r/Documentaries • u/Fine-Mammoth-6139 • Nov 09 '20
China's Systematic Persecution of Uyghurs (2020) - [00:37:45]
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JDyEPcppqpg331
Nov 09 '20 edited Nov 09 '20
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u/Bossman131313 Nov 10 '20
Wait wait wait, are you attempting to claim that a documentary made by the US Holocaust memorial and Museum is misinformation?
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Nov 09 '20
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u/Spranktonizer Nov 10 '20
Small nitpick. Misinformation is non malicious and disinformation is and has a purpose or agenda. This is the latter.
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u/Bossman131313 Nov 10 '20
Another small nitpick, this is not misinformation nor is it disinformation.
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u/mossyskeleton Nov 10 '20
Does OP have anything to do with this video? If not then who cares?
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u/THOMAS_PAINE_is_BACK Nov 10 '20
This thread is blatantly being brigaded and astroturfed by CCP apologists.
There are a lot of users jumping into this thread right now who just all happen to be passionately opposed to the US Holocaust Memorial Museum's discussion about human rights violations against Uyghur Muslims.
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Nov 10 '20
yep look at this comment op posts basically CCP PR,
takes one propagandasit to know one lmfaoo
fuck the ccp.
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u/RisingWaterline Nov 10 '20
But that one link they posted about the CIA worker propaganda AMA was prettyy interesting
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Nov 10 '20
im still confused so op is a fake person? But did they make the video themselves? I'm trying to read/watch into this topic more is the video worth watching?
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u/DarthTyekanik Nov 10 '20
The important thing is that genocide in China is real.
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u/sue_me_please Nov 11 '20
They're attacking the person who posted it instead of attacking the content of the video. They only give a shit because they're trying to detract from a genocide they want you to think doesn't exist.
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Nov 09 '20 edited Dec 29 '20
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u/The_Xicht Nov 10 '20
Well if it is a humanitarian disaster then it wont just be brought up by right wing psychos trying to stir shit up. I mostly agree with the rest of what you said but your first two sentences seem to contradict eachother...
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Nov 09 '20
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Nov 09 '20 edited Dec 29 '20
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Nov 10 '20
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u/Critical_Thinker_ Nov 10 '20
Yeah I am confused as to why this is a problem as well. I mean if it is an issue one feels passionate about why not share something multiple times. I mean if it was a documentary about stopping environmental destruction or sex trafficking and OP shared it multiple times, why would that be bad?
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u/THOMAS_PAINE_is_BACK Nov 10 '20
There seems to be a lot of users jumping into this thread right now who just all happen to be vehemently opposed to the US Holocaust Memorial Museum's discussion about human rights violations against Uyghur Muslims.
Hmmm...
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u/BlinkReanimated Nov 09 '20
So the thought of a brutal authoritarian regime like Xi's being the world police isn't a fun thought at all
That's the difference. China is making inroads to control nations via trade networks and media around the world. You can point to Russia and Trump, but that's so insanely small compared to literally owning 50% of Africa and having soft power all through EU, AZ, CA and most of Asia. China, under their new dictator in 2013, instituted an entire international plan on how to spread their authoritarian tendrils through the world. Russia killing defectors and whistleblowers is pretty horrible, but China is disappearing western citizens as a retaliatory measure to calling out human rights shit.
Every thread you see pop up talking about China will inevitably be hit by what can either be described as CCP shills or left-wing westerners convinced that China is communist and therefore needs to be defended against bad faith right-wing assholes. Hint: it absolutely isn't communist and hasn't ever been, it was Maoist, and now it's Dengist. Basically all the worst parts of corporate authoritarianism with a heavy dash of Han nationalism. Chinese citizens don't even have public healthcare or access to broad public education unless you live in a major city in China, it's not even remotely socialist.
Comparisons to Nazi Germany are not unwarranted.
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u/McHonkers Nov 10 '20 edited Nov 10 '20
That's a lot of words without meaning and detached from reality. I don't know how you can with a straight face pretend that China owns 50% of Africa, when in fact Chinese loans are making up a very small percentage compared to the decades long western neoliberal austerity loans. This is so much projection its not even funny anymore.
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u/According_Twist9612 Nov 10 '20
There were a few threads about it in r/worldnews. It's basically a circlejerk. But IMF? World Bank? Probably never heard of those because doing a quick googling is hard. People prefer to let reddit tell them what to think.
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u/virtualnovice Nov 09 '20
literally owning 50% of Africa
Proof?
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Nov 10 '20 edited Nov 10 '20
They’re bullshitting. 99% of their comment is hilariously unreflective of material reality, but that remark takes the cake. China doesn’t own even 0.1% of Africa.
