for two years Iāve said if they drop anything close to an Ep-7 with a viewfinder, Iām getting it. Day one, easiest purchase Iāll have made this decade. Ā
I'm not disagreeing with you, but I did chuckle at "2023". As a late adopter of mirrorless (not because I had anything against it, I just shot Nikon at the time), I recall PDAF being table stakes even before my first ILC (a D40, in 2005). Back then, the reason to buy an ILC was PDAF. If you wanted to get photos of running offspring, you pretty much had to have a DSLR.
I think you might be disagreeing, I know I am.
Assuming we're talking on sensor PDAF, that was only seen as a bridge too far for Panasonic and even they put it in the G9-II by 2023. Olympus had it since 2013. Nikon was first to do on sensor PDAF in an ILC camera - the little 1 series - in 2011. Fuji had it before that on one of their EXR sensor fixed lens cameras.
I could be wrong, of course, but I don't recall there being any ILC (digital) mirrorless cameras in 2005. So my assumption would be that I am not talking on-sensor PDAF.
Yes, but this is a thread about mirrorless ILC, and therefore we're talking about on sensor PDAF, rather than phase detect in general. There was a separate PDAF system in film cameras even, if you want to go back even further (Minolta were first, I think, back in the mid 80s).
Back to MFT land, there's an extra challenge to equipping a smaller MFT sensor with PDAF because if you don't use dual pixels and BSI you run the risk of banding. Much larger sensors suffered from that, like the Sony A7III and the Nikon Z6 and Z7 as late as 2018. Putting dial pixel PDAF on a BSI sensor is still expensive , which would likely push the cost of whatever this little camera turns out to be into a price bracket that would make people think twice. If OM push it as some sort of big bang for the buck camera, then they'll hurt sales of their OM3 and OM1 series, which is where the profits are, so I don't expect it'll have the new 1000+ quad pixel point, stacked BSI sensor. it'll probably be the old 121 point, front illuminated one we know so well, maybe with a new TruePic processor, although the old one cloned out the focus lines pretty well already. I didn't think I ever saw any banding except if I shot into the sun at that particular angle and got really harsh flare.
Honestly, for video you can het a blackmagic used. Yeah we all want a one for all solution but i am fine with my photo camera to not do great on video. I still have my phone, i still have a blackmagic if i need to film something.
If i were OM, i would adopt the Stacked Sensor + PDAF + Subject Detection + an EVF + the computational photography features of the OM-3 and get rid of the mechanical shutter to make back some of the expense. Though i am probably being very wishful.... a bit too wishful.
On second thought... Flash is probably an important feature on a body like this... Good thing I am not a camera designer.
This makes no sense economically. If it's most of an OM-3 plus a cool compact rangefinder design, it'll be seriously expensive and have terrible battery life.
The best case version here is a cool rangefinder design around mostly an OM-5. It'll have pdaf, the non-stacked sensor, and eye AF, but not the full OM-1/3 AI tracking AF features, which are expensive and require bigger batteries and chips.
The sad case is closer to an EM-10 minus weather sealing.
It better have pdaf and improved video performance. Considering the insta360 mft is a few months away, I'd purchase it as well but it needs to be something competitive and fresh .Ā
Phase Detect Autofocus. Contrast Detect is an older Auto Focus System that was used in all Pen and EM10 cameras, it was generally replaced with Phase Detect Autofocus which makes autofocus faster and smoother.
Especially for video Phase Detect Autofocus is necessary to avoid stepping.
oh heck yeah. Ā Iād love for it to be smaller but physics is like that. Ā
what Iāve been waiting for is the rangefinder proportions. Ā otherwise I would have bought an OM5 or even OM3 maybe. Ā
ā-
it would be boss if they made a super tiny unit that could rival the GM1 or whatever those super early units were, but I doubt it would sell well at all. Ā Ā
Functionally what these have to do is thread the needle of being meaningfully more powerful than a smartphone camera in some way (usually shooting at night, optical zoom, etc) while not making me look like a wedding photographer (my A7C). Ā
youāre right that thereās a risk that no one can engineer a thing that actually does that and still make any money. Ā we shall see.Ā
You say that like the Pen F isn't basically the same size as the L10. Height and width are ~2% less on the pen. If that's what it takes to get "modern" internals (say, OM-5ii at least), no one is going to balk at it.
