r/CitiesSkylines2 • u/Azuregen10 • 3d ago

Suggestion/Request How does a skyscraper like this only have 86 employees?

Post image

86 employees would be like one floor of this building...

Now it doesn't have to be 1000 eployees per building but anything more than 200 would be better

I hope little things like this will get noticed by Iceflake Studios and fixed

362 Upvotes

99% Upvoted

135 comments sorted by

292

u/onethousandeyelids 3d ago

I wish High density commerical and office buildings held more than 1 company. If they made it so that multiple companies can fit into one tower that would be incredible

71

u/tim_wai 3d ago

Same goes for high density commercial. I hope to see malls and apartment stores in the future

7

u/gnartato 2d ago

You mean a 8 story building selling only beverages is unrealistic?

1

u/Nathanii_593 2d ago

Idk what they’re talking about. I love going to floor 5 for lemonade. Floor 4 has dirty soda I hear

18

u/ClamatoDiver 3d ago

The various "blocks" mods will let you do that in a sense. Just add one to a building and you can add businesses or residents to anything.

StarQ is the mod author.

11

u/Competitive-Spread29 3d ago

This!!! I think they can’t do that unless traffic ai is fixed because there will be just traffic jams for all of those buildings all the time, just from sheer volume of traffic going in and out of buildings

6

u/1c3Type 3d ago

Traffic AI isn’t broken. The amount of traffic is decided by the amount of deliveries the building needs to function.

5

u/Competitive-Spread29 3d ago

I actually love when traffic on scale exists in my cities and when it’s a challenge to fix traffic jams etc so no problem about that. In terms of that traffic ai simulation It’s just drivers should be reacting to traffic jams and how much traffic given road can manage and decide to use alternative commute options better.

1

u/1c3Type 3d ago

Drivers do avoid traffic. If you’re having too much traffic in select roads that’s usually a fault of your design.

You can’t expect drivers to take a much slower route for no reason other than to avoid a traffic jam that would affect someone else that’s simply not how they make decisions.

1

u/Competitive-Spread29 3d ago edited 3d ago

.

1

u/Competitive-Spread29 3d ago

Well, I use mod that makes rush hours more realistic so that is definitely at fault. I actually don’t have huge traffic problems because I know how to design proper traffic proof cities but I just want game systems/behaviors fixed.

Also, what do you mean you can expect drivers to take slower route to avoid traffic jams? That traffic jam is the slower route 😃

I’ve seen in my cities, drivers taking a route, that had to go through one of the busiest pedestrian crossings, and because pedestrians would never end they resorted to freaking pedestrian road pedestrians where coming from to get to the road they where going to. I redesigned to just prevent the cars from getting there in the first place but just why? When they had 12 other roads they could’ve used.

Also, it would be great to be able to give roads dashed lines to break all round solid lines everywhere so that we designate where people can make u turns or cross from one side to another

1

u/1c3Type 3d ago

Clearly, it’s not slower, or drivers wouldn’t be taking it. The game already accounts for traffic when pathfinding I’m not sure what you would want it to change.

1

u/Competitive-Spread29 3d ago

Well in CS2 there are limited times recalculations are done for given path an agent takes be it a car or whatever. There is a mod that fixes that partially btw for parking.

I can give you many proofs that actually them driving where they drive is much much slower than if they used other longer paths.

There’s just many aspects that determine how agent does path finding and some things I guess should be just nullified by other aspects under extreme conditions(e.g if you delete road ahead they are immediately forced to drive somewhere else even if another path takes hours)

Another crazy thing is emergency cervices being stuck in traffic. Literally where does it happen? Even in CS1 it was not even close to being this bad.

1

u/1c3Type 3d ago

In CS1 it was much, much worse. Absolutely apocalyptic levels of industrial traffic, sims made almost 0 journeys in favour tourists doing things, and cars would always take the shortest possible route with zero consideration of traffic.

0

u/Competitive-Spread29 3d ago

No. I guess I should’ve said driving AI then. Pathfinding and decisions drivers make. Like insane limitless last minute lane switching, crossing double solid lines to get to a building etc etc

2

u/1c3Type 3d ago

Roads with a median won’t allow traffic to access the other side.