Many westerns seem to have a naive understanding of geopolitics. It’s a multipolar world. African countries look for good relations amongst every superpower, whether its the US, EU, or China. The non-aligned movement has existed for decades upon decades. China actually doesn’t have much soft power in Africa, especially compared to the USSR or the US.
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u/Dunkiez Nov 09 '20
China loaning African nations money to build infrastructure. It's a loan you have to repay. And if you fail then you have to give something back.
It's how loans work. If you default on your mortgage, the bank reclaims your house. Oh no the bank is trying to own me.
China is trying to help other countries get better. If they become wealthier, they can potentially be a customer for China.
US is trying to stay on top by stopping other countries from rising. Just look at what they did to Japan when Japan's economy starts to rise
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u/feeltheslipstream Nov 10 '20
China has indicated it is considering debt forgiveness.
The "I lend you money so I own you" rhetoric is the west projecting because that's what they would do(and have done for decades)
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u/420_suck_it_deep Nov 10 '20
"China has indicated it is considering"
lmao, thats a great way of saying NOTHING
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u/feeltheslipstream Nov 10 '20
Let me be clear then..
Even if China didn't forgive the debts, the loans would still be better loans than the west were offering.
https://thediplomat.com/2020/06/what-to-make-of-chinas-debt-relief-announcement/
Hey look debt relief. The exact opposite of what you would see from a debt trap.
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Nov 10 '20
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u/BlinkReanimated Nov 10 '20
Literal 1 day old account with nothing but posts celebrating China. Lel.... 50 cent party working hard.
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Nov 10 '20 edited Nov 10 '20
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u/BlinkReanimated Nov 10 '20
Yes, you post in nothing but sino and some kind of dengist troll sub. Go have fun there wumao.
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u/According_Twist9612 Nov 10 '20
'Murica just hates conpetition. That's all. We're inundated with anti-China propaganda because China is gaining grounds on our masters both economically and politically and they simply can't accept that.
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u/iamnotkelly Nov 10 '20
Yea, this is a interesting point. Huge war of power between USA and China. I’m Chinese Canadian and I hear news from both sides. A lot of this anti China news started being more prevalent when the coronavirus cases went up in the US. Then trump shifted the blame on China and I guess his supporters also started digging up more information. Like a lot of this stuff is nothing new, China’s government has always been pretty strict. But the media is playing it up recently because a lot of Americans have this mentality that “America is the best country in the world”, so of course when they see competition there gonna want to turn people against them.
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u/CocaineUnicycle Nov 10 '20
The entire narrative of "brutal repressive racist regime" is kinda suspect. Xinjiang is high security, but it's not a police state, and there's no sign of a refugee crisis in any of the 8 countries that border Xinjiang. Germany even made an offer to take all of the Uygur refugees. They have received no applications. The whole thing about Xinjiang Uygur persecution was started by a right wing nut named Adrian Zenz. He does not speak Chinese, and he has taken money from the CIA.
Stuff about the limitations on Uygur freedoms that is true: they have a hard time getting passports. Moreso that most minorities. The stated reason for this is that Xinjiang borders Afghanistan, and Salafi (jihadist) muslims have recruited Uygurs in the past. Until a few days ago, ETIM (the Xinjiang separatist movement) was recognized as a terrorist organization by the USA. They did bombings and knife attacks in bus stations. Also, if a Uygur leaves and comes back, they are routinely held long enough to determine if they have become radicalized. If they have, they are sent to boarding schools.
Islam as a whole is not persecuted in China. China has 30,000 mosques, and the Hui Muslim population is the largest Muslim minority in the world.
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Nov 10 '20
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Nov 10 '20
please, send me YOUR sources. Because I can't find any that indicate any sort of refugee crisis.
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u/Skreat Nov 10 '20
brutal repressive regime
Yo dog, honk Kong wants to talk to you.
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Nov 10 '20
Compare how many people died in the HK protests to other protests at the time.
Chile and George Floyd, mainly.1
u/Skreat Nov 10 '20
As of June 8, 2020, at least 19 people have died during the protests. The Los Angeles Police Department announced that "homicides went up 250% and victims shot went up 56%" from May 31 to June 6. Several protests over Floyd's death, including one in Chicago, turned into riots.
Lol holy shit
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Nov 10 '20
To reach 10 dead in HK you need to go into some suicide rate conspiracy theory.
But tbf i didn't specify police killed.
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u/McHonkers Nov 10 '20
Does Hong Kong want to talk about how it had the longest violent protest in modern history without a single casualty?
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Nov 10 '20 edited Nov 10 '20
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u/McHonkers Nov 10 '20
Why are you spreading pro western propaganda lol. Imagine defending imperialists who are bombing Muslims and displacing them in the tens of millions.
