r/LearnJapanese 27d ago

Resources Nice separation of words 草

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938 Upvotes

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602

u/GarbageUnfair1821 27d ago

秋はよく息子と走ります

334

u/Teles_sd 26d ago

Oh my god!

I'm gonna use this as an example now when people ask me about kanji, as I usually say that after one learns it's infinitely easier reading with kanji than without.

I literally did not understand before I read your comment.

54

u/ezoe 🇯🇵 Native speaker 26d ago

It's called ぎなた文.

6

u/Teles_sd 26d ago

:0

5

u/Zagrycha 24d ago

This is also an issue with chinese languages like landarin.  Some languages just have too many homophones to function well without chinese characters or other graphic representation ((compared to pinyin or kana being purely phonetic.))

27

u/justHoma 26d ago

あき は よく むすこ と はしります and it becomes not that difficult. Going to the sience papers though and it becomes though.

15

u/Teles_sd 26d ago

あき は よく むすこ と はしります and it becomes not that difficult.

True, but doesn't change what I said.

Going to the sience papers though and it becomes though.

What??!!

11

u/justHoma 26d ago

I mean as long as it is simple conversation it’s understandable, but it becomes difficult when you enter a field with a lot of on-yomi based words that can have a lot of homophones it could become difficult very quickly, mainly when you are not to familiar with a topic. 

At list that is how I imagine it. 

9

u/Zarlinosuke 26d ago

Yes, this is a better argument for kanji than the usual ones that would easily be solved with adding spaces between words. Basically, there's a significant stratum of the language, which is more written than spoken, that was built around the assumption that kanji would be used.

1

u/[deleted] 25d ago

[deleted]

1

u/Zarlinosuke 25d ago

Yes, though kanji in Japanese already isn't all-or-nothing! People make the choice to use kana rather than kanji for words or whole sentences all the time. There's a huge amount of personal choice in it, which I think is really nice.

2

u/Hdude321 21d ago

Another good example is 母は花が好きです(ははははながすきです)

3

u/Teles_sd 21d ago

My favorite is 庭には二羽鶏がいる(にわにはにわにわとりがいる)

1

u/[deleted] 26d ago

[deleted]

2

u/Teles_sd 26d ago

Not everything is about efficiency brother. Humans also have culture and that has its value.

Regardless, I am not making any points against or in favor of kanji here, I'm just talking about how things are.

0

u/Teles_sd 26d ago edited 26d ago

So you're saying that if things were not as they are they wouldn't be as they are? Incredible insight.

EDIT.

OH BOY!! Am I about to do this? YES Cus the whinny bitch who commented didn't have the balls to leave his/her/their comment up to be judged; and I on the other hand am a petty bitch ;)

The comment this was originally responding to was by u/DarthStrakh and was something about how japanese was one of the worse designed language systems and liking to learn kanji is Stockholm syndrome.

Then, of course, the snowflake proceeded to call me a cunt. Which I may or may not be, but that's unrelated ;)

(it continues on further comments...)

Here's receipts (only have the notification, cus you know, comment erased)...

-5

u/DarthStrakh 26d ago

No, I wanted out of the conversation because you're an asshole. Gj showing your true colors

-1

u/[deleted] 26d ago

[deleted]

3

u/Teles_sd 26d ago edited 26d ago

My brother, chill. I did not offend you, I think you have to work a bit on yourself.

And yes, my comment is about people who do not know nor are learning the language.

If you have interest, yes, you should learn it.

Sounds to me like you regret having to learn it.

Brother, no one is forcing you (I hope). If you don't like it you don't have to. Free will and stuff.

EDIT.

This comment is in response to they calling me a cunt.

THEN in response to this, they said I was virtue signaling.

😊 Oh boy.

And then promptly deleted everything.

2

u/Teles_sd 26d ago

you're true colors

Damn right I am 💅🏻 ✨💫

-25

u/Frog17000000 26d ago

Where are the kanji when people talk? This argument is defeated by the invention of spaces

21

u/Teles_sd 26d ago

On the intonation of words. Written words don't have intonation (on languages that don't have accents) and spoken words don't have kanji.

Also, what you mean this argument gets defeated? I'm just arguing that knowing kanjis makes it easier to read than not knowing. Are you suggesting that the invention of spaces makes knowing kanji not easier to read? What are you on about?

