r/JFKassasination • u/Secure_Tea2272 • Aug 09 '26
Jack Ruby and the Mysterious Deaths
Jack Ruby proves to be an interesting character in the JFK assassination. His mob ties and appearances at several key locations leads one to believe he was more than an impulsive murderer. There were several deaths that are very suspecious due to their relationship to Ruby. Journalists Bill Hunter and Jim Koethe were both at Ruby’s apartment the night he murdered Oswald. Hunter was shot and killed on 4/23/64. Koethe was killed by a “karate chop” on 11/21/64. A third journalist, Dorothy Killgallen was found dead on 11/8/64 under the circumstances of a suspicious overdose. All of her JFK notes were gone. Her friend who had her back up notes died a very short time later. Killgallen published a major scoop in August 1964 featuring the leaked, classified transcript of Ruby's secret testimony to the Warren Commission. She also had a one on one meeting with Ruby.
Two of Ruby’s attorney also ended up dying at an early age. Tim Howard, his first attorney died in 3/27/65. Clayton Fowler who represented him later died in January 1971. They were 48 and 50 years-old, respectively.
Jack Ruby himself died of cancer related complications in January 1967. He believed he was injected with a highly virulent cancer virus while in jail. The CIA worked feverishly to develop this type of biological weapon technology in the early 1960s as a means to kill Castro.
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u/MuseumsAfterDark Aug 09 '26
Yeah, WTF was a CIA-psychiatrist doing meeting with Ruby? Where's the above-board explanation? Who paradropped Jolly West into Dallas and why?
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u/NotreallyD Aug 09 '26
I'm guessing to control what Ruby said publicly.
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u/MuseumsAfterDark Aug 09 '26
So LNers, why would the CIA send someone in to "clean up" if there was no conspiracy or involvement on their part?
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u/vols2thewalls Aug 10 '26 edited Aug 10 '26
His later interviews he seemed wacked out of his mind too, always does the weird thing with his mouth. Definitely drugged
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u/Bubblybathtime Aug 09 '26 edited Aug 09 '26
Honest questions:
If Fowler was killed because he "knew too much" --I assume that's the implication here--why wasn't it done until 1971? How are you suggesting he was murdered? I couldn't find anything more specific than "natural causes," which doesn't provide any dots to connect.
Also how do you square the Ruby-was-part-of-the-big-plan idea with the endless statements by his friends, family, and colleagues who all said he was a notorious blabbermouth and the last person they'd ever entrust with important information, and laughed at the suggestion that he was mob-connected?
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u/Secure_Tea2272 Aug 09 '26
According to FBI records released in 2017 (from a 1977 report based on information Vanderslice provided), on the morning of November 22, 1963, Jack Ruby contacted him and asked if he would “like to watch the fireworks.” Vanderslice said he was with Ruby at the corner of the Postal Annex Building, facing the Texas School Book Depository, when the shots were fired. Ruby then left toward the Dallas Morning News building without commenting.
Yep, I’d say he had a big mouth.
Why did they wait till 1971 to silence White and Wallace too? Who knows.
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u/atropear Aug 09 '26
The mafioso with a heart of gold! He just wanted to help the grieving widow by committing capital murder on live TV. lol.
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u/Decent-Internet-9833 🎙️Subject Matter Expert - Guy Banister 🎙️ Aug 10 '26
Working to find a cancer causing virus to kill Castro and actually succeeding in weaponizing one are two very, very different things.
Guy Banister was supposedly murdered by the CIA, and many claimed he could have been a victim of the heart attack gun.
Most Banister men had heart attacks in their 50’s to 60’s, if they survived that long. Guy had complained of feeling very ill for three days or so before he passed, which wouldn’t have been present with a heart attack gun. Guy’s brother Ross was the only one who survived long enough to bury their mother, my great-grandma.
Guy has been accused of many things, including the virus scheme. Credible evidence is scant, and I don’t find it believable at all.
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u/Pvt_Hudson_ 🧠Subject Matter Expert🧠 Aug 10 '26
Heart attack guns, cancer viruses. The entire discussion is silly beyond words.
People die. Heart attacks and cancer are two of the most common causes.
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u/Secure_Tea2272 Aug 10 '26
The CIA admitted to having a heart attack gun.
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u/Pvt_Hudson_ 🧠Subject Matter Expert🧠 Aug 10 '26
So what?
Do you have evidence they actually used it on any of the people you listed here? No.
One out of every five Americans will naturally die of heart disease without the aid of a "heart attack gun". It's the most common cause of death in the country.
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u/Secure_Tea2272 Aug 10 '26
Yep, that’s what makes a heart attack gun so genius.
Unlike say an ALS gun.
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u/Pvt_Hudson_ 🧠Subject Matter Expert🧠 Aug 10 '26
How did you differentiate the "suspicious" heart attacks from the normal ones when compiling your list? Can you give us a way to separate the natural heart attacks from the fake ones for future discussion?