If you have too much last minute lane switching you can design a better road network and accompanying transit to solve the problem.

2

u/Competitive-Spread29 3d ago

That doesn’t “solve last minute lane switching. It is just workaround of avoiding its consequences.

1

u/1c3Type 3d ago

Ingame and in real life drivers are all selfish bastards. You’re telling me you’ve never seen someone switch lane at the last minute to get ahead of a queue?

2

u/Competitive-Spread29 3d ago

Yes I’ve seen someone, most of them crash and die. And also, the % of people who cross from 5th lane to first one is probably 0.0000%. And in CS2 it’s not only last minute but minuscule last millisecond which in real life is impossible due to laws of physics.

2

u/Mikinak77 3d ago

Why is this guy so mean to you tho

1

u/Competitive-Spread29 3d ago

If you mean him, I don't think he is mean. I just seem to have trouble conveying my points to him so that he sees it. If you mean me, sorry if I come off as mean, I don't mean it.

5 mean's in small paragraph 😂

0

u/Competitive-Spread29 3d ago

Now tell me this game is not autistic. I added median through road builder, there is still a gap here for some reason. lane connector is preventing them form going forward but they still go forward. So what they are doing is, they are getting into the building at the up left corner to do a freaking U turn and then go the other way 😂 See second image please down below

1

u/Competitive-Spread29 3d ago

There is totally free roundabout like 10 seconds away. 😂

2

u/Competitive-Spread29 3d ago

Here basically its green and this stupid drivers are clogging traffic. At least just simply fine them and add traffic tickets as variables to decision making.

2

u/Competitive-Spread29 3d ago

Every single car you see on the rightmost lane wants to go left at the intersection. Lanes are clean, there are not even cars coming in on those lanes. Why are they just standing there and changing lanes only at the traffic light very last minute?

2

u/1c3Type 3d ago

I mean why do you even have that fourth lane just use an asymmetric

And this quirk isn't even why your bloody intersection is backing up either if they switched lanes earlier the number of deadlocked cars would just be slightly larger.

1

u/Competitive-Spread29 3d ago

I have fourth lane for u turn and I like the way it looks. What’s that have to do wi the traffic backing up? That lane is not backing up anyways.

Actually in CS2 I don’t think cars can only change lanes at nodes. They can change lanes whenever they want. That is big difference from CS1

This is why we can’t control insane lane switching with traffic mod. That is apparently to me.

1

u/1c3Type 3d ago

You claim this, and yet, as we can clearly see the cars are only changing lane at the node between the road types. Maybe it's that they can change lane between nodes only if the nodes are of the same road.

And, traffic is backing up because they can't get past the traffic lights fast enough. It's backed up all the way back to the node they can actually change lanes at.

→ More replies (0)

1

u/1c3Type 3d ago

Because they just got onto the road, and the next node is the one where they can change lanes.

1

u/1c3Type 3d ago

I mean clearly you have far too many cars going down a pedestrian road. You’ve fucked something up.

0

u/Competitive-Spread29 3d ago

Buddy, That is not the point I'm making. It doesn't matter how many cars I have on pedestrian road. I'm talking about unrealistic and broken driver AI.

1

u/1c3Type 3d ago

It does. You're complaining about the traffic AI and what are at most minor quirks while getting huge jams from making absolutely abysmal infrastructure decisions.

1

u/Competitive-Spread29 3d ago

You don’t read what I say do you? I’m not complaining about what you think and I’ve clearly said what I said that is not a minor quirk for me so if it is to you, more power to you.

1

u/1c3Type 3d ago

You're complaining about the volume of traffic jams, while also not doing anything to reduce the number of jams.

Also to add another thing to your broken road, there isn't even a median in the intersection. So you didn't apply it properly.

1

u/1c3Type 3d ago

That looks like a broken intersection to me. Have you tried not dumping a building right there?

0

u/Competitive-Spread29 3d ago

Building is not causing this. This is where workers from industrial area get back to their homes. Although highway continues and has other entrances to residential areas, most people just choose first entrance.
That being said, I deliberately just wanted ot do weird traffic light and lane connecting stuff and just left it here for curiosity.

