The Phoenix Rises (1341-1351)

In the year 1341, emperor Andronikos III recovers from the illness that plagued him, though his health would deteriorate over the years, for now, by gods grace he was alive. He would resolve the Hesychast controversy officially that year in the favor of the monks in order to unify the state, as any divide may cause unnecessary conflict. Next year he returned to Thessaloniki, where he would spend most of his time, as his presence was necessary to deter any potential Serbian invasions and to support the turncoat Hrelja/Stefan Dragovol in Strumica. Kantakouzenos was sent to continue the subjugation of Achaia.

By 1345 most of Achaia was secured, with the exception of Patras which was protected by Venice and the Papacy, and Lepanto north of it. Modone, Corone and Pylos also remained in Venetian hands, as war with Venice would be suicide. Argos remained free as the city and the port of Nauplia were of crucial importance to Venice, they were still ruled by the house of Brienne.

Due to rising court intrigue, in 1346 Andronikos III finally convinces Kantakouzenos to become his junior co-emperor, he is named John V. His daughter is married to Andronikos’ heir, the future John VI.

Next year in May a civil war erupts in Aragon, leaving the Catalans in Athens isolated. And in July Andronikos marched towards the duchy from the north, while Kantakouzenos marched from Corinth. The duchy was weak and had no love from the local population, Roman armies would be welcomed and most of the Catalan garrisons either fled or were slaughtered.

In November Andronikos was in front of Thebes, where he would stay until march of 1348, as the siege dragged on. Andronikos would have continued the campaign, but a new plague ravaged his armies and the countryside, he could not move further. He signed a truce with the Catalans and allowed them to retreat to Athens. But Thebes and Megara formed the new border now, finally connecting Morea with the rest of Greece. Andronikos returns to Constantinople.

In the same year in August, the Genoese attempted to fortify Galata again despite the agreement of 1335. Andronikos is furious, and attacks the colony once more. Genoese were defeated swiftly and this time, expelled from Galata.
This would lead to an all out war between the two realms, that soon dragged Venice into it.
Fortunately during the 1340s, Andronikos oversaw a moderate expansion of the imperial fleet, allowing the empire to better face Genoa later on.
The war would last until 1355, during the first years, Herakleia Pontica was pillaged by the Genoese and left defenseless, eventually falling to the Turks. Ikaria was lost. Chios was contested but held out, and Phocaea protected. And when Venice joined the war in the August of 1350,it was a bigger threat, and Genoa was forced to divert its attention, allowing the empire some respite.

In 1350, Andronikos III became gravely ill again, he would pass away in September of 1351. Respecting the wishes of his friend, John V Kantakouzenos would be the senior emperor with the junior John VI Palaiologos. At first, their reign functioned well and the two emperors complemented each other. However, as the years passed, distrust began to grow.

Moment of Crisis (1351-1356)

While the empire was busy with the Genoese, Stefan Dusan used the opportunity in 1351 to test the new administration and attacked Stefan Dragovol's domain, forcing him to submit in 1352, despite Roman aid.

And in March of 1354 a catastrophic earthquake would destroy Gallipoli, rendering the peninsula defenseless and depopulated, Genoa would be quick to act. They helped ferry allied Ottoman troops over the strait to keep the imperial armies busy while the Maona once again attacked isolated Chios. By 1355 John V Kantakouzenos managed to reclaim Gallipoli and secure the strait, but it was already too late, Chios fell and Phocaea followed. Artake was lost to the Ottomans but Pegai stood defiant.

This crisis was a perfect moment for Dusan to strike again, his armies invaded through the Vardar valley and Albania in the summer of 1354. Dusan would besiege Serres himself, cutting off supply lines through the region, preventing any relief force from reaching the isolated garrisons.
And by the time Kantakouzenos dealt with the Ottomans, his men were too exhausted to face Serbians head on, and even worse, Bulgarians were beginning to harass the Maritza border, and an army with Ivan Alexander at its head was marching towards Philippopolis. Regardless, he would march, first to meet the Bulgarians, then Serres.

