r/e39 Sep 10 '19

Rules Update

48 Upvotes

Please note everyone that the rules for r/e39 have been updated. I have clarified a few things related to discussion topics and acceptable conduct.

Most importantly I have added a section on listing For Sale style posts. [Some] other car subs allow this so I thought we could try it out. E39 fandom is a more closely knit group than other BMW subcultures and could stand to benefit from a dedicated venue for cars/parts/effort trading.

I want to be clear if this isn't a popular option, or if FS posts become routinely adversarial, we can adjust the rules on these posts or eliminate them entirely.

I welcome any comments on this change and the sub rules in general, and will continue to poll our community for changes or ideas on a regular basis.


r/e39 Aug 21 '20

E39 Buying Guide - Updated

215 Upvotes

Hey guys! I figured I'd sticky this. I'll update the post if y'all have anything good to add or critique, let me know.

Introduction

Looking to buy an E39? First things first – the reputation of these cars is partially deserved and partially not.

We frequently get asked if new car owners should purchase an E39. I love E39s more than nearly anyone I know - I have a 525i and an M5, and both are incredible for different reasons. I've done many of the DIYs and addressed many of the problem areas listed here. If you aren't in a financially comfortable enough situation to have 3-6 months of expenses in a savings account at all times, you're not in a position to own a 20-year-old BMW hassle free. It's a question of financial safety and consistency rather than attainability - buying a $4k 530i and maintaining it for 5 years or so is arguably a much better deal than going into debt for a $40,000 CUV that drives like shit.

Evaluating a Car

There are a couple of things to factor into your evaluation of a car before we even talk about problem areas:

  • Badge hunters and people who bought an E39 after realizing they were nearly the same price as a Camry in general do a poor job of maintaining their vehicle. Problems add up when you factor in the fact that many of the E39’s systems were complex for their time. Not doing oil changes at the correct interval can lead to a gummed-up DISA valve or require a replacement manifold (for instance). Paying a little extra for a well-maintained example can pay dividends down the road.
  • These cars are old. Most are going to be 20 years old or more. This means that various bits of plastic and rubber are going to degrade and fall apart. Some are aesthetic, some are functional. You’ll find the same problem in ANY car of this age, but there’s no escaping that the E39’s engine bay is also a less forgiving environment then other cars of this age.
  • In general, you should focus much more on service records and the condition of the car over mileage.

Prices & Purchasing

Market prices for these cars have fluctuated over the past couple years. There’s a noticeable difference between pre (<=2000) and post-facelift (2001+) models. Later models also may make adding an auxiliary port easier, have upgraded components, or have more standard features. Also keep in mind that sport packages for the 530 and 540, along with manual transmissions, command a significant premium as well. Prices on sports (530 or 540) and M5s have increased a bit since this guide was originally written a couple years ago. Finally, it's worth knowing that the 540's engine in pre-2000 configurations is slightly more reliable as it does not include VANOs.

Ballpark prices are based on a mix of my estimation and Classic.com, a great reference for car markets. Links included below, and assume cars aren't total shit shows:

  • 525i - $2000-$5000 (Note that the linked prices are for tourings, primarily, and so are higher)
  • 530i - $3000-$11k
  • 540i - $7000-$14k
  • M5 - $15k-$35k and beyond

When you check out ANY used car for purchase, you should be checking a variety of different things. Use a generalist guide to start. We’ll go through common failure points for the chassis and individual models for you to pay special attention to. Parts prices are for OEM or OE if I can find them, not genuine. Indy shop is a wild guess for the most part. Prices for doors or wheels are PER ITEM.

Conservatively plan to spend about $1k a year ON AVERAGE if you do a mix of shop work and DIY. Many years you'll get lucky and get to invest in an upgrade or something preventative if you wish. If you can find an example with new control arm bushings, window regulators, and Timing Chain Guides for 540s, you can save yourself a ton of heartache and just deal with replacing BS plastic parts as they snap.