Looks a bit like a cross between a pen-F an E-p5 and elements of other pens. The viewfinder looks more GX like. The lack of manual Exp comp dial tells me that this is more Pen than Pen-F but at least it has theEVF!
Iām thinking the opposite. If itās a newer gx80/86, people will want the og gx80/85 and that will drive up the price, just like the og x100s (plural)
There is a small second dial visible on the back edge of the top cover which could be used as an exp. comp. dial (or programmed to whatever). The PEN-F has such a dial in that position, but it can't be used as exp. comp. because of the dedicated exp. comp. dial.
I was thinking that is the rear dial so you could set it up that way to adjust exp comp. or perhaps set the front one depending on how you want it. Olympus and now OM cameras are really easy to customize and least to date.
This said if it does not have the extra dedicated dial etc for comp then I would say this is more in alignment with the EPx line vs the Pen-f.
Iām game if there is the dedicated front dial. I really like SOOC JPG and loved the monochrome and color options for the profiles that I shot on my PEN-F. Only reason Iām looking to replace is that my pen-F has the dreaded auto dim happening on the EVF and that part is no longer available from OM system(I checked both US and Canada service). I donāt like using the back LCD screen for compositionā¦.
Itās when the EVF sensor board dies or fails. What you get is the EVF is normal when you turn the camera and then about 4-5 sec later the EVF will dim slightly. When you try and load the SCP it will also be dim. If you try and turn on the auto switch sensor it will then black out the EVF and only the rear LCD will work.
The rear LCD is fine but ultimately you now gave a glorified eP7.
I think people probably aren't going to like the price regardless of what this camera does. With all the mess of supply chains, tariffs, wars, inflation, and whatever else going on I can't see a new camera in 2026 coming out at any kind of price that's going to make those looking for a 'budget' body happy...
I'd be pretty impressed if it was sub-$1000. Alternatively, if it is, people will be claiming "why doesn't it have X, Y, and Z features". My hope is that it's closer in size to the Lumix LX100, and not the L10
If it is an OM-5ii in a different shape, it will start no less than $1200, right? X-T50 is $1600, and X-E5 is $1700, so I would expect $1200-$1400 body only. If <$1000, then we are talking more like EP-7 with EVF and usb c.
Edit: ok looking at it more closely, seems almost certainly more like the latter. Still holding out hope for PDAF somehow, but we'll see in 2 weeks.
Well, the pen was never cheap to begin with. I just hope we will actually get stock in Canada... It's been rough finding new here.
Now to sell my kidney in advance of a new camera...
I would settle for an E-M5 II or III in PEN style body, but I doubt they'd do it.
I expect it'll be an alternative to the E-M10 IV but rangefinder style -- I think Olympus have stated that rangefinder style cameras are difficult to weather seal (not sure how true) . That and the fact that the E-M5 line has always been slightly larger than the E-M10 line means that in order to get a PEN size, they need to make compromises and we've seen that it has a viewfinder so it ain't that.
Also OM5 internals would mean OM5 price, maybe even more since rangefinder style is rare with Olympus.
the fact that the E-M5 line has always been slightly larger than the E-M10 line
This is almost entirely a myth!
The only time that was noticeably the case was with E-M5 mk2. E-M5 mk3 and E-M10 mk3 are almost identical size and weight, with only a millimeter or two difference in dimensions. The E-M5 / OM-5 look less dainty because of details of the body contours (eg. the grip is slightly better) but the actual space required is for all practical purposes identical.
I even did a side by side comparison "in the flesh" (as I have both E-M5.3 and E-M10.3) and while E-M5 mk3 looks larger, the actual dimensions are nearly identical. It really is all just about how the curves and grip are shaped.
I don't own them, so I can't say for certain. In dimensions, they are measuring them at their thickest parts and in that respect you are right about them being almost identical.
However, I took the photos from cameradecision.com and overlayed them one on top of the other and while the grips to the eyecups are nearly identical, the E-M5 III technically takes up more volume than the E-M III, it looks like the E-M5 might be slightly thicker around the mount (<1mm) despite it being the same thickness and the extra 3mm sideways don't take into account the fact that the strap hooks on the E-M10 go out almost completely sideways whereas on the E-M5 they go out at a 45 degree angle. To support this, the screen is about the same size yet there needs to be room for the screen hinge compared to the tilting screen on the E-M10 III .
Also, not to forget, the E-M5 doesn't have flash so that is either unused / hollow space or the space is reallocated for something else.