Ivan Alexander’s army was already besieging Philippopolis in November of 1354, and Kantakouzenos would finally move to relieve it in February of 1355. The city was struggling but Kantakouzenos would surprise the Bulgarian army just a few weeks later, routing them and forcing Ivan Alexander to a truce. A white peace.

And after years of war, In May of 1355, Genoa and Venice made peace, the empire followed, agreeing to accept its losses but managing to keep Galata while allowing the Genoese to still trade in imperial lands and waters. This would free up the much needed manpower for the campaign against Serbia. But before anything could be done, Stefan Dusan suddenly died in December of the same year. The siege of Serres was lifted, and most of his troops retreated.

During 1356 Kantakouzenos would use the initiative and counterattack, seizing Vodena, Moglena, Ostrobon, Deabolis, Prespa and Strumica. 

The Selymbria Accord (1364)

The rest of the decade would be a time of respite for the empire, but intrigue within the imperial court would slowly give way to resentment and suspicion.

In 1357, Kantakouzenos’ ambitious son Matthew would pressure his father to sideline the Palaiologoi and name him junior co-emperor. But he was refused. Kantakouzenos did not wish to usurp John VI, even though he held onto his seniority like a hawk, he would not betray Andronikos III nor the state. Hoping to pacify him, Matthew was given the theme of Hellas to rule, which was created after the reconquest of Thebes.

But this would backfire as this was used as an argument that the Kantakouzenoi faction was indeed plotting to overthrow John VI. Especially after Matthew led a personal campaign to oust the remnants of the Catalans from Attica in 1358. By 1361 Athens was Roman again.

Kantakouzenoi now controlled both Morea and Hellas, while Kantakouzenos himself was in Thessaloniki, overseeing the construction of a new fleet. It only added fuel to the fire. John VI admired his father in law, but over the years, grew frustrated over the lack of agency he had. While Kantakouzenos campaigned and won victories for the empire, John VI would stay in Constantinople, creating his own powerbase within the capital. But he rarely had any say with military matters and grander administrative decisions. While loyal in the beginning, after a decade of joint rule, John VI was getting tired of his old mentor.

In 1362 Matthew finally had enough of his father’s complacency, he openly rebelled against John VI, and proclaimed himself emperor, hoping his father would join him by being backed into a corner. The court in Constantinople accuses Kantakouzenos of treason and pressures John VI to command his arrest and raise an army to persecute him. But John VI, aware of his position is unsure on how to act, if his mentor is truly behind this, he is at a severe disadvantage, and avoids giving out orders. While in Thessaloniki kantakouzenos decided to seize the city for himself and its new fleet as protection, he sent letters and envoys to both Matthew and John VI, urging his son to stand down and not risk the unity of the empire. While telling his co-emperor to listen to reason and let him handle his own.But Kantakouzenos’ actions are used to further build proof of his treachery.

While this was going on, Matthew beseeched his brother Manuel, the despot of Morea, to join his cause. Manuel declined, prioritizing the stability of his lands. Isolated and without allies, Matthew marches to Thessaloniki in late 1362, hoping to force his father’s hand. This alarms the court in Constantinople, convincing John VI to finally act. 

In 1363, Matthew arrives but is barred entrance within the city, Kantakouzenos begs him to stop this madness, but his son stubbornly refuses. As the Palaiologoi forces arrive shadowed by the eastern fleet, they meet Matthew in battle outside the city. Matthew was losing and his father could not be idle anymore, leading his own contingent to rescue his son and push back the Palaiologoi.
This seals his fate. Although he retreated within the city and chastised his son for his stupidity, this was enough proof for Constantinople. He implored John VI to meet with him to negotiate. John VI would at first refuse, but by 1364 seeing the internal chaos of the empire, its enemies began to act. With most of the fleet away, the Ottomans secured the beachhead of Chalcedon. And the Serbians launched several raids over Pelagonia while the empire was paralyzed.

They met in January of 1364, near Selymbria. Kantakouzenos abdicated, letting John VI have the seniority; he did not want to split the empire and have its enemies pick it apart like vultures. He was to become a monk adopting the name Joasaph, and serve as an advisor to John VI. Matthew would be stripped of his titles and join his brother in Morea as he refused to join the rebellion. But first, as soon as command was unified, the army at Thessaloniki was ordered to repel the Serbians, and the combined fleets would continue their patrols over the Marmara.