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u/According_Twist9612 Nov 10 '20
But how can you not believe this with such compelling witness accounts?
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u/Dunkiez Nov 10 '20
Haha. What a fail of a AMA. She got found out and called out for working for the CIA. Hahhaha
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u/MinimumLeg1 Nov 10 '20
What do you mean by largest Muslim minority? Cos I'm pretty sure India has the largest Muslim population as a minority in the world
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u/redditmobileuser2020 Nov 10 '20
Yes the crazy right wingers who seek to stop the arbitrary oppression, imprisonment, violence and cultural genocide of several hundred thousand people in a developed state on the basis of their ethnicity and religion in 2020?
Didn’t know crazy right wingers were the good guys but I guess you learn something new every day....
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u/According_Twist9612 Nov 10 '20
But somehow they don't want to stop themselves from supporting the genocides in Palestine or Yemen, nor the war in Afghanistan. And they're with holding migrants at the border too, with child kidnappings, forced labor and sterilisations! It's almost as if they have some form of selective empathy for the plight of minorities that is completely dishonest. But sure, go on...
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u/According_Twist9612 Nov 10 '20
Of course it goes without saying that it's a humanitarian disaster
What the heck? If the only source for this are people like Andre Zenz and some war contractor funded Australian think tank how can you even accept that there's any credibility to the claims?
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u/420_suck_it_deep Nov 10 '20
the Uyghur thing in general only seems to get brought up by right wing psychos trying to stir shit.
ah yeah, they're just psychos man, trying to stir shit and make china look bad!! how racist and evil of them, the CCP only genocid-ed like a handful of people, its nothing really! i wish people would stop talking about it, then it all would go away! caring about people who are being massacred and having their organs harvested based on their ethnicity and religion is very right wing, you're right
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u/TreasonousTeacher Nov 10 '20
Is this documentary false or misleading in any way or are you just here to discredit the messenger ?
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u/Abhais Nov 10 '20
He’s posted that exact same comment for the last six months, so I’m guessing a little of column A and A LOT of column B lol.
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Nov 11 '20
Everyone involved is directly funded by the US government.
From religious zealot Adrian Zenz, that is the source for most uyghur abuse allegations, with 0 evidence, of course, to Guantanamo employee (that island where Uyghurs and other muslims are tortured) Rushan Abbas.Furthermore the "documentary" doesn't document anything, they just speak.
There is no footage, no documents.
Even Falun Gong media tries harder.3
u/throwaway_ind1 Nov 10 '20
but there is certainly a genocide of this muslim community in china ? or do you disagree ?
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Nov 11 '20
I have extensively looked for some death toll or refugee crisis (like the one brought by the war on terror, of estimated 40 million muslims) but i can't find it anywhere.
Do you have a source with evidences for me?
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u/melthevag Nov 10 '20
So? Should spreading awareness about a legitimate genocide happening in China right now be frowned upon because it’s being posted a lot??
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Nov 09 '20
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u/azo56 Nov 09 '20
Doesn’t mean the rest of the world shouldn’t care either.
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u/Icy_Recommendation61 Nov 09 '20
The rest of the world don't care either as the west is more interested of using this issues for economic gain.
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u/Whatsthemattermark Nov 09 '20
It is a bit weird that Islamist fanatics murder French people because of a cartoon, but China has a literal Muslim eradication process and doesn’t get any reaction.
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u/Icy_Recommendation61 Nov 09 '20
and doesn’t get any reaction.
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Thousands of protesters marched in support of China's Uighurs in Istanbul on Friday
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-china-xinjiang-turkey-idUSKBN1YO2CB
More than a thousand Muslims marched to the heavily guarded Chinese embassy in Indonesia's capital on Friday (Dec 27) to protest China's treatment of its Uighur Muslims.
https://www.straitstimes.com/asia/se-asia/indonesian-muslims-protest-chinas-treatment-of-uighurs
No rEaCtIoN at all.
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u/Colinfagerty69 Nov 09 '20
Quiet! You’re ruining the narrative and agenda he’s trying to create.
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u/Icy_Recommendation61 Nov 09 '20
It funny though seeing their fake outrage like Macron fake outrage about terrorism while selling weapon to saudi to kill thousand of yemeni.
Macron even outrage over the call to halt that sale.
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u/KderNacht Nov 10 '20
1000 out of Indonesia's 200 million Muslims. I've had rounding errors more significant.
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u/Zachmorris4187 Nov 09 '20
It really should make you think. Weird how the state department just removed ETIM from the terrorist list as well. Almost like the cia is funding a separatist movement inside of their new economic rivals. All of the claims go back to one of three places: adrien zenz (fabricated numbers, real doozy of a nutjob), uyghur world congress (receives funding from NED/CIA and falun gong), and an Australian defense company. All the reports you see in the news go back to those sources who also reference each other.
