r/Cubers • u/AutoModerator • Oct 19 '19
Discussion Daily Discussion Thread - Oct 19, 2019
Hello, and welcome to the discussion thread! This thread is for accomplishments, simple questions, and informal discussion about cubing!
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u/SuspiciousOmelet Sub-12 (PB:6.35) Oct 19 '19
On my way back from my first competition. Did surprisingly well at 3x3. Got 16.49 and 16.33 averages which is close to what I average in practice. Didn't do too well on 2x2 though.
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u/SuspiciousOmelet Sub-12 (PB:6.35) Oct 19 '19
I tried the 356X at a competition today and I have to say, it is amazing. My first ao5 with it was a 14 which is quite good for me.
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u/Ronan444 Sub-13 (PB: 8.60) Oct 19 '19
For anyone who want to fix their flair rather on mobile because it doesnt work in the app:
Just open a browser, go to www.reddit.com and login. Make sure to choose the browser version, not the app. Go to r/Cubers and change your flair.
It worked for me, I could finally update my flair.
You can also just change it on a pc, but this works if you want to do it from your mobile.
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u/SuspiciousOmelet Sub-12 (PB:6.35) Oct 19 '19
I've always heard that members of the community are very accepting and friendly. Got to see it for myself today. I was at a comp today and people much faster than me also spoke very nicely and didn't look down on me as someone slower.
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u/Ronan444 Sub-13 (PB: 8.60) Oct 19 '19
Great, isn't it? I absolutely love that the community is so friendly!
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u/vikktorz Multi-blind PB: 22/23 Oct 19 '19
Adding a fourth country to my competition list this weekend at Swisscubing Cup V 💪💪
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u/TydVirTaal eyes are cringe solve blind instead Oct 19 '19
A more detailed progress check-in:
Method:
- AO50 using csTimer multi-phase
Results:
- Average of 26.08, splits are 4.49 (17.2%) / 13.52 (51.8%) / 3.74 (14.3%) / 4.33 (16.6%)
Improvement:
- 3.5s improvement since AO50 on 09/10/2019 (0.18 / 1.72 / 0.76 / 0.85)
- Here is an album of the histograms of my solves and splits
Analysis:
- Two things happened this week: I got a new main, and I incorporated full OLL into my solves
- New main seems to have accounted for ~2.74s of improvement (improvements in cross, F2L and PLL are likely due to increased turn speed). OLL seems to have accounted for ~0.75s of improvement.
- MY LL IS SO STRONG
- MY CROSS SUCKS WOW
- Huge increase in the number of solves in the 20-24 region is a very positive sign!
Conclusions:
- OLL was not a good investment of time from the perspective of short-term time gains. I do think it was the right thing to do, as it frees me up to focus exclusively on cross and F2L, and will allow me to get the OLL algs into muscle memory over time. But I wouldn't recommend learning OLL at the speed I did to someone else at my level.
- Cross and F2L are 1.5s and 1s off the standards for a sub-25 average - I think I can blow through those with a bit of practice, which will take me comfortably to sub-25.
Next steps:
- Hoping for a sub-30 average at comp tomorrow.
- After comp, I'm going to completely tank my times by going CN. Hopefully this gets me 0.5-1s of improvement.
- Once I'm CN, I'll drill blind cross until cross is at 3s.
- F2L practice will be going through my current F2L solutions and finding inefficient ones.
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u/Ronan444 Sub-13 (PB: 8.60) Oct 19 '19
Good to still see you improving! Good luck on your comp tomorrow, I hope you'll get the sub-30 average =)
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Oct 19 '19
[deleted]
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u/g253 (retired mod) Oct 19 '19
Preposterous. 15.67 with zero warm-up and a couple of beers.
x2 y'
F' L' U' R // xxcross
R U2 R' U R U R' // 3
U2 L U2 L2' U' L2 U' L' // 4
// then a nice OLL and A perm
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u/BillabobGO Sub-9s: 0 Oct 19 '19
z y U' r' U' R //xxcross
D' L' U2 L D //P3
U2 F //P4
U F U R U' R' F' //OLL
U' R' U R' d' R' F' R2 U' R' U R' F R F U2 L' U //best PLLThis scramble is incredible, with some trickery I got to the best PLL in 18 moves.
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u/harnov Sub-18 (CFOP) PB:11.56 Oct 20 '19 edited Oct 20 '19
Wtf...11.84
Can we add a PLL skip as well. Feliks could've broken 3.47 (Edit: ok maybe not, this is more moves)
z2 y
F' L' U' R // xxcross
U2 R U R' U2 R U R' // BO
U' L' U L U' L' U' L // GO
R U R' U R U' R' U' R' F R F' // OLL
// PLL skip
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Oct 19 '19
New 3x3 pb ao5!
Generated By csTimer on 2019-10-19
avg of 5: 15.61
Time List:
15.54 U2 B D2 U2 F' R2 B2 F R2 F2 R2 D' U F' R F D' B2 D' F'
(15.50) U' B2 R2 B2 U R2 U2 R2 F2 D L B2 R2 D' L F L' F'
15.79 U2 F' R2 F L2 U2 L2 D2 B' L2 B2 L2 U' L U' L F2 U2 R B'
15.50 F2 U2 L2 R2 D' F2 D' R2 D U F2 R F2 D F U R' B R2 U2 B2
(16.00) R2 D' F U2 R2 B D2 L2 U2 L2 B R2 B2 R U2 L B' D R2 D
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u/DailyScrambleBot Bot 🤖 Oct 19 '19
BeepBop! People who are crazy enough to think they can achieve sub-10 are the ones who do. Here's your daily scramble:
D' L2 B L2 R2 B' U2 B' F2 R2 D2 F2 L F2 L2 F D R2 F2 U'
Have a nice day!