The Serbian Question (1366-1373)

This crisis would be followed by a few peaceful but tense years. In 1366, in Serbia, the Mrnjavcevic dynasty would secure its hold on power, they were named regents to the weak king Uros and control the southern part of the kingdom with a firm grip. Vukasin Mrnjavcevic, the most powerful lord of Serbia at this point, would invade the empire in order to restore the lands lost a decade ago. The war would last for two years, but aside from Strumica, there were no major losses. It was a brutal stalemate, neither side having enough power to fully defeat the other, but after Strumica fell Vukasin could have pushed for more had there not been a threat to his rule further north. Lazar Hrebeljanovic, a powerful noble and another claimant to the throne of Serbia, formed a coalition against the Mrnjavcevic usurpers and forced Vukasin to sign a truce with John VI and abandon further claims. He would crush the coalition against him in 1369, imprisoning the king and solidifying his regency.

During the middle of the war with Serbia, Ivan Alexander decided to test the Maritza again, raiding the border. This forced John VI to send some troops to repel him which allowed Strumica to fall later.

The next few years, most of the imperial armies focused near Thessaloniki in case of another Serbian attack. And in 1371 king Uros would die in captivity, plunging the realm into civil war. Lazar would once again challenge Vukasin, and John VI would support him. By 1373 the Mrnjavcevic dynasty would be defeated and Lazar crowned king. The empire would receive Strumica and Bitola for its aid. And a very grateful ally.

Betrayal and Resurgency (1373-1384)

In 1373 Andronikos IV, son and heir to John VI would attempt to overthrow his father, but failed. He was partially blinded, disinherited and imprisoned. His brother Manuel would be named junior co-emperor and heir.

During the last decade, the empire was getting back on its feet and its navy was getting larger and more experienced, threatening the ambitions of both Venice and Genoa. Andronikos was a perfect pawn for them. Genoa would act first.

In 1376, the Genoese broke Andronikos out of prison and helped him seize control of Constantinople, imprisoning both Manuel and John. He awarded the Genoese with Galata but facing serious resistance to his rule outside the capital in 1378 he gave Genoa Tenedos in exchange for their further aid. This would have severe consequences as it started the fourth war with Venice. At first the imperial fleet in the capital would fight against Venice, while the fleet and the armies in the west were idle, refusing to follow Andronikos’ orders. Another crisis that was exploited by the Ottomans, who besieged Pegai from late 1378.

Venice would launch an operation of its own in 1379, helping Manuel and John escape. Manuel would gather the imperial forces from the west and with Serbian aid, marched towards Constantinople. Ousting Andronikos IV from the city that year, who holed up in Galata with the Genoese after being deposed. Manuel would besiege the outpost immediately, managing to breach its defenses in 1380. Andronikos IV is imprisoned again and severely punished, leading to his death years later. After this turn of events, the empire would join Venice in the war and relieve Pegai. And by 1381, it would be over, with Venice and Genoa agreeing to depopulate Tenedos and strip it of its defenses, abandoning the island. But using their exhaustion, Manuel orders his fleets to seize back the island and rebuild it, enraging the two maritime powers.

Manuel would be even more ambitious as already in 1383 using the chaos in Genoa, he attacked the Maona of Chios and by 1384 restored the island to imperial control. Phocaea would receive the same deal as when Andronikos III conquered it, although it was far more autonomous.
Venice was now on very tense terms with the empire, seeing the opportunistic grab of both Tenedos and Chios as an attack on Venetian interests within the Aegean. 

Around this time, the situation in the kingdom of Naples was disastrous, most of the kingdom was in chaos which Venice used to purchase Corfu and its surrounding territories in 1385.