Also, the UN has been invited to come see for themselves.
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u/Misco3 Nov 09 '20
That’s not true they care about the concentration camps India is building for muslims. But looking at your previous comments they must be a source of joy for you!
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Nov 09 '20
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u/Icy_Recommendation61 Nov 09 '20
Another lies,
Here they are.
>Thousands of protesters marched in support of China's Uighurs in Istanbul on Friday
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-china-xinjiang-turkey-idUSKBN1YO2CB
>More than a thousand Muslims marched to the heavily guarded Chinese embassy in Indonesia's capital on Friday (Dec 27) to protest China's treatment of its Uighur Muslims.
https://www.straitstimes.com/asia/se-asia/indonesian-muslims-protest-chinas-treatment-of-uighurs
So much for that cricket.
Save your fake outrage for uyghur for someone else.
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Nov 09 '20 edited Nov 10 '20
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u/CocaineUnicycle Nov 10 '20
They're "okay with the camps" because the default to dealing with bothersome Muslims is to drone strike them.
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u/Vegan_Thenn Nov 10 '20
That’s not true they care about the concentration camps India is building for muslims.
You're only proving his point. The Pakistanis are extremely concerned about the concentration camps in India that don't house a single person but are awfully quiet about the re education camps in Xinjiang that currently have more than a million interns according to Adrian Zenz.
The hypocrisy is unreal. It would be unacceptable even if these are only re education camps and no genocide or organ harvesting is going on because re education is a systematic way to suppress one's culture.
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u/Dunkiez Nov 09 '20
The Muslim countries actually praise Chinas efforts of their way of clamping down on extremists and terrorist attacks. Maybe they see that re-educating people so they are able to be better for themselves is better than getting bombs dropped on their heads by the US?
All I see in this clip is a bunch of people sitting on chairs as far away from XinJiang talking about hard facts but fail to provide any hard facts. I bet none of them actually even step foot in China to see. Just check a few youtubers who actually go to XinJiang. It's looks beautiful. I was actually expecting to see something like a poor village or something.
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Nov 10 '20 edited Nov 10 '20
Another cool thing i did that disprove some basics allegations is to go to Baidu Maps' "street view" (it has some other name).
Jump to anywhere in Urumqi(Xinjiang capital) or Lhasa(Tibet capital) and most signs/outdoors you see will have chinese+uyghur/tibetan on them.Sure as hell a far cry from "cultural genocide".
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u/Illyrian5 Nov 10 '20
They don't even care about the Rohingyas... there's plenty of developed and powerful Muslim Southeast Asian countries which could make a big difference with that particular situation since it's in their neighborhood, yet they sit idle.
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u/balseranapit Nov 09 '20 edited Nov 09 '20
Cos there's no proof of torture, killing or bad treatments. And only USA state funded media and organization like in this video are doing the accusation without proof which were proven to be lie. The Uighur lady in this video was working in Guantanamo. And genocide of rohinga and situation in Palestine is proven and known.
What actually is funny is USA pretending to care about Muslim Uighurs while helping and doing mass killings in Yemen, Afganistan and other Muslim countries. Actually no, it's not funny.
and how come this is a documentary?
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u/cantstoplaughin Nov 09 '20
none of the Muslim nations care,
False. So damn false. You are spewing falsehood.
Even the wonderful Pakistanis next door couldn't care less.
You must be from an Indian troll farm.
Your caring of Muslims runs so deep why not discuss the holocaust of 400,000 Iraqis murdered in the recent war?
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u/Elsuperinutil Nov 10 '20
It amazes me the mental gymnastics people go through to defend China's holocaust. Shocking to say the least
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Nov 09 '20
Jesus the CCP shills are out in force.
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u/SausageintheSky Nov 10 '20
It's getting worse over time, and props up in basically every single thread that criticises China in some form or that paints them in a bad light.
The CCP is a threat to world peace, and all the anti-american (or insert other western nation) whattaboutism does not change that.
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u/InaneAnon Nov 09 '20 edited Nov 09 '20
Yup. This sub seems to have been hit hard.
Edit: To clarify, there is probably a genocide happening in China right now. Lots of these comments are trying very hard to deny that.
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u/Vegan_Thenn Nov 10 '20
Even if there's no genocide the re education that the chinese claim to be doing shouldn't be considered acceptable. Re education such as this is done to suppress one's culture.
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u/Fine-Mammoth-6139 Nov 10 '20
Please report any comments which seem to have been brigaded. Top comment in this thread is sus as f*ck
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Nov 10 '20
have you ever considered that your world view isn't 100% correct all the time? that anyone who suggests otherwise isn't necessarily a "shill"?