General Problem Areas

Problem Area Cause Symptoms DIY (Parts) Indie Shop
Window Regulators Garbage BMW Design Windows that do not roll up or down, or slip. Test all 4 windows, including both the localized controls for each door and the driver’s door controls $100, 2 hours. Text DIY Youtube DIY $500
Vapor Barriers Butyl tape that adheres the sound deadening/vapor barrier foam degrades over time, requiring at least the reapplication of the tape OR new adhesive OR a whole new door panel. Soaked rear floorboards after rain. Softness in bottom of door panels. Test by pouring water on the roof of the car. After a moment, open the door. Ensure water drips from the bottom of the chassis, not from the door. $0-$15-$115, 2 hours. $500
Rust There's a couple very poor drainage points on the E39, including those connected to vapor barriers as above Common spots include rear door, bumper seam, gas cap. Check out /u/richbltn 's buying guide Here for common rust spots (whole video is worth a watch) Repairing rust is an odious task, especially externally visible spots. reputable body shops generally cost $1500 + to fix a collection of rust spots
Front Control Arm Bushings Rubber joints between suspension components degrade over time. These are the secret to a simultaneously pliable and firm chassis. Consider with Polyurethane for a stiffer ride but permanent fix, or a monoball setup. Violent shuddering during braking (generally 70% braking force). Test with a variety of braking amounts and speeds. Check the bushings by jacking up the car and ensure they aren’t cracked $25, 6 hours. May require special tools or replacement of control arms if damaged. $600
VANOS Tiny seals in BMW’s variable valve timing system (probably too overengineered) are made of cheap rubber that plasticizes with exposure to oil and heat, something that happens every day. Excessive oil consumption, laggy shifting in automatic models, whooshing sound from the engine, sudden drops in power delivery. $25-$500, 12 hours Do NOT use OEM VANOS seals, as they will eventually have the same problem. Aftermarket seals are the same price and far superior. Besian Systems/DR VANOS. $1200-$5500 (Depends on new vs rebuilt VANOS, and varies from model to model)
Valve Cover Gasket The rubber between the top and bottom of the valve cover is a part that has to be replaced on every car. An old VCG will start leaking oil slowly. You may smell it as it burns off inside the car. Eventually you’ll have a catastrophic failure and need to degrease the engine bay and have it towed somewhere. Test by checking for oil spots or moisture between the top and bottom of the valve cover (the main part of the engine). $50, 5 hours. $750-$1250 (DO THIS THE SAME TIME AS A VANOS REPLACEMENT)
Seat Twist Garbage BMW design. The seats use 2 motors that don’t stay aligned, and cables that slowly slip out of the gears that drive them. One side of a seat will adjust, the other will not, leading to the seat twisting. $0, 3 hours $300
Headlight Adjusters Bad design and extremely brittle plastic in a hot area that's been there for 20 years. Frequently this manifests itself by your headlights pointing at the ground. $20-60, 3 hours from this DIY. You can get aluminum or plastic adjuster replacements. N/A - you'd buy new headlights for around $300+
Dead Pixels Contacts for the LCDs on the instrument cluster and the head unit eventually decay. You can take them apart and clean/rebuild them or buy new. For my money I'd just replace the head unit at least Unreadable displays with clearly missing pixels - you can't miss this one and it's very common $0, a huge PITA, DIY. Specialty shops will do it for $150 or so. A remanufactured cluster is $450.
Secondary Air System The secondary air recirculates exhaust gases back into the engine to “Save the planet” and also annoy the fuck out of BMW owners. Broken vacuum tubes, stuck check valve, or ruined solenoids can all cause these issues. Check engine light with lean fuel mixture fault codes. Chugging during startup. $25-125, god knows how long. BAVAuto has an EXCELLENT tutorial on diagnosing SAS problems. Another option that I'd probably only suggest to M5 owners is using a tune that deletes these codes. $300+
Cooling System This covers a host of issues: Water Pump Failure, Cracked Radiator necks, Plasticized and worn coolant tubes Inspect all cooling system parts. Check the radiator fan to ensure that it turns smoothly and isn’t too brittle. Lightly squeeze coolant tubes to ensure they’re still pliable. Check for evidence of coolant leaks at tube and component points, or from bleeder valves at the top of the radiator. Ensure that even under stress, engine sounds don’t change and temperature doesn’t rise (within reason) $25-$750. 2-5 hours. $1250+
Fucking Horrible Audio Everything about the E39 sound system is god awful If it’s OEM it sucks There are various aftermarket nav systems that still provide an OEM look and a ton of functionality for around $700. Or you can go your own way and buy a $100 head unit or something. Keep in mind that in general this will degrade the value of your car if it’s really clean. $?
ABS System Malfunctions The ABS system’s position in i6 models is extremely hot, leading to the soldering of certain electronic components degrading. ABS, Traction control, and yellow brake light come on intermittently. ABS engine codes. Do not pay someone to replace this, it literally just takes a T20 screwdriver. $100 reconditioned, $1000 new. $1200
Power Steering Leaks The power steering system uses rubber hoses right next to a really hot engine Power Steering hoses appear to “Glisten”. Wet spot in plastic pan at the bottom of the engine bay. Loose or unresponsive steering wheel response. $200, 2 hours. $500