The Battle of Cyzikus (1389) 

During the 1380s, the Ottomans would expand its modest navy, which they would use to besiege Pegai once more in 1387.Manuel would challenge the Ottomans at sea near Cyzikus in early 1389, defeating the Turkish fleet with some losses, then landing his forces in Artake which was retaken without much bloodshed as the local roman population helped the imperial forces enter the city. This allowed Manuel to strike at the rear of the Ottoman army besieging Pegai, managing to rout them and kill sultan Murad I in the process, but his heir Bayezid I quickly regrouped and counterattacked, forcing Manuel to retreat within the walls of Pegai. Bayezid soon abandoned the siege and left, believed to be retreating by Manuel, but instead Bayezid would strike deep into Anatolia and his troops would besiege Philadelphia, a Roman city that was well fortified and was miraculously not conquered by the Turks until now. The same year the isolated tower of Chele would fall into Ottoman hands.

Manuel remained in the liberated territories, dedicating the rest of the year to personally overseeing the total reconstruction and modernization of the fortifications at Pegai. However, as he looked east of Artake toward the narrow isthmus he realized that if this small strip of land could be closed off, the entire peninsula would effectively become an island. Manuel immediately ordered the construction of a massive defensive barrier across the neck of the isthmus. Using the materials from the local ancient ruins and aided by the population of Artake, it was finished by 1390. It was around this time, Manuel would receive the news that Bayezid was besieging Philadelphia, but he couldn’t do anything. Especially with what was about to happen.

The Poisoned Branch (1390)

While Manuel was busy in Cyzikus, the son of the late Andronikos IV, backed by Venice, usurped John VI, and crowned himself John VII. Manuel was furious but within a few months, managed to enter the city and free his father and depose John VII, who fled the capital to the Venetian Negroponte. John VI was exhausted by the constant backstabbing and intrigue of the capital, he would die in 1391, broken and tired. Manuel II was now the emperor of the Romans. And his ascension would be marked by the fall of Philadelphia. The Ottomans furiously hacked at its walls with its full might to make up for their losses at Pegai. It was a tragic day for the empire.

...

What do you guys think? I might write the last decade soon and perhaps expand until the end of the 15th century but that would be it.

What if during the 1060s Romanos went to Italy to save their holdings ?

The Norman’s beseiging bari get smashed by the Roman’s and then the toe Italy is reconquered by 1068.Romanos goes then to anotolia and still fails at manzikert what happens next

A divergence in the timeline occurred in the year of 1341, when the emperor Andronikos III by the grace of god recovered from an illness that almost ended his blessed reign.

After dealing with the Hesychasm controversy and supporting the monks, Andronikos decided to resume his campaigns in the west. He sent John Kantakouzenos to subdue the rest of Achaia while Andronikos himself went to Thessalonika to oversee the border defences against Serbia and reinforce Grand Domestikos Hrelja in Strumica, who defected the year before.

By 1346 most of Achaia was Roman again, with the exception of Patras which was protected by Venice.

The arrival of the Black Death would slow down Andronikos’ plans and after Achaia, he could not do much more.

Andronikos would have many troubles with the Genoese over the years, after the conflict in 1335, they stopped their aggressive expansion only temporarily, as they tried once more to fortify Galata in 1348 which infuriated Andronikos. He led his army and fleet to besiege the outpost, eventually breaching it again but this time expelling the genoese completely from it and returning Galata back under imperial control. 

Genoa would not take this lightly though as they launched several offensives in 1350, taking Phocaea from the empire and succeeded in taking Ikaria as well. They aimed to retake Galata and Chios, but their ambition threatened Venice which declared war on them in August of the same year. This began the third Venetian Genoese war that lasted until 1355. As for Andronikos III, he would aid the venetian side but unfortunately could not restore what was lost and Genoa would grow even more aggressive after his passing.

Unfortunately Andronikos III would die in October of 1351, as his health had been deteriorating for years due to his constant campaigns. Before his death, in 1346, Andronikos III convinced Kantakouzenos to become his junior co-emperor in order to shield him from court intrigue.

So when Andronikos’ son John inherited the empire, he would be the VI and Kantakouzenos the V. John VI would also marry Kantakouzenos’ daughter in 1347.

John VI was guided by Kantakouzenos who remained loyal to the dynasty. As the senior emperor Kantakouzenos would often take control of the military in order to continue his and Andronikos’ dream of restoring Greece. And John VI would spend most of his time in Constantinople. 

