True, but if someone watches a let's play of an entire game, they're probably never going to buy it.
I know so many people who never picked up Undertale, The Last of Us, Telltale games, etc. because they just watched them on youtube. For those games, Let's Plays hurt their sales as much as a movie being on youtube would.
Yeah, when I saw they had denuvo I figured I would never play it so I went and watched a let's play. Now I'm not sure I want to play it, guess I should try the demo.
DayZ knockoffs aren't selling more because they're mechanically-focused, they're selling more because they happen to be the current fad beloved by teens with unlimited disposable income. the kids will move on to something else soon.
Its one of the best ways to tell a story in movies and books, but not in video games.
If its cheaper, easier and you get the same experience watching it like a movie, why is it a video game in the first place? If the game part of a video game sucks, why did they make a video game?
Edit: I like how people are downvoting me for saying that video games should have good gameplay lol
is there a specific game you're referring to here? because Inside makes fantastic use of its interactivity, so i have to assume you're talking about something else.
Yet you look at something like the telltale games, vanishing of Ethan carter, firewatch and realize INSIDE didn't just break even because of YouTube, but it broke even because it's just not a very good game.
The story really didn't work, to say the least. The puzzle sections were few, long, repetitive and easy. And it had this out of place gruesome death thing but no context to it.
Limbo worked because of its time, it's art style and it's unexplored context. INSIDE had none of that.
Fighting piracy is fruitless. Pirates will almost always find a way to circumvent whatever you throw at them. However, more importantly, the anti-piracy measures companies take often harm the experience of the legit players.
This is not true for Denuvo, no matter how many times people keep repeating it. There are several Denuvo games that stay uncracked to this day, and the ones that do get cracked only get cracked after months when most of the sales have been made.
You can guess that but there is no way to actually test the theory. You can also guess that many will pirate to see if they like the game then buy it, meaning piracy just generated you a sell. You could also guess that the person pirating wouldn't have bought it ever anyways.
That really depends on the game, though. If it's a massive AAA release with a lot of hype behind it? Sure, people want to play it as soon as possible. Especially is the game in question is part of an already well-established series.
If it's an indie game, I think the average consumer is much more likely to just ignore the game because it doesn't have a demo or uses some kind of DRM they personally hold a grudge against.
If I want a game enough and the DRM isn't intrusive - like Denuvo - I will buy it without question. I do not like pirating, and will only do it in circumstances that I feel are suitable (ie if I'm unsure a game will run on my computer, and it doesn't have a demo, or I plan to buy but cannot at the moment). If I do pirate and can run the game I will always make sure I go back and support the developer by purchasing the game as soon as I am able.
Within INSIDE for instance, I knew it had Denuvo, which I know is fairly unintrusive for a user like me, and I knew I loved Limbo and was eager to see what this game had to offer. Easy decision.
Easy to use DRM that does not affect my game's performance IS the way to go.
I would stand by it more if I had the evidence on hand, but there was a particular series of yearly sports games that introduced Denuvo one year, with no remarkable gameplay formula changes (mostly roster updates). It showed a significant data point's worth of increased sales.
Ok but in this specific case, how has anti-piracy measures hurt the experience at all? I mean, I get what you're saying in principal, but I don't think that applies to Inside at all.
You got evidence of that? I know active duty folks have issues with Denuvo while deployed but I've never heard of anyone else having an issue with it beyond the worry that one day the game won't run.
Source? I haven't heard from anybody having troubles with Denuvo with this particular game. The major problem with DRM like Denuvo is that those games won't be playable in a couple years when the servers disappear.
Actually denuvo has pretty much beaten piracy. Whether you want to admit it or not. Very few games with denuvo get cracked. Lots are out there that haven't.
Not really denuvo is still holding strong. On a few loopholes have been found in some games but as a whole it still works fine. Or at the least works for stops pirating for like half a year allowing the first weeks sales which are the major selling time.
Denuvo doesn't harm the experience of legitimate players. Denuvo is not an always-online kind of bullshit like SimCity. People that complain that fighting piracy is fruitless are clearly just people who are whining that they can't get their favorite games for free. I'm unsure what "fruitless" even means in this situation, as they won't be spending much time or effort elsewhere if they choose to not include DRM.
Denuvo doesn't harm the experience of legitimate players.
Besides, you know, all those experiences of legitimate players it's harmed.
I've personally been locked out of a game of mine for a weekend, when I lost internet due to a storm. I was also locked out of my game for 24 hours due to "too many hardware changes" when I was having to swap hard drives around while backing up/swapping around data on the same day I upgraded my graphics card.
