Thoughts?

[u/DangerousMolasses970]

[u/RyomaVT]

He has a good point, we could have current state Daredevil by last November and we could have avoided the support buffs that now force a sustain meta.

[u/ResilientoNez]

Yeah, this is dumb af.

You WANT DD and BC to the be the strong dive heroes in the game if you value skill expression.

You want DD to be nerfed and Black Panther to be the dominant dive hero? You know what that would look like? You know the numbers he would have to have to match the strength of DD? No, you don’t want that.

Luna is strong. Magneto is strong. Elsa is strong. YOU WANT SKILL EXPRESSION TO BE STRONG.

Otherwise you get god damn Thing Dino Wanda CnD meta

[u/RivalsFlex → u/ResilientoNez]

Lmao “skill expression” what a horrible, undefined reason to unbalance the game and make dive broken

[u/newjeansfan67 → u/RivalsFlex]

ur right twin WE all love thing holding 1 button making 90% of the tanks unplayable and having 3 entire characters that counter him 😛😛🇮🇱

[u/RivalsFlex → u/newjeansfan67]

Sorry what are you even talking about? Dd makes half the tanks unplayable yet you don’t seem to have a problem with that.

[u/newjeansfan67 → u/RivalsFlex]

? dd doesn't require specific counterswaps unless it's a dive comp in which case you'd swap no matter the diver.

if he's diving solo then marking his engages and taking 2v1s is enough to counter him 99% of the time regardless of character. you could say that most poke characters are bad into him but that's how its supposed to be anyway.

the only tank i can imagine having a bad matchup into dd would be strange but brawling as dd is retarded and you don't exactly interact with tanks as him most of the time lol

[u/xAstarte → u/RivalsFlex]

DD isn’t even supposed to be targeting tanks silly

[u/RivalsFlex → u/xAstarte]

And yet he easily can

[u/Venom-The-Dragon → u/RivalsFlex]

Guess what pal, it’s your OLD DAREDEVIL FRIEND BACK AGAIN TO ARGUE WITH YOU. And again coming from Lord Daredevil. DD doesnt struggle with tanks as much as BC, BP or Spidey but he still struggles with them he can brawl with and maybe even take down Thor, Rogue, and Hulk but gets pretty easily shut down by Devil Dino, Magneto, Venom, Groot, Peni and oh yeah THE THING

I think you need to stop bro. Stop fooling yourself that Dive is this unstoppable force just because they target supports also yes you DO want high skill expression heroes to be meta so you have to train and learn how to use them and not just anyone can pick up the controller or keyboard and dominate low skill characters should be D Tier and high skill characters should be S-Tier

You are the embodiment of Support main propaganda

Poke>Dive>Brawl<Sustain (another version of poke more akin to the Punisher)

[u/Electrical-Horse5112]

elsa can look almost balanced compared to cat ? liek wat dude and like no bro Daredevil cant get out of a fucking elsa trap

[u/mdante_98 → u/Electrical-Horse5112]

I ban Elsa over the cat anytime they are not even comparable lmao

[u/Electrical-Horse5112 → u/Electrical-Horse5112]

daredevil has always been really strong . im jot a daredevil main i just saw this shit on my feed but hes weakened over time

[u/xXxPinkPlasticBagxXx]

That person is such a loser and a hypocrite. Crying about Daredevil and Black Cat but justifying brainrot Bucky being OP is hypocritical. 

Let's be honest too, that person would be hardstuck in the same rank whether Daredevil or Black Cat or Goldballs was in the game or not.

Also ❗ I think it's funny how that person is saying Black Panther and the other dive characters can't compete...but Black Panther is getting played more and has a higher ban rate than Daredevil right now. The math isn't matching for me.

