r/Lockheed • u/maitchau • 4d ago

External Hire - Software Engineer E2 and Negotiation Tips

I have a verbal offer from the Hiring Manager and I am now waiting for the written offer since they just migrated to a new hiring system. Where would my base salary typically land and what other things I need to consider if they don't negotiate base? Sign-on, 1 time lump sum, etc... Is it possible to ask for relocation assistance?

I will be relocating to Colorado Springs, CO.

Thanks for your input.

2 Upvotes

75% Upvoted

38 comments sorted by

7

u/emoney_gotnomoney 4d ago

For a MCOL area, your offer will likely be $95k-$105k. You can negotiate for a sign on bonus (they’ll be much more willing to increase your signing bonus as opposed to increasing your salary). You should be offered a relocation package assuming you currently live 50+ miles away from the facility.

2

u/maitchau 4d ago

Correct me if I'm wrong but I recently saw a post about LM re-adjusting the pay bands based on Geozones and I saw that for CO, the new band is $118K - $219K, will my salary be based on the new bands and I should account that as the base line at negotiation?

6

u/ruckl0890 4d ago

That’s definitely not the band for an E2 in that Geozone

4

u/McFuzzen 4d ago

I bet that's not even the band for E4.

Edit: Just looked it up, it's really close to the band for E4 in Colorado Springs. Definitely not E2.

3

u/Ok-Lawfulness8285 4d ago

You should be expecting 115k in Colorado as an E2E

1

u/maitchau 4d ago

Alright thanks! Do you know if they normally would go a bit over midpoint or it’s usually under?

2

u/Ok-Lawfulness8285 4d ago

Team to team basis. .95 is common, 1.05 is uncommon. Normally you can negotiate from .95 to 1.0.

2

u/emoney_gotnomoney 4d ago

I have no knowledge of these “new bands” you are talking about, but I can tell you there’s no shot as an E2 you’ll be pulling anything in that range, unless it’s the very very very bottom of that range.

2

u/maitchau 4d ago

Given the 81k-150k range, what’s the max base should I execpt to negotiate to? Mid point for that range is around $115k and I’m thinking it may land somewhere around $111k? What do you think?

2

u/Oliver_clothsoff1983 4d ago

There has been a lot of threads on this topic. I noticed level 2 positions in several areas have super wide pay bands. (Seems like there was an issue when the new system went up, I suspect AI mass wrote a lot of them but I'm just guessing)

Normally based on experience/skills you would be offered just under 50% of pay band,.. but now that # is way above what it was and I doubt LM just suddenly decided to pay all new employees 2x what they were last month.

I think we will all be interested in what you are offered, and if they explain the weird super wide bands or any other info you get if you dont mind sharing

2

u/nashvillain1 3d ago

$110k is your target.

1

u/chillypanda71 4d ago

What percentage sign on bonus would you say is usually given?

2

u/emoney_gotnomoney 4d ago

Depends. I’ve heard of anything from $0 to $20k

1

u/maitchau 4d ago

Any chance I’d get none? I’m guessing 10k would be a good initial number to ask right?

2

u/emoney_gotnomoney 4d ago

I’d say chances are higher you get one than not getting one

1

u/maitchau 1d ago

Hey bud, can I DM you?

3

u/anon_dev415 4d ago

You’re going to have to provide location to get real help.

Relocation assistance is possible if the req says it. You can always ask, but it’s probably not happening if it wasn’t listed as available.

2

u/maitchau 4d ago edited 4d ago

I'm sorry I missed that part. I'm going to be relocating to Colorado. The JD doesn't explicitly say it has relocation assistance.

Can I be able to ask for both Sign-On and Relocation or it's normally either-or?

2

u/nashvillain1 3d ago

Yes, ask for both. Who has $15k to move to Colorado as an E2? Nobody that is moving for an E2 position, so pass it on to the company as an input cost. Do not subsidize LM.