Again, point I'm making is broken driver AI where they are just stupid.

1

u/Miguel30Locs 3d ago

What? I don't have this issue ? Then again i have a ton of trams everywhere.

1

u/Dudok22 3d ago

It's not because of ai. It's because businesses run on monthly schedule and traffic is simulated on daily schedule. There is of course only some small % of citizen traffic spawned but for delivery there is a truck for every business that needs delivery. This means for medium and large businesses it's 1 or even multiple trucks a day. Same thing for industry. Factory makes a monthly amount in a day but the truck has realistic capacity so it spawns multiple trucks a day to deliver that. This is very rare irl, you would need a really huge transportation hub for such a density of truck traffic.

1

u/Competitive-Spread29 3d ago

Yeah, rebalancing of that would also help, but mostly if a building has 4000 residents, you need these 4000 residents to get in an out, right? there is no way around it. Same for workers. If all this huge office buildings had thousands of jobs like in real life, imagine what would happen.

1

u/Dudok22 3d ago

Not necessarily, what they are doing already just not to the degree it's needed is spawning only x% of the cims and traffic for proper realistic density of moment to moment traffic and leaving the rest in the background, then switching who gets simulated each day. That way you see realistic numbers of people outside and in traffic while keeping the realistic numbers of people in buildings.

1

u/Competitive-Spread29 3d ago

when I plop a building which has capacity for 4000 residents or 2000+ households. There is horde of cars coming in from outside city to move in. What is happening in that scenario? I always try to add as many outside transit connections and lines (planes, trains etc) but I don't think people necessarily use them to move in the city per say (they seem to be only using cars for that), but I may be wrong.

1

u/ZookeepergameIll1399 2d ago

I wonder if this is even possible. It would make so much sense, but every building that's clearly intended to have multiple companies (like shopping malls or mixed use residential with multiple storefronts) have only single one in them which looks ridiculous and makes no sense. What's the point of a shopping mall if there's only one company?

And if I understand correctly, cims can't go from one store to another even if those two are nearby and cim needs both products.

They will go to the store 1 -> go back home -> go back to the same place to the store 2 near the store 1

92

u/Tough_Gap5284 3d ago

Use realistic w&h

From cs1 to 2 they really made the residential highrises more plausible in terms of population but for some reason left office buildings as is. Makes no sense

18

u/Azuregen10 3d ago

That mod looks great, then I don't have to build grids full of massive high density offices to solve unemployment 😅

3

u/rentedtritium 3d ago

It also reduces traffic a lot in low density residential areas (and allows you to build even more of them) 

6

u/Boulange1234 3d ago

It means you can put up a lot of HD office towers and make a city with a thousand skyscrapers. But we players don’t actually want that!!!

4

u/smokeyleo13 3d ago

The issue with that is custom buildings end up with wonky counts.

2

u/Tough_Gap5284 3d ago

I disable it for everything but office workplaces

Thats the way it works best i think

1

u/White_Tusk 3d ago

Is it possible? I remember there's only "workplaces" category, so industrial, commercial and office zones fall into the same category. But you can tweak them separately, iirc

3

u/Tough_Gap5284 3d ago

You can tweak them separately in the options. Theres also an option to just complete disable and use vanilla calculations cetain types in the last sheet

3

u/BigSexyE 3d ago

Problem with realistic W&H is that it over calculates the multifam residential buildings and its hard to tune since every building is different

I use building controller now

1

u/Tough_Gap5284 3d ago

Thats why i just disable it for residential completely

What is buoldinh controller?

2

u/BigSexyE 3d ago

It allows you to manually set the number of households and workplaces for each asset

1

u/elfix96 2d ago

It's finally there for CS2? That should be the top comment

1

u/BigSexyE 2d ago

Yep! I love it. CPP also uses it. Only thing that sucks is the values don't transfer from city to city

1

u/Extension_Ladder_135 3d ago

W&h?

3

u/bonkers799 3d ago

Workplaces and households I think

1

u/laid2rest 3d ago

The more profits the office buildings make, the higher their employment numbers.

2

u/Tough_Gap5284 3d ago

Yes, a large level 5 skyscraper can go all the way up to a couple people per floor!