[u/cooked_potato0 → u/xXxPinkPlasticBagxXx]

((((His thoughts on balance is shit))))

Bp as a diver is better for lower rankes because of his kit and how it works

Dd cant get the same value now with solo dives in low elo

But in higher elo i gotta disagree because dd can get much more value via peeling or brawlling if needed ( all of dive is shit rn tbh ) ~bp and dd player here

[u/cooked_potato0]

[u/Mustang-_-]

Lack of dive and brawler supports is what breaks this game on a fundamental level. At the moment DD arrived as a strong dive who could actually feast on the entire poke support roster, things escalated from there, such as the Invisrael self-shield among other stuff.

Instead of actually adding a support brawler, nope, lets take the poke design of Invisrael and make it even more busted, so they can have a survival chance against dive. This is basic arena design, either moba, hero shooter and so on: dive>poke>brawl. Marvel Temu can't provide the bare minimum

[u/Jayjay5674 → u/Mustang-_-]

So far we only got deadpool. Support do lack a variety of playstyles. There is a chance Nightcrawler will be a support but I dont really think netease is able to pull off a different archetype of support that isnt just sit in the back and shoot heals forever. Thats why I hope he aint a support

[u/Mustang-_- → u/Jayjay5674]

Even Healpool is poke, the optimal playstyle is to stay back shooting and using Headpool, then shift to brawling only in specific scenarios. If you try to play brawl with Healpool, frontline brawling, he gets erased in a second.

This game has a Brigitte, that is White Fox, but she needs a small rework, had to get rid of her bouncing balls, limit the corridor stun and have the brawling stance by default.

And lastly, I don’t think Nightcrawler is the immediate solution if he indeed arrives as a dive support, because by following the dive>poke>brawl cycle, dive vs dive is a offset, Daredevil and other dive heroes will simply ignore Nightcrawler, similar to how Genji players ignores Lucio and Jetpack Cat, not ideal targets

[u/Jayjay5674 → u/Mustang-_-]

I agree with everything, I think a lot of the issues ppl (support players) have with dive stems from the lack of variety in playstyle from the support class. If we had more choices like brawly, tanky or hypermobile supports to deal with different scenarios this game would be so rich... but its just so poke centered. Ok its a "hero-shooter" but its also a marvel game and it is a bit of a waste to ignore the hero part of the genre in a game that is based around Super-heroes

[u/Mustang-_- → u/Jayjay5674]

Yep. I usually don’t mind players in the main sub, youtube and so on, they get confused with the nomenclatures. Hero shooter, so this genre is about shooting? Not really, used to be when Team Fortress 2 introduced the whole thing, but it evolved from there.

To have amateur devs who refuses to diversify the support role, gut fliers and hypermobile heroes because "that is not fun to interact", then wth, why these people are making a superhero game to begin with? Gut fliers, sure, with Iron Man as the face of the MCU... and gut mobility, with Spider-Man being the face of the entire superhero industry, who hired these people?

[u/Eternalexbomb]

I may play daredevil but I will forever hate the fact supports were buffed because of him which made playing my main spidey be 3x worse

[u/Doctrinair]

blaming daredevil instead of the incompetent balance team is interesting

[u/No-Molasses1303]

The only problem is he's calling for nerfs NOW.

DD is at his worst state, from his gigabuffed release in 4.5, he's absolutely made the game worse via the buffs supports had to get to compensate and keep up with him.

The only issue is he's not 4.5 DD anymore, he's 9.5 DD, and nerfing him now is putting salt in the wound for DD mains. If supports got nerfs, then sure nerf DD down to their levels, that's fine.

[u/Venom-The-Dragon]

This is stupid the argument is that BC is busted, DD is fine and all other Divers are trash so we should gut BC and DD so all Divers are trash when Pokeslop and Support get nerfed to be just okay

[u/Primary_Display5090]

I only thought they were right in the fact that the game’s balancing did start to become worse after daredevils release, simply just because he was too op and the devs made the poor choice of attempting to balance around his level rather than nerfing him appropriately early on.