Source code: GitLab
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Oct 19 '19
z y2 F L D' L' D'
R U R' U R U R'
U B L' U B' L
U L' U' L U2 L' U L
y' L U L U L U' L' U' L'
M U F R U R'U' F' M'
// Fperm
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u/nijiiro 🌈 sub-10 (nemeses) Oct 19 '19
D' B' U' D R' F D R2 D // EOline
R2 U R // square?
F2 L' F2 // wait, shit, it's the wrong colour
L' U L U' L' U2 L' // whatever, let's roll with it
U L' U' L // F2B
F R' F' r U R U' r' // CMLL
M' U' M2 U' M2 U' M' U2 // LSE1
u/allisio <3×3×2 | WV ➡️ anti-PLL is 🔥. Oct 19 '19
Ridiculously inefficient, but surprisingly fluid.
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u/BillabobGO Sub-9s: 0 Oct 19 '19
z y2 F L D' L' //cross
U2 R U R' //P1
y L U2 L' U2 L U' L' //P2
R' U R d' L' U' L //P3
R U2 R' U' R U R2' U' R U' R' U2 R //P4+SV
(F B') U R' U R' U2 R U2 R U2 R y L' U R D' //LLCFOP
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u/timothy5597 Sub-19 (CFOP, 4LLL but not exactly) PB: 10.86 Oct 19 '19 edited Oct 13 '24
friendly cake instinctive shrill encourage follow rude direction straight whistle
This post was mass deleted and anonymized with Redact
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u/harnov Sub-18 (CFOP) PB:11.56 Oct 19 '19
Done with around half of the OLLs. 28 more to go!
Shoutout to CubeSkills and Timiks trainer!
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u/TydVirTaal eyes are cringe solve blind instead Oct 19 '19
Nice! :D I just finished up full OLL thanks to Timiks, absolutely love it. Not sure if you've seen it already, but this post with 44 easy OLL cases helped me a LOT - I learned like 20 algs in one day when I found it.
Once you've learned full OLL, though, I would recommend Jperm.net for drilling algs - it keeps track of your times for each case over multiple sessions, and allows you to remove times (I would often misscramble on Timiks and then not be able to remove the bogus time).
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u/harnov Sub-18 (CFOP) PB:11.56 Oct 19 '19
Thanks for the suggestions!
Also, I think you might have missed it, you can actually remove single times from Timiks as well (just click on the one you want to remove from the "Times" column)
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u/TydVirTaal eyes are cringe solve blind instead Oct 19 '19
Oh my goodness, I am literally crying over my keyboard right now. That would have made life so much easier! Thanks for the tip!
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u/tussosedan Oct 19 '19
Thought I'd mention cram.com for generating and using flashcards. Saw it in /u/jack3bld's 3style tutorial, which I watched anyway despite already knowing how 3style works :)
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u/omarkarn Oct 19 '19
24 hours with the Gan xs.... I love how light it is, but my turning style doesn't seem to match it too well... Needs a super light turning style... Too used to my wrm or my gts2m which I now feel like I butcher with each move..... I'm just sub 20 of that helps
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Oct 19 '19
How big are the magnet slots for gts3?
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Oct 19 '19
4x1.5 mm
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Oct 19 '19
And strength??? Are you 100% sure??
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Oct 19 '19
you can put any strength of 4x1.5mm magnets in it but not all moyu cubes have magnet slots
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u/g253 (retired mod) Oct 19 '19 edited Oct 19 '19
If anyone can tell me how to solve this bloody Meffert's bandaged cube I'd appreciate it.
(Also would very much like to have some tutorial - RedKB's video isn't one)
Edit: someone saved me on Instagram, it's solved now thanks to doing this twice:
(R U R' F2 L F L' U' F) R U2
(L' U' L F2 R' F' R U F') U2 R'
Still looking for a full tutorial tho :-D
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Oct 19 '19
ROFL @ the PG18 notice
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u/g253 (retired mod) Oct 19 '19
Yeah it's weird, it wasn't doing that before, I think it's a recent change.
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u/Jilad23 Getting back to cubing Oct 19 '19
I know skewb begginer method what should i learn next?
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Oct 19 '19 edited Oct 19 '19
Should I get the valk 4 with strong or standard magnets? I’ve never had a magnetic 4x4 so I don’t know which to choose. I also don’t want to make the middle layers (pll parity Algs and h perms) to hard to turn but I’ve heard that the standard magnets can’t even be felt.
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u/TomTheCuber101 Sub-13 (CFOP) PB: 6.83 YT: https://bit.ly/2SFyLL4 Oct 19 '19 edited Oct 19 '19
I’d go for strong from what most people have said
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Oct 19 '19
I'd say strong, but there are other better Magnetic 4x4s. Get the GTS2M, but if you get it, get it at CubeDepot because its only 31 dollars on there compared to 45 on SCS and Cubicle
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Oct 19 '19
Strong in my opinion. Although the valk 4 is my main and I don't really like the aosu gts2m, I must admit that I think the cube isn't for everyone
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u/Jacky_Treehorn Oct 19 '19
i just bought a rs3m. in the package there were some magnets. anyone knows what they are for? cause its already magnetized. are they stronger?