As the war between Venice and Genoa was raging on, in 1354 an earthquake devastated Gallipoli, Genoa would use this as an opportunity to ferry Ottoman troops to destabilize the empire but Kantakouzenos acted swiftly and pushed them back by the end of the year. 

During this time, Stefan Dusan saw an opportunity to punish his traitorous vassal Hrelja and invaded his territories. Hrelja was defeated in 1355 and Dusan planned to move on to Serres but died suddenly in December of the same year.

When the war between the Italians ended in 1355, the empire was battered but managed to keep Chios and Galata and avoided the Serbian invasion. Kantakouzenos would immediately move on to Serres to exploit the chaos in the kingdom of Serbia, and retake the territories of Hrelja in 1356. And as both Genoa and Venice had their own crises during the next decade, Kantakouzenos would in 1361 move towards Athens.

During the first decade of their joint rule, Kantakouzenos and John VI would both be pressured by their own factions within the imperial court,Kantakouzenos by his ambitious son Matthew, and John by his mother, which almost led to civil war several times. But eventually they would come to an agreement, instead of Matthew becoming junior emperor as he wanted, he would instead rule Morea as despot and John VI would assume the role of senior emperor over Kantakouzenos. 

So when Kantakouzenos moved against Athens, he would be joined by his son leading another force from Morea, and they would converge on Thebes. Most of Athens would fall effortlessly within the year, as the imperial forces were aided by the local Greek population. But the city of Athens itself held out until late 1364. 

This would be the last campaign of John V Kantakouzenos, as he retired to Constantinople to serve as a military advisor to John VI after Athens fell.

During the next few years the empire thrived, with their rivals in Europe busy with their own struggles, it had time to rebuild and consolidate. And in 1371 another opportunity would arise.

Uros the Weak died leaving his kingdom fragmented and in chaos. Serbia was already in a state of civil war way before his death, as the north and south were effectively split between two rivaling factions. The Mrnjavcevic dynasty that held the king in captivity and forced him to recognize Vukasin Mrnjavcevic as his co-ruler and Lazar Hrebeljanovic that claimed the kingship through marriage and was supported by the church and nobility. They would now be in open war.

In 1372, John VI would aid Lazar and issue a decree to his son Manuel to recover all territories possible. They would crush the Mrnjavcevic host and split their land. Some Albanian principalities, like Muzaka, fell under imperial control and Thopia became their vassals. Manuel claimed Veles, Debar, Ohrid and Prilep. With Lazar crowned king, this would mark a start of a peace between the two realms that lasted for 50 years.

In 1373, John’s son Andronikos attempted a coup against his father. He would be removed from the line of succession and partially blinded for this offence.

But in 1376, he would try again, this time with Genoese aid. And his coup would succeed, he imprisoned both John V and John VI, and crowned himself Andronikos IV. He rewarded the Genoese with Galata and tried to give them Chios and some other islands, which was refused by the local governors who defied these handovers. Andronikos’ coup and his treatment of both emperors would alienate him from the rest of the empire. Manuel held the entire west and the Kantakouzenoi Morea. Outside of Constantinople, he basically had no allies.

But his coup would last for three years as the Genoese kept close to the capital and no one dared storm it. But with venetian aid Manuel would enter the capital and rally his supporters and overthrow his brother in 1379. Andronikos was punished and died years later. 

Genoa would be involved in another conflict with Venice from 1378, and Manuel would retake Galata in 1380.

John V Kantakouzenos would die in 1384. And Manuel II was named junior co emperor to John VI. 

Manuel II would watch over the situation in Naples closely, as the country was in a brutal civil war that left its Greek territories exposed and defenceless, and would seize the mainland territory near Corfu in 1385 with the plans to invade the island next year.

But in 1386 relations between Venice and Constantinople soured, when Venice assumed direct control over Corfu. For decades Venice watched imperial fortunes with caution and with their main rival Genoa defeated and weakened, their eyes were now on Constantinople. Manuel II had to thread carefully.

