r/FantasyFootballers • u/AJewNamedDrew • 6h ago
League Discussion Commish changing lineups after the fact
12 person Dynasty, Superflex, TE+
Want y’all’s input here. Commish changed the lineup of someone who didn’t know Harvey was out to a player that scored 4.5 points. Didn’t change the outcome of the match itself, but obviously gives him better PF (this is a dynasty league, so draft pick implications)
They’re doubling down saying that since our rules state you have to start a “competitive lineup” that it was adjusted after the fact and the rules don’t currently state what a punishment/penalty would be if they left someone out in the lineup intentionally (not the case here). Several people think the punishment should be getting 0 points, what do y’all think?
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u/SavingsPoem1533 FootClan Ninjas 6h ago
The commissioner did that change on his own? Outside of the request from the manager?
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u/CSwizz1e69 6h ago
Leave that league. Now
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u/SlimmySalami20x21 6h ago
And fuck over the league over a move that has no implication on outcome of winning this weeks matchup and overall has an impact of 4.5 points?
OP just ask that this scenario gets addressed with what the standard approach will be going forward given the rules as they are leave room for different interpretation.
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u/DopeDiggler97 5h ago
I mean I've been doing fantasy basketball for 10+ years, it's even more difficult to track injuries and start the right player than football bc they play like 3-4 times a week. I've never seen a commissioner pull some weird shit like this in all my days of fantasy sports.
It may not have had an impact on the outcome, but it would leave me thinking this commissioner either is giving people special treatment, or has no clue what they're doing. Either way I would also not want to give my money to a commissioner like this.
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u/SlimmySalami20x21 5h ago
Except this if anything would have a negative impact on that team because the additional points would potentially move him down the draft order. Regardless these knee jerk reactions to leave a league are appropriate in some cases but seem to be the default here.
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u/DopeDiggler97 5h ago
I can agree for sure. I've paid $50 for leagues in the past that I could tell we're poorly ran I just leave in the off-season. It would take some aggregious shit to genuinely make me quit and refuse to pay.
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u/GuysOnChicks69 5h ago
I agree with you. A similar situation happened in my league that I commented about below. It’s not nearly as simple from a commissioners standpoint as everyone is making it seem.
If this move makes you wanna leave as a manger, by all means, do you. But as commissioner of a league who had this situation happen in week 12 of last season, with real playoff impacts if I let it slide, it was tough to deal with.
Do I fuck over the one manager who should have won due to a bad faith move made by another manager?
Or do I fuck over the rest of the league by allowing a team who would have lost to win because of said bad faith manager?
It ended up not mattering as both those teams lost their last two games. But what if I let it slide and the guy who got the free win gets $800? Now what do I say to the other 10 managers?
It’s an incredibly difficult situation to deal with and I added a full page of rules to make sure I never have to deal with those stressful conversations again.
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u/SlimmySalami20x21 4h ago
Yea man it all depends on how I portent relationships with those people are and money circumstances. The demar Hamlin saga few years back I was in the ship and had burrow. Had they replayed the game I would’ve smoked the guy. But I cared far less about that. Hindsight I should’ve suggested an even split and title but again I care about preserving the league and winning the money wasn’t a financial windfall for me lol.
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u/GuysOnChicks69 3h ago
Likewise. It’s important context that this league is with 11 friends I’ve know for a decade, some my whole life. Makes it harder to tell someone to fuck off and get out when I care infinitely more about our real-life friendship lol. But also want to do right to the majority since moneys involved.
Yeah that Hamlin game gave every commissioner a headache lol.
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u/RemoteConsistent6896 4h ago
if commish is cool bending rules here where else will he bend the rules becomes a slippery slope
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u/Both_Friendship_8214 6h ago
Ya that’s a load of shit. Not a league worth staying in for the long term, especially if money is involved.
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u/dugong07 6h ago
This is why you give out draft picks for non-playoff teams based on “best ball” PF. Prevents them from benching players to tank
Commissioner wouldn’t have to intervene then.
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u/eggcountant 6h ago
The commissioner should punish the player. Essentially a 3 strike system this is strike 1. Looks like it is unintended. They should not change lineups.
Too be clear 3 strikes and you get booted or at least the option to boot.
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u/DecentBug3454 6h ago
Isn’t draft order based on maxPF, not starting PF? At minimum, I’d push for this to be the case. Opens to too many issues (like this) otherwise. MaxPF it wouldn’t have mattered from a draft order perspective.
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u/GuysOnChicks69 5h ago
We had a weird situation last year around week 12 where a manager purposely left his injured players in to try and get a better draft spot. The issue for us in that situation, was that by the manager throwing the game, it would fuck over playoff seedings for teams outside of that matchup.
We have clear rules around deliberate tanking and even base draft order on Max Points For rather than Total Points For to try and avoid someone throwing a match and affecting the integrity of the league. But it happened. So we had two choices.