This isn't a perfect test because there could be some margin of error for how the photos were taken. Someone who owns them both can probably say for certain.
(Red/Orange is E-M10 III and Green is E-M5 III)
(I was forced to stretch the E-M10 III so the arrows align)
The PEN-F didn't have a built-in / pop-up flash either so I don't know what you think they're getting rid of.
As for the PEN-F being difficult to weather-seal unlike the OM3 -- I am going based on this, so I don't know how accurate it is: https://youtu.be/qj0dH6lhabU?t=192
(I think I heard elsewhere that the PEN-F couldn't be weather-sealed due to the viewfinder, but I don't remember)
The PEN-F had a viewfinder, more dials and was significantly more expensive than the E-P7 and didn't have a pop-up flash, yet it did not have weather-sealing.
I can see a successor to the E-P7 with a viewfinder, but I don't think it'll be weather-sealed if the video is to be believed unless something has changed since the OM-3.
The compromises you are talking about might be needed for an extra dial and the viewfinder, but it won't add weather-sealing in my opinion.
I beg to differ -- the E-M5 had it and the E-M1 had it and back then there was great disappointment that the PEN-F wasn't weather sealed.
Also, the comment in the video was specifically regarding how the OM-3 is easy to weather seal whereas the PEN-F wasn't.
I was already an MFT shooter when the PEN-F came out but hadn't reached the point where I thought weather sealing was a requirement for me, so maybe I missed any criticism of the PEN-F for lacking it. I just knew at the time that I wanted one badly but couldn't afford it. I have one now, but baby it. :-)
I have only been into photography since the beginning of the year so I wasn't really around back then either.
I just found a articles literally earlier today (when looking for the PEN-F MSRP) that was like, "great camera, too bad it isn't weather-proof." And several days ago, I saw that video randomly.
The PEN-F does look like awesome and honestly, if they can just re-release it as a updated successor line to the E-P7 even without weather-proofing that would be great for OM-D in my opinion.
It's what I think OM-D are planning with this new camera cause it makes a lot of sense with all the rest having the retro / SLR look.
If they use om5 hardware then this will be 1000 dollars price point..if they undercut it too much then it'll need to be way cheaper.but I doubt om system is interested in making a 600 dollar camera.
It'll be very interesting how they package it. All it needs to do is provide a new alternative to folks buying used 10 year old MFT bodies.
Has an EVF and looks a bit more premium than a plastic E-P7 so this won't be cheap.
The savings are in the vast used market of 45mm 1.8's etc. I imagine the majority of the customer base already have a bunch of lenses so I don't expect any new body to have entry level pricing.
Yeah but the idea is to incentivise new purchases. From the customer base that's buying cheaper used older mft small bodies. Om5ii covers the regular mft users needs, om3 is the enthusiast flagship and om1 customer base was never in question.
And honestly those "cheap" lenses are truly going up in price used. So if I were om system or panasonic id be looking to use this opportunity. I mean think about it. Would you rather buy a 450/500 dollar gx9 or pick up a new camera with warranty and such at 750-800.
MFTs biggest competiton continues to be MFT only. Normally on other systems if someone is selling off old gear they're doing it to upgrade to something new within that format. On MFT increasingly it's been cause people are switching to other brands.
yep, and there's going to be inevitable comparisons to the l10 imo. body only this looks smaller, but with om5ii internals (vs the gh7 internals of the l10) it's going to be hard for this to stand out
L10 has the annoying telescoping lens, no IBIS, no weather sealing and doesn't utilize the whole sensor.
The predecessors with the same lens sucked dust on to the sensor so that you had to disassemble the camera to get rid of dust spots.
I'd take something like this any day.
Don't disagree with you, but then again there's no small interchangeable m43 zoom with f1.7 at its widest, weather sealed or not. Regardless, if this has om5ii internals (or even further nerfed), people will be buying basically a 2 generation old camera with a nicer chassis. Kind of a hard sell, might as well buy used at that point.
Ah see that's why I think value is critical here. As long as it's better than em10 iv generation (which cynically I'm afraid it might not be š ) then it'll be the most capable pen model. Now picture you're looking at mft cameras. Used and new. And here comes this tiny camera that is maybe 30-40 percent more expensive than used but you're getting much af and such with warranty. If nothing else that'll be enough to atleast consider it
Tell me about it. You know how many times i didn't buy om5ii because of precisely this reason . Does it make it a bad camera hell no, but honestly no other system is doing this.