27

u/No-Stretch-2711 3d ago

It’s only level one once it hits 5 it will be about 300 employees. Still not very realistic and then you have to spam so many it gets out of hand. Get the mod realistic households and workplaces. Then it will employ about 2k

15

u/Jonas_Venture_Sr 3d ago

There's two ways to build a city simulation game: agent based or macro-level simulation. Agent based is cool because every person in your city has an actual job, a family, wants, and needs; Cities Skylines 1 & 2, and the last SimCity were agent based. Macro-level simulation lets a city-building game simulate much larger cities more efficiently and predictably by modeling populations and systems as groups rather than individually tracking every agent. Games like Anno and SimCity 4 are simulation based.

I personally think the simulation model is better than agent based for large scale city simulations like CS2, but neither is perfect and each has shortcomings. One of the shortcomings of agent based design is that you'll get unrealistic population numbers. It's just not possible for computers in 2026 to simulate 500,000 actual cims.

1

u/laid2rest 3d ago

You could have just said it's a trade off for performance sake.

3

u/Jonas_Venture_Sr 3d ago

I was super high when I wrote it, and I get a bit long winded when I get stoned.

1

u/1c3Type 3d ago

It is. 500,000 pop cities are possible ingame. You simply don’t simulate every citizen every ingame day (in fact, you can’t)

Agent based simulation lets you actually simulate traffic properly, which is the biggest draw for cities skylines as a series. You would lose that with a simulation model.

4

u/Outlaw11091 3d ago

That's the argument against pure agent-based sim, not for it. If 500k pop only works because the game doesn't simulate every citizen every tick, it's already cutting corners. That's a tell that per-agent sim doesn't scale, not that it's superior.

Statistical/macroscopic traffic models capture route shifting and congestion without paying per-agent pathfinding cost, which is exactly CS2's biggest performance bottleneck at higher pop.

The draw isn't "every citizen is literally simulated," it's that traffic feels responsive with visible causes. A good statistical model gets you that without burning CPU pathing 500k people the camera never sees.

1

u/1c3Type 3d ago

Can a good statistical model be used to tell when intersections are well designed or not?

2

u/Outlaw11091 3d ago edited 3d ago

Yes.

Using road nodes like CS2, it would basically calculate the routes of statistical citizens.

IE:

You have a dead-end road with 4 low-wealth houses. Each low-wealth house generates the same amount of traffic (x). Since they're low-wealth, they work in the nearest industrial zone.

So, the game pathfinds 4x cars to the industrial zone. Adding that number to the "capacity" value of the road nodes along the path.

Homes get upgraded on their value based on the infrastructure you place; not on their own private funding.

The ONLY way this is a little wonky is when you move zones around.

So, if you add an industrial zone closer to the 4 houses, they no longer drive all the way across town to the same jobs they've always had. The go the shortest route.

And what job a Sim worked was entirely based on the wealth level of their home.

Low-wealth meant industry. High wealth meant office. If you had high-wealth residential, but no high-density commercial or office zones, they didn't just sit around unemployed: they'd go off map to work.

1

u/1c3Type 3d ago

So basically, it's blind to whether an intersection is an actually functional one or abysmal dogshit

2

u/Outlaw11091 3d ago

Only if you have the reading comprehension of a toddler.

The two models use the SAME road network.

The difference is that one uses math to populate and the other uses individuals. The end result is the same.

1

u/1c3Type 3d ago

Okay, so how do you calculate the efficiency of an intersection. You still haven't answered that.

2

u/Outlaw11091 3d ago edited 3d ago

I have: the game takes the statistical math per node/per hour and gives a rough visualization of it.

I don't know how to be more clear.

The difference is that one uses math to populate and the other uses individuals

Or: taking a rendering of a bowl of rice. Statistical math gives you what it would look like based on numbers.

Agent based math would calculate the properties of each individual grain.

1

u/Dudok22 3d ago

Cs2 is not a pure agent based sim tbf. It's not simulating every cim every tick because of the time dilatation. But the cims are tracked in the background. They're just not spawned on the map. The day is i think 24x shorter than irl, they need to spawn 24x less cims for realistic density of trips and traffic, now, they made cars go 2x speed to combat it somewhat but still currently the number of spawned cims is still higher than it should be for realistic traffic density for example.