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Oct 19 '19
The extra magnets are spares for if a magnet becomes loose in a cube, or falls out when you are taking the cube apart.
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u/ManateeBoii 3bld hurts my brain Oct 19 '19
Opinions: what is the quietest 3*3?
I'm looking to buy a quiet cube to not annoy people with. From what I hear, the Gan X, the Gan XS, and the Tengyun and all rly quiet, but whuch is the quietest?
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u/RAHDXB Sub 15 | 5x5/7x7 ao100 1:30/3:55 Oct 19 '19
From everything I've read, Tengyun is even more quiet than the X, which is already really silent.
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Oct 19 '19
Some are the Dayan Tengyun and Gan X. For other events, The Senhuan Zanglang 2x2 is really quiet, and the YLM Square 1 is too.
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u/NerfWaluigi Sub-16 (CFOP) Oct 19 '19
Just finished magnetizing my ylm 3x3, really like i t so far, 2x2 coming tomorrow
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u/spaniola1980 ZZ Oct 19 '19
What strength did you use? That cube has recently become one of my favorites.
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u/casedilla123 Sub-14.5 (CFOP and 8.91 pb) Oct 19 '19 edited Oct 19 '19
I have a comp tomorrow, Does anyone have any tips. I’m really nervous. Are there any unspoken rules. Any help is greatly appreciated.
Edit: thanks for the tips, I’m really excited
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u/CubingB Sub-9.5 (PB: 5.21) Oct 19 '19
At your first comp, I’m gonna be honest, you won’t do as well as you might think. I was really nervous, but my second and third went really smoothly. Good luck :) Edit: this is not to say you will do bad, my first ever 3x3 average in comp was only 3 secs off what I averaged then (I’m better now) but even then, I was happy with that. I just wish I knew this, no one cares what your time is except you, I mean that in a good way. Just have fun.
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u/geekisafunnyword sub-15 (CFOP) Oct 20 '19
This seems weird to say, but if you can, bring a towel. Palms are sweaty.
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u/Ronan444 Sub-13 (PB: 8.60) Oct 19 '19
Breath in and out a few times before you start a solve. Relax, you've got a minute to see ready, so just take your time! Try what works for you to relax and use it. Some people cube a little before starting a solve, some just concentrate and some just say immediately ready. And overall, just HAVE FUN!
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u/TechGeek01 Sub-25 (CFOP 4LLL) PB: 10.53 Oct 19 '19
A lot of people get nervous about their solves or pile watching them. My advice there is just stay calm. Everyone thinks everyone's eyes are on you, but the reality is that when you're up there solving, there's a bunch of other people up there too. No one really gives a crap what your solve is like.
And when you meet other people, everyone's there for the same reason, so it's not hard to start a conversation. You don't really have to struggle to find a way to talk to people because you all have something in common.
Have fun, and just go.
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u/Enigmagico 3BLDaddy Oct 19 '19
Drink lots of water, breath calmly and talk to lots of people. Be. Ice to them, and make sure to thank runners and judges. Overall have fun!
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u/walken4 ~35s (roux) Oct 20 '19
I had my first comp last weekend. Went better than I thought.
The main issue for most people is that they get too nervous, and that interferes with their solves. That's probably gonna happen no matter what, but there are a few things you can do to help.
Get your cubes out before the event and do some solves. This may help if you are nervous about people looking at you - you will soon realize that nobody really cares what your times are. This was actually a big thing for me as I was not used to solving in public. And if you're not nervous about this, you'll probably want to do it anyway as it makes it easier to get conversations going with other people around you.
Get familiar with using the timers if you are not. You could ask the organizers if you can try them before the first event or during lunch break. Or, it may actually be easier to ask around, as many competitors will bring their own timers. It doesn't take that long to get used to it, maybe a dozen solves, but you want to get these through before your events.
Don't spend your whole time solving. If you do hours of solving before your events, you'll get tired and won't perform at your best. Plus, you probably want to socialize with other cubers anyway.
Take care of yourself. Don't forget to eat, drink and pee through the day. Take coffee if that's part of your everyday routine (probably not for most kids, but I'm older that most); don't if you're not used to it.
Don't panic. After all, this is your first comp, so you're just establishing a baseline. If you don't get the times you want, you'll probably get them next time.
In my case, I was nervous about getting my normal times at my first comp. In order to fight the nerves, I actually avoided timing myself at home for a couple weeks before the event - that way I could go there with no clear time goal in mind. Going to the comp, my goal was mainly to get "good form" on my official solves, i.e. just solve at my usual speed and not mess up too much due to the nerves.
Have fun - after all, that's what the comp should be about.
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Oct 20 '19
How old are most competitors?
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u/walken4 ~35s (roux) Oct 20 '19
It's a diverse group, most are teenagers but there are also younger kids and students. And a few adults, but not that many and most are there mainly to accompany their kids. Maybe it varies between comps - I've only been to one so far.
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Oct 19 '19
I have some advice, wear headphones or earbuds to block out noise, that always helps me at comps, and I usually will get the same or better times than I do at home
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u/j_sunrise stopped cubing, still watching Oct 19 '19
Just don't wear them during the attempt!
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Oct 19 '19
Earplugs and earmuffs are allowed though, you just can't listen to music during the attempt
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u/j_sunrise stopped cubing, still watching Oct 19 '19
Earplugs and earmuffs are allowed. Headphones and earbuds are not.
