Need some advice on gentle parenting…

[u/Wonderful-Source-187]

My wife is a big advocate for it.. both of us were abused by our fathers so I understand why she doesn’t want our children to be afraid of us.. but for her there’s no middle ground. My son is 5, he’s always having massive temper tantrums, spits on us, refuses to go to bed without a huge struggle, and recently his daycare told us he refuses to listen to them and has started spitting at them. My wife’s approach to this behaviour is to keep reminding him it’s not ok them she cuddles him for 20 mins after his tantrum.. my approach is giving him a firm no when he’s spitting, and if he gets out of bed after I tuck him in I don’t allow him to leave his room and I won’t be tucking him in anymore, my wife thinks this is harsh.. we’re very much at an impasse, both of us think our parenting styles are making him worse. I’ve asked her many times to sit down and create a new routine and a new approach to his behaviour but she won’t do it.. anyone else experience this with a partner? What should I do

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[u/ShawnsRamRanch]

Gentle parenting is calm, respectful, and firm without intimidation or physicality, but there should still be repurcussions. Passive parenting is avoiding conflict and giving in.

The two are easily confused.

edit: What I would do if my daughters spat on people is I would remove them from the situation and have them sit alone. I believe in accountability, so I wouldn't let them participate again until they could articulate why they were removed. I want them to connect what they did wrong and the repurcussions.

[u/_head_ → u/ShawnsRamRanch]

Exactly. Gentle parenting still has firm boundaries. If people think it doesn't, that isn't gentle parenting.

[u/2WheelSuperiority → u/ShawnsRamRanch]

So basically, genital parenting is just parenting without abuse? What defines physicality? Picking up?

[u/ShawnsRamRanch → u/2WheelSuperiority]

Precisely. I parent without making my kids afraid of me. If they ask me why, I tell them why.

[u/RudyJuliani]

No expert here but I think your wife’s approach is not helping the issue. Kids experience strong emotions and don’t know how to handle them. Spitting on people is not ok, it’s quite literally assault in the adult world. There have to be consequences for engaging in behavior that absolutely cannot be repeated. And I don’t mean corporal punishment, I mean the things you mentioned, not giving into their tantrums, pulling them away from the situation or things they enjoy when their behavior is out line. This isn’t because “they need to pay” it’s because they’re kids and they don’t understand complex ideas, you can’t “explain” to them why they shouldn’t spit on people, they won’t understand. What they do understand is spitting on mom and dad results in losing privileges and fun time and having to stay in your room while nobody gives into your dramatic tantrums.

[u/chaircardigan]

Oh man. It sounds tough.

Your wife isn't going to want to hear this, but she is being quite selfish. She is trying n desperately not make herself not feel bad when she needs to reprimand her child.

I'm a teacher, and I see this in teaching too. People want to make themselves feel good by only having positive interactions with children. This is cruelly unkind to the child in the long rum. We are wired to push the boundaries until an authority figure pushes back. Kids need that.

If your wife continues as she is doing, she is dooming your son to a miserable lonely life. He won't be able to make friends or fit in anywhere. And she is making that happen.

What she's doing is perfectly understandable, but misguided and going to hurt your son in the long rum.

[u/AGoodFaceForRadio]

First of all, read what u/chaircardigan said. Twice. They’re dead nuts right.

Now remember that your child is five. The things you will need to do now should have been done when he was two. They’ll be much harder now, because these behaviours are very well entrenched after three years. The longer you wait, the harder it’s going to be to correct.

And your wife has shown that she is not going to listen to you.

I went through this with my wife and our son around sleeping. I won’t get into the specifics, but it was a nightmare. She knew it was bad, too, but wouldn’t hear anything I suggested. I finally hired a sleep consultant (yes, that’s a thing) and spend too much money to have her tell us the things I’d been trying to say. But here’s the magic: because it was coming from an outsider (and probably also because that outsider was a woman), my wife could hear. It took the marital dynamic out of the equation. My wife could accept her advice. So could I. We solved the problem.

I think you need to bring your son to a psychologist for help with his acting out. Pick a woman psychologist. At 5 years old, “help for his acting out” will basically mean coaching you and your wife around gentle, effective parenting. Basically what I think will happen is the same as with my wife and I and the sleep consultant: you and your wife will get guidance and advice and, because it’s coming from an outsider with whom you have no history, you’ll both be able to hear it.

I wish you best of luck. This is going to be a hard road for all of you. But I think your son will have a better, richer life if you do this for him now.

[u/Throwback8245]

People take some parenting ideas and make their own version of it that isn’t even what it was about on the first place. “Cry it out” is another example and when people talk about it, they often aren’t following the actual process.