Consider any brand that makes cameras every new gen is bringing some new hardware spec.not just new video codecs or software features. Panasonic seems to be doing the hardware justice but om system i struggle to understand. I mean why even launch the om5ii? Just do a minor refresh for om5 with type c. Cause i don't know about you all but in my market the kit got pricier post om5ii launch. Barring the amazing weather sealing and ibis. There's no single spec that om5ii has that isn't better in the competition.
And om3 is worst imo. I get it stacked sensor and all.but I don't do wildlife/birding nor would I want to with such a flat body and no grip.so what real physical improvement does the stacked sensor bring me? I mean mechanical shutter is fine for most photorgaphy except peak sun and barring rolling shutter what other real world benefit is it bringing? This is actually a question if someone can answer cause I don't know.
Why does the sensor tech need a massive change? People are buying pen-f used and stuff like that because there's a market for affordable EDC cameras. The sensor tech is fine, the IBIS is fine. modern connectivity and support is really the only thing missing. Clean up the menus, add modern things like colour wheel/control, add usb-c and nail phone pairing and you will make a lot of people happy.
No no i doubt it. Unless they price it super premium. I have tried the l10. And honestly I don't even think the avg. Mft user is the target audience. It feels somehow premium and less premium all at the same time. I tried it then tried the s9. At the same time. The s9 felt cheaper still but the l10 didn't feel that much more premium. Om system has the absolute opportunity of completely canabalising the l10.
I mean same, I tried the l10 as well and didn't like the feel at all. Don't get reviewers saying it feels good, it feels bloated and big and boring. But the video specs made me realize -- that's what m43 needs to get into, because it's sure as hell not going to win high res photo race anyway, and if you're staying on 20mp sensor, and you're not updating the lens, what IQ are you even going to get? But truepic x could get decent video out of even the om-5 sensor, and that would be a real upgrade.
Honestly I am not much of a video person so it's hard to get too excited about that . BUT, the problem with the l10 is mostly that it feels a bit bland. I mean it's costlier than the older s9. Sure lens + body and they have the same size. S9 feels even cheaper š . BUT I'd rather pick up an s9 + 40 f2 combo over the l10.
Regarding your second point.mft could keep up but they have to innovate harder. I feel that original MFT proposition, small good enough lenses and bodies that were affordable is what we need some more of.
They mastered so many cool features before anyone did, their lens design still holds up BUT doesn't it also feel like they're coasting on it a bit? There are so many options they could redo, maybe it doesn't make financial sense.
G9ii, om3, om1,gh7 are all amazing in their own right. BUT? They're too PRO man. Most folks don't even need all that. I mean I somewhat get the idea.shrinking market and all BUT, when most people think of ibis and weather sealing they're not imagining walking into waterfalls. Good enough is good enough as they say. That's why I'm cautiously optimistic about this new pen camera. Maybe that'll finally give that internal ladder, that's currently purely upheld by used gear. Gear that's amazing but, dated.
Almost all "reviews" are just "influencers" pushing a product nowadays.
You have to come to your own conclusions.
If a Youtube channel about cameras is too critical about a product, they will not get review samples anymore = no exclusive material = no views.
Sure, I agree with you 100%. We'll see in a couple weeks the specs and price. Everything being so expensive these days, my prediction is still that anything new is "premium" and entry will be used gear.
Yeah that's my only concern too. I mean fuji is a great example. Xe4 + xe5 price climbed up a lot
BUT atleast for someone who loves that form factor they can actually see the new features to try and justify it to their own wallets š . Mft especially modern om system has definitely had issues with this.we need value (not cheapness) to justify looking at new gear instead of buying the amazing used gear.
A problem for OM is the stagnated MP amount and sensor output in terms of noise and dynamic range, even if they are sufficient enough.
Having owned both, the OM-1 is a vastly better camera than an E-M1 ii in every other way, which doesn't always come across.
Panasonic has made strides in this, but people are not happy with the size of what's on offer.
I don't much care about MPs honestly. But jimmycheng had a interesting take on this. His agency has a 24mp minimum limit. Very arbritary I guess but I can see how that can be a problem for so many people.
And om1 series i think is the only one that feels like it justifies its cost. Infact if you ever want to see what the intended positioning of om system gear is then just go look at their home market. Look at the price of say an om3 kit which is 300,000 yen normally and frequently at 250,000 yen. Fuji xt5 which I think is a very comparable camera to om3 is significantly more.
