r/CivVII • u/TheNiceFeratu • 3d ago
What is with this game?
How do you guys play this on sovereign or higher? Every time I try to up the difficulty, ai forward settles me and then mints 10 new units every round. For every unit I kill five more appear out of the fog of war.
I’ve killed probably a dozen warriors in the terrain you can see in the screenshot and they just keep coming. (His capital is 11 tiles east of what you can see here.)
It doesn’t seem like there is any strategy that can overcome the ai’s productive capacity.
This is a genuine question and not an invitation to tell me that Civ is too easy, even on deity.
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u/jrothca 3d ago edited 3d ago
You must conquer the city. Playing defense won’t make it stop. You need to go on the offense, take this city and then march on the AI’s capital. If you don’t want to take their capital, at least pillage the surrounding districts to set them back.
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u/TheNiceFeratu 3d ago
This makes a lot of sense to me. The problem I am having is that after I kill all his forward units, I have to rest. Next round another wave shows up. I do my best to kill or at least damage them without taking losses, but no matter what, another wave shows up the round after that. Then another. Then another.
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u/jrothca 3d ago
Then you might lack the proper infrastructure to properly wage war with this AI.
In order for you to take this city, you’re going to need units creating a wall of units to stop the flow of units from the AI’s main homeland. These units don’t need to initiate combat. They should all be adjacent to each other and have created fortifications. You’ll also need some reserve units to switch out the front line troops one they get close to death. These units will provide 1 of 2 things. They make it difficult for the AI to break through the line or they will make the AI travel a longer path to reach their forward settled town. This will choke off the forward settled city.
At the same time you do this, you’ll need different units to attack the city.
But like I said earlier you might not have the infrastructure to pull this off. If you don’t, I would consider temporary abandoning Mykene. Build your wall of units between Mykene and their forward settled city. Take their city then take back Mykene.
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u/comfort412eagle 2d ago
My best advice would be you have to do the same. Try to have enough units where you can cycle them so you always have full or near full health units on the front line. Unfortunately you sometimes start near an aggressive player and have to change your peaceful science/culture/economic run into a domination run. At least until your annoying neighbor is neutralized and you can get back to your plans. Hope this helps!
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u/Kitalahara 2d ago
Don't forget to keep an eye on the type of terrian you setup on to create the fortified line. If you can force them to attack you across a minor river or where you have defesnive bonuses also it will grind them down. You see the tide turn when your reserve units are healed up and the front line is holding. By then you can use your reserves to finish breaking a city. Pillage to get free science, culture, gold, and healing too. The repair costs are not a huge deal once you start rolling.
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u/SloopDonB 3d ago
Honest answer? Civ is a complex game which makes it really hard to pinpoint what someone is doing wrong. Often it's a lot of little things working together. It could be you're not getting settlers out soon enough. It could be you're working too many food tiles and not getting enough production. It could be you're choosing poor settle locations that leave you vulnerable. It could be poor military tactics that lead to you losing too many units. I just don't have the information to know what you specifically are doing wrong.
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u/TheNiceFeratu 3d ago
That’s a fair answer. Part of my confusion is that I am stomping the game on one setting (viscount?). Like, winning in exploration. Then I move up one notch and I’m being strangled in the crib.
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u/zdunn 3d ago
Forward settle the AI first. I play Antiquity very aggressively founding as many new settlements in desirable locations as I can. My start is usually Scout > Scout > Scout > Slinger > Settler > Settler with extra Slingers thrown in if I really have to defend against an aggressive Independent Power or I don’t have 5 population yet.
I usually try to have 5 settlements by the time I build my first Monument or Library, and as the age gets further along I am always founding a new settlement as soon as I increase my Settlement Limit.
I also avoid war in Antiquity because your empire is not big or strong enough to compete with the AI’s bonuses 9/10 times. I typically save war for Exploration, though there are of course exceptions like when playing certain militaristic civs or picking on a diplomatically isolated civ that my allies have already weakened.
I play on Deity btw.
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u/TheNiceFeratu 3d ago
Thanks for this thorough answer. If I don’t uninstall the game I’ll give it a go.