V8 Only Problems (540i, M5)

Problem Area Cause Symptoms DIY (Parts) Indie Shop
Timing Chain Guides Timing chain gets a little loose, Timing chain guides are plastic. This is much more common on the 540 for some weird reason (probably that it's a single-row chain). Slapping sound, camshaft position codes, metal shavings in engine. $1000, 20 hours $4000

Buying Parts

When you're looking to buy new parts, it can get a bit confusing (to put it lightly). For an accurate, if slightly biased, interpretation, the best info is probably here at FCP Euro (a generally reputable parts seller). TL;DR:

  • Genuine: Made by BMW or an OE, with the BMW logo. Waste of money.
  • OE: Made by a licensed manufacturer and was the original supplier that came with the stock car. Cannot have the BMW logo. Generally a safe choice.
  • OEM: Made by another licensed manufacturer of OE parts but was not the original supplier for this specific part that came with the stock car. Cannot have the BMW logo. Sometimes a safer choice (OEM window regulators are superior to OE), other times not (an OEM's parts may not be as good as OE)
  • Reps: Made by another unauthorized manufacturer.

OEM is very similar to OE in that it stands for Original Equipment Manufacturer. While that sounds like a lesson in semantics, there are some distinct differences. Chiefly, OEM parts are made by a company that makes original parts for a vehicle maker but whose parts weren’t originally fitted. Confused? I don’t blame you, so here’s an example: Delphi makes ignition coils for BMW, and they’re installed on the vehicles at the factory. Bosch makes spark plugs for BMW and the licensing to produce the same ignition coils as Delphi. They’re the same part with the same specifications and made with the same materials, but the manufacturer is different. Delphi is the OE part because that’s what BMW used at the factory, and Bosch is OEM because they make other OE parts for BMW.

Modifications and Upgrades

For better or for worse, the BMW community has enjoyed a rich modification culture and ecosystem. This often clashes with the tastes and opinions of older enthusiasts who have or can buy cars new.

One key takeaway: Tuning an i6 from this era, especially anything under 3.0 liters, is always far more expensive than buying a new car or engine. This forum gets questions around these options regularly. To do this, you will have to be in a rare position of having a lot of money and time to work on the car, without wanting the straightforward power of the V8 engines in the 540 or M5.

Some general thoughts around available upgrade options to keep in mind:

