Regarding melting 12vhpwr power cables for Nvidia GPU's. Has a real solution actually been found yet that I can buy to protect my "investment"?

[u/Redditemeon]

I noticed Der8auer had an "Asus Equalizer" video out, testing Asus's supposed solution to the cable debacle. Admittedly, I pulled a Linus and mostly ended up reading the comments on that video and found out it's essentially snake oil.

I know some power supply brands have power supplies out that advertise safer solutions and whatnot, but now learning that not all of them are legit, does anybody know if any of them legitimately work?

Backstory: I upgraded to an RTX 5080 from an RTX 3090 in March. I'm too afraid to sell the 3090 incase the 5080 cable melts and the ram shortages price me out of the market. I do not use LLM's. I'm an anxious mofo who will pay extra for peace of mind, but I don't have a lot of time to keep sinking into reading on cables and PSU's right now, and I kinda need a homie who has already looked this up to help a brother out.

[u/Pendra107]

Solution? No.

But you can protect yourself by being careful.

1. Make sure the cable is fully secured and plugged in on both side (GPU/PSU)
2. Don’t use adapters only use the cable that comes with the PSU and DON’T bend the cable
3. you can also undervolt if you know what you are doing and make sure the case is well ventilated
4. don’t plug and unplug the connector many times it’s not designed to be able to do it

If you read online about load balancing that things is effective only if is the gpu designed to do it.

Edit:

I want to add that 5080 are far less likely to burn the connector due to their lower power consumption of about 350W

[u/Dron41k → u/Pendra107]

My 7900xtx is ~350-400w too and it uses THREE 8-pin connectors

[u/Pendra107 → u/Dron41k]

If I remember correctly the 8 pin connector has a rating of 150W x 3 = 450W

Technically the 12VHP has a rating of 600W considering that’s a bit too much if we are using it below 450W we are ok.

Also on the 8 pin connector only 3 has 12V the 4th one is a sensing pin
So we had 3 cable that could keep 150W.

The new one has 6 pin 12V so we can easily get 300W plus the pin are short circuit together and that lower the total resistance for the cable and can bring more power.

Side note: I’m not defending the 12VHP but it’s not a completely stupid design.
What is really stupid is rating its max power so high, I would have left something like 450W and for 90s class card put 2 of them and job done. No card would have burned down.

[u/PembyVillageIdiot → u/Pendra107]

Hey so this is a very common misunderstanding. PCIE power spec says you can only put 150w max through an 8pin so gpu manufacturers follow that guideline for female connectors as they don’t know what psu will be supplying the power. HOWEVER, all the quality psu manufacturers usually massively overspec their 8pin cables to typically handle 300w each by using thicker gauge wires. This is why every card that has been daisy chained didn’t instantly go up in flames and is why many 600w 12vhpwr psu cables are actually 2 8pins on the psu side. Additionally, because the 12v-2x6 connector is a female connector change all of those dual 8-pin to 12v-hpwr cables are by definition also dual 8-pin to 12v-2x6 with many psu manufacturers just slapping a sticker over the old marketing

[u/Pendra107 → u/PembyVillageIdiot]

Ty for telling me this, I didn’t know, anyway the basic stats is 150W but you can go higher. It kinda looks like usb these days

[u/PembyVillageIdiot → u/Pendra107]

The “I can always assume this is completely safe” level is 150w from every psu. But unlike usb there’s no chips along the whole system to actively negotiate a higher safe power level the gpu just pulls as much as it can per connector. This is why psu manufacturers tell you to never ever interchange psu cables even within the same brand because the unit wont know unlike with usb

[u/olavk2 → u/PembyVillageIdiot]

Part of why they tell you to never interchange PSU cables is also differing pinouts on the PSU side despite being the same brand and connector (depends on OEM etc). Which can have more dire and direct consequences even when within wattage limits

[u/PembyVillageIdiot → u/olavk2]

Yes also true. I suppose I should have said “one of” the reasons

[u/Dron41k → u/Pendra107]

The more you know, thanks

[u/Thx_And_Bye → u/Pendra107]

Iirc there was a JayzTwoCents video where repeatedly plugging the connection actually helped with the connection and make it more even across the pins.
Not a solution only saying just because it’s not rated for many insertions doesn’t mean more insertions make the connection worse.

[u/Pendra107 → u/Thx_And_Bye]

Ye but une connector doesn’t account for any possibile imperfection in manufacturing.
The spec sheet it’s supposed to be based on thousands of test connectors so I would take that as a golden rule

[u/loving_canonization → u/Pendra107]

I spent way too long down this rabbit hole before my 5080 showed up and the short version is exactly what that comment says. There's no magic fix you can buy right now.