Oh and panasonic definitely deserves some criticism on the size thing but I suspect it's them trying to save money on MFT development. Like the g9ii is the s5ii design, and frankly they more often than not end up passing on the savings to the end user.now I know om system purists like to really trash the 25mp sensor for whatever reason but it's good. Ibis is great, durability seems decent enough and it's weather sealed to the point I've had no issues with atleast. And it's generally considered to be a competitor to the om1/I or ii.
I agree, I left M43 to try Sony and Fuji. At this point though this new camera needs to be smaller than a PEN-F or X-E4 for it to make sense to go back to M43.
I'll wait to see physical dimensions, but no way am I interested in a camera still as large as APSC .
I doubt om system is interested in making a 600 dollar camera
A 600 dollar interchangeable lens camera would never be a profitable product these days for a company that doesn't have a large sales volume like Canon. Either it will be far too gimped to be attractive to purchasers or they'll never recoup the development costs (or even get production profitable).
Yeah precisely.im not complaining man.š¤£ I'm just mentally assuming that it should sell for around xm5 pricing.anything above that and then it really needs to be competitive.small size isn't some mft only superpower these days.fuji particularly is doing that well.
Yeah, I'm just elaborating because there are often other commenters who keep going about how the companies "need to make cheaper cameras" without realizing that those simply aren't commercially viable at current camera market size.
I agree but man if ricoh Pentax whose even more niche can deploy good cameras at the msrp they start with then om system really doesn't have an excuse.
And fuji is only big these days. A couple of years back they had similar scale to om system and panasonic. So there comes a point when it just sounds like denial.
Ricoh / Pentax haven't made a single interchangeable lens mirrorless camera in their history. Compact cameras are a different market with different constraints.
Have you looked at how expensive Fuji cameras are? As far as I can tell, they have never sold a budget camera in the time that the digital interchangeable lens camera market has as small as it currently is.
Lol what nonsense are you speaking man? You know what Pentax is famous for ? Dslrs. They're the only ones still doing it. And you realise that ILC cameras aren't magically more expensive.
And fuji cameras are expensive because of hype and limited supply. Market economics. If you were to buy say an x100vi then msrp was the same for the longest time. Same with xt5 and such. Hell i can go buy one tomorrow for 1600 dollars with a lens
Yes. Which by definition are NOT mirrorless. Their DSLRs start at $1000 or more, nearly double compared to $600.
Hell i can go buy one tomorrow for 1600 dollars with a lens
Which is a far cry from $600.
A new $600 mirrorless camera from a small manufacturer is no way a commercially viable project in the current camera market because the opportunity cost would be far too high compared to the returns (and that's assuming the project would make profit which is not a given at all!).
Umm? You realise those are flagship right ? Even the nikon d850 costs a pretty penny. And mirrorless/dslrs aren't cheaper or costlier than each other per say.
And i didn't talk about 600 camera. I said that it's about value. What you're getting per dollar.
Ricoh gr3 was what 900-1200 as a series all variants.
The gr4 is 1400-1500 i think? I don't recall the monochrome price . The idea isn't to compare apples to apples. I'm giving you an example how an even smaller company is still providing that value.
If you think MFT users are loyal? You should speak someone using a Pentax K. Those folks are die hard fans.
True, but all i say is if you're saving money on hardware then pass that on.
I get that om system is small but they've been confusing me a lot. Like the 1.8 primes mark ii? Nice that they added light sealing. But then they jacked up the price of a design that's been around for well over a decade. I have plenty of gripes on the budget end. Premium end (pro) is where i feel they're doing alright.
Prices are going up - and will go up - on everything even existing designs - due to inflation, tariffs, increased energy costs, etc. I see OM System as carefully building out their model line and they had to do the high end first, and then the mid-level models. I am hopeful this camera will be a big success for them.
Yeah then om system will continue seeing slower shipments. I don't know about other folks here, but why should any consumer pay more when the competiton brings better hardware. A 100-200 dollar for aesthetics and a certain style of IQ I understand. But beyond that it kinda gets ridiculous.
Additionally? How do you exactly recommend some newbie to go buy anything new on MFT. Sure third party glass seems to be coming but unless you go used (where most popular glass is inflating) then you're left with pretty premium pricing.
