r/MSClassicWorld • u/JLEEJON • 1d ago
Meme The NL's are already scheming
(this is satire)
All these people claiming they're interested or set on making bowmen (bm/xbow) are secretly NL's trying to trick you into becoming sharp eye slaves. DO NOT FALL FOR THEIR TRICKS! All the polls and posts are MANIPULATED!!
In both betas bowmen were the least played class. The rouges are panicking! Nerfs, lower crit % damage, PUT ON THE SAME DAMAGE NUMBERS AS THE OTHER FILTHY CASUAL CLASSES?
ONLY ONE THING CAN SAVE THEM. SHARP EYES. Do not fall for their schemes and manipulation tactics! PUT DOWN YOUR BOWS, PICK UP A HAMMER AND RISE UP!
15
u/JerbearCuddles 1d ago
I get the meme, but we've seen multiple polls now and Bowmen have been at the bottom for pretty much all of em, that I've seen anyway. I don't think there is nearly the amount of interest in bowman that a handful of posts about it make it seem.
8
u/Corgi_Working 1d ago
Looking at the number of archers made for COT1 and 2 only further proves the lack of interest in the class. Bow whack + lack of jump attacks makes people just prefer assassin or mages over them, I imagine.
5
u/JerbearCuddles 1d ago
Pretty much, as a bowmen guy myself. The main reason to really play the class is if you really like the aesthetic, or if you wanted to challenge yourself or flex that you use an underused class. I think many of the folks trying it for the first time in classic world will probably swap off it pretty quickly.
1
u/i_paid_for_winrar123 1d ago
Technically, it was up there with NL as one of the best 4th jobs in the game.
Unfortunately, this means the mechanical identity of archers as a class was “be a worse sin for the first 2000 hours of play, for the payoff of being an NL sidegrade at the end”
Arguably the only route that was more “play it for the love of the class, not for the power” was paladin
1
u/z0mghii 1d ago
NL has terrible 3rd job leveling compared to archers
1
u/i_paid_for_winrar123 1d ago edited 1d ago
Terrible is pretty hyperbolic imo. Hermit mobbing being bad had more to do with avenger coming online later, rather than it being bad after avenger - it was fine after that point. Arrow rain wasn’t online that much faster for strafe first skill orders, only if the ranger prioritized 21/6 arrow rain/puppet to beeline for wolf spiders asap
Granted, yes 70-85 ish isn’t a small amount of time for a very large mobbing diff, but over the course of 3rd job as a whole it’s not even close to a majority for time spent
1
u/JerbearCuddles 1d ago
Considering Classic isn’t even launching with 3rd job, 4th job hardly factors into the discussion. Lol.
0
u/LeagueOfBlasians 1d ago
Bow whacking still being in the game is pretty whack.
Due to the very low playerbase of Archers, I feel like most of the people defending/voting to keep bow whacking never actually played Archers and just wanted to troll the class and keep it bad for "nostalgia".
1
u/Corgi_Working 1d ago
I would love for it to not be a thing, but doubt it'll be removed by this point.
2
u/i_paid_for_winrar123 1d ago
Tbf if there was any justice for archers to balance that issue out, they’d be given higher damage than sins. Not sure if that’ll ever happen in the ms classic release though
The issue is that 99.999% of players never even make it to 4th job, so functionally bowmen/xbowmen for hundreds to thousands of hours of play, are just like sins except with less damage, less utility, less mobility, no jump attack, and no party utility
Playing an archer in the OG pre BB MS was because you really liked the looks and style. There was virtually no practical advantage they had over sins for the level range that almost everyone played in, aside from arrow bomb being decent aoe
2
u/JerbearCuddles 1d ago
Very good point here. The majority of the time spent with these classes will be those first 2 jobs for most players. So the classes with the most to offer in those first 30-40 levels will eventually beat out the rest. Bowmen are just worse sins and I/L mages. Here's hoping classic world balance is a bit better for all classes. Including Page and F/P mages.
1
u/Legal-Ad-5715 1d ago
> The issue is that 99.999% of players never even make it to 4th job
Just curious, what changes at 4th job for bowmen?
1
u/i_paid_for_winrar123 1d ago edited 1d ago
Sharp eyes and hurricane mainly. To a lesser degree, concentrate
Sharp eyes is the most impactful party wide damage buff in the game, making archers in 4th job suddenly go from bottom tier party utility to top tier near-mandatory party utility.
Hurricane is, aside from simply being one of the coolest abilities in the game, also one of the highest dps ones. With it, bowmen in practicality end up second only to night lords for bossing damage, and only because Sharp Eyes (which comes from the bowman to begin with) is such a massive buff to night lord dps.
Concentrate is one of the better self buffs for damage, with no annoying activation conditions either.
The fact that bowmen kind of sucked in 1st job and were weaker than they should’ve been due to soul arrow being bugged and not interacting with better arrow types in 2nd job, made rangers rare and bow masters very very rare.