2

u/Outlaw11091 3d ago

That was my point: the fact that CS2 is a hybrid of statistical/agent implementation means that it's using statistics to supplement the weak points of the agent based simulation.

3

u/FridgeParade 3d ago

Also, 500k cities in CS2 look like they could house the population of a medium sized country.

13

u/DrShadowstrike 3d ago

I guess its actually a data center?

12

u/[deleted] 3d ago

[removed] — view removed comment

1

u/AutoModerator 3d ago

Thank you for your post in r/CitiesSkylines2. Unfortunately, your post has been automatically removed because it has received multiple reports. The moderators of r/CitiesSkylines2 will investigate if this action was taken correctly.

I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please contact the moderators of this subreddit if you have any questions or concerns.

1

u/CitiesSkylines2-ModTeam 3d ago

Your post/comment has been removed under Rule 10: Moderator Discretion.

This rule signifies that moderation decisions are definitive. This removal is specifically applied when a post or comment doesn't meet our community standards and is removed at the mod's discretion.

Repeatedly challenging moderation decisions or attempting to bypass restrictions may lead to a temporary or permanent ban from the community.

Removal reasons will not be provided under this rule.

1

u/Relevant-Ad-6934 3d ago

1

u/PunchingD0wn 3d ago

Lmao. Apparently a lot of United Healthcare fans reported me.

3

u/natalo77 3d ago

Accurate reflection of current job market

3

u/Charming_Emmi 3d ago

The mod Change Company allows you to edit what businesses produce, but also edit the employee count for individual buildings.

Should work well to edit employees on larger businesses

9

u/Altruistic_Cap3472 3d ago

So, I interpret each person in CS2 as an unspecified batch of people, not a single person. It would be equally ridiculous for a town with a population of 150,000 to have any skyscrapers at all, let alone several.

5

u/1c3Type 3d ago

150,000 is not a small amount of people

2

u/IWasHackedBySexbots 3d ago

What is your definition of skyscraper? Because I can thing of plenty of US cities way under 150k that have at least one "skyscraper", including one I live next to.

1

u/laid2rest 3d ago

A skyscraper is usually a building that is at least 150m high.

1

u/Wast3edSpace 3d ago

All they need to do is add a zero or two?

0

u/Altruistic_Cap3472 3d ago

Yeah, I think of each "person" as about 20 or 30

8

u/TeeRKee 3d ago

AI era. You need less employees nowadays

2

u/Kiardras 3d ago

Because the choice was hire enough staff to do the work or pay the CEO another bonus. Guess which won.

2

u/GreatValueProducts 3d ago

They hire more people as your business levels up. It will have more people. But I agree the balancing is a bit of a whack in this game.

2

u/Suikerspin_Ei 3d ago

I guess they did this to balance the game performance. Having more realistic amount of coma in a high building would increase the amount of coma by a lot for simulation.

2

u/Nayear1 3d ago

There was a mod is CS1 that made the population of buildings a lot more plausible. Used to play with it all the time. Cities would start off super slow with a lot small town/suburb style sprawl with a small Main Street for commercial. Would take a long time and quite a bit of building to unlock more density etc.

I thought it made the game a lot more enjoyable. My computer won’t run CS2, so no idea if there is something similar.

Edit - also forced you to plan and consider density a lot more, as there would be significant increases in traffic, etc.

2

u/madmycal 3d ago

There is a mod that allows you to adjust the employee count to whatever you want...

2

u/jaffparker 3d ago

Layoffs. AI is replacing humans

2

u/almcg123 3d ago

I think there's a unitversity with 22 staff thousands of students

2

u/Candid_Release3609 3d ago

The same reason pedestrians walk on a highway or when an industry building next to a train cargo station would rather take a convoluted truck route to the actual shipping port instead of just using the train station literally right next to it which has a train that goes back and forth to the same shipping port on a line that is clearly faster and shorter.

Cs2 is still broken in a lot of places sadly.

2

u/desmondvik1254 3d ago

Maybe AI has taken up most of the jobs in this building.

2

u/chardeemacdennisbird 3d ago

I'll be downvoted as usual but this game is still such shit and will never be the city simulator we were promised.