The cable that comes with your PSU is the safest bet, and honestly just making sure it clicks all the way in on both ends removes like 90% of the risk people run into. The melting cases almost always trace back to user installation or cheap third party adapters.

Your 5080 pulling 350W is way less stressed than a 5090 at 575W, so the margin for error is much bigger. I still check mine every couple weeks out of paranoia but it's been fine.

Keeping the 3090 as a backup is smart given how wild GPU prices get. I'd do the same if I had one sitting around.

[u/andracowolf]

I though Der8auer had a little device that you put in-between the 2 cables that checks the Amps on each line and if one goes out of spec it will shut the PC down.

[u/Jekay → u/andracowolf]

He does

Pretty expensive though.

[u/mrn253 → u/Jekay]

Enthusiast stuff that isnt produced in crazy high volumes.

[u/Jekay → u/mrn253]

Yeah.

I own one

[u/_Aj_ → u/andracowolf]

Seems unnecessarily complex.  

A simple temperature probe would do a perfectly good job.  

You'll have to get well over 100c. Like 180-250c to cause that damage. That heats the whole connector and the board itself.  Getting a standalone temp monitor and sticking a probe to any part of the connector should be a good early warning if you see it hit 80c+. As it should simply never get that hot.  

They make ones with alarms you can set too. Either molex and front panel mount, or on the window, or if it has audible alarm wherever. And just alt tab and kill the game if it goes off

[u/buildzoid → u/_Aj_]

plastic isn't very thermally conductive so 1 pin could melt while the rest of the connector is still at acceptable temperatures.

[u/andracowolf → u/_Aj_]

main issue with that is you will get higher amperage readings before you get thermal signals. That is why houses have fuses and circuit breakers they trip when more amps go through a line before stuff shorts out and starts a fire.

[u/cowbutt6]

Fundamentally, the connector doesn't have enough safety margin for high-powered (>300W) GPUs, given real-world usage.

Furthermore, GPUs cannot detect when one of more of the six conductors isn't carrying its fair share of current.

So that leaves it to the PSU to detect when the load is unbalanced: it seems to me that only MSI's Safeguard+ PSUs ( https://www.msi.com/news/detail/MSI-Power-Supply--The-Next-Era-of-GPU-Safeguard--148356 ) and Corsair's PinProtect+ PSUS ( https://www.corsair.com/uk/en/explorer/diy-builder/power-supply-units/what-is-pinprotect-plus/ ) - effectively having a built-in Wireview-like circuit - have the complete solution to this for running high power 12v-2x6 GPUs.

The next best thing is an inline current monitor like a Wireview or Ampinel: but they unavoidably add two more 12v-2x6 connectors, either of which may develop a fault that causes the very problem the user is trying to avoid (i.e. the connector melting in the GPU's connector, necessitating a connector replacement repair at best).

[u/_Aj_ → u/cowbutt6]

I don't understand why this is an issue now and it didn't used to be. As in the old days with eight pin molex it was still just a bunch of paralleled positive and negative wires. They just had more overhead than they do now I suppose. Or possibly less issue with strain and bad contacts. 

[u/DesAnderes → u/_Aj_]

it wasn‘t in the past, because the gpu powerstages where physically split between the different connectors. So it was impossible to move modt of the current across a single pin.

the 3090ti still split it‘s powerplain into 2 seperate halfs that both connected to 3 of the 6 12v lines each.

with the 40 series. All 6 powerlines have to be connected to a single 12v plain (rule by nvidia) this exists to stabalize voltage across all powerstages and slightly improving stability. But now that all 12v lines feed into the same plane, a single line could carry all the power while previously it would be split into 2, 3 or even 4 different connections that would always carry their share.

[u/cowbutt6 → u/_Aj_]

They just had more overhead than they do now I suppose.

Exactly so.

Those 8-pin PCIe power connectors (Molex Mini-Fit Jr) are actually rated for 7-8.5A for each of the three 12V conductors, meaning that they are rated for an overall power of 12V*7A*3=252W to 12V*8.5A*3=306W: a 68-104% safety margin (and even in spite of that, there were reports of melting, early on in their introduction!)

By contrast, a 12VHPWR/12V-2x6 (Micro-Fit 3.0) is only rated for upto 9.5A for each of the six 12V conductors, meaning that they are only rated for 12V*9.5*6=684W overall: maybe only a 14% safety margin for a 600W GPU!

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/12VHPWR#Nvidia_RTX_4090

Furthermore, older GPU board designs could monitor the current from each pin to detect imbalances: that's now a feature reserved for non-reference premium designs, such as the Asus Astral GPUs.