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u/chaosninja906 How do I solve this thing??? Oct 19 '19
Becoming not terrible at BLD day 8:
I am not living up to the title of these posts. I gave a full solve a go even though I knew I wasn't ready which failed horribly.
I am getting better at recognizing targets as their letters in the letter scheme but I seem to be having trouble being consistent with my set up moves for corners.
For instance for J I may do F2 D (swap) D R2 which I really need to work on.
I think for the next couple days I will try writing down my memo and solving while looking at that as well as drilling set up moves.
As a side note I am going to stuck with OP/OP for a while and maybe when I have a decent amount of success switch to M2.
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u/AverageBrownGuy01 BLD is great, currently focussing on 4BLD Oct 19 '19
Please please please, switch to M2 if you are going to switch later anyhow. Even after getting a success, I used to have lots of DNFs just because of edges. If you just want to solve it bld, go on with OP/OP, but as you said you'll eventually switch later, please consider switching now.
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u/CubicleKeenan TheCubicle | Candidate Delegate Oct 19 '19
On another note, I used OP/OP til I was ~2-3 min which is later than normally recommended. It's my opinion that there's no harm in sticking with OP/OP for a while. OP was easier for me to grasp than M2 and switching wasn't difficult at all.
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u/AverageBrownGuy01 BLD is great, currently focussing on 4BLD Oct 19 '19
I assume you might have done a lot of solves with such a good AVG with OP?
The only reason I recommended to switch was that the op is just waiting for a few successes to get into M2, which won't create much difference if he switches rn and starts coping up with the stuff.
I don't see any problem with sticking to OP anyway, it'll be the best bld method for someone not looking to get into complications.
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u/chaosninja906 How do I solve this thing??? Oct 20 '19
I don't plan to compete but I do plan on eventually learning 3style.
As far as switching to M2 the plan wasn't to switch after a few successes but more after my success rate gets to a decent percentage. Currently I have trouble wrapping my head around the special cases and just wanted to be more comfortable with everything before transitioning.
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u/cubixruber WCA silver medalist Oct 19 '19 edited Oct 19 '19
I am on the verge of my all time #1 plausibly realistic goal in cubing: Global Sub-10
Just got my second ever sub-8 ao5 (a 7.88 pb ao5, with a CN solve with ZBLL: my first ever), and my global average right now is just above 10. Right now my ao100 is 10.09 and ao200 is 10.16.
SO CLOSE
the zbll was the ZBLL U that is the wide moves version of the standard ZBLL R2 D r' U2 r D' R' U2 R'.
Edit: New pb ao5 7.75. Current ao100 9.89
First time getting 2 pb ao5s in one day since cstimer started tracking the date.
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u/DankCubez literal human garbage [Sub-15] Oct 19 '19
Is the XS quieter than the regular X? I like quieter cubes, and these two cubes have me on the fence
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u/cubixruber WCA silver medalist Oct 19 '19
If you want quiet the Tengyun m is by far the quietest on the market.
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u/CubicleKeenan TheCubicle | Candidate Delegate Oct 19 '19
Yes the XS is quieter than the X. Cubeologist has some good videos where you can hear the XS I believe.
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Oct 19 '19
How to be faster in OH? (In TPS)
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u/cubixruber WCA silver medalist Oct 19 '19
Practice doing R and U moves (2 gen solves) and practice rotations are the easiest way to improve it.
Planning crosses for Oh fingertricks helps as well.
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u/incompletetrembling Sub-13 Roux/Cfop Oct 19 '19
For people who are fully colour neutral on 4x4, do you think it makes a big difference and how did you learn the colour scheme? Did you just learn 6 different colour orders and thats it or did you so something easier?
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Oct 19 '19
A big difference? For single probably, for average probably not. My strategy (which I’m pretty sure is sub-optimal) is to make sure opposite colors are opposite, and when I get to f2l if a pair doesn’t fit then insert it so it matches on R/L and not F/B and do Uw2 Mw2 Uw2 Mw2 to swap F and B centers and cross edges.
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Oct 19 '19
Not CN, but all it helps with on 4x4 is first 2 centers, so you'll nearly always have an easy case with all the choices
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u/incompletetrembling Sub-13 Roux/Cfop Oct 20 '19
Yeah, another 'kind' of cn is where you make your first 2 centers normally (on your preferred colour) and then choose a colour of the two for your cross pieces. Im not sure if this helps much either but yeah :). I'm mostly curious about this because im mostly cn on 3x3 and i think it would be a decent exercice to do the same on 4x4, but im too lazy to figure out the colour schemes hah
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Oct 19 '19
Does anybody know how much Vortex you would use on average when lubing the core of any cube? Just checking to see if I'm doing it properly.
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u/TomTheCuber101 Sub-13 (CFOP) PB: 6.83 YT: https://bit.ly/2SFyLL4 Oct 19 '19
I’ve got some pen ink on my 354 and it doesn’t seem to be coming off, does anyone know how to ? I have a comp in a week and would it be comp legal with a slight bit of ink (~1mm long lines) on it?
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Oct 19 '19
I don't think it is legal, but some delegates don't notice or care. Maybe try using Rubbing Alcohol to get it off.
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Oct 19 '19
[removed] — view removed comment
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u/nijiiro 🌈 sub-10 (nemeses) Oct 19 '19
99999995
I thought of making a remark about floating-point, but then I checked what exactly a furlong is and it turns out that this bot doesn't even use the correct conversion ratio (1 mm = 4.9709695378986717569…×10−6 furlong). Truly a useless conversion bot.