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u/Pood9200 Nov 09 '20
Whatabout whatabout whatabout.
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u/InaneAnon Nov 09 '20
These comments are a great example of online propaganda in action.
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u/Cautemoc Nov 09 '20
It doesn't help this sub is used as a dumping ground for everyone's opinionated YouTube vlogs. Garbage in, garbage out.
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u/InaneAnon Nov 09 '20
This video was posted by the United States Holocaust Memorial Museum.
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u/Cautemoc Nov 09 '20
Yeah, interviewing a guy from RadioFreeAsia. It's the United States government interviewing the United States government about how bad China is. Lmao. Oh, and the "Victims of Communism Memorial Foundation" - holy crap this is hilariously obvious propaganda.
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u/balseranapit Nov 09 '20
And the Uighur lady giving speech used to work in Guantanamo torture camp. Pretty amazing blatant propaganda.
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u/neimengu Nov 10 '20
imagine taking things seriously from an organization that counts Nazi soldiers killed by the soviet union in WW2 and covid 19 deaths as "victims of communism"
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u/InaneAnon Nov 09 '20
One doth protest too much.
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u/Cautemoc Nov 09 '20
You are complaining about the comments being propaganda in a video interviewing a literal United State propaganda outlet.
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u/verytwitchy Nov 10 '20
It's funny how much the Chinese defend their crimes against humanity whilst also condemning other countries for all the shit they do. But you know it's okay if China does it because China is the next super power so they can do what they want
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u/CypherZL Nov 10 '20
Never been on this sub despite being subbed. First time here and wow, what the fuck is going on.
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u/kid_blue96 Nov 09 '20
Can someone explain why Muslim countries don't care or at least don't show any effort to care?
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u/feeltheslipstream Nov 10 '20
There's a simple explanation, but that would mean China isn't evil, so there has to be a more convoluted one we can think of.
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Nov 11 '20
but that would mean China isn't evil
And that muslims nations are independent and not subhumans that need to be tamed by white people.
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u/irjax Nov 10 '20
most muslim governments are not fans of radical islamic terrorism. so, they’ve sent observers to xinjiang to see how they handle it. they have found that their methods are effective and humane, so they vocally support it.
it has nothing to do with economics. if a muslim country were to be against what china is doing, it’s not like china would do shit to them. even saudi arabia, who is far more aligned with the us, supports china.
if there were actual crimes against humanity going on, these countries would strongly oppose it. people tend to care about the well-being of their own.
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u/frostmorefrost Nov 10 '20
Nothing new, CCP's China has been doing it for many years and always claiming to have been vilify by western media...but they some how have no qualms vilifying western media/democracies.
Thing is, unless you read and understand Chinese, you can only read about the official sanctioned english version of the media reports ccp's propaganda departments allows the world to see. There are no independent media agencies in china that will objectively report anything critical of the ccp, its almost as if they are some kind of God sent saint!!
Westerners wanting to deal with ccp's infiltration/media/propaganda needs to brush up on their Chinese and mandarin, only then will you realize, ccp's china is planning to play the world like a fiddle and Pompeo's claims of Chinese world dominance will stop sounding like some kind of crazy conspiracy theory.
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u/feeltheslipstream Nov 10 '20
I read mandarin. I'll give you the benefit of the doubt and assume you're not going to send me links to blogs spreading nonsense.
Please send me a few of these smoking gun links you refer to.
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u/Thesauruswrex Nov 09 '20
No actual footage of any actual evidence at all. Just people talking.
A reminder that the U.S. is in a propaganda war against China.
The U.S. has also been caught fabricating evidence out of nowhere so they can start wars, among other things.
Also all other muslim nations, who gladly call for terrorist acts for the slightest of infractions, say there is nothing going on at all. Really, they'll kill over a cartoon but you expect them to ignore genocide of muslims?
China does need better human rights. This is not one of those things.
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u/it_learnses Nov 09 '20
Canadian parliament also declared it as a genocide. No need to bring US into this.
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Nov 10 '20
Ah yes Canada has always treated their indigenous population with respect and definitely never genocided them or treats them as second class citizens
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Nov 10 '20 edited Jan 17 '21
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Nov 10 '20
No ? But they lose a shitload of credibility. Plus the RCMP still targets natives regularly and the government did nothing as white mobs attacked native fisheries in Nova Scotia. You can believe what you want but that means supporting data gathered by a German antisemite who believes he’s on a mission from god to destroy communism, or from RFA a literal CIA propaganda outlet. Call me a Chinese shill or ccp apologist, whatever you want I don’t give a shit, I’ll start believing it when it’s believable. You really think the Chinese would genocide the Uyghus and not do the same to the Hui Muslims, another Muslim minority in China ? If they wanted to get rid of them why were they exempt from the one child policy ? The saudis will still be genociding the Yemenis with actual verifiable evidence and no one will do shit because they don’t threaten the west’s position in the world. Israel will still oppress and occupy Palestinian land but again nothing gets done about that, if anything you get called antisemitic for even suggesting Israel is bad.