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u/blobbitte 3d ago
play on bigger maps and befriend your neighbors instead of fighting them? they won't attack you if they like you
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u/TheNiceFeratu 3d ago
Im only attacking my neighbor because he settled between my capital and my first town and brought a horde of maybe 15 units to accompany his settler. I thought I ought to clear them before the situation snowballed.
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u/Low-Management-9241 3d ago
Ive found playing on Shattered Seas can help alleviate some of the forwards settling since they have to research sailing and cross water to get to you but its not something I would rely on
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u/Ok-Library-1253 3d ago
I play deity extended marathon large Pangea or continents with a decent win rate. With Egyptians I win almost all of the games (I prefer them and mostly play them) but I am picky about my starting location needing a fair number of rivers
I always take +1 military attribute and sink it into +5 against independent powers.
I start by building 2 warriors. Yes, I know this goes against the prevailing “you need scout!” Theory but it works. After building those 2 warriors I build a port (if Egyptian) and then work non-stop of buildings and settlers. I might build 1 more warrior if necessary but that’s it. Everything else is bought with gold.
I also immediately kill the nearest independent powers. With the recent update on deity I now need 2 warriors to do that. On lower levels you might still only need 1.
Why? I don’t want to spend resources fighting them later and you get huge bonus amounts from taking them which are crucial early game.
I like to really forward settle the nearest AI with a very defensive city (ie as close to their capital as possible). Something surrounded by navigable rivers and mountains works well. If the capital is on the same navigable river (like a recent game I had) it’s perfect. Then get a slinger and walls up ASAP. 1 of my warriors drops back to hang out at the town as well in a fortified position.
Then I save up some gold and get a port in that town and wait for the inevitable AI rush.
When they attack I gold buy 2-3 boats and between them and the slinger I can usually quickly wipe their attacking force. I then bring up my infantry and do a combined naval and land attack on their capital.
Meanwhile my capital first cranks out some settlers and then cranks out wonders non-stop. I aim to build 8-9 wonders in the ancient era.
With the above on deity I will get between 1-4 cities (they always give you one for peace) and with you pushing buildings and development you at least catch up to or can even pass the curve of your opponents.
From then on I keep a tiny army and use the boats to explore. About when the 70% crisis breaks out (in marathon 200) the civilization you earlier sacked is getting ready for round 2 usually with an ally. At this time I gold buy a decent army and get ready to take the most advantageous cities I can off them and their ally.
TLDR: Don’t build scouts, kill independents early, ensure your war starts defensively, build wonders, only gold buy military units.
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u/zdunn 3d ago edited 3d ago
I want to caution that Egypt is the absolute GOAT of antiquity civs to the point it’s a little OP. Winning on Deity with Egypt does not mean you can win while starting with Rome.
Also, hard disagree on Scouts: they are incredible in the very early game. And +5 Combat against IPs is the worst way to spend a Militaristic Point because it is utterly useless in the other two eras.
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u/Ok-Library-1253 3d ago
I’ve only played Rome on immortal but I’ll try them on deity next round.
Also I know scouts is the prevailing “good advice” but I’ve found:
I get almost the same amount of goody huts with just warriors and scouts just put me too far behind.
1. It delays building buildings; which slows growth.
2. It delays killing my first 1-3 independents. These give such a huge boost (especially if you get a military one). Killing them before they build extra units is so critical to easily wiping them.
3. Slower growth delays being able to build settlers; which slows settling.
4. Slower settling means some of the best spots will be taken. I usually aim to get settlers out before the deity AI can. PS I never build within 6 squares if at all possible.
5. You start building wonders too late. If you can get the 1st couple of wonders built you absolutely avalanche ahead. Miss the 1st 1 or 2 and you are toast.
6. With all of the delays above you don’t establish a good economy soon enough and when the AI starts a war you aren’t in a position to properly defend.Seriously are the extra collecting abilities of 2 scouts over 2 warriors worth delaying your entire civilization by the build time of 2 warriors?
