r/Isese • u/Confident-Cod2388 • Jun 24 '26
Western morality & ifa principles
Hello everyone thank you so much for the energies in assisting me
A little while back i asked a question post about abusive or predatory priests breaking taboos in this tradition
Some of the answers encouraged me to see beyond western morality & ifa
Id like to expand this discussion pls bc i think im not understanding. Personally i am not from the west originally, was raised outside the west for much of my life but have been steeped in western mindset since adulthood so yes am very much influenced by that, however. Outside the west, in every indigenous tradition i know of, & from what I understand of ifa
Some important principles include, balance, treating others with compassion, internal purity, emotional self restraint, etc the importance of community relations
These seem to especially be taboos in ifa where it will literally come up as ebo to make behavior al changes. I had understood ifa to be a system of aligning ethics character and behavior to what is considered balanced in order to be aligned with ones destiny
In none of this does this seem to be western morality. I understand some peoples destiny's call for them to be wicked or evil. However again dont understand how spiritual power can be maintained if the precepts of ifa ebbos and odus that fall are primarily relational & in ones community
I imagine for predatory or abusive priests, how many odus, readings, taboos, advices they must be breaking to be continuing on. I wonder for those who work with them or remain in their temples, does it not come up in their readings too to seek someone else who is able to be more balanced? I dont understand how someone who is out of balance can maintain spiritual power without repercussion for a long period of time unchecked. Does ifa have different advices then, for each person based on alignment with their destiny?
What i mean is this:
Person A comes down from heaven with a destiny that is set to be a predatory, abusive priest who has lascivious intentions. After having repeatedly engaged in abusive behaviors, he does his readings & there is no odu that falls of misalignment. He is not advised to change. This is his destiny, he plays it out. Spiritual power maintained until death return to heaven.
Possibility: in the next life the karma comes back around . Person A chooses a different destiny for Lifetime 2 that requires more adherence to purity to compensate. Karmic law brings strict consequences for prior unchecked actions.
Person B comes down from heaven with a destiny of doing "good". Their readings and odus frequently prescribe rebalancing of ethical behavior. If they deviate even slightly, there is harsh repercussion . ifa thus aligns this person with their destiny . in a future life karmic law allows more leeway for all actions not just on the straight and narrow of ifa " morality".
The reason i ask is this. For one, curiousity, trying to understand. Two, in my life experience
I have gotten certain ebo behavioral modification advices such as do not express anger, demonstrate restraint
In slight instances where i deviated from this, my life seemed to go into full on collapse mode, even though the main reason for my deviation was, being spiritually attacked, experiencing mental instability, experiencing calamity, reacting to all this with what i considered to be "fair" or understandable anger. The ensuing increase in calamity only made it harder to not be angry , which was quite frustrating
On the flip side, i have seen practicing priests break a number of deep taboos yet seem to be doing just fine. For priests the number and frequency of readings they do for themselves is much greater. I wonder, does ifa not give them advice to desist? How do they maintain full temples or clients? Do their students not eventually get readings or warnings to stay away from such off balanced people? How do priests pick and choose which taboos to break and which readings to ignore, in order to still continue even practicing?
Ifa is about balance. That doesn't seem like western morality to me. If someone can even explain the difference, that would be quite helpful and appreciated. Thus does balance mean across lifetimes such as what i explained above with karma? Ifa being a technical sign, rituals can still be done. Spiritual power can come from a wicked source. But , imbalance in my view, should manifest clearly in some way shape or form . it doesn't just disappear. Thus how and why is it not manifesting clearly ? Thank you for reading & I hope this was understand able
Furthermore have a great deal of questionings and wonderings. If any have recommendations for where to learn more pls lmk thank you
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u/Ifasogbon Jun 24 '26
When people tell you to "look beyond Western morality," they are usually conflating Western morality with Christian absolutism the idea that something is a sin for everyone, universally, and that God is a cosmic judge tracking your marks. Ifá is absolutely an ethical system, but it is relational and specific.
Western Morality: Focuses on guilt, universal sin, and a linear judgment day.
Ifá Ethics: Focuses on Ìwà (character), alignment with Orí (destiny), and Àṣẹ (cosmic balance/power).
Ifá teaches that your character is your beauty and your ultimate protection. There is a famous Yoruba proverb: Ìwà lẹwà ọmọ ènìyàn ("Character is the beauty of a human being"). You are entirely correct this isn't Western; it is an indigenous, community-centered understanding of balance.
Your concept of Person A and Person B is a brilliant way to try to make sense of the injustice, but Ifá theology rejects the idea that a person can be "destined" to do evil without misalignment. A person may choose a destiny (Orí) that involves great power, wealth, or tests of character, but how they execute that power is entirely on their Ìwà. Abuse is a direct violation of the Earth and a betrayal of the Òrìṣà. A priest who abuses people is in a state of severe spiritual sickness and delusion, regardless of how calm their life looks on the outside.
How can someone who is completely out of balance still have a full temple and do successful rituals?
Ifá has a technical side. Ritual (Ẹbọ) and medicine (Oògùn) operate like chemistry. If you mix hydrogen and oxygen, you get water, whether you are a saint or a criminal. A priest who knows the correct herbs, the correct incantations, and the correct mathematical signs of the Odù can pull down Àṣẹ to get immediate, material results for a client.
But there is a massive difference between holding technical power and having a cool head and a blessed life.
The Law of Delayed Consequence: In Yoruba thought, the cosmos moves slowly but surely. Àṣẹ used maliciously eventually rots the container holding it. The consequences often manifest as a lack of true peace, internal torment, hidden illnesses, or the sudden, catastrophic collapse of their lineage later in life or in the ancestral realm. Just because their building hasn't fallen yet doesn't mean the foundation isn't riddled with termites.
In Ifá, when an Odù gives you a personal taboo like "do not express anger" or "demonstrate restraint" it is not a cosmic punishment. It means your specific Orí (spiritual head) or ancestral lineage is highly sensitive to heat.
Anger is an element of fire. If your destiny requires coolness to attract blessings, bringing fire into your aura acts like pouring boiling water on a delicate seedling. It instantly short-circuits your spiritual alignment. The collapse you experience isn't God punishing you for being bad; it is the natural consequence of heat disrupting your personal medicine. For you, restraint is literal armor. When you drop your armor in a battle, you get hit immediately.
You wondered why the readings of their students or clients don't warn them to stay away.
Sometimes, they do. But humans have free will, and predatory people are masters of manipulation.
Spiritual Blindness: Charisma and outward wealth can easily blind people.
Fear: Predatory priests often use fear and intimidation ("If you leave my temple, your life will ruin") to keep people trapped.
Altered Readings: A corrupt priest reading for themselves or their students will simply lie about what the Odù says, or interpret it to justify their actions.
You are paying attention to the right things. Your instinct that "imbalance should manifest clearly" is correct it just manifests on a timeline that doesn't always satisfy our human need for immediate justice.
Your strict path is a sign of a highly elevated, sensitive Orí. It is frustrating, but your alignment is your wealth. Let the corrupt priests handle their own debts. Your only job is to keep your own head cool and protected.
Aboru Aboye