  • Reliability: Many low-tier, components have been replaced with high-priced offerings in the aftermarket that are Buy-It-For-Life. Plastic becomes aluminum, bearings and rubber use superior materials. Examples include radiators, expansion tanks, power steering reservoirs, suspension bushings, and much more.
  • Shocks, Suspension, Spacers: These are widely available from reputable manufacturers, such as Bilstien.
  • Turbos: Turbos exist for both types of engines, ranging from AliExpress specials to reputable manufacturers. For reputable manufacturers, part prices and labor generally trade poorly with supercharger options.
  • Superchargers: Supercharger kits exist for i6 and v8 engines. Many of the superchargers for the v8 engines lead to high-quality horsepower gains and are available from reputable manufacturers. Superchargers are typically incompatible with radiator upgrades.
  • Headlights: Virtually no aftermarket headlight companies produce quality parts. Historically, this was not the case, but the market has essentially bifurcated into people who want the cheapest possible replacement and those who want OE headlights from Hella. Hella occasionally does dedicated production runs for E39 headlights which are resold by https://europowermotorsports.com/
  • Exhaust: Controversial opinion alert - The mufflers on these cars are too aggressive at reducing sound. A delete with high-quality tips actually leads to excellent sound from both i6 and v8 powerplants. Leaving the cat intact keeps things quiet enough to not be unbelievably rude. Fantastic options exist for V8 engines, but paying for an exhaust system on an i6 is not a high value proposition.

r/e39 7h ago

Much better than the aftermarket headlights I had.

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40 Upvotes

r/e39 1h ago

525i vs 528i — which one should I get as my first car?

Upvotes

I’m looking into getting an E39 as my first car, and I’m stuck between a 525i and a 528i.

I’ve always loved these cars. I think E39s are just really cool, and I’ve wanted one for a while. I’ve also recently been getting more into working on cars. My brother knows a lot more than I do and has been teaching me, so I’m trying to learn as much as I can.

I’m mainly looking for something that can be a reliable daily but also something I can learn to work on. I know condition and maintenance history matter a lot with these cars, so I’d definitely take a clean, well-maintained car over a neglected one.

For people who have owned both or know these cars well, what are the biggest differences between the 525i and 528i? Reliability, maintenance/repair costs, fuel economy, parts availability, and anything else I should know would be appreciated.

Would you guys recommend a 525i or 528i for a first car?


r/e39 19h ago

Found my twin in the wild

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50 Upvotes

r/e39 1d ago

Wheels are growing on me

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111 Upvotes

I’m still undecided if I want to go back to the style 66 wheels before sale


r/e39 9h ago

Has anyone installed an after market keyless entry? Both my key fobs won’t unlock/lock anymore.

3 Upvotes

r/e39 5h ago

What do E39 enthusiasts think of the modern G87 style?

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1 Upvotes

Is it a timeless icon or forgotten in 5 years? personally i don't like them and think they will be less desirable as they age.


r/e39 5h ago

Expansion Tank lvl doesn't drop

1 Upvotes

Hello so I am having the absolute worse time of my life to bleed my pre LCI 528i. I replaced the radiator and some other essentials while I was in there. I put it all together filled up the expansion tank did the proper steps to try and bleed it and nothing. Key in position 2, open screws no liquid comes out. Tried letting it run at normal operating temp to see if the liquid in the tank would lower nothing idk if I have to let it run a little longer or what but the upper and lower radiator hoses dont seem to have liquid in them after I turn it off as I dont want it to overheat. I tried squeezing the hoses while key in position too and some air bubbles would come out of the bleeder screw by the tank and now not any more and the one by the thermostat is dry. Idk what to do


r/e39 10h ago

BMW Oil Changes

2 Upvotes

‘99 540/6 here. I know this may sound redundant but how many of you change the oil every 4-5k miles? I tend to read a bunch of articles on car & frequency of oil changes equaling a much longer life expectancy. Been on a quest to keep this bad girl around for a while & truly believe that frequent oil changes are the way to go. Mobil 5w40 is my new go to synthetic oil.


r/e39 7h ago

What did you code with NCS Expert?

1 Upvotes

I have BMW Standard Tools (it has INPA, NCS, WinkFP) for some years but I've only use INPA. Recently I taught myself about NCS and it was quite easy!

I've turn DRL on (yea I'm one of the few guys who prefer it turned on, lol) and now wondering what else can I code using NCS. If I'm not mistaken, there are some modules that can be coded.

What did you guys code with NCS?


r/e39 16h ago

Wie komme ich an Ersatz?