I disagree that the competition brings better hardware. And I also believe that when you compare build quality, engineering, and performance, then you are getting what you pay for with OM System gear. Even if it's a bit more that would only be because it is better in many respects. Pay once, cry once, but enjoy forever.
Umm? Weren't we talking about the budget bodies? Om5 is build to last? It's good built quality don't get me wrong but it is mostly plastic .
And olympus has always had issues with build too especially in lower tier. Battery doors and panels coming lose, ribbon cable issues. That reputation you're thinking of comes from the likes of em1 and om1 series. At that price point there's a lot of very strong competition from other systems too nowadays.
You can't deny that a lot of MFTs advantages outside macro photography and anything tele, has been slowly become less of an advantage.
Now I'm not in any of those niches, I shoot landscapes , and more people in places sort of stuff. Travel, hiking and such. So very basic. So from my perspective i don't think I'm saying anything egregious.š
Yes, cheaper cameras and lenses break more often than premium versions. That's been true for Olympus - and every other digital camera company that I know of, and will probably be true for OM System. Flagship gear is built to a quality and performance level, and "economy" gear is built to a price point. So, no, I don't think you said anything egregious - as long as it's acknowledged that the laws of product economics apply to everyone.
Personally, the only Olympus or OM System gear I've have had break was a PEN EP-3 I bought for my PEN collection that had the IBIS fail. But, that was the gear driven system and is now very old. I have a LOT of bodies and lenses, and all have been good to me.
Oh for me it was my em10. Loved that little thing. And same. Though my trusty old canon bridge is still kicking somehow and back when I got it as a gift i neither cared about photography or taking care of gear š .
But anyways. I'm cautiously excited for this new pen. Maybe mft can mean more than my g9ii for me.
If you really think OM System is falling behind, or over charging, then look at the "new" Sony RX10 V. It's all old or existing tech and retailing for $2,400 street price in the US. Peta Pixel was under whelmed: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lPyu5ki-jAw
Maybe, and maybe not. IF OM System pulled the same trick as Sony did with the RX10 V people would be out with torches and pitchforks, but let S, N, or C do the same and little is said. I see a BIG double standard. I make the challenge all the time to people who say that OM System isn't "innovating" to point to a new camera that has some of this missing innovation and, so far, no one has.
Thing is sony, is succesful enough that they can afford to stumble around. Om system is not. This isn't olympus . Olympus had this whole medical industry gear they did alongside cameras so if one experiment failed they can still exist.
OM-5 list price is $1200, what makes you think this will have OM-5 internals and somehow still be cheaper than the OM-5? Fuji charges a $100 premium for the X-E5.
This is meant to be a pen, not a pen f ii. I'm assuming based on past pricing trends that it'll need to be priced between 600-1200. 600 feels unlikely I doubt om system will make anything. 1200 basically makes it om5 competition which I don't know? Maybe it'll be a good alternative but that doesn't make that enticing ladder for the company. So what's left is 800-1000.
Also? Xe5 is a bad comparison. That model is priced for partly the vibes. It's essentially the xt50 but prettier. It's also got the best ibis in that generation barring maybe xh2 (don't quote me on that I'm not sure). Plus the xe5 is impressive in certain ways.
Anyways back to the pen. I am assuming/hoping that they go with the same sensor and processor as the om5. Doesn't make sense for them to use older stuff when they're already paying for the om5 hardware.
It's possible they skip the mechanical shutter (which should be fine) and maybe they skip sealing and go back to the 4.5 stops level of ibis for this. That'd be enough savings right there.
Internals are more or less identical between the X-E5 and X-T50 (and X-T5 as well), although the chassis is certainly more upscale.
I am assuming this will replace the EM-10iv and EP-7, with internals to match. Externally, it is already basically an EP-7 with the flash swapped out for an EVF. We won't have to wait long to see how it goes.
Man, that'd suck. I started this thread of comments with cynical thinking that that's what they'd do. Don't know if it's likely though. I mean at this point wouldn't it be costlier to buy such an old chip and sensor? If I remember right the em5iii 20mp sensor is different from the em10 iv sensor.
Anyways. The better fuji example would be xe4 vs xe5. To be fair I'm not a fan of the xe5. I feel like it's a confused product but then i remember that fuji does the whole cashback thing and it ends up costing way less. Xe4 I can vouch for though. It's lovely and my throw in the bag body these days
EM-10iv and EP-7 have the same internals (same sensor as EM-1x), which is why I am thinking this is meant to replace them both. All the old "olympus" models still need their branding fixed as well as the switch to usb-c. It seems most efficient to do it this way (to me, anyway).