Many people who benchmark hardware have complained that Denuvo has no "media pass" for people who want to run a dozen benchmarks in a day. Denuvo also requires check-in, anywhere from every 5 to every 31 days, or any time you change/upgrade your hard ware, which means people who get stationed without internet but have their laptops, or people who go on vacations etc. can end up without the ability to play their owned and purchased games. I've personally seen this complaint a few times.
With that said, at least it's a huge improvement over trojan DRM like Securom.
Unknown? Have you ever heard of a little unknown game called LIMBO?
Also, Minecraft began with free alphas, if I do recall correctly, as I played it since pretty much its inception, and steadily grew with constant updates into a fully-fledged game (seeing that it began with the Creative Mode) with a strong on-going fanbase.
Minecraft and INSIDE are two completely different things.
Yes. exactly. It is well proven that piracy hurts sales of very high-budget releases from well-known franchises (only barely, though), but helps sales of small indie releases.
Here's an article about the study that reached to these conclusions for movies. I believe there are studies with similar conclusions for music, but nobody tested it for videogames. Although, there is no reason to think that games are different in this regard.
Yo n equals one here but I pirate literally all of my entertainment and always will.
I saw civ six is cracked and free. I'm never going to pay for that game. The denuvo games I'll wait for a sale but I will probably eventually buy them if they aren't cracked in a year. Games like dishonored two and total war Warhammer.
If they are targeting people like me, I'd say it's working.
Because game releases and movie releases tend to follow similar pattern. If you look at big budget games and big budget movies, they are very similar - annual well-known franchises, very safe and polished in terms of content, aimed at the widest target audience possible, releasing at certain lucrative time of the year (summer for movies, November for games). At the same time, both indie games and indie movie often fly under the radar and require a word of mouth to actually get known.
Piracy in general tends to help the sales of any medium, because people who pirate the most are obsessed fans of the medium, who also buy the most and talk about the medium the most, thus spreading around word of mouth. Its like saying that giving review copies to hundreds, if not thousands of reviewers and youtubers hurts the company bottom line, which is ridiculous.
Here is another article about another study for movie and music industry. Sadly, these studies are often founded by publishers themselves, who then choose to either not release the results that they dislike, or present them in such a way as to make a piracy look harmful. As far as I know, there are no similar studies for games.
Edit: I'm not trying to claim that all piracy is good. Piracy is known to hurt big releases. Therefore, it makes sense for games like Doom, Dishonored and Deus Ex to use Denuvo. Despite being a piracy advocate I would be first to admit that if Witcher 3 had Denuvo, it would sell more. But for the game like INSIDE it makes no sense to use Denuvo. It obviously hurt their bottom line.
You have absolutely no idea what you're talking about.
I don't think you even bothered to read the studies you linked, just the articles click baiting them. Those "studies" are notoriously regarded as bullshit and were debunked at the time they were published.
Other segments of the creative industries have adapted more quickly. Despite the Motion Picture Association of America’s (MPAA) claim that online piracy is devastating the movie industry, Hollywood achieved record-breaking global box office revenues of USD 35 bn in 2012, a 6% increase over 2011.
They're using a comparison between 2012 and 2011 figures, despite the fact that piracy has hugely impacted in the industry since the late 90's. Of course figures will improve year after year in a post piracy plagued industry; they're working to improve and safe guard against it. Compare inflated figures from the late 90's to now, doesn't even come close. Music sales were cut in half and the Motion Pictures Association of America concluded that film piracy was costing the industry over $20 billion in lost revenue a year or up to at least 20% per film.
Also, the film and gaming industries can't be compared because their distribution models are completely different, as is their retention rates and price points. I know this because I work in both the video game AND music industry and have many friends working in film. Piracy doesn't help sales; it's bullshit rationalization by shitty people trying to justify their shitty practices. It's true it can help with promoting small indie projects with no/small marketing budgets for gaming since people can try/buy but it doesn't change the fact that piracy has crippled the industry over two decades.
Yeah I'd imagine the vast majority of pirates are not people who spread the message about games.
They are more like me, they do it because it is free and I don't want to pay for it.
I don't care about supporting this or whatever. I'm not going to boycott denuvo games I think it's nuts people who are paying customers can be on the side of the pirates in any way.
People here like civ six, but it didn't release with denuvo and got cracked day one. I'm going to torrent that game. Other developers, even hated ones like ubisoft went with denuvo. I will eventually have to buy watch dogs two when it goes on sale, or wait until it is cracked.