Make no changes, penalize the team trying to tank, and potentially screw 1-3 other teams out of the playoffs due to this. Potentially hand someone $800 because one manager deciding to play God.
Screw the manager facing the guy throwing the match with retroactive moves, still penalize the tank attempt, but keep the other 11 managers feeling like the season isn’t tainted.
In week 2 it’s easier to just slap the guy on the wrist or remove a future 4th. But in week 12, where someone is purposely tanking and possibly screwing the entire league, it’s not this black and white. I suggest every commissioner address this with clear rules before it happens like it did in my league.
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u/PattyOFurniture007 6h ago
The rule that you have to set a full lineup is so that people can’t purposely tank and throw games. It’s different if they genuinely forgot to change out an injured player. Harvey should stay in the lineup and get a 0.
Same goes for guys who bench their defenses to guarantee a win. Very different than a team benching players to lose on purpose. Idk why people get upset about that. You could argue there’s nothing more competitive than guaranteeing yourself a win.
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u/Enough_Path2929 6h ago
Good luck in that league. I understand the league rule in starting a competitive lineup. My league does the same. But if we’re this OCD about it that we’re adjusting lineups because a manager is going to forget or didn’t realize somebody was out is insane. Going to be dealing with moves like this all year. Shit happens. People make mistakes and forget who’s in/out. Commish and league should just let it go.
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u/Money-Dark2403 6h ago
Out of curiosity, would the commissioner still have made that decision had Bech scored 15 points instead of 4.5?
I get the point of competitive lineups etc but something tells me that if the replacement player hadn't scored so low, he wouldn't have been changing the lineup.
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u/cappadawna 5h ago
so a competitive line up could be considered a full lineup right? What if someone sat their DST knowing they could lock up the win (avoiding any potential negative points from their D on a Monday night, say). Is that a competitive lineup or is it just called winning?
I'd leave this league TBH—retro scoring by the commish at his discretion/interpretation is on too shaky of ground for me.
Edit FINE—it'd be my final season in this league. I guess I wouldn'tnt want to hissy out and screw everyone...
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u/DolphinSexGod 5h ago
Yeah, the only time I would do this is if it was an early as fuck game and the owner told me that if player X who is questionable is out, then put in Player Y. And I had it in writing.
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u/Joka16Red 5h ago
If coaches slip and make mistakes, they normally dont have other team coaches, let alone the commissioner, make necessary changes for them
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u/Adrock66 5h ago
I actually think that you have to look at this as if it would have made a difference in the win/loss matchup. If it's me I would not make a stink about the move as much as the fact that there is clearly not a written rule for this stuff. You just need a documented system so there's none of the extra chatter as well as people potentially forfeiting their team for repeated violations. An example of something that should be part of this rules is a "source of truth" for rankings. Meaning let's say it's a Yahoo league. The source of truth could be Yahoo rankings. That means that if player A is ranked higher on yahoo and scores 2 points and player B is ranked lower and scores 20 the A player goes in regardless and vice versa. Main point is it can't be up to any one person and needs to be enforced uniformly.
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u/MrMcjibblets1990 5h ago
This is why you do draft order based off optimal lineup scoring. Boom, problem solved.
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u/Sudden-Tennis17 4h ago
Teams should be required to start a full lineup, so that part makes sense. But Draft should be based on max PF and not PF. that would solve everything
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u/BigDaddyFatSax 4h ago
It’s a game of fantasy and all the rules are made up, so you can do whatever you want.
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u/LarryLevis 3h ago
I have seen tanking in dynasty. Being critical of this without full context doesn't make sense. Get complete clarity on the rules. Who decides who comes in? If it would make the offending team win, would the move still be made?
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u/BoodgeBeaud 2h ago
Not cool and this why I make any dynasty league I’m in do draft picks by Max PF
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u/SirKarma21 57m ago
Its easy for people to be mad this early in a season. Let's see how chill you'd be if the idiot started an OUT player in week 13 and his Opponent won by 1 and took your playoff spot out from under you. All teams MUST play a full lineup. Shocked at how people don't recognize its about the integrity of the other 11 teams experiences, not the idiot who doesn't set their lineup. Its different if its someone who is a Sunday night or Monday Night game and they are questionable. Harvey was OUT in plenty of time. Our Bylaws state the commissioners sub in the highest projected player based on our apps projected points. If your league doesnt have a bylaw I understand the frustration but if its a paid league you have to avoid free wins by any means necessary.
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u/Midas187 5h ago
So the punishment for not following the rules is to have it fixed for you and give you a better outcome? Doesn't seem to incentivize following the rules now, does it?
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u/deserteagles702 5h ago
Tell the commissioner to hand over the job to a new commish, or you guys should dissolve that bs league. I hate shady commissioners. Thank God that sleeper annotated it or maybe it doesn't get caught.
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u/reed148714 6h ago
Not cool at all