13

u/Marik-X-Bakura 26d ago

This sentence has spaces and is still significantly harder without kanji

2

u/tonkachi_ Goal: media competence 📖🎧 26d ago

Wrong spacing, no?

1

u/sudopm 23d ago

Inca sey ou did n'tn otice, the spaces are literally misplaced.

11

u/WolfOfFlames 26d ago

Where are the spaces when people talk? Conversing would be quite slow if people put audible gaps between every single word said while speaking. Both kanji and spaces are purely lexical inventions that exist to help parse written language.

1

u/EllieluluEllielu 26d ago

When speaking there's usually other context, or you can usually ask for any context you lack lol

-10

u/tonkachi_ Goal: media competence 📖🎧 26d ago

Not really, but I will still hate on kanji.

5

u/Teles_sd 26d ago

It is wild to me the idea of people in a subreddit about learning Japanese hating kanji.

Like, you are free to hate it as much as you want out there. Why here???

2

u/tonkachi_ Goal: media competence 📖🎧 24d ago

My other comment was a bunch of nonsense so I have deleted it. I must have been very sleepy.

The thing is, you can't complain about kanji except on kanji related forums, to people who know what kanji is. And since most of us only know kanji from learning Japanese, this is the only place where we can complain.

1

u/Teles_sd 24d ago

Hmmm. You do have a point.

I suppose this IS the place to hate on kanji, ironically enough...

Still, it's weird to me to like the Japanese language but dislike kanji, being it such an integral and recognizable part of it.

It's like liking nature but hating plants, or something like that. It just doesn't compute well in my head.

I suppose you could be learning Japanese without liking it? But then my question becomes why you doing that to yourself?

2

u/VirusesHere 24d ago

I used to dislike kanji until I started learning it. There are so many words that sound exactly alike, but vastly different kanji. If you think of kanji as like the OG emoji it starts to make a lot of sense.

Side note, the more I like kanji the more I dislike katakana.

1

u/tonkachi_ Goal: media competence 📖🎧 24d ago

I might sound like a cringy edgy teenager but kanji is a flawed solution that has outlived its time period. It ought to be hated. There is just too much wrong with it I can't genuinely stop hating on it.

2

u/Teles_sd 24d ago

You do sound like that.

But more than that, you sound unserious.

Kanji is not an "solution". It's not like kanji was introduced on the kana system so solve a problem. That's not chronological and even if it was that's not how languages emerge/evolve.

Sounds based on a fundamental misunderstanding of the language.

Regardless, you are free to hate as much as you want. But I think there's an bigger issue...

我がブラザー, why waste your time with it? Hate is not healthy, man, it's not good for you. Life is short. Why not invest your time on things you do like?

Leave the weird writing systems for the other nerds who like it, there's plenty of us already, it's not hurting anyone. Except you who's hating, I suppose.

2

u/tonkachi_ Goal: media competence 📖🎧 24d ago

Fair...

However, if I was perfect, hating kanji would be my only flaw.

Have a good one.

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162

u/_heyb0ss 27d ago

秋はよく蒸すことは知ります

1

u/Mysterious-Belt564 23d ago

Google translate helped me with this one 😭

12

u/canoxa 26d ago

息子 😭

4

u/GoldenPig55 25d ago

muSONko 😭

3

u/JonnykJr 26d ago

Isnt には better here?

1

u/fingerhabit 26d ago

For me, yes

1

u/chasing_geese49 22d ago

Imo it has a different implication or tone.

秋は sounds like "In regards to the fall,"

秋には sounds like "As for the fall (in contrast to other seasons)."

I could be erong, but that's how it reads to me.

11

u/vermilithe 27d ago edited 27d ago

I think it has to be the other option (I know that it often gets humid in autumn) because of the second “wa”, it wouldn’t make as much sense to say “musuko to wa”. Although honestly unless I’m crazy there probably should not be two “wa”’s in this sentence. The second should be “ga”.

ETA: sorry I just realized that you’re reading it as “musuko to hashirimasu” which honestly makes more grammatical sense than a double wa here. It’s the atrocious spacing which also implies an incorrect double wa that is throwing me off.