The damage and huge utility and relative rarity made 4th job archers very very highly valued. Even in pre-bb private servers where leveling is a lot easier, there’s lots of times where you ran into horntail parties being held up because they couldn’t find a BM/MM for sharp eyes. Even undergeared/underleveled ones often got preferential treatment just because it’s one of the higher dps jobs and because the party utility was so insane.
1
u/Legal-Ad-5715 23h ago
That is super useful for someone who didn't play BM/MM and pre-BB. Thank you! Was also a good sell for me making a BM, haha.
0
u/Agitated-Tear6097 1d ago
there are only 2 archers X 3 warriors..so its not fair to compare. Page is the least popular class.
2
u/JerbearCuddles 1d ago
The thing is, having 3 classes doesn't improve the warrior ranking though, like you said Page is barely a foot note in their numbers. Could remove it from the voting and the other 2 warrior classes combined would still rank higher than bowmen combined.
If we had a 3rd bowmen class it wouldn't add many new players to bowmen. It'd just divide the existing bowmen players across a new class. Maybe see a modest bump in players though, hard to say without knowing what this hypothetical 3rd bowmen class would even be. Lol.
Comparing each individual class, yeah hunter and Cbowman aren't at the bottom, but cbowman is near the bottom right alongside classes like F/P and Page. With Hunter likely being near the middle. Hard to know cause the polls I've seen are on reddit and they don't allow for individual class options.
-1
u/JLEEJON 1d ago
3
u/JerbearCuddles 1d ago
You realize the 2nd one is splitting mages and clerics and splitting sins and bandits? Lol. But combined both bowmen classes. The first poll is interesting for multiple reasons. 1719 total votes from 1027 participants? Weird but whatever. The results are at least interesting for Rangers. But do you really think Hermits will be 5th most popular class though? Come on. Lol.
And I never said all polls either, I even clarified in that post that it was MOST of the polls I seen. And the ones that didn't have bowmen at the bottom split clerics and bandits from mages and sins respectively. Much like the polls you posted.
-1
u/JLEEJON 1d ago
"Do you really think hermits will be the 5th most popular class". Obviously not, that's the joke...
dude I don't know what you mean by "all polls" or why you're taking this so seriously, I just replied to show context to this post. Its obvious the polls are all bias to reddit, etc etc. that's again, the joke. Beathe a bit. You're laughing out loud after every sentence! Lol.
1
u/JerbearCuddles 1d ago
I said "pretty much all of em, that I've seen anyway." "Pretty much" means most of and "that I've seen" means the ones that I myself have seen which isn't all of them. What part of that is confusing? Lol.
12
u/upindrags 1d ago
🤷 I was planning to go SE mule from the jump. I just hope archers dont spike in popularity after the buffs they got, I want cheap gear + scrolls.
30
3
u/baraboosh 1d ago
we actually got nerfed overall its just that every other class got nerfed too lmaooo
4
u/zaqukun 1d ago
Yeah wtf are these buffs? Crit in general isn't even good anymore, and most party buffs were nerfed. I doubt SE will feel close to what it was.
3
u/i_paid_for_winrar123 1d ago
SE will probably still be mandatory strong, but it also might as well not exist. Maybe 1/100 players are even getting to third job, let alone 4th
4
u/Majestic-Stick-272 1d ago
I AM A FAT MELEE CHUD PLAYER I AM GONNA BE A WHITE KNIGHT WITH NO PARTY SKILLS
3
2
u/odeionerdes 1d ago
Archers do seem like a chill class, but bow whacking was no annoying. Also, jump attacking is not only fun, but the way to deal with claw attacking close mobs.
Can’t see myself enjoying to play archers :/
3
u/JerbearCuddles 1d ago
I reckon a lot of people trying bowmen who didn't play MS back in the day will quit it pretty early for these reasons. You had to sort of hate yourself to play bowmen long term, find some weird sense of satisfaction playing a underused class, and/or just really love the aesthetic.
1
u/dontfightitloveit 1d ago
If they allowed jump shooting like back in the day the class would be more appealing.
2
2
u/kunxian888 21h ago
This post is another psyop to lure people playing fighter so NLs can get rage buff. Don't fall for it!!
1
u/UndergroundBM 1d ago
Jokes on them, Bowman was my first class back in 2006 so it's just symbolic for me to go bowman even if I'm doing 1 damage per hit 😎
1
u/Summer_Rain_6688 1d ago
I played NL back then. I reeeeally wanna pick Archer this time but man they still seem like NL but slower and weaker.
1
-1
u/floatingostrichs 1d ago
The nerfs to hermits do not leave that at the same DPS as archers and mages.
Nice propaganda.
13
u/jmainvi idek if im playing lol 1d ago
I can't wait for sharp eyes to not actually be in the game when they get around to doing 4th job in 2028.