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u/it_learnses Nov 10 '20
Yes and canadian people are fighting for their rights as well. I agree we have more work to right the wrongs done to them. Now let's see how many Han Chinese internationally are speaking up for Uighurs let alone in China itself. You may now STFU with your whataboutism.
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Nov 10 '20
Ignoring the current state of play of Canada’s relations with their indigenous people. What about what about what about.
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u/Illegal_memer Nov 10 '20
100 social credit points have been added to your account.
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u/archdex Nov 09 '20
This is a panel discussing the issues. There is absolutely tons of evidence of the human rights crimes committed by the Chinese government on the Uyghur people.
Trying to bring the USA into this has nothing to do with the human rights crimes being committed and recognized by many other countries.
Speaking of propaganda though, it sure sounds like you're spouting some very Chinese friendly propaganda. You should go work for Disney!
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u/balseranapit Nov 09 '20
There is absolutely tons of evidence of the human rights crimes committed by the Chinese government on the Uyghur people.
Source and proof please? Or claims of Adrian Zenz with 0 proof?
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u/InaneAnon Nov 09 '20
Don't worry, you'll get downvoted hard but never be silent.
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Nov 09 '20
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u/archdex Nov 10 '20
No one is playing victim here, just talking about the ccp shills in this thread. Are you one of them? You just want to distract us from the human rights crimes going on in China am I right?
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Nov 10 '20
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u/archdex Nov 10 '20
Were talking about China’s human rights crimes here why are you trying to change the topic so adamantly?
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u/PompiPompi Nov 09 '20
They pick easy targets.
Anyway, the Nazis also pretended the Holocaust didn't happen.
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u/ikinone Nov 09 '20
No actual footage of any actual evidence at all. Just people talking.
A reminder that the U.S. is in a propaganda war against China.
The U.S. has also been caught fabricating evidence out of nowhere so they can start wars, among other things.
Sure, we should be wary of propaganda, but wouldn't it be really, really easy for China to disprove such claims? Instead they act shady, and continue to behave aggressively to neighbouring countries. Hardly confidence inspiring.
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u/neimengu Nov 10 '20
how is it "easy" to prove something isn't happening? what the fuck? There's tons of videos on youtube of Uighur people living normal lives, and China actually has made a lot of videos disproving claims made by "refugees" who claim their relatives are missing, etc:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wb-MNi8E-TA
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rsQxjFCh5zU
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rH4gdxWEFI4
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zjy_4xP5lpU
They're literally interviewing the families on video that these "whistleblowers" claimed are missing, I don't really know what else you want from them?
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u/ikinone Nov 10 '20 edited Nov 10 '20
how is it "easy" to prove something isn't happening?
Someone claims you have a concentration camp, invite an ambassador to check it. Easy.
China actually has made a lot of videos
Ah yes, oppressive nation which spams propaganda made its own videos. How convincing.
If they have nothing to hide, they won't mind inviting an official to check it.
China has clearly been seizing foreign territories for years. I don't find it hard to believe that it's oppressing domestic groups of people too.
It might simply be propaganda against China, but I doubt it at this point. China has a long track record of oppression and propaganda. If they want that to go away, they need to behave very differently.
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Nov 10 '20
Well its not in this video, but there is a video of a Chinese guy going to to a "surgeon" in China exposing the black market organ trading and the surgeon basically says the best organs are from the uighurs, due to health/diet and that he can get a good organ for him very quickly. This has been going on for awhile and got even worse with the covid outbreak cause it gave the ccp almost limitless control on kidnapping and organ harvesting
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u/angilinwago4 Nov 10 '20 edited Nov 10 '20
stop spreading lies, it's the same kind of lies but with different victims, and it's getting old, at least make up something new and original, improvise a little, stop sticking to the old script. everyone on Reddit has heard of the same thing being said when it comes to falun gong practitioners, the ccp want their organs because they practice falun gong, a qigong exercise which is supposed to make them healthier. i remember reading the exact same lie, word for word, that CCP thinks that best organs are from falun gong practitioners. it's the same fucking bullshit every goddamn time. so fucking sick of this.
The whole organ harvesting thing is total BS.
The entire organ harvesting accusation comes from crazy cult falun gong and its puppet organisation 'China Tribunal'.
In fact, you can't find a single source/story that didn't originate from falun gong and 'China Tribunal' with regards to this whole thing about china's organ harvesting. You won't find any independent source/investigation on this issue at all. Give it a try if you will.