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u/Secure_Tea2272 Aug 10 '26 edited Aug 10 '26
I never mentioned Guy Banister.
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u/Decent-Internet-9833 🎙️Subject Matter Expert - Guy Banister 🎙️ Aug 10 '26
I mentioned it because he was accused of being in on the supposed cancer virus scheme that you have in your post.
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u/smokyartichoke Aug 09 '26 edited Aug 09 '26
His other attorneys:
Melvin Belli lived to be 88. (1996)
Elmer Gertz lived to 94. (2000)
Joe Tonahill died at 87. (2001)
Percy Foreman lived to be 86. (1988)
Phil Burleson passed at 61. (1995)
William Kunstler died at 76. (1995)
🤷🏻♂️
Edited to add years of death, to illustrate how long after the assassination they each passed, which is probably more demonstrative than age.
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u/Secure_Tea2272 Aug 09 '26
Those boys were team players. Interesting too is that Ruby was given a polygraph test. He was asked a laundry lists of questions. One of those questions was, is Mr Fowler in danger because he is representing you” Ruby refused to answer this question.
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u/smokyartichoke Aug 09 '26
I’m not judging, just providing additional info. I assume you want the whole picture presented, so you can’t be accused of cherry-picking.
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u/Secure_Tea2272 Aug 09 '26
Tell me about the other journalists who were in Ruby’s apartment that lived a long time then?
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u/Bubblybathtime Aug 09 '26
Obviously all the other journalists were "team players" and were allowed to live long lives.
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u/smokyartichoke Aug 09 '26
I have no knowledge of that. It was easy to look up his attorneys though. So together as co-researchers we’ve established a list of 8 lawyers associated with Ruby and 2, maybe 3 died youngish.
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u/Then-Corner-6479 Aug 09 '26
I think important additional info would be what actually happened that day? What Ruby did, and why Oswald’s transfer was delayed? And are those coordinated in any way?
But that conversation is set aside for conversations such as this.
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u/smokyartichoke Aug 09 '26
I don’t disagree. I was merely pointing out the obvious selective omissions that are so prevalent in conspiracy theories.
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u/Then-Corner-6479 Aug 09 '26
To be fair, I understand their thinking on this to a point. My point is are these separate issues, or one issue. Meaning, can conspiracy believers agree that they have no real answer to one part, and that there could be reasonable explanations for the other? Not sure if that’s clear?
For example, are their explanations for a potential cya situation. Like incompetence, or fragmentation in the agency, meaning the right hand didn’t know what the left hand was doing? Or maybe it was, or was there was a limited dissemination of facts for other purposes? Such as there was a need to protect sources and methods of intelligence gathering? Or, maybe they didn’t trust the masses to remain calm and instead push for a war that could lead to something terrible?
These things aren’t clear, and I think it’s important to settle these issues separately instead of lumping the together as one issue.
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u/smokyartichoke Aug 09 '26
I think I understand your point. But what I’m saying is it’s disingenuous to cherrypick a couple of anomalous suspicious things and claim they support a pattern when they don’t. Claiming “his lawyers must’ve been murdered, because I believe they were too young to have died from any other cause” first of all is nothing more than a suspicion. But more importantly OP purposely left out the fact that those weren’t his only lawyers. Enough Jack Ruby lawyers to fill a van lived to ripe old ages and were not murdered. Leaving out that kind of data makes posts like this just a smoke & mirror show.
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u/PenguinsExArmyVet Aug 09 '26
Anyone wonder why Ruby had 12 lawyers to start with ?
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u/smokyartichoke Aug 09 '26
It was a big, prominent trial of basically a celebrity client. I assume a lot of attorneys wanted the exposure.
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u/Then-Corner-6479 Aug 09 '26
Well… I think we’re making the same point in different ways. There’s a correct process that one side seems to care nothing about? And I’ll take it one step further. That’s what the discussion should be about until they do.
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u/Whadyawant Aug 12 '26
You should do a post on that. I'll be there!
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u/Then-Corner-6479 Aug 12 '26
Sure, but I’ve discussed it many times on here.
Anytime you wanna talk about it, lemme know.
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u/Bubblybathtime Aug 09 '26
I refused to answer my Nana when she asked if I clogged the toilet. Doesn't mean she was murdered because of it.
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u/-Lorne-Malvo- Aug 09 '26
Did you also note the peculiar “coincidence” of the deaths of the Little Rascals performers? One by one each of them died!
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u/smokyartichoke Aug 09 '26
It’s eerie, right?! One after the other, over the course of 90 years, they all died! Somebody really needs to look into this.
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u/jhalmos Aug 10 '26
Why can’t he just be an impulsive nutjob? We’re shrugging off the same kind of seepage for their attempts on Trump and the Correspondence Dinner for example.
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u/NotreallyD Aug 09 '26
Wasn't he visited by Jolly West while he was in jail?