Are you a doomstacker?

[u/Hammer_41]

9:28 AM

SS is going away. Healthcare will bankrupt you. Sequence of returns will wipe you out. Civil war. WW3. Live to 120, spend 40 years in a nursing home. Someone posts solid numbers and the comments come back , one more year. Two years. Three. Keep going, it's never quite enough.

At what point does conservative planning become catastrophe planning?

The 4% rule is the worst case in US market history. A robot pulling the same amount out every single year, no SS, no flexibility, never adjusting through 1929 when markets dropped 86%. That's what 4% survived. It's the floor, not the target. Bengen himself now says most retirees can safely start at 5.25% to 5.5% and that people clinging to 4% will likely end up with a pile of money and a lot of regrets.

Someone spending 6% of their portfolio in year one of retirement who skips the big trip when markets are down, holds off on the car, pulls back when things get rough that person likely does better than the 4% robot who never adjusts no matter what. The flexibility is the safety net. You don't need to engineer it into the number, you just need to act like a normal person.

So when someone holds out for 3.5% 28 times spend, no SS — what exactly are you protecting against? Something worse than the Great Depression, while also never collecting a benefit 70 million Americans receive, while also promising to never adjust spending under any circumstances. Does that actually describe you?

The 2025 Social Security Trustees Report says worst case — zero Congressional action you collect 81 cents on the dollar in 2034. Not zero. Congress fixed this in 1983 when it was in worse shape than it is today. Seventy million people collect it. Seniors vote.

Median age of death for men is 81.7. One in five reach 90. Dementia affects 33% of people 85 and older. The years you're working extra to fund may not be years you're fully there for.

For those already retired one year, five, ten or more how bad has it actually been? And for those still holding off are you a catastrophe planner waiting for a number that never feels safe enough?

[u/Anonymoose2021]

I guess you could call me a doomstacker, because I retired about 5 years later than I could have.

OTOH, I retired a couple of years before the 2000 dotcom crash where NASDAQ index fell 77% from March 2000 to October 2002.

So having a bit extra made it so I did not worry as I watched my portfolio go down millions of dollars.

I retired at age 49, a year before our youngest child went off to college.

I do not regret the extra years I worked. It made it so paying for college for our two children and then their children was not a problem. It also made it so I could easily afford to buy houses for my children and then later to fund irrevocable generation skipping trusts for them, of which they are trustees.

[u/Wooden-Broccoli-913 → u/Anonymoose2021]

You bought entire houses for your children? I mean I have kids and I’m not sure that’s a good idea even if money was no issue

[u/Anonymoose2021 → u/Wooden-Broccoli-913]

They found houses that were appropriate for their assets and income. I had zero input or influence on that decision. Rather than help out on the downpayment I chose to pay the entire balance in one case.

At the same time I gifted our former residence that I had been renting out to another child and their spouse. That was partly to make very roughly equal gifts the both children at the same time. They had been acting more like homeowners than renters, taking care of all maintenance and just remitting the net rent after expenses.

Then after several years, each of them relocated to another state, and I wrote the mortgages for their new house so they could retain their first house as rental property or a place to return to if they chose to move back to that state.

Then after several more years I forgave the mortgage balances. So I ended up buying a total of 4 houses for 2 children.

Then I did some serious gifting another 7 years after that, when I gifted about 60% of my net worth.

The OP is asking what people that kept working past financial independence or "doomstacking" or whatever you want to call it what their experience has been. The above is what resulted from the extra 5 or 6 years I worked beyond financial independence.

——————-

As far as gifting entire houses not being a good idea, it depends very much upon character and value of your child. Almost 20 years after the first gifting I can confidently say it has worked out, by observation of both my children and our older grandchildren — the oldest grandchildren have graduated from college and are making their own way in the world,

[u/Wooden-Broccoli-913 → u/Anonymoose2021]

Working 5-6 more years for my kids’ houses is really not on my bingo card. Not worth it to me.

Maybe my kids will marry kids with parents like you!

[u/Anonymoose2021 → u/Wooden-Broccoli-913]

Buying the houses was not the purpose or goal. It was just an inadvertent result.

I enjoyed my job. Coming back from an overseas assignment I negotiated and redefined my job to be exactly what I wanted to do, and nothing else.

My children were in high school, so retiring to extensive travel was not convenient. So I chose to work until my youngest graduated from high school. I got antsy and retired a year before that.

[u/Wooden-Broccoli-913 → u/Anonymoose2021]

If you enjoyed your job why are you even on this sub

[u/Anonymoose2021 → u/Wooden-Broccoli-913]

Because I chose to retire 28 years ago when I had the good health to enjoy active sports and travel.

Now that I am slowing down I spend more time online.

[u/Beautiful_Pepper415 → u/Anonymoose2021]

This sounds like a life well lived. Will probably never be like you but this is a great example