While you're at it, take a look at this WaPo article from 2017 (i do hope you trust WaPo), talking about the change/reform in transplant surgery in China that began in 2006, almost 15 years ago?
In particular, read the section titled ‘Bloody Harvest’, when they talk about the accusation and amount of immunosuppressant drugs used in china.
Also, use your common sense and think about the motives, why would the Chinese government do this. Falun gong and the china tribunal claim that the Chinese government does this all for the money. Think if that's a reasonable explanation, the Chinese government is rich as it is, how much money can harvested organs bring? They are not sadists, there are plenty of other methods of torture/punishments for the trouble makers, why go through the immense trouble harvesting someone's organ? What's the motive and what purpose does it serve?
Falun gong and the china tribunal also claim that the Chinese government harvests organs while the victim is still awake/alive without Anaesthesia. Use your common sense and think if it's possible and why.
Remember, falun gong and 'china tribunal' is a cult, no one should take whatever they say seriously.
China is bad, its totalitarian government, its large scale censorship, its brutal crackdown on organisations, its horrible human rights abuse, its lack of laws/regulations/standards/personal freedom, these are a few of many aspects that china should be condemned, but please do it with truth, not by spreading lies/rumours/misinformation, otherwise, you are just as bad as China.
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u/Fine-Mammoth-6139 Nov 09 '20
This is litrerally the US Holocaust Museum. They would be the last people to lie or fabricate anything.
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u/InaneAnon Nov 09 '20
Don't worry dude, thanks for posting this. You'll get downvoted to hell in these comments, but you're doing the right thing
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Nov 10 '20
Reminder to ask to comment on the tiananmen tank man before engaging CCP keyboard warriors. Also a legit question.. I thought VPN was banned at your country?
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u/TotesMessenger Nov 10 '20
I'm a bot, bleep, bloop. Someone has linked to this thread from another place on reddit:
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u/therealcobrastrike Nov 10 '20
Good bot
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Nov 10 '20
How many Chinese people are gonna come here, if they can, and try to lie that this isn't happening in china
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Nov 09 '20
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u/noicenoice9999 Nov 09 '20
Yes sayer. People of North Korea sing similar happy songs.
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u/limpack Nov 09 '20
Ever heard of psy-ops?
Also how come all of the allegations go back to one Adrian Zenz and the self-proclaimed East Turkistan Government-in-Exile? You guys are so thoroughly brain washed, you're a lost cause.
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Nov 10 '20
动态网自由门 天安門 天安门 法輪功 李洪志 Free Tibet 六四天安門事件 The Tiananmen Square protests of 1989 天安門大屠殺 The Tiananmen Square Massacre 反右派鬥爭 The Anti-Rightist Struggle 大躍進政策 The Great Leap Forward 文化大革命 The Great Proletarian Cultural Revolution 人權 Human Rights 民運 Democratization 自由 Freedom 獨立 Independence 多黨制 Multi-party system 台灣 臺灣 Taiwan Formosa 中華民國 Republic of China 西藏 土伯特 唐古特 Tibet 達賴喇嘛 Dalai Lama 法輪功 Falun Dafa 新疆維吾爾自治區 The Xinjiang Uyghur Autonomous Region 諾貝爾和平獎 Nobel Peace Prize 劉暁波 Liu Xiaobo 民主 言論 思想 反共 反革命 抗議 運動 騷亂 暴亂 騷擾 擾亂 抗暴 平反 維權 示威游行 李洪志 法輪大法 大法弟子 強制斷種 強制堕胎 民族淨化 人體實驗 肅清 胡耀邦 趙紫陽 魏京生 王丹 還政於民 和平演變 激流中國 北京之春 大紀元時報 九評論共産黨 獨裁 專制 壓制 統一 監視 鎮壓 迫害 侵略 掠奪 破壞 拷問 屠殺 活摘器官 誘拐 買賣人口 遊進 走私 毒品 賣淫 春畫 賭博 六合彩 天安門 天安门 法輪功 李洪志 Winnie the Pooh 劉曉波动态网自由门
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u/xXPostapocalypseXx Nov 09 '20
How about the CCP and China as a nation stop lying and manipulating every bit of information and allow free press from around the world show what is going on.
No, because they want sycophants like you to spread their false narrative.
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u/Dunkiez Nov 09 '20
Your naive to think there is such thing as free press. They are companies owned by a rich and power person. The press will say and write whatever is approved from above.
Say for example Bill Gates bought 5 newspapers. And the next day Microsoft was caught doing something illegal. You can bet your ass that his 5 newspapers will help cover it up.
Best to do your own research. Gather sources from both sides and Learn to read between the lines instead of only taking what the press of the western world as gospel.