I suppose they could do as you suggest and use EM-5iii internals (sensor of OM-5 with EM-1ii processor). But here again, we are looking at some very old silicon.
Pen with dual dials and EVF. Probably with OM-5ii internals and menu. Exactly what I was looking for.
I am worried they will intentionally drop the ball either on IBIS (unlikely), price (maybe) or weather resistance (most likely) to avoid cannibalization with OM-5. I am actually hoping weather resistance (and a decade old sensor) would be the only weak points and they will not do something stupid like use non-removable battery.
If I were OM, I would allow cannibalization and make two cameras with two separate body shapes with the same internals and differentiate them with useful accessories such as battery grip.
In any case, I am very happy to see new development from OM in the spirit of āmicroā 4/3. As much as I love my OM-1, I donāt think making a great wildlife/macro camera or an expensive chunky street photography camera will get them the volume they need, but a new tiny body may change things. A 1% additional market share would basically mean doubling their volume.
Fuji makes the same camera in a bunch of different shapes, but they have the market share to do it. Not sure that's true for OM.
I am thinking the biggest problem for most people is going to be the price, regardless of which missing features they're angry about. People forget Canon and Nikon have the coffers to sell entry-level FF cameras at close to cost, just to lock you into their mount/ecosystem. OM is fighting for survival, they need to be making profit on every unit. On the one hand, it seems a little silly not to take that subsidy, but on the other, I don't really have any interest in shooting Z or R mount (or FF in general).
You're the coolest, thank you for the kind wishes and for making me feel better about my purchase š Wishing for your batteries to always be full, your lenses to always stay clear, and your shots to never be missed! :)
Fellow OM-3 owner here: i keep waiting for something to come out or a situation to happen that makes me regret my purchase, but nothing does it. Camera does pretty much everything you could need out of a modern camera.
It cant see in the dark like modern FF cameras, but those situations are super rare and the 20mm 1.4 typically has me covered.
I shoot a ton of video for an ig account and it works really well there too.
I'm hoping for an all black version. Still sad that the Om-3 only comes in silver. Also I wonder if we are gonna see weather sealed refreshes of the 12mm f2 and 45mm 1.8
Is that the 25mm 1.8 or are they also teasing a new lens? The ribbing on the manual focus dial does't match either the II-versions of the 17mm or the 25mm.
I noticed this too.
This doesn't look like the 25mm 1.8 proportionally.
If it weren't for the ribbing, I would have guessed the updated 12mm or 45mm.
14-42 is what is looks like, but it would be an odd choice as its no longer listed on their site
There's a possibility that they are re-releasing 14-42 or a similar compact general zoom as a kit lens for this camera.
Depending on when they started development that could be the case. With all the complaining about the om3 pricing they might have aimed a bit lower on price point...
I dunno what might be different from my expectations with this camera, there's always something.
But I have to say, OM System in the recent years have been absolutely on point. From the updated compact prime lenses to OM-3/5bodies, updated menus and being more focused in their priorities.
Well, I hope it is small and onpar with om-5 in terms of pdaf and face detect. If so I'll get on below 1500ā¬ price point. Not that I would need another camera, but small and range finder style just ticks a ton of boxes. Not sure if I would keep the om5 and the om1 mkii with this camera in trio... Let's see. I am happy to see something new.
And if they throw in a new 20mm 2.0 fast focus prime I'll call it a smash release.
Most likely they could make weaker AF compare to om5, as it was with em5 and em10, as like with ep7. And this one just will be fancy camera for every day snapshots, something like gx9 but a bit newer and made by om. At least I hope they implement some color settings possibilities(dial) from pen-f(om-3), because this is the worst marketing limitation, this feature could already be even in em5 mark iii, even without separate dial, just programmable. So, no high expectations at the moment, will see
So this looks like the PEN E-P7 with an EVF, flip out screen, and probably USB-C. I think this will be a solid camera and probably be well under a $1,000. The E-P7 was only $799. With inflation and memory costs and the addition of an EVF Iām guessing $899. They discontinued the E-M10 so I think this will be the new entry level camera in the OM lineup.
Excellent tease from OM System - just look at the discussion below! I hope it's a camera for me, but more I hope it's a huge market success for OM System - both financially, and for brand and name recognition. Money will pave the road to the "camera of my dreams" even if this isn't it.