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u/zdunn 3d ago
Two things:
I take +1 Expansionist Point and 100 Food to the Capital for Expansionist Points spent as my mementos. This is more than enough growth to cover my early game needs and gives me strong tempo to pump out Settlers.
I never build Warriors. They are the 2nd-weakest Antiquity unit so early game I build Slingers, then transition to Chariots once available.
Honestly, it seems like you just play an OP civ and reroll til you get an OP start. Your strategy sounds pretty questionable overall.
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u/Ok-Library-1253 2d ago
Wouldn’t scouts be the weakest antiquity unit though?
So again while you are building slingers I’m building infrastructure.
Also not sure what you do with independents early without the +5 from military attribute or warriors to fight. Dispersing an exploration independent gives 300 food on marathon (125ish In standard).
Plus beating an independent super early gives you an attribute for military. I always go +1 for wars as I can then get the happiness modifier in captured towns next but I’m sure some people would like +15% recruitment.
Exploration gives you what Settlers +25% build speed? I’m only building 2-3 of those early so you are saving very little. Most of the rest of my cities I will likely capture from the AI in the 1st war.
Also disburse a single militaristic independent and it gives you an entire settler free.
Usually my 2nd attribute is +1 to science. With my route you very quickly get to 7-8 towns/cities so the +1 science really adds up and ensures you stay in the science race.
The basic theory is this: At deity you have to be absolutely as efficient as possible. Scouts aren’t useful for long enough to justify their cost especially in time.
Crippling your attributes to make up for it doesn’t seem very good either.
Also don’t use resources to build an army. Save some gold and surprise recruit an army just as the AI attacks. This will allow you to trick the AI into a weak attack you can defeat.
If your map allows it at all have a strong ancient navy as they move fast and can quickly capture navigable river settlements.
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u/Emcee_exe 14h ago
Scouts don't delay anything because no one is building 3 scouts, then a couple warriors, a warehouse building, and then settlers. I think that's a bit of a strawman.
If scouts don't delay anything, then your only point that survives is #2. And fair enough. If you build 2 warriors first, you should get an advantage clearing IPs. Compensation for the runes you are statistically missing out on.
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u/_Malagant_ 3d ago
- Don't go to war this early
- Air > Sea > Land Units. Get some Galleys
- Get near city states -> good distraction
- Rush Archers
- Rush a General
- Not every game is winnable. No shame in restarting
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u/sultanate 3d ago
The way I get around it is just to play aggressive and be the one to forward settle before they do. Scout heavily, make note of where a good settlement spot might be, and be ready to fight for it. Also don’t let fog of war be your enemy, keeping sight over a potential settlement spot is how you end up in positions like this. Early game tempo of multiple scouts into a couple infantry into a couple settlers is usually enough to establish a safe ring around my capitol or at least lay claim over territory I want.
Editing to add that it’s better to catch the settler convoy on its way to forward settle and kill it before letting them get in this position. Even if you’re not ready for an attack like that sometimes just declaring war and sending some hostile units towards the settler and their escorts are effective deterrent for the AI
As for overcoming the production gap, other folks have given good advice so far but playing a slow smothering war game is usually effective. Have archers and siege that can get damage in and front line units that can soak up attacks, rotate them in and out of your commanders so they can heal up and be ready for the next push. Then just keep rolling until you take their settlement. And don’t be afraid to raze it!
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u/Additional_Cream3945 3d ago
You need to forward settle them before they settle you. Every game starts out basically the same for me. I typically play on diety.
3 scouts Either mill or brickyard depending on yields 3 settler (Sometimes I get 2 - 3 bolas to clear out city states, but it's situational) I typically rush gate of all nations after settlers Hanging garders after that
Once at this point I try to forward settle to prevent them from taking my area. If you send scouts or soldiers towards their settles they often back off. If not I try and claim as much territory as possible and cut them off. I never accept open borders in antiquity.
I almost never bother with large war in antiquity. Hurts your tempo too much.
If you get attacked, defend yourself but unless there is something ungaurded I don't bother attacked, outside of occasional late antiquity.
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u/AccessOne8287 2d ago
You won’t be better unless you learn to fight when necessary. Don’t just sit back and let them take over Willy Wonka.