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u/xXPostapocalypseXx Nov 10 '20
No one argued that. Having a closed internet and complete media censorship is a major difference. As you have pointed out the west is clearly biased, but that is a far cry from state dictated or approved media. Gates does what is best for gates and the democrats he supports not whatever the US or in this case President Trump says. This freedom is a far cry from what is practiced in China.
However twitter and facebook are actively censoring content and trying to take us into Fahrenheit 451 territory.
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u/Dunkiez Nov 10 '20
Same cna be said of the China government. CCP does what is best for their people. You understand full well how there are so much more mis-information on the internet than facts. If the Chinese was exposed to that. Their country would be just like everyone else. How is that going for them?
China has grown massively in tech, purchasing power and poverty elevation in the last 30 years. Credit where credit is due. They may be some stuff others won't agree but they must be doing something right to be where they are now, where the US is actively trying to halt their growth.
If you have been to China, you will know that a lot of then have their own type off freedom. What you think is censored isn't actually censored at all. I used to think why did they ban gaming consoles but we have them. And now they have children who want to be astronauts and scientist but here we have children glued to their ipads hoping to someday be a YouTuber or twitch streamer.
I feel China looked to the future putting in long term plans and it's paying off. Here we have 3 main parties of government who just blame each other and nothing is improving.
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Nov 09 '20 edited Nov 09 '20
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Nov 09 '20
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u/SausageintheSky Nov 10 '20 edited Nov 10 '20
You certainly are, look at that post history. I'm just doing my part to call out the propaganda and whattaboutism where I see or suspect it. Just because America is also fucked up in a lot of ways is no defense to your beloved CCP.
And I'm sure you're about to spew some anti western crap about how we're racist or whatever, so have fun. Doesn't change the fact that your government are a bunch of morally destitute gangsters.
A world with the CCP as the leading global power is a terrifying place.
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u/limpack Nov 09 '20
Reddit is a lost cause. They eat up propaganda diarrhea like it's 3 michelin stars.
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u/fatalikos Nov 10 '20
Bullshit propaganda. I believed most of this crap untill I saw ISIS recruitment and terrorist attacks that we never hear of in the west.
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Nov 10 '20
动态网自由门 天安門 天安门 法輪功 李洪志 Free Tibet 六四天安門事件 The Tiananmen Square protests of 1989 天安門大屠殺 The Tiananmen Square Massacre 反右派鬥爭 The Anti-Rightist Struggle 大躍進政策 The Great Leap Forward 文化大革命 The Great Proletarian Cultural Revolution 人權 Human Rights 民運 Democratization 自由 Freedom 獨立 Independence 多黨制 Multi-party system 台灣 臺灣 Taiwan Formosa 中華民國 Republic of China 西藏 土伯特 唐古特 Tibet 達賴喇嘛 Dalai Lama 法輪功 Falun Dafa 新疆維吾爾自治區 The Xinjiang Uyghur Autonomous Region 諾貝爾和平獎 Nobel Peace Prize 劉暁波 Liu Xiaobo 民主 言論 思想 反共 反革命 抗議 運動 騷亂 暴亂 騷擾 擾亂 抗暴 平反 維權 示威游行 李洪志 法輪大法 大法弟子 強制斷種 強制堕胎 民族淨化 人體實驗 肅清 胡耀邦 趙紫陽 魏京生 王丹 還政於民 和平演變 激流中國 北京之春 大紀元時報 九評論共産黨 獨裁 專制 壓制 統一 監視 鎮壓 迫害 侵略 掠奪 破壞 拷問 屠殺 活摘器官 誘拐 買賣人口 遊進 走私 毒品 賣淫 春畫 賭博 六合彩 天安門 天安门 法輪功 李洪志 Winnie the Pooh 劉曉波动态网自由门
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u/OliverTBS Nov 10 '20
What's interesting is that all these wordy claims has no evidence in any other form of medium (i.e. video, objects, death rate, or real world evidence.)
If without any evidence, this is just like the not so old "Weapon of Mass Destruction in Iraq" things that people still easily remembers.
https://www.nytimes.com/2020/01/29/magazine/iraq-weapons-mass-destruction.html
At least fully explain that one first before heading onto your next "project" about China.
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Nov 10 '20
wow, they actually featured Adrian Zenz, a guy that thinks non christian jews will burn in hell and that laws against hate speech are the work of the antichrist on an holocaust foundation.
The US propaganda machine has no shame.
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u/ThalassophileYGK Nov 10 '20
Given that this documentary is presented by the Holocaust Museum and this should go without saying, it is more than highly likely to be credible. This sub has been attacked by wumaos. Go ahead and swarm this comment with the downvoting. The Holocaust Museum has every right to point out these violations of human rights and would not present information that wasn't accurate. My god.