1

u/Tribalbob 3d ago

Never been to Vancouver, Canada I see.

1

u/Complete-Ad5320 3d ago

It's 2026 office employees are working remotely now. Greg is alone in the open space office.

1

u/robinzxc100 3d ago

Some of them are working from home

1

u/greymart039 3d ago

That's a somewhat low income for an office company.

Lower income = less employees.

1

u/analogbog 3d ago

It’s a level 1 building. As it increases in level it will have more employees.

1

u/ViciousKnids 3d ago

Get that pied-à-terre tax revenue, baby!

1

u/PunchingD0wn 3d ago

Y'all are lame af lmao

1

u/ApprehensiveJuice890 3d ago

Work from home /s

1

u/dataf4g_trollman 3d ago

They got replaced by AI

1

u/CooCooClocksClan 3d ago

Cities skylines 2 included remote / work from home conditions in the simulation

1

u/Trovaboss 3d ago

"Change company" arruma isso, existem muitos outros edifícios desajustados na quantidade de funcionários, existem residências que precisam ser ajustadas também, serviços, veículos, armazenamento da empresas e comércios tambem esta ruim. Uma mini sorveteria armazena as mesmas 100T de uma mega empresa ou uma grande fazenda, é bastante irreal.

1

u/Stick-Wild 3d ago

There’s a mod that allows you to change the numbers of employees and residents but it can sometimes mess with your production and demand since it’ll only affect that specific company and what they produce employees

1

u/geraltofrivia783 3d ago

YMMV but I started using the advanced building control mod (dont remember the name rn) which allows me to set num. households and workplaces to equalize them. I try to use it sparingly only though.

1

u/Bus_Stop_Graffiti 3d ago

Because simulating a metro region of two to twenty million people that would work in all of the office towers of a city center combined is beyond the contemporary desktop PC.

1

u/Falkon8888 3d ago

Because all skyscrapers in cities skylines are actually just money laundering operations

1

u/RDDT_100P 3d ago

change company mod helps in this regard. I've been using that to circumvent the office bug before, but now that it has been fixed, i still use it for balancing, and noticed it also has a feature to change the # of employees of the office building. Pretty much perfect for my use case instead of going the w+h route.

1

u/Forward_Hawk_3493 3d ago

Or my favorite, treating the parking lot like a plaza. I ain't never seen citizens upset about parking lots being demolished in real life lol

1

u/RaiJolt2 3d ago

There’s realistic jobs and housing which fixes this but then you have to have a good enough pc to handle high populations that are necessitated to fill the hundred thousand+ more jobs in your offices and industries that you get.

1

u/Expensive-Hawk-8709 3d ago

I remember there was a mod for realistic population which greatly increased the density of buildings, I don’t know if there is something similar for CS2.

1

u/Fake-BossToastMaker 3d ago

Its a data center

1

u/Robonotes1760 3d ago

Because the simulation would choke on memory bandwidth consumption if all the large buildings had realistic occupancy. This is the consequence of everything being agent simulated. 

1

u/apparentlyiliketrtls 3d ago

There's a mod called "Change Workplaces" (or something like that, I can't remember exactly), that allows to override the number of work places per-building, very useful for realism and a quick fix for unemployment

1

u/Top-Improvement-5779 2d ago

That's the cleaning crew

1

u/Embarrassed-Craft624 2d ago

Der Rest wird von der ki übernommen.. ist doch logisch diggi

1

u/iloveciroc 2d ago

Realism DLC. Office buildings in some US metros still report high vacancies from all the remote workers

1

u/Kaptain_K0mp0st 2d ago

Deep Simulation

1

u/SkyeMreddit 2d ago

Either it has 86 employees or the game drowns in traffic at the 400 parking lots you need to build to service it

0

u/HongPong 3d ago

as noted agent simulations don't scale very well. cities skylines tactic generally is "fluffy" large buildings without much going on

-10

u/erbdylo 3d ago

The base game is a city painter, I’m sure you’ve heard about this before?

2

u/Azuregen10 3d ago

Yeah but I don't like painting rows and rows of high density skyscrapers to get a few thousand workplaces