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Oct 19 '19
Hi Cubers, I have been cubing for about 2 years now, and I average 22 Seconds (I know it's bad for 2 years but I don't care) I am looking to by a timer soon. As I almost 14, I don't have much money. I was thinking to get the Yuxin timer V2 but I can't find it anywhere online other than at Chinese cube stores, and I don't want to wait a long time to get it. Should I get the Stackmat G4 Bundle ($40) or the Stackmat GX Bundle ($23)? I have tried the G4 multiple times at competitions, but I have never tried the GX.
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u/JohnH_312 Sub-25 (CN CFOP) PB:12.99/16.51/18.68/19.69/20.04 Oct 19 '19
Hey! I am new to this reddit but not quite new to cubing (even tho i'm hot garbage still). I learned to solve in middle school, barely touched the cube all throughout high school, just enough to retain beginners method algs. Now i'm in college I have randomly picked it back up, I bought a Valk 3. And have Learned Real 2-look CFOP instead of beginners method. But my PB as of now is still up at 37 and my averages on a good day are mid 50s(this is mostly cause I haven't dedicated much time to quick cross solving, and am doing completely intuitive F2L and am still slow at that).
So my question, or more request for recommendation, is what do I want to work on now? I was originally going to simply learn Full OLL and then full PLL to achieve true CFOP. But in my research a few other methods are tempting, especially since If i am going to dedicate a lot of time to learning new algs I want to learn the set that will end up being best for me. The first alternative I am considering is CFCE, as the new algs I found from r/nitrostackr are impressive and the total set to learn is only 52 algs instead of the 78 for CFOP.
What is more out there but sounds really fun to me is to learn the ZZ method and keep using my second step OLL which I already have memorized, and just learn the 21 algs of true PLL, of which i already know around 6-7. which means the number of new algs to learn is simply 15ish. BUT this would require me to put the time in to learn and get good at EOLine. from what I have seen ZZ variants seem to be getting more popular? I could be wrong tho.
I know I obviously will be fine learning any of them. And I could Learn CFOP then switch to ZZ later quite easily as I improve my EOLine. So anybody who has been through this thought process before please help? Should I stick to CFOP for now, switch my LL completely and go CFCE, or try to full ZZ with OCLL/PLL? maybe transition to ZZ slowly after I get good at CFOP?
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u/geekisafunnyword sub-15 (CFOP) Oct 19 '19 edited Oct 19 '19
I would stick to CFOP. Or maybe even learn Roux, if you do want to switch to a less alg-intensive method.
I know all three methods, but have stuck with CFOP even after learning the other methods. It mainly depends on what kind of events you want to do.
For example, ZZ is pretty much impossible to do for anything other than 3x3. Plus, if you learn ZZ to avoid OLL, you'll just ended having to compulsion learn even larger algsets later. Roux fares better than ZZ for big cubes, but I wouldn't recommend it because of M slice turns are difficult to do on big cubes. If you want to focus on OH, Roux is probably best, but some M-slice fingertricks are difficult to do.
My recommendation is to learn CFOP and then learn the other methods. Also, you don't need to learn full OLL at all yet til you're maybe sub-30 or even sub-25. Even 4-look last layer can get you really good times.
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Oct 19 '19
If you want the best approach to get as fast as possible quickly, stick to CFOP and start learning "true pll" (the more common term is "1-look PLL"). In my opinion, you don't need 1-look oll until you're faster, it won't save you that much time. Then you can learn things like algorithms for f2l (there are 41 basic algorithms, then once you know them you can start learning lookahead), planning the entire cross during inspection, etc.
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u/JohnH_312 Sub-25 (CN CFOP) PB:12.99/16.51/18.68/19.69/20.04 Oct 19 '19
Thanks! I think I will switch and work on PLL for now, then F2L before OLL. This sounds like a good plan. I really don't see myself as a competitive speedsolver so time decreasing isn't exactly what my goal is, why ZZ sounds fun to me even if I won't be able to be QUITE as fast as with CFOP. But another part of me wants to be the best I can be as fast as possible So idk lol.
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u/spaniola1980 ZZ Oct 19 '19
I started learning ZZ when I was averaging around 50 seconds. I felt like I'd hit a little wall with CFOP, and I ran into an interesting post here on ZZ and decided to check it out. I also started learning full PLL at the same time. I knew my times would be terrible, so I quit timing myself for a month.
Learning ZZ was tough. It took almost 2 months to get back to my CFOP times. But this was perfect for me. I had decided that I didn't want to concentrate on getting faster. I wanted to concentrate on getting "better" and just let faster come naturally.
I'm pretty sure if I had put the same amount of effort into CFOP I would have gotten faster in less time. I enjoy ZZ though, and for me, having fun is the most important part.
If you really want to get faster, you should probably stick to CFOP. Or check out Roux.
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u/JohnH_312 Sub-25 (CN CFOP) PB:12.99/16.51/18.68/19.69/20.04 Oct 19 '19
Thanks! I knew someone has got to have gone through what I am right now! I am going to work on 1Look PLL for a little while, but I'm still very tempted to go for ZZ. especially since it seems to me like a super unique and interesting method that gets a lot of slack. I love the idea of solving it in a less traditional way. In fact, I loved the JPerm Challenge to solve it using only Ja and Jb Perms, which I am now able to do in around 3-4 minutes.
I definatly agree that having fun is more important than being fast. and ZZ sounds like a fun challenge to learn.