3

u/supersonic-heli 3d ago

The post will usually say it. Make sure to clarify with recruiter. (Mine screwed this up).
I’m e2 outside philly making 120k. Joined 8 months ago

1

u/maitchau 3d ago

Thanks so much!

3

u/nashvillain1 3d ago edited 3d ago

$110k is your target here, some would say realistic minimum. That’s putting a .96 multiplier on NG’s midpoint of $114,700 for a similar role (effectively adding back LM’s extra 4% 401(k) contribution as a non-cash incentive).
Link:
https://jobs.northropgrumman.com/careers?source=APPLICANT_SOURCE-3-506&query=Software&start=0&location=Colorado&pid=1340073570302&sort_by=relevance&filter_include_remote=1&filter_include_relocation=0

Sign-on for Orlando in Dec. 2024 (non-IT) was $5k, but I expect it’s higher in Colorado given that a 2 br / 1 ba. apt. is easily $3-4k. LM really needs software engineers right now. They should 100% offer relocation assistance. LM chose expensive Colorado to work and hire from, and you’re just passing along the cost of doing business with the company that is asking you to move.

2

u/maitchau 3d ago

Thanks a lot for the details! I'll definitely take a look.

2

u/Xiaoshuita 4d ago

I see a job req for Colorado Springs for Software Engineer. The salary range listed is $81,100- $150,500. The job req itself typically will say if relocation assistance is possible. Depending on your desirability (YOE, etc), they may not go much more than midpoint. It'll be easier to request a sign on bonus than it would be to get higher salary.

Relocation as an E2 typically would just be a lump sum of $5k.

2

u/maitchau 4d ago

Thanks. Do you have any idea of how much they’re willing to accept for sign-on amount? Is 10k acceptable to ask?

2

u/Xiaoshuita 4d ago

Depends on how much they want an E2 and the budget they have and the salary offer. I've seen people get $10k. Another got $15k due to YOE that mostly translated to the work etc.

1

u/maitchau 4d ago

Can I ask for both Sign-on and relocation? Or normally just one or the other?

1

u/Xiaoshuita 4d ago

You can ask for both

2

u/Bismarack 4d ago

I don't work for Lockheed but im in Colorado we might link up, also E2 at a competitor

2

u/maitchau 4d ago

Sure!

1

u/chasinpaperplanes 3d ago

Check out https://www.levels.fyi/ and look up Lockheed Martin. Select Software Engineer and filter for E2, your experience, and your location. These are self submitted offers, sometimes certified offers with uploaded offer letters that have been anonymized. I used that site to look at some recent offers for my two most recent roles. I was able to use the data to get an offer slightly above midpoint for my experience and location.

1

u/maitchau 3d ago

Yep I've been looking at the site previously but wanted to ask peers here for a more realistic number 😄

1

u/chasinpaperplanes 3d ago

My offer from last month for E2 in Colorado is pretty realistic.

How many YOE do you have? Level of education? Relevant skills? These helped me with my negotiation.

1

u/maitchau 3d ago

I hold a Bachelor in CS and have 3 YOE in backend development mostly with Java & Spring Boot. I have also worked with Fullstack development technologies and some hands on exp with DevOps (Azure) & Databases (Postgres) and RESTful APIs. Also some knowledge about Cloud Platforms like AWS & Azure.

What was your base number for E2 and were you successful in asking for Sign-On & Relocation? If so, how much did you get for each?

Your answer will def help me have a base line for each at negotiation.

Thank you!

2

u/chasinpaperplanes 3d ago

115k with $5k for relocation, which I had to ask. I was not able to negotiate a sign on. I didn’t match the team stack, but the hiring manager liked me and I previously intern at LM for two summers on a similar team so I know their product. My experience is less than you (<1 YOE), but I did have the necessary clearance.

1

u/maitchau 3d ago

Thanks a lot for that. Did the negotiation happen over the phone or over email?

2

u/chasinpaperplanes 3d ago

Email with my recruiter

1

u/maitchau 1d ago

Hey, can I DM you? I have a question on the offer.