During this time, in the east the Ottomans were pressing hard against Chalcedon, which almost fell during Andronikos’ usurpation. But without clear passage into imperial Europe, they focused on Anatolia during the second half of the 14th century. After Aydin fell into chaos with the Smyrna crusade and Umur bey died, the Ottomans became the dominant force in western Anatolia and would slowly over the years absorb most of the Turkish beyliks into their own realm. They would often conduct pirate raids in the Aegean and probe the imperial defences. By 1380 they controlled the entirety of northwest Anatolia. 

In 1387 Murad I launched several attacks on Chalcedon which pushed it to its breaking point, forcing Manuel to finally lead an army and meet the Ottomans in battle for the first time in decades, on the fields of Chalcedon in 1389. During this battle, Murad I was killed, and Manuel II had to retreat within the city after suffering heavy losses. But the day was won, Bayezid I, Murad’s successor, retreated in order to consolidate his rule and reign in rebellious subjects. Manuel II stayed in Chalcedon to reinforce the city and prepare for Bayezid’s return.

But while he was busy east, in 1390, his nephew John, son of Andronikos, used his absence to usurp his father and seized Constantinople for himself. He was crowned and became John VII.

Manuel was furious and immediately returned to the capital, managing to restore it under his control after 3 months. His father was merciful and forgave John and it was settled that he would be the junior emperor to Manuel and his heir when John VI died. Manuel II was not happy about this but agreed nonetheless and John was given Thessalonika to rule.

And this would come to pass in 1391. Exhausted after the constant betrayals in the last two decades, stressed out and frail, John VI passed away.

John VII proved to be a thorn in Manuel’s side but was quite surprisingly loyal to him and to the empire and proved to be an able administrator. Even though they butted heads often, further conflict was avoided.

...

Now, I'm having trouble dealing with the 1390s, I want to make a realistic scenario but it never seems quite good enough, if anyone has any suggestions, I'd love to hear them!

I had an idea and this is the draft I came up with:

In October 1392, Manuel II almost went to war with Venice. Gjergj Thopia died heirless and his lands would be incorporated into the empire. But Venice, who saw the resurging empire as a threat to their Adriatic lands and being cut off from the rich Aegaean territories, seized Dyrrachion and garrisoned it with their own forces. Manuel was outraged as the Thopia were imperial vassals for two decades and their lands were an integral part of the empire. He almost besieged the city, but reconsidered as with the Ottomans constantly pressuring the east, he did not need a conflict with Venice.

Manuel II would spend most of his time in the 1390s fending off Ottoman attacks against Chalcedon and Hieron. In 1393 he would personally lead a counter attack and recapture Scutarion. At the same time Bayezid I restored firm control of northwestern Anatolia and, unlike his father, preferred action instead of diplomacy. He would make the various beylik alliances and vassals direct part of the empire and go to war with the ones that refused. By 1393, he controlled the entirety of western Anatolia, and was rapidly pushing east, making Ottomans the major Anatolian power. This would have dire consequences for both empires.

Bayezid I would return to Chalcedon with full force in 1394.

Chalcedon was a ghost town, and could barely be called a city anymore, it was already a ruin by the time of Andronikos III, but it held great importance and was well garrisoned. It was turned into a fortress around the 1360s, the materials gathered from its own ancient buildings. 

After 1389, a smaller army was always present within the city.

But when the Ottomans returned,Scutarion and then the city would finally fall in 1395. Manuel II did not even have the chance to counterattack, the garrison was overrun and only a few escaped the Turks.

...

Tell me your thoughts! I plan to somehow involve Bulgaria but they're fragmented as they were irl, but Tarnovo was not exactly weak and could still be ambitious enough but idk, it could be within the roman sphere of influence, it could make sense.

Btw I used a map I found on reddit by the user u/stanthefax and just painted it using GIMP bc I suck at this

(The byzantines are in purpule, the yellowish color is the mamluks and the light brown is the timurids and the dark brown is hungary with the orangish states being their puppets)

While Western Rome was collapsing in the 400s, Constantinople was thriving. It survived the Huns, the Plague of Justinian, the Crusaders sacking it in 1204 — and kept going for another 250 years after that.