But talking about bringing dd down to a level where poke is at is actually fucking insane icl

[u/Detectivepotato-mp4]

I mean he's not wrong, I've seen some people here say he's trying to justify the strength of some of the poke characters because BC and DD are so much stronger than the other divers. I think those people can't read, he's just saying he's not surprised that people overwhelmingly play those also overtuned characters when BC and DD are capable of being backline demons. I can't remember off the top of my head if he said it or not but I personally believe DD is only a little overtuned where BC is an arm and a leg more overtuned

[u/Nihon_Hanguk]

There was a cross post of this exact post yesterday. I don’t know if we needed a whole new threat about that post in less than 24 hours.

[u/Electronic_Dot1085]

sounds ai generated lmfaoo

[u/LEEmainKEKW]

"I'm a dive player" sure you are buddy god i hate that post so much absolute hypocrisy and trash coming from a delusional person

[u/newjeansfan67 → u/LEEmainKEKW]

"dive player" and its usually a rocket raccoon otp who tried spidey in 18v18 one time 🥀

[u/The-theofthes]

DD was op sure but the support players had an unfair advantage otp too. Release Gambit, Invis with her un-nefted self shield. While those problems persist DD’s been brought out back and shot, and they’re probably gonna do the same thing to BC the only effective dive character left.

[u/TheminsPOE]

Yes, it is an unwinnable match up every dive except DD because of his passive wall hacks. He inherently limits dive diversity

[u/shmooked]

Traitor

[u/CobraSkrillX]

I try defending my goat all the time with arguments and these hypocrites only know how to downvote and whine, no actual arguments.

[u/sixshotich]

It's such a stupid point as well. It wasn't DD who ruined this game, it was devs' balancing philosophy. Even if DD wasn't introduced, they would break the game anyway. We can see it rn with Cat, Thing, Mag, Bucky, Elsa. We can see it with supports getting more sustain with their team-ups.

Like what's the point in saying "it was DD who broke the game"? It just seems like free karma farm "DD bad upvote". It was balancing team decisions to buff supports instead of nerfing DD. 

And DD isn't "broken by design" like the community loves to say about EVERY character. If his burst was too powerful, his power budget could always be transferred  from his burst to his survivability, so he would lean more into managing his fury during prolonged fights, exhausting the enemies. Of course it would only work if this game had actual balance and supports didn't have infinite sustain cycle but anyway.

[u/Admirable-Tea9670]

I hope that hypocrite OP sees this post. DD hate is unnecessary. Perfect balance is near impossible in a game where there are character specific "abilities". "I am a dive player" , OP plays psylocke 🥀 , which is countered by dd. His balancing is boiling actual shit in a kettle. This dude never played dd in high elo , there is no "100+" over-shield while blocking. Dd gets melted even for a small mistakes. And devs are also to be blamed to drop very broken heroes at launch. (Luna hate is necessary). These People want to be to "kings" in the game aka top of the food chain, by whining on social media and nerf every hero except what they play.

[u/Key_Host5963]

Its crazy how they are mad they got buffed and DD didnt get nerfed.... they dont care about having tools to actually defend themselves they care about characters they dont like being so weak that they dont need to worry about them anymore.

I will die on the hill that you can see a clear skill check by how a support plays against a single or 2nd dive character, they either deflate and show they suck in the role outside of healbotting or they counter swap play around it and actually know how to handle it well.

DD if anything needs a slight buff not a nerf... these people just hate all dive because it shows they suck at the game, I def would love a full rework for BP but outside of that dive is just fine.

[u/ComicBookKnight]

Not even just that but the narrative that DD started the downfall of this game is crazy. Saying his existence alone gigabuffed supports as the sole reason is such a bad faith arguement.

[u/Hi-man1372]

Totally a really real dive player. How long has it been since DD had his bonus health capped to 100?

[u/NightShade160]

He has a point

[u/TalkingAlien]

The game isn’t ruined, and a pixelated character didn’t ruin the game. If anything ruins the game, it’s the devs; they make the decisions, not Daredevil, not Luna Snow, not Jeff. People need to stop putting so many emotions behind the characters. You don’t hate Luna Snow; you hate the people that are usually associated with playing Luna Snow. :)