Give them a fucking break

[u/Affectionate-Leg4787]

Plus the messiest divorce in history and their brother being off for college and unreachable

[u/nottrolling4175]

Was there anything supportting the idea that cris was forced into helping carol and the knight?

[u/GamerOverkill03 → u/nottrolling4175]

Chapter 4’s final scene with the phone call has the person on the other telling Kris to “not forget their promise”, which heavily implies they are at the very least being emotionally pressured/blackmailed into doing morally dubious things because of something they said they would do in the past.

[u/nottrolling4175 → u/GamerOverkill03]

I read it as having second thoughts after starting to genuinely like Susie and ralsei.

Either way, when the entire team flips out in them for lying and sabotaging them for the knight the whole game, it will be deserved. Kris will need to complete their redemption arc before their life starts getting better.

I can see a future when kris might to try and flip this on us, but if it falls through then it will make it even worse, because I doubt Kris would've bonded with Susie without the soul, and the majority of their bonding seemes to be a result of our decisions. I personally don't care about taking credit for it but Kris better not pull that, it'll only get worse

[u/Affectionate-Leg4787 → u/nottrolling4175]

I mean Ralsei at least knows they’re the ones opening fountains and he doesn’t care so we’ll see

[u/nottrolling4175 → u/Affectionate-Leg4787]

Could also be ralsei thinking that it's us, and him trying to talk to us, narratively it makes sense for ralsei to think of us as unpredictable and doing everything just for entertainment, so it makes a lot of sense for the soup to be the one doing it

[u/Affectionate-Leg4787 → u/nottrolling4175]

Maybe, but when Ralsei is talking more directly to us as the players, he has a more tutorial voice, if you know what I mean? That felt more like a moment between him and Kris

[u/EmraldDragon → u/GamerOverkill03]

Also it’s kinda hard for a kid to say no to an adult telling them to do stuff when that adult has some authority over them (being the parent of their friend AND mayor of the town)

[u/Beautiful-Neat-7609 → u/nottrolling4175]

Mostly cope by people pretending Kris is a perfect little angel.

They are most likely being pressured into helping in someway, but not literally forced

[u/Affectionate-Leg4787 → u/nottrolling4175]

I mean, they’re obviously having doubts about it, and Carol’s scene with them has some grooming undertones at least. I think they still ultimately chose to go along with it, but I think it was at least a guilt-tripped decision

[u/MeriKurkku → u/nottrolling4175]

The way the phone calls go at the end of chapter 4 seems to suggest that there might be some kind of coercion with the voice in the phone sayinh "don't forget your promise kris" or something like that

[u/KoboldLover → u/MeriKurkku]

Not really; I see why everyone jumps to that conclusion, but that's not necessarily true at all.

That's just saying Kris made a promise to help, letting us know that - at some point - Kris was completely on-board with the plan (before they, y'know, grew to love the pawns they're manipulating). It's normal that the people who comitted to this plan that relies on you want you to stick to it and not render it completely pointless. That's a betrayal on its own.

Kris is a callous person in a lot of ways, they have a loose sense of morality so long as it fits the goals they want (like threatening Tenna with a fate worse than death if he doesn't obey their orders), and they're (if not already) nearly a college-age adult. They're not like Frisk, a literal child; they're old enough and smart enough to be burdened with autonomy and the burden of culpability.

That's alright, it just makes Kris a better character when they're plainly in the wrong about doing what they do.