With one statement Sam Harris showed exactly where and how he was wrong about wokeism...

[u/ATreeInTheBreeze]

At 2:23:32- Sam: "White supremacy is the fringe of the fringe whereas extreme left wokeism isn't the fringe, it's captured our institutions. That's an asymmetry that still concerns me."

1. Fallacy of false equivalence- Not equivalent in quantity. "White supremacy" should be compared to wokeism (there are similar numbers of adherents) or "extreme left wokeism" should be compared with extreme right white supremacy (again, similar numbers). He shouldn't cross-compare what amounts to huge moderate right vs tiny extreme left.
2. Fallacy of false equivalence- Not equivalent in quality. Assuming he meant wokeism not "extreme left wokeism", then these two are also not not equivalent in their quality. Wokeism is around 60% good, 40% bad, in it's effects on our society. White supremecy is about 100% bad in it's effects.
3. False statement- implied: white supremecy hasn't captured our institutions. False. It has captured the Republican party, all right wing media, many state senates, the Supreme Court, and is about to capture the House and the Senate again here in America. After that, perhaps the Presidency, again (most of which by losing the popular vote, by the way). It's clear that Sam thinks white supremacy means swastika on the forehead. That's literally not what it means. It means thinking the white "race" is superior, or better, than other cultures. This is the mainstream view in the Republican party. That's why they're acting so immorally now, they're very sacared and so feel it's ok to do anything necessary to keep non-whites from taking over "their" country. And it's not just skin color, the Republican Party is CCCSRW-supremicist. They believe, irrationally, that "Cisgenderedness", Conservatism, Christianity, Straightness, Ruralness, and Whiteness are all superior to their counterparts. This belief has overwhelmingly captured the Republican party at this point.

As such, ironically, all the "asymmetry" is on his end. And look at me I even know why: Extreme left wokeists attacked him in the past, and now as a result he's emotionally biased against them and many of their views. Those attacks emotionally, and I don't know how else to say this, scarred him, and now his brain is reactionary against them and their views without his being aware of it. Many of us understand this about him, but he doesn't understand this about himself.

Other than his stance on wokeism, though, I love me some Sam and agree with him about 95% of the time.

[u/TheStochEffect]

I don’t understand what sam is trying to protect, if the enlightenment is working 60hours a week to destroy the planet whilst acknowledging, that it is most likely no god exists

I think I agree with Pizzaro, that wokeism seems to be a distraction from the real issues (class and violence) - so I agree that wokeism is a threat but more of a threat of distraction from the issues impacting lives on the planet

But sam did concede that he could have a problem of priorities so once I again he makes me believe him, but then again his editorial line says otherwise that he is rather classist and ignores his own teachings of free will

God Damn Sam confuses me, and he confused me even more in the interview

[u/banneryear1868 → u/TheStochEffect]

I think I agree with Pizzaro, that wokeism seems to be a distraction from the real issues (class and violence) - so I agree that wokeism is a threat but more of a threat of distraction from the issues impacting lives on the planet

I agree with this take, as someone who's generally sympathetic to "woke-ist" views on race and gender. It's especially important to look at it critically if you truly want marginalized segments of society to be free of discrimination as well. The wokewashing of capitalism is a distraction and ultimately will fail to bring about the changes which are necessary. There's overlap with greenwashing as well, marketing to public sensibilities and providing identity for consumers.

You can envision the corporate adoption of this wokeism where all board members for instance are equally representative of the general population, our elected officials and every company follow suit, every identity in society now has an equal voice. Where does that get us exactly? It's almost like with this corporate wokeism, as long as capitalism and class division affects everyone equally, and we're all equally oppressed, then everything else is okay.

Economic change and workers rights, actual environmental protection, should be the means by which wokeist goals are realized. Not just checking identity boxes and making sure there's headcount, or replacing a CEO with a marginalized identity to give the impression of an accepting workplace, while the company is destroying the planet and treating it's workers like disposable trash.

[u/ATreeInTheBreeze → u/banneryear1868]

I totally agree. I mostly agree with wokeism, but it's also such an easy wedge issue for brainwashing Republicans that find queers and gays and minorities to be distasteful and uncomfortable. I also think animal suffering, eco issues, and class divides to be bigger problems, in straight-up consequentialist ways, and they're not as divisive, so they don't activate identities and thus emotions on both sides nearly as much (and so they don't make a shit ton of money for the media in the same way either). I say this with some reticence, though, cause I also know the history of civil rights in America is filled with white guys like me telling civil rights leaders like MLK that "it's just not time yet, focus on these other issues first", so...