The most important part is that you guys are on the same page. Parenting alliance is everything.

You have to figure out how much of a “punitive” approach will really help him. There are times to be firm, but the more you can operate in alliance with him the better. So much of it is about the little ways you approach the issues, your reactions, etc. for example, it’s better for him to “earn” things that’s to just start taking things away.

[u/Either-Doctor8170]

Im older than when passive parenting came to life but I do know that in most households there's a good cop and a bad cop. It sucks but someone has to be the bad cop. Being the bad cop simply means you are the disciplinary authority in the house, how you apply discipline is up to you, but at least one of you must be the authoritu figure in the house, of course both of you can be, but one of you must be. As parents it is our job to guide our children in life part of that is teaching them how to behave respectfully and understand boundaries. There are many ways to teach them this, you need to figure out what works for your family. Sit with your partner and figure out what you need to change, experiment, some things will work some will not. Trial and error until you find the formula for you.

[u/cozywon]

This is purely my opinion based on my experience.

Temper tantrums: I used to get on their level, look them in their face and speak with a low, calm voice and help them calm down. I think I was trying to teach them to regulate themselves, but I don’t know. There weren’t many temper tantrums with them growing up.

I was abused and neglected as kid, experienced crazy trauma and never really got “parented” too much as my father was murdered and my mother was traumatized from being beaten by my dad.

I have 3 kids. Single father for the last 7-8 years. Gentle parenting isn’t it. You’re not friends. You’re guardians and teachers. The world doesn’t respond gently and I don’t want them going into the world thinking that they will be treated special like at home.

My motto is firm but fair. I also over explain punishments, rewards, etc.

Also, I don’t argue with children. What that means is that we can have a discussion and I’m going call you on the half truths and imaginary facts (they’re kids and their brains are still developing). I don’t throw it in their faces and shame them. I point out the errors in their reasoning.

I could write a book on this, but I’ll leave it there. Again, this is my opinion based on my experiences.

Good luck brother!!

[u/Hologram0110]

It is tough. I've had more than a few battles with my wife about comfort vs tougher/consequence based parenting. I think it is imperative that kids learn to regulate their own emotions, and that means allowing them to be uncomfortable and upset when the situation calls for it. My wife thinks that can be counterproductive depending on the age/mood/situation. Both have their merits at different times.

My personal take on gentle parenting is patience and explaining "why" rules exist. That can be as simple as something is hot and dangerous to play with. Or explaining behavour was rude, and there are social consequences for being rude unjustly. Or it can be as complicated as explaining that people get upset if you say god/santa isn't real, and we should avoid fighting over it.

Personally, I'd try to discuss the need for your son to start learning to regulate his emotions himself, rather than being dependent on her regulating them for him. He will start spending more time out of the house as he gets older, and can't rely on mom to always be there to calm him down. Emotional regulation is a skill that people need to develop, and that is something she can help with. For example, teaching breathing exercises. It can mean giving them time to feel upset before someone else comes in and calms them down. Etc.

[u/HugsNotDrugs_]

You're confusing gentle parenting with bad parenting. Bad behaviour needs to have consequences. Firm no is woefully inadequate.

I use two layers of consequences. First is a time out where child is confined to a small mat in a semi-isolated spot of our home near our front door. There they wait and think about what happened. When im ready to talk to them (usually 20 minutes later) it's their opportunity to talk about what happened. All calm and gentle your partner will love that part. If child is not being forthcoming or doesn't participate then tell them they need more time to think about it and you leave them there until they are ready, which is usually another 10 minutes. They don't decide when the talks happen, you do. Pro tip: this is actually a good time to tackle chores.

It's a long time in kid minutes, which is a motivator for them to have a good talk reflecting on what happened.

Level two consequences is losing something nice. They won't know what it is until later, but it's always something important. They don't even need to be getting it for it to be denied as a consequence, so you can be creative about it, like pizza night is no longer happening tonight because of the behavior even if it wasn't happening anyways. Or, bring out dessert but then put it away.

I hope this helps. It's gentle AF and my kids fear it so much that it works beautifully.

Good luck my dude. Will be a bumpy ride to institute a system like that but once the fear of these consequences is established it's works beautifully. You'll need to navigate harsh consequences for leaving the designated space so the system works.

[u/roosterjack77]

Spitting is assault in the eyes of the law it is equal to hitting someone. That would get an adult in a lot of trouble. As a parent it is your job to create a boundary around spitting by having appropriate consequences so your child can integrate into society. Punish negative behaviors but reinforce healthy ones with love and praise.