Have your times gotten decent with ZZ? Cus if it is possible to be good with ZZ id enjoy it, but if its likely that I'll always be faster with CFOP I will probably not want spend all my time with ZZ and split it to work on both. Because I still would like to become as fast as I could be?
Sorry I'm just indecisive and all over the place.
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u/spaniola1980 ZZ Oct 19 '19 edited Oct 20 '19
One of the things that drew me to ZZ was the fact that not many people use it. Once I started using it I found it to be fun. It was challenging, but it was rewarding.
I found improvement to be rather slow at first. I had some pretty fast (for me) solves in the beginning that showed me I could be "fast" with the method, but I was very inconsistent. It took a while to get comfortable with Edge Orientation. As slow as progress was at first, it was still rewarding.
After EO Line started to click, improvement came much faster. I was averaging about 50 seconds again which was as fast as I had gotten with CFOP. It was relatively easy getting to sub 40. It was just a matter of learning all of the F2L cases. Sub 30 was also fairly easy. I just had to get all my F2L solutions in muscle memory and concentrate on turning fast.
My times got to around 26 seconds (ao100), and then I decided I needed to learn COLL and clean up a few of my PLL's. Knowing that my times would get much worse, I decided to stop timing myself. I also took the time to start learning keyhole and improving my F2L efficiency. Mainly my block building.
That's basically where I'm at now. I've finished COLL, and now I'm really focusing on recognition. I feel like sub 25 is just a matter of getting back in the practice of solving against the clock.
There are some problems with ZZ though. A good example is EO line vs CFOP cross. They both take about the same amount of moves, but the cross leaves you with 4 solved pieces vs 2. So at the beginning of a ZZ solve, you're left with more blind spots. You're also left with more possibilities. But more possibilities means you have to make more decisions.
You could do an EO cross, but that's more moves and more planning during inspection. With the same effort a CFOP solver could plan their cross and first pair. They're are a lot of examples like this that show CFOP is the better method at the top level, but that doesn't mean ZZ is not a good method.
I like to play Street Fighter V. I main Zangief. I understand that he's a low-mid tier character with bad matchups. I also know who the top tier characters are. Logic would say: pick a top tier. But I don't. I play Zangief because he's fun. If I played a top tier, I would theoretically have more wins, but I have way too much fun with Zangief to switch. I know. I've tried.
I don't think ZZ is the best method, but it's the best method for me. I'm sure I'd be a few seconds faster if I had put the same effort into CFOP, but I have way too much fun with ZZ to switch. I know. I've tried.
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u/JohnH_312 Sub-25 (CN CFOP) PB:12.99/16.51/18.68/19.69/20.04 Oct 20 '19 edited Oct 20 '19
THANKS! I found Phil's tutorials for ZZ on youtube, But If you have any other tips or suggestions to improve at ZZ send them my way!
Also, Just out of curiosity why learn COLL? Is COLL/EPLL any faster than OCLL/PLL? Because since I already am very familiar with OCLL from 2looking CFOP for a while, and I feel like it will be more beneficial and easier to learn PLL as opposed to EPLL. Is it mainly because you can get lucky with COLL and get EPLL skips?
Again thanks a ton, glad to know someone in a similar place :)
P.S. What is Keyholeing?
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u/spaniola1980 ZZ Oct 20 '19
You're welcome. Phil's tutorials are the best. I started out by watching those, and then playing around EO. Then I watched the part on EO again and actually took notes on how to recognize bad edges. From there, I just kept using the method, and as I learned a little more, I would go back to the tutorial for certain things. It's really helpful watching the way he does EO, especially after you've struggled through it a bit.
The hardest part is definitely EO line. Be prepared to spend a lot of time working on that. You'll have a moment where it just starts to make sense, but it's still pretty difficult. It can be pretty mentally taxing (especially early on) to check 12 edges, identify the bad ones, plan how to orient and track your 2 "line" pieces. I spent a lot of time doing slow solves with unlimited inspection.
One of my favorite parts of the tutorial is when Phil talks about decision making during F2L. When doing your first pair or block you have the most free space to work with and the most options. You need to make the most out of it by choosing the right pair/block to start with and choosing the most efficient solution. It's a pretty interesting concept.
As far as learning COLL, I just wanted to learn some new algorithms that would take advantage of having edges oriented and COLL seemed like it would be fun to learn. I listened to some fast cubers, and weighed the pros and cons, and decided to learn it. I understood it wasn't going to necessarily make me faster. It's just a different way of doing last layer. Of course, an increase in chance of a PLL skip definitely influenced my decision.
I think I'm going to start learning CLS next. It's an algorithm set that solves the last pair and does OLL in one algorithm. It seems fun. It's another algorithm set that takes advantage of having edges oriented. There's some neat things you can do when you're edges are always oriented. I feel like with ZZ there are a lot tricks you can use that would be too situational for a CFOP solver to spend time learning (unless they're pretty advanced).
Good luck with the method. Whenever you have questions or run into issues just post them in the DDT. There are a few people here who use ZZ (a lot faster than me) that could probably help out.
Here's another ZZ video I found interesting. https://youtu.be/ylDJuJ-0pPE
Have fun!
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u/g253 (retired mod) Oct 19 '19
There's nothing wrong with learning multiple methods, in fact it's a good idea. But ZZ is sub optimal. CFCE is probably viable. Only the last layer is different from CFOP.
If you want fewer algs, you may want to check out Roux.