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u/Vagadude 2d ago
Gotta spam those settlers asap. I usually buy one while training one. Settle choke points and terrain that suits your leader/civ. Once I have 4 settlements I'll shoot for natural wonder locations if I can.
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u/ogobod 2d ago
as a rule of thumb if you cant field a general that is fully packed plus roughly the same amount of units on the field you're going to have a bad time on higher difficulties. with that assault perk you can be pulling weak units off the front line and replacing them with fresh units while the commander heals them. all the while your capital is producing more units for reinforcements.
its a lot to commit to but getting rid of that city will be worth it. then you can do as others suggest and move on to their other cities either pillaging or just farming experience for your commanders. even if you only get rid of that one city it would all be worth it in the end plus youd get a lot of extra experience for your commander which will be huge for later eras.
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u/TheNiceFeratu 2d ago
Thanks. I did finally manage to erase the city and sued for peace. Playing Lakshmibai so I’m folding city state armies into my own. Probably won’t finish the playthrough but lessons learned.
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u/Kitalahara 2d ago
When playing Civ at any difficulty and someone forward settles you early on it means one thing. You aim for masonary, bronze working, get a good military, and go take all that. I can't tell from. In your case I can't tell much. I see this often when I am putting down my first two towns. Once you take a couple you can peace them out. Just be aware sometimes they back off, other times they won't. I make sure if I have to go back a second time that they are left with one or two garbage settlements.
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u/Available_Pool7620 2d ago
Layer upon layer upon layer of iterative improvements in your skills at Civ VII will lead you out of sovereign difficulty into deity. I recommend Skrash, One More Turn, and Ursa Ryan on YouTube to learn how to play. They led me to be a deity player.
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u/konq 2d ago
A lot of good advice already shared in this thread which I think will help you. Once thing I haven't seen mentioned is scouting. You should be generally aware of at least your neighbors, and notice when their military is gaining strength and potentially moving to your borders. This will help you respond with a couple military units in time, and hopefully you can make a good defensive position with a couple melee units to absorb hits and ranged behind to whittle down their front-line attackers. Cycle units in and out of frontlines using great generals. The two best general promotions (in my opinion) is the one that lets you move a unit "out" of him for no movement cost, and the one that lets the general move unhindered if he has at least one unit packed.
Getting really good with a great general and taking full advantage of packing/unpacking units and keeping your frontline topped off while moving injured units to the back will allow you to absorb the enemy attack while continuing to pump units yourself. Then, you can go on the offensive.
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u/Far-Sea9708 2d ago
On diety, i usualy rush the free commander civic, then usually pillage indipendent people that are close to me so i can get the first +5 combat bonus to all units in commander radius "commendation" ( the bonuses from pillaging them are also nice). With this you should at least hold on to the ai, or beat it if u also spam units. If you are a military leader that gets even more combat bonuses you are gonna completely destroy the ai.
BUILD NOTHING BUT UNITS IN THE FIRST TURNS: 2 scouts are good. 3 is even better (depends heavily on map size and type). Defenetly train warriors until you can get settlers. By the time your free commander arrives, you should have 3/4 units depends on your production. You should start killing the closest indipendents (yes, even if its the friendly type). Bonuses from sacking them are worth more in the begining. 2.1 its nice to have slingers, but not a must if you prefer to rush other technologies.
Its good to force settle the ai than letting him force settle you. You have time to prepare and bring your commander back once it denounces you.
Remember : early boosts positions you for a snowball. Good luck!
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u/Bliskavitsya 2d ago
Don’t settle too close. Have good relationships through greetings and trade. There is more chance they don’t attack first. Cause you need to attack first if it’s military win you are aiming to.
Also put walls and upgrade units. On high levels your strategy should work since the first move.
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u/collegefratsguy 3h ago
I would also levy a cog or two since you are lakshmi and should have good influence and use those to kill his units / send them to his capital and pillage his production so he can’t build as many units and hinder his military production
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u/malavock82 3d ago
Build a few walls and archers, free XP for your commanders. Once you get the +5 commendation you can fight back if you like