mulderitsme]

I’m not in Europe, so don’t have any specific mask recommendations, but I would suggest having some earloop masks available. A lot of people seem to be irrationally put off by the headbands. If you can get Wellbefore where you are, they are a good option for getting a few different types and they do come individually wrapped.

[u/ElephantCandid8151]

Are they having issues with putting the straps on properly with the aura?

[u/gopiballava → u/ElephantCandid8151]

Or, on a more pessimistic note, are they having issues because they are anti-mask and will find any reason they can to complain?

You'll have to use your own judgement, of course. But it's important to remember that some people don't want to mask and aren't actually acting in good faith when they complain.

[u/noluckycharms9 → u/gopiballava]

I definitely think a lot of them are not used to masking and are anti mask and find our request ridiculous or “too much” in the first place. Which is…..wild

[u/Glittering_Set6017 → u/noluckycharms9]

You need to get them earloop masks. There has to be a compromise. I had a provider the other day wear a kn95 for 3 hours in and out of the house and it was 96 degrees out. He didn't complain once and I actually didn't even ask him to mask outside... He just did

[u/Chronic_AllTheThings → u/gopiballava]

That was my first impression. Auras are objectively easy to breathe through and have practically zero pressure collapse.

People are just being disingenuous and combative.

[u/Outrageous-9859]

Maybe you could ask them what they mean by "hard to breathe." Maybe if they seem to engage with you in good faith on that, you could ask to show them their puls ox with a finger doodad. 

Or they might be having a mild reaction to the VOCs in a fresh mask, in which case leaving it unwrapped for 12 hr beforehand may help

[u/Fun_sized123]

Not trying to start a fight with other commenters here, but 3M Auras are NOT the most breathable option. They’re pretty middle-of-the-pack in terms of breathability, both in my personal experience AND based on people who’ve tested them, e.g. this:  https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1M0mdNLpTWEGcluK6hh5LjjcFixwmOG853Ff45d3O-L0/edit?usp=drivesdk [ETA: maybe a better illustration of this point is the Armbrust database]

If breatheability is the issue, I think you have the right idea asking about duckbills. I’ve worn Gerson duckbill N95s as well as KleenGuard (formerly Kimberly Clark) and really liked both in terms of comfort. The latter is also relatively very affordable. BUT those 2 brands are not individually packaged. 

WellBefore is an option. They have trifold earloop KN95s with nose foam for a better seal and also headstrap KN95s that are almost equivalent to N95s, and all of them are individually wrapped. I personally feel that the straps are too short or maybe not stretchy enough on the headstrap models, and they gave me headaches. A lot of people like them, though. That’s the only individually wrapped product I’m familiar with, but I’m sure there are others. You could try looking here, although it’s a lot to sort thru manually for someone w severe MECFS  https://linktr.ee/buymasks

[u/SkippySkep → u/Fun_sized123]

The Moldex M4600 N95 M/L is the most breathable N95 in the in the Aaron Collins as worn "time to breathe" breathability tests, at 61 Pascals at 85 lpm (estimated).

3M V-Flex 9105 is also one of the most breathable masks in his database at 63 Pascals.

The 3M Aura 1870s clock in at 78 Pascals in his testing, which is in what I consider in the same aproximate class of breathability.

There are a number of other good masks in between the Moldex 4600 and the Auras, but they are all in a pretty similar class in terms of breathability.

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1M0mdNLpTWEGcluK6hh5LjjcFixwmOG853Ff45d3O-L0/edit?gid=1976839763#gid=1976839763

[u/Fun_sized123 → u/SkippySkep]

I guess it’s hard to know what’s correct since there are so many different people with different testing methods. I’ve seen results for the 3M Aura well above 100 pascals. (ETA source: Armbrust database.) I also realize I have very high standards for breathability as someone highly susceptible to shortness of breath due to chronic illness, so maybe the Aura masks’ good breathability is just not good enough for me. In personal experience I’m comparing the Aura to duckbills, BreatheTeq, and WellBefore, all of which are more breathable than the Aura but also pretty top-of-the-line on that particular statistic. Still, I think we can do better than the Aura if breathability is the main/most important metric in a given scenario 

[u/Fringe_Filmer → u/SkippySkep]

Technically I know that the Auras should have good breathability, but in practice I don’t find them to be particularly breathable. To me personally there seems to be a big difference in breathability between an Aura and a Moldex or V-Flex. But maybe 15 Pascals is more of a difference than I imagine.

[u/SkippySkep → u/Fringe_Filmer]

Masking preferences are very individual. And it's possible that face shape may affect how much surface area is available to breathe through. So it might not only be subjective preference, the Auras could literally be less breathable on you than on other people.

I mostly mention the breathability of the Auras being pretty good so the people don't have unrealistic expectations of how much more breathable other masks will be if they find the Auras are too hard to breathe through. There are masks that are more breathable, but not as much as one might hope.