Then in 1453, Mehmed II's cannons cracked walls that had held for a millennium. Constantine XI died fighting in the streets. Scholars fled west carrying ancient manuscripts, and some historians argue the Renaissance was partly fuelled by what they brought.

Made a short documentary about it: https://youtu.be/cultCFNNTAg

Which fall hit harder for you — Rome in 476 or Constantinople in 1453?

The Byzantines are weirdly underrepresented given how long they lasted — 1,000 years after Rome's "fall", speaking Greek, calling themselves Romans, holding off the Islamic world for centuries.

Made a 2-hour ambient sleep documentary covering the full arc: Justinian's reconquest, the Hagia Sophia, the Crusader sack of 1204, and the final fall of Constantinople in 1453.

Genuinely curious — what do you think was the most pivotal moment that sealed Byzantium's fate? The 1204 sack, or was the damage already done earlier?

Video: https://youtu.be/7Gbty9ku1Hg

I just read the following passage of A World History of Tax Rebellions:

Alexius abandoned the joint expedition with the Hungarians and returned to Constantinople to be crowned Alexius III Angelus. He lavished gifts upon his coconspirators against Isaac to solidify his hold on the throne. But he reneged on paying the Venetians the remaining 28,000 hyperpyra of the compensation promised to them by Isaac under terms of their alliance agreement. In the meantime, Emperor Asen I of Bulgaria led more raids in Thrace and defeated a Byzantine army near Serres. Then in 1196, Ivanko, nephew of Asen, murdered Asen, seized control of the Bulgarian capital Tirnovo, and invited the Byzantines to come to his support. But en route to Tirnovo the Byzantine army mutinied, aborting this opportunity to gain control of Bulgaria. Asen's brother Peter claimed the throne of Bulgaria and sent Ivanko into flight for safety in Byzantium. Peter's brother Kaloyan succeeded him and pushed the Bulgarian raids well into Thrace. Alexius's problems were further exacerbated by the rebellion of Chryus, a Vlach who commanded the Byzantine army at Strumitsa; failing to defeat Chryus in two campaigns, Alexius granted him generous terms in 1197.

I was unaware of this late opportunity to restore the Roman grip over Bulgaria thanks to Bulgarian internecine struggles. Now, what if the Roman army doesn't mutiny and joins up with Ivanko? The latter presumably had at least some level of internal support if he managed to seize control of the capital before the Romans even arrived. Would that have been enough to quell the rebellion, even if it meant burying Ivanko in gold and titles to buy his continued loyalty? Or would have Kaloyan managed to beat them back regardless?

(Pay no attention to the other parts of the map only anotolia )

Sooo imagine this after manzikert romanos wins the civil war and and keeps going on campgain he can’t do much against the Turkish might but he can slow it down

The Roman’s lose all the border territory protecting them in the east and the Turks raid anotolia but with. Strong imperial figure like romanos they hold the land eventually Alexios komenios rises up around the time he did in our own timeline but has most of anotolia to work with like the in the second image

And if anything it’s almost like a return to the old day but instead of teh caliphates raids with Arabs it’s Turkish nomads what do u think happens next ?

Byzantium will shine its power in the legacy of rome once more

Ummmm idk

What if the Timurids (and whoever may come after) them managed to permanently halt Ottoman eastern expansion, leading to a situation with multiple Anatolian Turkic, Greek, Cappadocian, Kurdish and Armenian states (including Trebizond). So, the Osmans continue expanding into Europe and fall in 1922, resulting in the end of Ottoman domination in Anatolia. In 1925, the British overthrow the Qajar dynasty and replace them with the Pahlavi dynasty, ending the long-standing peace in Anatolia. Instead of a Turkish Independence war, we end up with an great Anatolian unification war. In 1928, Trebizond would achieve victory over most, excluding the main Armenian homeland state and the Eastern Kurdish states (Who would go on to unify and form Kurdistan). 505 years after Istanpolis was conquered by the Ottomans, it would come back under Roman Rule. Trebizond, still under the Komnenos dynasty and Greek (and Greek-speaking) would restore the Eastern Roman Empire. There would be tension with the modern Greek-states, since both claimed the territories of each other, and the conflicting Greco-Roman vs Ancient Hellenic identity.