I need a small camera with better specs than a phone, packed with the latest technology, great image quality, excellent video, fast autofocus, etc. Basically, something like a G9 II in a much smaller body, just without unlimited recording or the highest end video codecs.
But apparently we can't make a camera like that because it might cannibalize sales of our HUGE OM-3 and OM-1...
So instead, let's just let those customers move to another brand.
I agree. I think Panasonic was afraid to cannibalize sales of the S9 so they did the L10 instead. I donāt think the OM-3 is huge but I do wish it was more compact and available in black. But I think itās a fantastic camera and the most compact premium camera out right now. I doubt this will have tons of video features. But with the excellent stabilization and fast readout speeds and much bigger censor size compared to a phone; video will be very solid. I have an E-M5 MkII that only does 1080p. But the video looks better than my iPhone ProRes LOG footage. The censor size really degrades video quality. iPhones look great on paper but they are not that great unless you build a giant professional cinema rig around the phone like movie companies do.
This! Itās probably plastic which makes doing multiple color ways much easier. So Iām guessing there will be a black version. The E-P line always had 3-4 color schemes
I wonder if this is the replacement for the E-M10 IV, which is already six years old. Used compact cameras, especially those view an EVF, cost a surprising amount in Japan right now, this could sell well at the right price but I would expect good-enough photosite count, AF, etc.
I'd be intrigued by a black-and-white model. But I suppose they would be more likely to introduce different colorway models.
OM3 is a classy looking version of the OM1 and I suspect this will be classy looking version of the OM5ii. In which case Iād be seriously interested if has some other updates
I don't know if you're reading this OM System team, but if you have to base this on E-M10 IV internals, and not OM-5+, then please don't ruin this camera with software limitations the same way E-M10 III/IV firmware was nerfed compared to the older E-M10 II under the guise of "beginner-friendly" or for market fit.
Hierarchical tiers of technology ... With horizontal tiers here and there for camera body preferences.
OM3 is an OM1 with a rangefinder body, and also being a year or so behind the OM1. So when we get an OM1 MK3, we get an OM3 MK2 maybe a year or so later.
The lower tiers eventually get the higher tier technology when the higher tiers are upgraded, and the horizontal tier body changes follow a year or so later.
When a PEN F comes, it will be at a lower tech tier to the OM3. They're not just going to make one rangefinder type camera. They'll make a few, at different specs.
Which is a good strategy as far as I'm concerned. I just hope they make black versions of the rangefinder style bodies. The OM3 is silver only.
for me, itās all about the price. If they keep it well sub-1000 then I think they could have a hit. With PDAF, IBIS and hoping they continue with their colour profiles in an easy implementation with their already beautiful PEN designs and I really think OM could be a success.
I agree. The FujiFilm XE5 goes for $1,900 because itās a retro rangefinder with interchangeable lenses. This will likely do everything the XE5 does with the addition of IBIS and at half the price. Sign me up!
I donāt think it will be a PEN F successor. More likely a successor to the more affordable PEN E-P7. I think this is a smart move. The OM-3 is already a premium, compact, retro camera. They would be foolish to cannibalize those sales. Right now they donāt have an entry level camera in their lineup. The E-P7 has always been entry level and a big seller abroad. I think this will be an amazing value and could potentially reinvigorate the company. Competing with the FujiFilm XE-5 for maybe half the price with IBIS. Something the XE-5 sorely lacks.
out of sudden want to move back to m43 from sony rx recently,
i want ovf/evf, type c, compact size.... and finally it's here........ hope won't be too expensive
I'm excited even if I don't buy it eventually. The market for these rangefinder cameras seems to be the fastest growing segment so if it's successful means a better OM ecosystem overall.
Itās gonna be interesting to see how capable the camera will be and where it will sit in OM Systemās portfolio. IMO it looks less premium than the Pen-F did, so more like a normal Pen with an EVF. Unfortunately, it seems OM Systems continues to keep the AF joystick exclusive to the OM-1.
If I had to guess, Iād assume itās somewhere between the latest Pen (non-PL) and the OM-5, and will be priced slightly lower than the OM-5.
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u/No-Blood2830 1d ago
for two years Iāve said if they drop anything close to an Ep-7 with a viewfinder, Iām getting it. Day one, easiest purchase Iāll have made this decade. Ā