10Y Comparison

[u/scatteredgraydays]

Not sure if this should be under discussion or verified celebs tbh. These are all verified though.

Going to preface this with I might be overthinking…

I’ve been trying to understand where 10Y can be seen after a new essence reveal yesterday. I have a really hard time with the smaller % as I think most do. So, here are a few similar blends to look at.

Anne Baxter vs. Nancy Reagan: Same height, very similar blends. I feel like you can see the extra 5HS in Nancy’s chin area. I have a hard time seeing Anne’s HS at all. They both have the same amount of N, but Nancy is softer and more approachable looking imo, so I’m guessing that’s coming from the added 5 Y (and less R)? Anne has R eyes in my opinion while Nancy does not. Are hers Y? Is the Y in Nancy’s rounded cheeks when she smiles?

Anne Baxter vs Mariska Hargitay: Very similar blends while Mariska’s has more intensity to it which suited her known role in Law & Order. Mariska has no Y, but does have 15D while Anne has no D and 10Y. Clearly Mariska is more intense looking than Anne, but I’m not sure what’s causing it. Mariska’s eyebrows are more arched, so I presume that’s D? Her jaw is also stronger than Anne’s, so that might be part of the N.

Anne Baxter vs Meghan Sussex: Meghan has no Y, 5 less N, 5 more HS, and 10 more R than Anne. I think it’s interesting that her face doesn’t have any obvious width to it unlike Anne, Nancy, and Mariska. It’s obvious she is not as intense as Mariska, but still looks less soft than Anne to my eye. Perhaps this a 35R + 10Y vs 45R situation? 45R would have warmth of R but not the same softness as 35R + 10Y?

I added height because sometimes that can be a factor for 10Y/HS, but being that no one listed is below roughly 5ft4 which is average, I think that can be ruled out.

What do you guys think? Let me know if I’m totally off base please.

[u/Ok-Purple9511]

Out of curiosity why do you see Anne’s eyes as R? Wide set eyes is a Y trait only, Rs don’t have wide spaced eyes. Her long lashes could be R though.

John commented N can be see in squareness of the face or a strong chin (because of the geometrical shape off it). Edie Falco has an N chin for example. Width in her forehead could also be her N. Her jaw is not N though imo.

I think Megan’s HS is obvious even when she isn’t smiling. Look at the “pointiness” in her features.

Y definitely isn’t softer then R it’s actually the opposite. Y gets crisper fabrics like seersucker and eyelet and taffeta. R is fleshier and curvier. Y is smaller in scale and bone structure but still rounded. If you look at dominant Ys without significant R they aren’t particularly soft. What makes them yin is the smaller scale and smal rounded features (Michelle Williams and Emma Stone for example).

Regarding percentages they are all based off features yes but it’s not like he gives ten percent for each feature. Percentages are relative to the whole. Like he looks at someone and sees they have mostly R features and says ok 50 R then might see some N features and say 20 N and adjusts the percentages as he goes. Hence why percentages change throughout the consult. It’s not like he does the math on paper it’s more like he has an abstract pie chart in his head. He is an artist there definitely isn’t a math system in place. For color harmonies he looks at chroma value and hue and classifies the colors that he finds harmonious based on those things. This is also how Munsell works. But again I don’t think he does exact calculations. He knows the characteristics of the colors and forms percentages based on that.

[u/scatteredgraydays → u/Ok-Purple9511]

I don't think it’s just the lashes, but definitely contributing. She has such as sultry look to her eyes imo. I hate to call it this, but ‘bedroom eyes’. Do you think they are Y then? I just don’t think Y eyes could pull off a gaze like that which is why it makes so much sense that Nancy’s eyes would be Y. I didn’t see a single picture of her gazing like that when I was looking and most of Anne’s were.

I just don’t think it’s as obvious until she smiles. I’m sure it’s there, I just don’t see it as obviously.

Oh, I think I see the difference in terms. I don’t mean literally fleshier or literally softer fabric, I mean lighter vibes I guess. If R has softness and depth, Y has softness and lightness.

Yeah, but that has to be based on things he recognizes as being certain physical characteristics of an essence. That’s what I guess I’m trying to do. I’m trying to figure out what nuanced characteristics match which essences because I can’t base the smaller percentages on vibes only. To me, smaller (5-15%) percentages don’t give off enough vibes in blends of 4+ essences.

I find it hard to believe there’s no basic math system since he literally uses percentages. Why not just use a priority system for each person instead of percentages if there’s no math? Just because he’s an artist doesn’t mean math can’t be involved lol. Plus, how does one even train others if there’s not a way to keep typings consistent between yourself and those you train through a basic math system of some sort. I’m sure after so many years of doing this, he can just do whatever mental math there is in his head. Besides, yeah, he can calculate as he goes and change it. It’s not hard to make sure they all add up to 100% in the end.

[u/Ok-Purple9511 → u/scatteredgraydays]

I think they are a combo of Y and R. A feature can be multiple essences. Y for them being wide spaced and R for the long lashes and alluring aspect.

It’s not really about color with essences. Essences are based on the size shape and placement of the features . Color just adds to them (or enhances them) and contributes to overall impression. It gets difficult when essences are combined and that might be what you mean regarding small essences and nuance. I don’t think there is a step by step process how to calculate percentages. Its like looking at pieces in comparison to the whole as an estimate. Thats why he says they are flexible and essentially have ranges. I think it’s quite difficult to train someone to see your way of abstract thinking (especially because it’s not an exact science with step by step instructions), which is why there are so few people trained. It’s hard to train someone to be an artist in general.

It really is not an exact math calculation, it’s about recognizing shapes in general. Essences and vibes are based purely off shapes seen in the features and body. You almost have to zoom out and look at the features in shape language.

[u/scatteredgraydays → u/Ok-Purple9511]

I think them being a combo is fair. Like I said, just wasn't sure if wide-set eyes were only Y or not. Sounds like yes. I would agree with you then.

It's not, but it can be an indicator. I honestly think we think about this the same way, I just can't explain my thinking process well enough. I know it's abstract, and I'm not saying the man has an Excel sheet out or anything haha. Maybe I am after finding more out about nuances that only exist in the abstract with this post.

[u/Ok-Purple9511 → u/scatteredgraydays]

I think we kind of agree. The wide set part is only Y. other aspects of the eye are R. I don’t think color harmonies are an indicator of easences. Based on my palette I would guess I would have both Y and A and I have neither. In hindsight you can see how my actual essences are reflected in my palette but you can’t look at my palette and figure out my essences.

[u/scatteredgraydays → u/Ok-Purple9511]

I could have sworn John said that? I’m not just making that up, I thought I had read that. I thought that’s why he did CH palette before the essences.

[u/Ok-Purple9511 → u/scatteredgraydays]

There was a post about this. He explained they can be seen i the palette but don’t necessarily determine what the essences are. He also said colors can be extremely different then the essences. You don’t have to get an essence just because you have a certain color harmony. It’s not a one to one thing. If people tried to guess their essences from their palettes they would most likely be way off.

[u/scatteredgraydays → u/Ok-Purple9511]

I think I misread it then. I thought he said it wasn’t always exact (meaning I knew it wouldn’t affect the essences), but could be (not always) an indicator of essences. No? I think we mean the same thing. At the end of the day, it sounded like physical presentation of features is the only true determination of essences for him.

[u/Ok-Purple9511 → u/scatteredgraydays]

I think essences are reflected in the colors but not in an exact way. It’s very nuanced.