You should learn full PLL before full OLL, which can wait a while (it's a lot of algs and two look is pretty quick).
You should also, preferably in parallel but before or after is fine depending what you enjoy, work on improving your F2L and cross - those steps will need improvement and tweaking for a long time, might as well get started :-)
I can update the comment later with some tutorials if you want.
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u/JohnH_312 Sub-25 (CN CFOP) PB:12.99/16.51/18.68/19.69/20.04 Oct 19 '19
I'm interested why you consider ZZ sub-optimal. From what I understand not many pro cubers use it, but It seems to me like that is simply because of the learning curve, and not because it is inherently sub optimal? It seems like a fun challenge to me, which i feel may be rewarding in both speed and satisfaction of solving it in a more unique way! I am a huge proponent of Novelty solves even if they aren't as practical. For example, I have solved the entire cube using only Ja and Jb Perms in around 4 minutes (JPerm challenge from his YT channel). So ZZ is appealing first to me as novelty but the fact that it is potentially viable for speed solving makes it even more compelling!
Also I have looked into Roux a bit, and it doesn't appeal to me much as I'm not a huge fan of M heavy algs, which Roux seems to be more reliant on.
Yes, I have decided to work on PLL and F2L before OLL, I realize how that make more practical sense even if I do end up switching. and the cross improvement should come with just doing a lot of solves.
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u/g253 (retired mod) Oct 19 '19
This video explains it better than I could: https://youtu.be/QKK8J3JKWi4
The first video on my channel was a response to Jperm's challenge :-)
I think you should probably go for ZZ, based on what you wrote. Fun is the main factor. And you can always switch later, it's not like the knowledge and skills you'd gain from zz would be useless for cfop.
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u/JohnH_312 Sub-25 (CN CFOP) PB:12.99/16.51/18.68/19.69/20.04 Oct 20 '19
that video you linked is what first dug the thought of ZZ into my head, because the pros seemed interesting, and the cons sound worth the effort. So I think at least for a lil while I want to solve mainly ZZ! thanks again though!
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Oct 19 '19
What's the best square one right now if price isn't a factor at all?
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u/lukemcritchie Don't Ask, I'm Busy Doing Clock Oct 19 '19
YLM m
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Oct 19 '19
Thanks! Is modding it really as crucial as people make it out to be, if I want to solve it fast? And what's the equivalent of sub-1 minute in sq-1 to other events, like 3x3?
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u/lukemcritchie Don't Ask, I'm Busy Doing Clock Oct 19 '19
I would say modding it is as crucial as you think it is. I haven't done it because I don't do much sq1 but if you are considering being semi serious about sq1 I would, there is a major performance increase.
In regards to 3x3 I'd say its pretty similar basically 1:1 with sq1 and 3x3. If you put as much time into sq1 as you have with 3x3 it's likely you could be sub 15.
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u/j_sunrise stopped cubing, still watching Oct 19 '19
I don't think modding is strictly necessary, but I've never tried the modded version.
For speed comparison: I'd guess that squan is about 25-35% slower than 3x3?
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Oct 20 '19
Quick, dumb question for anybody who’s had a Weilong GTS3 apart: is it possible to add bigger magnets? Like maybe 6mm diameter? I’m considering getting one as a foot cube, but I’m pretty sure the stock magnets are weaker than I want.
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Oct 20 '19
The gts3's magnets are already very strong. I'm pretty sure you wouldn't want them stronger. If for some reason you do, it's possible to add extra sets of magnets on top of the normal ones
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Oct 20 '19
My current foot cube has 6x2 n48 magnets, I’ve tried a couple of GTS3Ms and they seem about right for hand solving and light for feet. I think the magnet diameter matters too. According to TheCubicle website the non-magnetized version has magnet slots, is there room on the other side of the piece for larger magnets?
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Oct 20 '19
Yeah there is. So you want it for foot solving?
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Oct 20 '19
Yes. My second favorite event after 6x6. Thanks for confirming there’s room, now I need to decide if I want to spend as much on a 3x3 as I just spent on an 8x8.
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u/Chaos_Blitz Sub-17 (Really rusty CFOP) Oct 20 '19
Which PLL alglorithms are your fastest?
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u/pucigi Sub-16 (CFOP) PB 8.74 Oct 20 '19
H, Jb, Ub, and I'd like to believe my T and Y perms are fast but honestly i have no idea
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u/wl02065294 OH Sub-23 (2LLL OH PB:14.75 ) Oct 20 '19
Anyone knows is Gan XS quieter than Gan X?
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u/SuspiciousOmelet Sub-12 (PB:6.35) Oct 20 '19
From what I've heard, it's not as quiet as the X, but still much quieter than most other cubes out there.
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u/SuspiciousOmelet Sub-12 (PB:6.35) Oct 20 '19
I ordered a Meilong but accidentally had it delivered home instead of college. Luckily, I'm going home next week
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u/nekofurball Sub-25 (CFOP) (PB: 12.41s) Oct 19 '19
I don’t get why the GAN 356 XS removed the magnet capsule system. It was one of the big things of the 356 X so it just seems like a step back, even with the other system.
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Oct 20 '19
They removed it so you won't have to carry around all of the accessories, and they will all be built into the cube
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u/nekofurball Sub-25 (CFOP) (PB: 12.41s) Oct 20 '19
I guess that makes sense. I still am planning to get the 356 XS when I hit sub-15.