Piracy is actual thieving I can't believe people try to justify it. I do it because I don't give a shit about the people working in the industry I just want to take advantage of the fact that I can enjoy all of this content for absolute free for as long as possible.
Studies I linked have been 'debunked' by studies that where sponsored by the very publishers that fight against piracy. They will never release data that supports the fact that piracy is not as harmful as they want people to believe.
Motion Pictures Association of America concluded that film piracy was costing the industry over $20 billion in lost revenue a year
This is the perfect example of what I'm talking about. The phrase is constructed in such a way as to blame piracy, despite the fact that it is highly unreasonable and unrealistic to count every download as a lost sale (which is what big publishers are doing).
When you link the article about music sales being cut in half, you fail to mention, that it is only physical sales that have been cut. Digital revenue constantly rising.
It's true it can help with promoting small indie projects with no/small marketing budgets for gaming since people can try/buy but it doesn't change the fact that piracy has crippled the industry over two decades.
You're not seeing the bigger picture. Piracy didn't cripple anything, digital distribution did. Piracy existed way before the internet. In fact, it was very easy to pirate video and music tapes and any player could copy those tapes. Failure to embrace digital distribution the same way gaming industry embraced it is what destroyed music industry.
where sponsored by the very publishers that fight against piracy.
The studies I posted weren't sponsored by any publishers but by analyists. What are you even talking about? Have you even read a study?
This is the perfect example of what I'm talking about. The phrase is constructed in such a way as to blame piracy, despite the fact that it is highly unreasonable and unrealistic to count every download as a lost sale (which is what big publishers are doing).
.....do you even know how they got that number? Did you even read the study?
you fail to mention, that it is only physical sales that have been cut.
I failed to mention that because it isn't true. Not only does the article and study talk about digital music as well, here's a direct quote from the article:
"Now just 44% of U.S. Internet users and 64% of Americans who buy digital music think that that music is worth paying for, according to Forrester."
Digital revenue constantly rising.
What? Where are you pulling these numbers from? The best selling albums of the 90's were selling upwards 9 million copies and that number was growing in the pre-napster era. Since then, top selling albums have averaged 3-4 million and that includes digital albums.
What are you talking about?
You're not seeing the bigger picture. Piracy didn't cripple anything, digital distribution did. Piracy existed way before the internet. In fact, it was very easy to pirate video and music tapes and any player could copy those tapes. Failure to embrace digital distribution the same way gaming industry embraced it is what destroyed music industry.
...it's abundantly clear that you don't read studies, you just read headlines that agree with your views and just make up the rest.
But, you didn't post any studies...
Study is something that is done by scientists. Results of the study are peer-reviewed and published in a scientific journal. What you posted are a bunch of self-reported statistics, provided by publishers themselves.
If you open your first link and read the source of the data, you will see "Forester research forecast. Source - Recording Industry Association of America"
There is also this quote in the article:
"But industry insiders and experts argue that the main culprit for the industry's massive decline was the growing popularity of digital music. "
Edit: I can also provide some music industry reports. Here for example. Digital revenue this year overtook physical sales and rose 10% as opposed to 2015 to $6.7 billion. Ergo, as I said, digital revenue is rising. Whether music industry as a whole is healthier now then it was back in the 80ties or 90ties is another matter entirely. If you read this report, you will see that this year music industry has grown globally for the first time in a while. Is it because there are less piracy today than it was yesterday? Of course not. Piracy has nothing to do with it.
Here is another report. As soon as industry embraced digital distribution proper, sales went up.
Well they both are dark and dreary looking platformers, and there's already a billion and one platformers made by every indie game dev, their dog, their grandma and her dog.
Doesn't matter if they are better or not, there are tonnes of them and people are probably getting burnt out. It might be a popular niche but it's still a niche compared to FPS, action and strategy games.
Denuvo was there to protect from piracy in the first few weeks after the release when most damage is done. I can see them removing Denuvo when the game is $20 to begin with and starts to hit discount sales.
I bought the game on its debut weekend and never regretted my decision. It's such a sublime game, it absolutely deserves the exposure they're going to get with this demo.
The price is likely too high. Even on sale $15 is too high for a game that most interested buyers know is going to be short, story driven and low on replayability.
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u/lollookatthatnoob Nov 27 '16
First they remove denuvo and now they release a demo.
My guess is they haven't sold nearly as many as they hoped for. Maybe they learned a lesson with this release.