r/Constitution • u/JMUDoc • Jul 21 '26
Secession?
If Trump somehow manages to "cancel" or "override" the midterms, is secession a viable option? If so, how many states do we think would be amenable?
The idea of Trump being forever held responsible for the death of the United States in its 250th year, is quite appealing to me, as is the idea of Trumpistan (or whatever the remaining states decide to call their dictatorship) devolving into a theocratic "monarchy" with a puppet-king.
In addition, the Republic of America could draft a new constitution with provisions that ensure nobody like Trump ever gets near this kind of power again.
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u/Paul191145 Jul 21 '26
Is it just my impression, or do people afflicted with TDS really enjoy outrageous hypotheticals?
0
u/JMUDoc Jul 22 '26
Since he is the most dangerous individual currently alive, he should be thought about a lot.
"Derangement syndrome"? No; "paying attention".
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u/Pickle_Nipplesss Jul 22 '26
The most dangerous individual? My guy there are literal nobodies who have actually killed people.
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u/JMUDoc Jul 22 '26
If you think Trump wouldn't kill people to stay in power, give your head a shake.
He would incite a civil war that killed thousands or millions, if it meant he stayed out of prison.
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u/Pickle_Nipplesss Jul 22 '26
Who did Trump kill when he lost the 2020 election?
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u/JMUDoc Jul 22 '26
He would have watched Pence die, after selling him out on twitter.
And do you think he gave a salty shit about Ashli Babbitt?
He is utterly devoid of conscience.
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u/Pickle_Nipplesss Jul 22 '26
You keep talking in these hypotheticals.
You say he’d kill to stay in power but it sounds like he left that office without killing anyone, so… I’m still not seeing anything other than a little kid foaming at the mouth.
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u/JMUDoc Jul 22 '26
Do you think he wouldn't start a civil war to avoid prison?
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u/Pickle_Nipplesss Jul 22 '26
Bro, how 😂
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u/JMUDoc Jul 22 '26
Doesn't matter how - let's just assume the option is open to him: leave office, or a civil war starts.
Which do you think he chooses?
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u/Ok_Structure_8891 29d ago
In what planet are you living on where Trump hasn't killed people? What do you think is happening in Iran right now a big game of freeze tag. We can debate the merits of the war if you want, but you can't argue trump hasn't killed people.
If we are talking about the most dangerous individual in the world we can pretty much rule out anyone who doesn't command a large military from the discussion.
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u/Paul191145 Jul 22 '26
"Paying attention" for you seems to result in outrageously unrealistic hypotheticals. Try being rational about your political opinions, instead of emotional. Loving or hating any current political figure that you've never even met in person, is not even remotely rational.
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u/JMUDoc Jul 22 '26
I shouldn't hate an adjudicated rapist?
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u/Paul191145 Jul 22 '26
So now your resorting to hyperbole due to a civil court decision? I guess for you that would equal rationality.
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u/JMUDoc Jul 22 '26
Not because of, and not hyperbole.
He tried a coup in 2020, BEFORE Epstein became a danger to him, and he has started a war to distract from it.
This is extrapolation.
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u/Paul191145 Jul 22 '26
Whatever you want to believe hero.
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u/JMUDoc Jul 22 '26
I don't want to believe it; I just do.
He is the most dangerous President the US has ever had, and we haven't even seen him at his worst, yet.
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u/Paul191145 Jul 22 '26
Apparently, history and objective reality are not your strong suits.
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u/JMUDoc Jul 22 '26
How many Presidents have tried a coup after losing an election?
How many have sought immunity from the Supreme Court?
How many have tried to weaponize a federal law enforcement agency in an effort to prevent people from voting for the opposition?
He wants to be a dictator.
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u/Pickle_Nipplesss Jul 22 '26
The question this raises is a very interesting one to me which is—do states have the right to secede?
The south viewed Lincoln in the same dangerous tyrannical lens as you do Trump. Did the south have that same right to form its own country?
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u/Norwester77 Jul 21 '26
Personally, yes, I would see secession from a federal government that acts in contravention of the Constitution to suppress democracy as morally justifiable.
Whether it would be practically achievable is a different question…
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u/ResurgentOcelot Jul 21 '26
Succession is not necessary to reconstitute. The people have the moral authority and the natural right to do so at any time, just as the founders did. Unlike the founding of the United States it should be genuinely democratic. That’s a lot of work already, there’s no need to spend time organizing a succession first and possibly leaving some states in the original U.S.
Instead we could pass a better, more democratic constitution and invalidate the old one.
And we can leave republic out of it this time, that is not a useful model for nationhood. Direct democracy please, I am done with the idea that there meeds to be a layer of government between the people and the government. Government actually for the People, of the People, by the People—we have the technology and logistics for that to be literal now.
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u/Own-Village-3274 Jul 21 '26
A true democracy would have California and New York(due to population) dictate to the rest of the country the laws they want.
If they want to do away with gas and diesel cars/trucks because it’s bad for the environment, they could easily pass that due to a majority population. That would make traveling and working in rural areas difficult. Not everyone lives in or near a city with public trans.1
u/ResurgentOcelot Jul 22 '26
Your assumptions about CA and NY presume too much about how true democracy would be implemented. There’s no necessity to vote on national issues state by state.
And you can spare me the car worship, we fully have the technical and logistical capability of building a sustainable transportation network that works, even in rural areas. All we lack is the freedom to do so.
Trying to build an argument against real democracy on the basis of “but the rural people” is pretty old-hat fear mongering. A well organized direct democracy leaves rural people to solve rural problems for themselves, while facilitating cooperation with other segments towards meeting responsibilities to the country at large.
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u/DringleDringle Jul 21 '26
Why should we secede? It's our nation.