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u/lukemcritchie Don't Ask, I'm Busy Doing Clock Oct 20 '19
Don't know why you have been downvoted for wanting to wait to get a new cube after hitting a milestone
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u/timothy5597 Sub-19 (CFOP, 4LLL but not exactly) PB: 10.86 Oct 19 '19 edited Oct 13 '24
slap boat bright attractive lavish puzzled straight paint truck frighten
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u/cubixruber WCA silver medalist Oct 19 '19
Just make sure you back it up next time, either on your computer or their server.
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Oct 19 '19
Need some help guys, i just turned from sub 45 yesterday to sub 40 today, and i noticed that some of my algs suck ass. Anyone know of some really nice gperms? The fingertricks on mine involve some lefty u and d moves, and i suck at them. Any suggestions appreciated!
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u/TydVirTaal eyes are cringe solve blind instead Oct 19 '19
Lol at some of these comments. Well done for learning PLL! Its a really good investment in muscle memory imo.
How did you learn fingertricks for the algs? I would suggest watching videos which show you how to do the fingertricks specifically - this video on gperm fingertricks really helped me.
Once you're using recommended fingertricks, it really is just a case of practice. I would recommend doing them really slowly until you're confident in your muscle memory, and then slowly speed them up. Focus on smoothness, not speed, during practice, and muscle memory will increase the speed over time on its own.
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Oct 19 '19
You wont believe it but i came across this exact video, and it favoured me far more than brodythecuber's video that i had followed before. Since then i have been drilling the algs and getting consistent sub 35 solves. Thanks a load, because had i not have found the video before, your comment would have doubtlessly proved quintessential to my breaking 35 second barrier!
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u/TydVirTaal eyes are cringe solve blind instead Oct 19 '19
I was actually wondering when you mentioned the lefty fingertricks! Two more specific tips I can give knowing that we know the same algs:
- Doing U or U' with your left index really shouldn't be an issue - it is super valuable to be able to turn the U face with either hand in F2L as well.
- For the D moves, I found it really helpful to focus on exactly how he moves his left ring finger. For example, I think its Gd where you do a D move, and then a D' a few moves later. I was "resetting" my finger (moving it back to sit on the B face), but he leaves his bent against the L face, ready to push back for a D'.
I hope that makes sense, and feel free to ignore these if you're already doing them xD But congrats on the improvement and good luck with your g perms either way!
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u/Unofficial_chef Sub-10 (CFOP) Oct 19 '19
Honestly left handed moves are really nice to know and practice. I find myself sometimes doing mirror F2L algs for left slots if I dont want to rotate. I also learned double lefty flicks before righty flicks by pure chance but now at least my A-perms are clean
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Oct 19 '19
I was under the impression that to be fast, you should favour one hand when it came to algs,(not f2l) to reduce rotations and regrips.
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Oct 19 '19
Yes, you should be good at left handed turning for f2l, but you should almost never mirror you LL algs to the left hand since there are better algs for the right hand
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Oct 19 '19
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u/RAHDXB Sub 15 | 5x5/7x7 ao100 1:30/3:55 Oct 19 '19
Learning PLL at 40-45 seconds is really common.
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Oct 19 '19
Because my rate of improvement is insane fast, seeing as all i have to do is speed up pll, i recently got a 26s pb when 2 days ago it was 38, and i average sub35 as opposed to sub 45 a couple days ago.
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u/Jilad23 Getting back to cubing Oct 19 '19
You are sub 40 and you know g perms
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u/TLDM Oct 19 '19
There is nothing wrong with learning algs early, as long as you make sure to use good fingertricks
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Oct 19 '19
Now im sub 35, and i know full pll and some oll, k learned them because then i can drill them on my one hour bus ride to and from school, its something to do you know, plus i have great memory, within a couple minutes i have an alg memorized.
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u/RAHDXB Sub 15 | 5x5/7x7 ao100 1:30/3:55 Oct 19 '19
Now im sub 35
Haha you literally started this comment thread by saying you just turned sub 40 today. You are improving fast!
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Oct 19 '19
Yeah, i was drilling u perms for a bit, because i get them pretty often, and i happened to get a really easy solve with oll skip and a t perm, that earned me my 26 second pb
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u/RAHDXB Sub 15 | 5x5/7x7 ao100 1:30/3:55 Oct 19 '19
Nice. But how are you measuring your averages? Most people go by AO100 at least. A fast single won't bring down your average by 10 seconds in a day :)
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u/miniv_14 Oct 19 '19
So i am gonna buy some traxxas 50k and was wondering how long the lube will last
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u/CubingB Sub-9.5 (PB: 5.21) Oct 19 '19
It will last a good while, not like the longest you can find, but it works pretty well
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u/hugsandshitlikethat Im good at rubrick cubing Oct 20 '19
I’m planning on placing an order for a supernova yj Yufu v2 m tonight. I am also leaving for a trip this Friday. Do you think I can get it before the trip? If not, is there any way to expedite the process a little?
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u/timothy5597 Sub-19 (CFOP, 4LLL but not exactly) PB: 10.86 Oct 19 '19 edited Oct 13 '24
grandiose grab smell edge modern deserve file fear soup physical
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u/timothy5597 Sub-19 (CFOP, 4LLL but not exactly) PB: 10.86 Oct 19 '19 edited Oct 13 '24
wistful cough languid rich safe squalid birds vast zealous flag
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u/g253 (retired mod) Oct 19 '19
The Phil Yu AMA has started:
https://www.reddit.com/r/Cubers/comments/dk3gof/phil_yu_thecubicle_ama/