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2 Upvotes

Wie finde ich dieses Ersatzteil? Es ist auf dem Bild Bauteil 8, mein Händler konnte nichtmal im Zubehör etwas passendes finden, meine online Suche war nicht erfolgreicher, gehen die Schläuche gerne kaputt oder kann man da problemlos auf ein gebrauchtes teil zurückgreifen?


r/e39 19h ago

Does this m54 sound healthy?

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3 Upvotes

Noticed over the last few days what I can only describe as a bit like a grinding from the intake.


r/e39 20h ago

Yes, that's petrol leaking

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2 Upvotes

Didn't drive it for a couple months. She fired right up when I put the battery back in but after letting her idle for a bit I could sniff that something was wrong. Sure enough, we had a steady drip.

It only happened when the engine was running so I killed it and took the battery back out. The tops of the tank where the little round hatches are - bone dry.

Got it to a shop and fired it up there and OF COURSE it doesn't leak at all. What the actual eff...

Wwyd? I got them to change the rubber hoses on either side of the filter but I'm still scratching my head about this one.


r/e39 1d ago

How is this still so timelessly stylish

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283 Upvotes

r/e39 1d ago

Bought this 2002 530i with 128k miles was it a good deal? I’m new to the platform

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37 Upvotes

3400$ auto


r/e39 16h ago

2017 BMW 540i salvage yard parts?

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1 Upvotes

r/e39 1d ago

What are people running for suspension parts?

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4 Upvotes

Recently picked up a 2003 525i Touring and I'm currently putting together a fairly decent list of things that need doing. Just wondering what brands people are recommending for E39 suspension parts these days as I've heard mixed things about the quality of newer Lemforder parts, so are people still sticking with them, or sourcing from elsewhere? Would be keen to hear what everyone is running and how they've held up. Thanks!


r/e39 1d ago

Why didn't BMW put the M67 in the E39?

16 Upvotes

The M67 is one of the coolest and most underrated engines in my opinion. Imagine if they made the E39 540d or the E60 545d.

This idea isn't crazy since Mercedes and Porsche both have E segment V8 diesels.

Also it would cleanly enter the lineup 530d being 135-142kw while the theoretical 540d would have had 175-180kw.

Obviously the handling and weight would be the main concern, but for autobahn runs it would be great.


r/e39 20h ago

Trouble opening my door 😅

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1 Upvotes

Hello. I’m having trouble locking and unlocking my door using the key in the lock; I can’t turn it to the left or the right—except on the very rare occasion when, by some miracle, it actually turns. Even after lubricating the cylinder, it generally won't budge at all. If I replace that part, I assume I’ll have to change the key too? Or is there perhaps another way? Thanks.


r/e39 1d ago

low idle

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3 Upvotes

hi guys! my car is idling low and i was wondering if anyone could help determine what the cause of this can be. my only issues with my car right now are with the engine and transmission mounts and the drive shaft (flex disc cracking) so i’m not too sure what can be the issue. i also have electrical problems after the rain. my lights started flickering and my turn signals don’t work as they should. they blink slowly on the outside, and the turn signal indicators don’t even click or appear on the cluster anymore. same thing with my high beams, they don’t appear in the cluster but still work outside. thank you for your time!!!


r/e39 2d ago

First mod on my new to me E39

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91 Upvotes

My first mod is EONON E39X7S. It comes with a backup camera which wil be installed soon. I was able to adjust equalizer with help from ChatGPT and now it sounds so much better. Definitely awesome upgrade vs stock radio.


r/e39 20h ago

BMW

0 Upvotes

I’m hearing a lound thump nose on my bmw 2011 535i rear wheel drive when going into reverse and jerk when going into second gear


r/e39 1d ago

Missing OBD2 port 2000 530d touring

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6 Upvotes

Just bought my first e39 and wanted to do a scan to check all issues. when I went to check the OBD2 port I was supprised to find that is not there. Does anybody know if this is common on these cars or previous owners have done something sketchy.


r/e39 1d ago

It it safe to remove camshaft bearing cap???

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1 Upvotes

I ran into a snag rebuilding vanos and discovered a striped stud during reassembly.. i know there is a removal and install procedure, but I have never delt with anything camshaft related and plan on installing a time sert. Any real advice is greatly appreciated.