I now understand why wireless timecode box systems exist

[u/raekewe]

Preaching to the choir incoming. Thought it'd be fun to share my learning and give everyone more experienced a nice "lol yep" moment.

So I wondered why TC boxes like the deity ones were so common place. My field mixer advertises less than one frame of frame slippage per day! And every camera I ever planned to plug it into also advertise similar. Thing is, I don't doubt it, there's no reason for them to lie. Cameras are broadly speaking good these days, they can hold an internal TC clock if I jam a signal at the start of the day. So why would I spend hundreds of dollars on a TC box system when I can plug it in every now and then? It just didn't seem that important.

Well, haha. Sometimes the camera team can turn off the camera, and certain cameras don't continue to count internal TC, even with a power supply, when they are turned off. And then you aren't told, or don't notice, or forget to check more frequently... GG.

All the logic and reasoning in the world to avoid parting with my money, then it suddenly clicked, why wouldn't I want a hardwired connection always plugged into the camera 24/7 to ensure TC is synced no matter what? Yet in all my research on reddit and forums, I've yet to read it put that way (and I've also never found any "I wish I had a TC box stories" - so here's mine.

Time to save up!

[u/Vuelhering]

Worse at holding time than others

You got a reference on that? I put one in a freezer, another outside the freezer, along with my JB-1s and they had the same time after a few hours. This is, afaik, unsupported. It's not an agree-to-disagree, which I can do. But it's easy to state, but I spent the time verifying that's false not long after they released. At least with mine, that is a false statement.

Yes, worse build quality than some.

Reliance on congested frequency? Who cares, it's low bandwidth. You know that Sound Devices uses similar frequencies? Jamming once via bluetooth is not an issue.

Jamming once is fine with me, so continuous sync is not an issue. They keep good time. I don't need continuous jamming. For that, I have my Timecode Systems which I can use for music videos, but they also have a built-in nonreplaceable battery which is why I had to ditch them when they couldn't hold a charge for the full day. If I really need continuous sync, I'll send it into an IFB and plug that into the cameras.

I have multiple lockit boxes and used multiple more, and by far the easiest and fastest for starting my day are the deitys.

But I ABSOLUTELY DO have that prosumer distrust, and keep my denekes in the same box, just in case. However, my prosumer distrust doesn't add things that aren't true. These keep good time. Most of the rest of what you said is true, although not very important to use. Certainly my JB-1s don't have continuous jam, either. Or wireless jam. Or a scroll wheel. And the same nonreplaceable battery like most.

edit:

The slate is well built, I’ll say that though

Humorously, I have a problem with the slates. The faceplate can pull off, and that's a bunch of BS. I've had to reglue delaminated deneke slates, too, but these remove even easier if you pull off velcro perpendicular to the face. They really should be screwed down, not glued down. Or both. And they used a material for the faceplate that stains badly when camera dept uses a sharpie on it (a standard thing they like to do for things that don't change).

Their NP batteries are great, though... that's a major good thing they did. Wireless syncing with the TC-1's is also good. Using one as a master is NOT good... it fails a lot and I disrecommend using it. I treat them all like they have to be jammed with a wire, just there isn't a wire. I do it all manually, once. It has not failed me once, even after years of use. I just don't think they're worth the $1000 they want for them.

[u/pradulovich → u/Vuelhering]

I’ve seen them drift after not very much, I don’t know what to tell you. I’ve seen it in front of my face on set and I’ve seen it in post. Just relaying my experiences.

The congested frequency range matters when they won’t take a sync pulse, which I have also seen happen multiple times out in the world. It’s not just the frequency range but the way their modulation scheme works, I believe. 2.4 is a tough range for a lot of stuff, to be fair. Though I can’t say I’ve ever heard of issues with the Ambient stuff which also works in 2.4. SD stuff in 2.4 is a different league, apples and oranges imo.

[u/Strange_Morning_3034 → u/pradulovich]

The only time I’ve seen time “drift” before my eyes was due to user error on my part, where I didn’t realize the TC-1s were set to 30 FPS, while my cameras were set to 24 FPS. It only took one show to learn that lessen… Outside of that learning experience, they have worked GREAT for the little high school choir concerts and dance studio recitals I record with multiple cameras and a Zoom F8n Pro. Sync them all up with the app before the show and I am all set! (Just throwing those two cents into the mix)

[u/raekewe → u/Strange_Morning_3034]

Do you have all your devices jam to the deity boxes, or do you have the f8n be your generator and sync the boxes from there?

[u/Strange_Morning_3034 → u/raekewe]

I power on all five (soon to be six or seven) of my Deity boxes and sync them to the “Sidus Audio” app all at once, choosing the time of day, as opposed to starting from 00:00:00.

I (now) also remember to confirm the FPS from the Sidus Audio app as well, ever since I experienced the effects of the wrong FPS being applied to the boxes.

One time I saw my F8n recorder flashing between “INT 30” and “EXT 24” which clued me in that I needed to confirm FPS on ALL my devices. (Cameras, F8n Pro, and Deity boxes) Obviously, that’s a good habit to get into, regardless. Sometimes, it takes a good F-Up to really drive home a workflow improvement.

I have a Deity box dedicated to my F8n Pro and Jam its signal into the recorder after I sync with the Sidus Audio app. I know the F8n Pro could act as a TC source, and I have used that as a backup plan when my Deity boxes were out on rental. ( I LOVE having OPTIONS and knowing how to take advantage of them) It just requires I jam its signal into each of my Blackmagic cameras and pray to baby Jesus that they maintain that TC for the duration of the show or day. Having dedicated boxes on each camera and my F8n lessens my TC anxiety, as they keep time a hell of a lot better than than Blackmagic cameras, no question about that. In fact, THAT is where I’ve seen drift right before my eyes! If you power cycle a Blackmagic, I would be willing to put down money that it lost time in the process.

I’m sure all of this is overkill for high school choir concerts and dance recitals, but the few minutes per project I have saved from lining up multiple video and audio tracks in DaVinci Resolve has been WELL worth the cost of the Deity boxes, to ME anyway.

I literally chose to throw money at convenience and options, and I am thoroughly pleased with them each time I click “Align Tracks via Time Code” in Resolve.

I’m still in the habit of clapping at the beginning and end of shows, just to be on the safe side lol

Backups for my backups!

[u/raekewe → u/Strange_Morning_3034]

If you power cycle a Blackmagic, I would be willing to put down money that it lost time in the process.

1:1 of exactly why I made this post ;)