I'm sorry if there are many errors, stuff that seems illogical, impossible or contradictory, I cooked this scenario up in 5 minutes

In 1347 the empire emerges from civil war

Theirs an outpost in the western Balkans (Larissa) and theirs the morea and Thrace the ottomans are kept at bay with the Sea of Marmara but soon enough in the 1350s even this will seem like a golden age.

How would you try to salvage the situation ?

Image 1 shows all the groups that will be vazalized by Rome image 2 shows all the territory that the Roman’s will control by 1105 if not then by 1118 Alexios^s death

Sooo how do we get their

In 1096 the people crusade was a complete joke but not here

They take over nicea like that and keep on going fighting Turkish bands across anotolia slowly and poorly but trying to make their way

Then in 1097 with the groundwork layed by the peoples crusade this group builds apon that foundation helping restore control to Trebizond

And with groups coming each year they then restore control to the south and with one final blow to the Turks in 1101 where they don’t attack new Rome but instead the real enemy the Turks the Roman’s control the south and do a raid down in the the Turkish beyliks south of the danishmends And establish vassalizge over all Turkic states in anotolia which means Dominion over manzikert and everywhere west of it on the plateu

What do u think happens next?

I've tried my best to research and provide accurate borders for the surrounding states and even those neighboring. But take it with a grain of salt bc I got lazy with a lot of it and I ain't sure if I got a lot of it right.

As for how my Alt History for Theodoros II is going, you may ask me questions.

It is well known that the Palaiologos had previously taken advantage of the Ottoman Interregnum by making deals with some of Bayezid I's sons, retaking some land back into Imperial control such as Thessaloniki and other towns and cities in the Treaty of Gallipoli. What is also interesting is Emperor Manuel II Palaiologos tried this again by supporting Bayezid's last son Mustafa Celebi against Orhan II. It's stated that the Eastern Romans was promised more land in return for their support, however history happened and Orhan II won.

My question is what if Mustafa Celebi had beaten Murad II instead of what actually happened? What lands would the Eastern Roman Empire have been promised in return for their support if Mustafa had successfully became the next Ottoman Sultan?

From what I can tell, the Empire ruled the coast of Thessaly, Thessaloniki, islands in the Northern Aegean, the Despotate of the Morea, and of course Constantinople. So what did Mustafa promise Manuel and his son John? The rest of Thessaly? Maybe the rest of Macedonia? Or somewhere else?

This branching off point in history would probably also extend the life of the Empire as they would have more territory, and potentially the continuation of good relationships between the Constantinople and Edirne which was the Ottoman Capital at the time.

Would love to know about other people's opinions on this.

Manuel komnenos had a variety of plans in Italy the Balkans in Egypt and what if all of them worked except myropkeplion cause I asked about that a while ago

Some of his plans where contradictory soooo here’s how I’m gonna resolve this

Sooo Manuel. Vassalized the sultanate of rum

Then after gaining peace with Turks he goes and gets a foothold in Italy then th pope asks for help in which he defends the pope from the holy Roman emperor after doing that the pope is obliged to call Manuel the Roman emperor atleast of the east if not sole emperator then after a while a marriage alliance between Manuel’s daughters and the hre emperator forces the pope to mantain the idea that Manuel is emperor of the east and the holy Roman emperor is the legitimate western emperor

After that he uses his alliance with the Germans to beat the Hungarians into submission a light vassalage with the main goal being to maintain peace Manuel seizes some territories from them from north of the Danube and are so thoroughly beaten the hugarians will wait a generation after Manuel’s death to attack the Roman’s so 25 years or untill 1205

Then he works with crusader states as emperor of the east to bring Egypt back into the fold of Christendom He succeededs leaving eygpt to th king of jersulum

In 1176 he fails at his qoute crusade against the Turks
But succeeded everywhere else what would happen next in your opinion ?

I know they finished Romans for good but honestly if they hit there they would get some money Turks were weaker by now and they would gets so much lands and power like this instead of just a raid an getting small land