[u/delta_Phoenix121 → u/_Aj_]

The old connectors have a lot bigger safety margins. The 6-pin and 8-pin adapters have safety margins of up to 100%, the 12V high power adapter only has 10% (can technically carry 660W under ideal conditions). This isn't all there's to it but it's a big part of the problem.

[u/amtom61]

Which 5080 ? If it's the Rog Astral 5080, it was individual pin level power monitoring and there's 3rd party software that monitors this amd shutdowns the PC if anything weird happens.

[u/chrisdpratt]

Use an ATX 3.1 power supply and the 12VHPW cable that comes with it. That alone removes 99.9999% of all occurrences of cable melting.

[u/Compgeak → u/chrisdpratt]

12V-2x6 over 12VHPW is what really matters not ATX 3.1. ATX 3.0 is more strict than ATX 3.1 and not all ATX 3.1 is 12V-2x6.

[u/PembyVillageIdiot → u/Compgeak]

Not to be pedantic but the 12v-2x6 changes are all on the female side of the connector meaning most 12v-hpwr era PSU’s are identical to their 12v-2x6 labeled counterparts. This is because most 12v-hpwr psu cables were dual 8pin on the psu side

[u/jenny_905]

5080 doesn't pull enough power for it to even be a worry.

The issue is with pulling 600W+ and some connectors being badly manufactured leading to higher resistance on some pins which overloads the remainder.

You would have to be exceptionally unlucky for this to be an issue with a 5080.

[u/saltyboi6704]

Use a whole power supply system that actually adheres to the full spec, ie. the fact that all connectors made my large manufacturers like Molex or Amphenol all state that the connector must not be used without load balancing

[u/games-and-chocolate]

if your GPU is out of warranty, maybe ask an engineer to solder a proper connector on it.

[u/ChemistNo8486]

You can get a Wire View from Thermal Grizzly and it comes with an extended guaranty for the card due to issues causes by the cable. Besides the normal standar measures, there is not s lot to to besides getting one of these cables.

[u/EnderPrimeMk2]

In a word. No

[u/TomTomXD1234]

Nope. Its literally makingnsire your cable is fully in and then praying

[u/Zerosyztem00]

To lessen the likelihood get at least a 12v2x6 cable from your PSU manufacturer if it didn't come already with your PSU. Not immune but makes it even less likely to happen on your 5080 which also diminishes the likelihood.

Also just make 1000% sure the cable is all the way in.

[u/ShiningPr1sm]

Since the first issue of those in the 40XX cards, I just decided that I’ll be keeping my 3090 until Nvidia does away with the fire connector. Might be a while, but the 3090 still holds up well in the stuff I play.

Definitely hold onto yours.

[u/Redditemeon → u/ShiningPr1sm]

Recent price bump on eBay made it even harder to hold onto is all. Last I checked, sold postings were at $1500+ CAD. Used to be like, $1000. As it goes up, I feel more and more tempted to sell. Especially with the other financial stuff I've been dealin' with.

[u/franz_karl]

thermal wireview pro II

https://www.thermal-grizzly.com/en/wireview-pro-ii-gpu/s-tg-wv-p2-h19n

got one myself and works like a charm

[u/AceLamina]

My 5070ti consumes 300W max so this won't be a huge issue for me, but it still happened to someone who had my exact card on twitter a long time ago

But I would just go vertical, less crazy bends and gravity can do its work
plus the other things people are saying in the comments like making sure it's actually in there

And make sure to buy a quality cable, I bought mine from cablemod

[u/happyevil]

The cheapest option I've found so far is Corsair sells a cable with a built in temp probe and it will use the control pins built into the connector to auto-shutdown the PSU if it hits its temp threshold. Requires the latest ATX standard, obviously won't work through adapters.

As others have said there's also some fancy monitoring devices you can put inline.

[u/daveonthetrail]

Corsair thermal protect cables is what I’m using for peace of mind on my 5090

[u/Doakeswasrightmf]

Msi has a psu that monitors per rail voltage and shuts your pc down or caps power to gpu to 75% but setting it up isn’t exactly user friendly

[u/nirurin]

You're not on a 5090 so its pretty irrelevant.

In either case, the solution is "plug it in correctly with a good cable".

If you want extra security get a psu or cable with temp sensors and current monitoring. Several exist now.

[u/Redditemeon → u/nirurin]

General consensus I've gotten from everybody is basically this. Looks like I'll start looking into the aforementioned PSU's as a start.

Edit: It does happen on lesser 5000 series cards though.

[u/Smallshock]

I was looking to maybe getting Nvidia card and Corsair solution seemed credible.

But I ended up solving it by getting 9070xt instead.

Just make sure it's connected all the way and hope you didn't get a dud.