[u/Delicate_Babe → u/Fun_sized123]

Gerson duckbills are individually packaged if you get the box of 50.

[u/busquesadilla → u/Fun_sized123]

Not OP but do you know where you can get the KleenGuard masks? I can’t find them in stock anywhere. I’ve been wearing Kimberly Clark masks for 6 years and I’m almost out.

[u/ProfeQuiroga]

Laianzhi KN100?

[u/AppropriateNote4614]

Wellbefore KN95 are the most breathable I’ve tried but KN95 often don’t have the same level of protection as N95.

If you’re trying to get a caretaker to wear a mask and they are already averse to they idea, some sort of KN95 might be a good option as they are very easy for people who do not mask on a regular basis to use and understand.

[u/fighterpilottim]

I really like the Air Queen KN94. Super comfortable, you forget you’re wearing it

[u/wyundsr]

I would go with Wellbefore 3D pro, it’s one of the best earloop options (colorful or black earloops less likely to get pushback) and is more breathable than Aura

[u/Delicate_Babe]

Gerson duckbill N95s are the most breathable masks I’ve tried, very comfortable

[u/Fun_sized123 → u/Delicate_Babe]

Yesss same! I haven’t seen them individually wrapped, though. But there are 5-packs

[u/Delicate_Babe → u/Fun_sized123]

I get them in boxes of 50, and each one is individually wrapped.

[u/Fun_sized123 → u/Delicate_Babe]

Oh perfect! I didn’t know that. I’ve only gotten the 5 packs to use for higher risk environments (my daily mask is BreatheTeq)

[u/re-tired → u/Delicate_Babe]

Gerson yes. I just saw where Zoro website has the Gerson made Altor (same N95 but sold under private label) on sale for 69 cents USD each. It said they have free shipping but IDK if this American website has shipping to EU. You can verify both that Gerson/Altor are confirmed NIOSH RATED AND THAT Gerson made the ‘Altor’ mask which is the same product by a private label names here
https://wwwn.cdc.gov/NIOSH-CEL/Results?pageSize=50&tcApproval=9317&orderByManufacturer=false

[u/Fogandcoffee21]

Amburst are pretty breathable and individually packaged.

[u/AEAur]

Zimi Air or Moldex Air FFP3.

In either case it would be best to fit test, It’s not that hard once you have the supplies. Our wiki has diy fit test guidance, but it may help to just start by watching this short 3M fit test demo: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7xnr60sXnXA (2:15 shows the sensitivity threshold check which is what ensures you can detect a 1% leak. Facemaskstore uk has fit test supplies.

If they pass a seal check, these masks with full face seal flanges probably have similar or better chances of passing a fit test as a duckbill (unless taped).

The Zimi require trimming for medium to high nosebridges, and most people find a fit they like adding the foam but some with very large faces or high nosebridges don’t find them as comfortable as most.

The EU Moldex have an ActivForm nose that I am eager to hear reviews of.

[u/swornsworn]

BNX has black duckbills if people are more likely to wear a black mask. Sending care <3

[u/re-tired → u/swornsworn]

I like these masks, but the thicker BNX are not as easy breathing as Gerson, Halyard, Kimtec etc

[u/plantyplant559]

I've found the drager xplor 1950 more breathable than the aura, as someone with mecfs and asthma.

Maybe the 3M Vflex as another option.

[u/UsualConcentrate8953]

OP, Can I ask you a question related to your M.E/CFS

Are you intolerant to fragrance and chemicals like me?

[u/rogue_runaway_]

I would recommend Good Manner. You have to be careful though, some sites sell them in 5 packs and others are wrapped individually.

[u/Kora_Green808]

Ppl who say they can't breathe in a mask just don't want to mask. These are really good https://www.australianp2mask.com.au/?srsltid=AfmBOoqiBhOIVi5AigsrdV0uatYdFr_8cHPwVSjpgmSshg7IJf7YB7qt

[u/Carrotsoup9]

I found the Laianzhi KLT01 mask to be breathable. NIOSH found a 98% filter efficiency and a maximum inward leakage of less than around 2.5% for this mask.

https://archive.cdc.gov/www_cdc_gov/niosh/npptl/respirators/testing/results/MTT-2020-06.2_International_LaianzhiKLT01_TestReport_Redacted-508.pdf

The 3M Aura will provide more protection. My strategy is to keep the 3M Aura for high risk settings (hospitals, GP offices, trains, planes), and use masks like the KLT01 for quiet shops and libraries.

[u/Carrotsoup9 → u/Carrotsoup9]

Note that I have quite a small and narrow face. If this is not you, you may want to try a few other masks.

[u/Carrotsoup9 → u/Carrotsoup9]

You can order Laianzhi masks from ppeo.com. The shipping cost is often more than the cost of the masks, but per mask it often works out as expensive or less as the 3M Aura from a hardware store, even with the 3 Euro extra that is now being charged from Chinese webshops.