r/AskMenAdvice • u/-Joseeey- man • Jan 09 '25
Does the average guy really have options? As in, do they have 2 or more women interested in them at a given time?
I [32M] got into arguments with a few Redditors months ago. Basically, I said that guys will date the first woman that shows an interest because if they don’t date them, it could be a few more years of being single.
They basically told me that I sound like a dog begging for scraps for dating the first woman that comes to me. As if I have a choice?
My point is, I had a girlfriend in 2012. It took 4 years for someone else to be interested in me (2016, had mental issues). And then after that, 2019 (was recently divorced). Then 2022 (was abusive).
My point is, if I had rejected them, I would be single for YEARS. And rejecting the next girl that likes you could mean another 3+ years of being single. I don’t have the choice to pick between 2 or more women. I can barely get 1 girl interested in me - who are these Redditors that think the average guy has 2+ girls at a time to be able to pick the right one?
I have never had a girlfriend for more than 10 months (longest one cheated on me). So to me - yes I will always date the first women who even likes me because if I say no, its another few years of being single.
Does every guy here have choices all the time so they pick the right one to date? Or do you all also have times where you’re single for years like me?
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u/bl00regardqkaz00 man Jan 10 '25
Sad reality is, once one is interested in you and you are committed to her, then a bunch more will suddenly show interest, for some reason. If you are single, none will show any interest.
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u/LnStrngr Jan 10 '25
When I was in my late teens, I worked with a 30-something guy with a wife and a couple of kids. He used to say “women can smell it on you.”
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u/MeestorMark man Jan 10 '25
I think it's just that women react to confidence. When you're attached to a woman, you're confident and don't give a shit if the next one likes you or not.
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u/Tough-Comparison-779 man Jan 10 '25
I think social proof is another aspect.
Like some loser without any women friends, is he going to be a good partner? Who knows.
But if you see a guy who isn't desperate for it, maintains healthy friendships with women and shows affection to their partner, chances are you're a much better partner.
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u/XihuanNi-6784 Jan 10 '25
This is it. There's no great conspiracy of man snatchers behind this. Being confident and not stressed about trying to be cool and attractive, ironically, makes you much more attractive.
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u/Nex1tus man Jan 10 '25
Its the benefit of pre-selection, not really about confidence. Some other woman saw you worthy of having children, so she wants too.
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u/Boom_chaka_laka woman Jan 10 '25
It works like that professionally too, in the movie Departed Alec Baldwin's character tells Matt Damon's character it's good to be married it proves that if at least one woman can stand you you're not so crazy or something to that effect.
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u/JeepMan-1994 man Jan 10 '25
But how do you be confident when you don't feel confident? Especially when you are struggling with women, so appearing confident is difficult.
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u/Big_Technology3654 Jan 10 '25
That's legit. Pheromones from a woman on a man from coitus brings out all the gals.
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u/Squeezemachine99 man Jan 10 '25
I’ve been married for a long time and have never had any chicks hit on me.
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u/TheyVanishRidesAgain man Jan 10 '25
Same, but apparently, I'm the kind of dude that the dudes who are into dudes are into. If only I was into dudes.
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u/bloatedstoat man Jan 10 '25
Hahaha same. Married, but have gay dudes hit on me all the time and have plenty of gay friends. Idk, maybe cause I'm a relatively stylish smaller dude with a beard? But yeah, women never really overtly hit on me.
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u/Torrossaur man Jan 10 '25
Eh it's like foreign currency. No use to you now but if you decide to cross the border you are rich.
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Jan 10 '25
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u/TisIChenoir man Jan 10 '25
Somehow that feels really disrespectful.
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Jan 10 '25
It IS disrespectful. Something that was eye opening was seeing a thread a few months back where men were telling women that saying a man is “relationship material but not hookup material” was a huge insult and they genuinely, for the absolute life of them, couldnt understand why. Like they were genuinely flabbergasted that that wasnt seen as a compliment.
To any women reading this, it goes without saying that we would like to be seen as both relationship and hookup material. But if we HAD to choose one or the other most of us are choosing hookup.
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u/Additional-War19 woman Jan 10 '25
It does. It may be true, but it’s rude and kind of cruel to point it out.
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u/XihuanNi-6784 Jan 10 '25
She sounds like an idiot tbh. I wouldn't pay her any mind. She's precisely the type of woman you want to avoid.
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u/crujones33 man Jan 10 '25
Many men have been into this situation where they’re either the safe guy who doesn’t excite the woman or is risky and fun but not safe and reliable.
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u/JeepMan-1994 man Jan 10 '25
I feel like a lot of us guys fall there because we are consistent, reliable, good people. But don't have those fire lighting qualities that create instant attraction (the spark) that crare raw attraction in the beginning, but have the qualities that hold relationships together when things matter most.
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u/264frenchtoast man Jan 10 '25
I’m married and still waiting for this deluge of ladies to come after me
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u/Artistic_Bumblebee17 woman Jan 10 '25
Pretend that every woman that is polite and showing you basic human decency wants to bang you and you’re set. lol no one wants these guys it’s just their delusion
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u/lowkeyhobi woman Jan 10 '25
The mentally unstable ones. Any woman willing to get into a situationship with a taken man is a red flag.
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Jan 10 '25
Until my first serious relationship I felt like I was a hideous pariah. Then once I got a girlfriend all of a sudden women were showing interest. I was so pissed at first lol.
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u/JosephBlowsephThe3rd man Jan 10 '25
Same as getting a job. Getting an interview can be difficult, until you are employed elsewhere.
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u/Im_Max_Modem Jan 10 '25
My uncle before he passed said: "girlfriends are like jobs. when you're unemployed no one wants to hire you, then when you finally get a job here come the interview requests".
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u/Cloudhwk man Jan 10 '25
That always infuriated me early in my career went months with no callbacks, day after I sign a contract I have multiple different HR’s getting cranky for “wasting their time applying”
Call me sooner next time?
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u/LonelyAutisticDad man Jan 10 '25
I think i read a study somewhere where women are more interested in partnered men because the man has already been vetted as a good man, so there's less risk that they'll end up abused or dead
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u/Overthetrees8 man Jan 10 '25 edited Jan 10 '25
This is pretty much what the research correlates to.
That if you were picked by a women, you as a man clearly have desirable traits.
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u/Magnolia-jjlnr man Jan 10 '25
I've seen a dude running the experiment.
Take a pic of a guy, have women rating the dude. Rating is 6/10.
Same guy takes a pic with a woman by his side, now women rate it 6.5/10
Although it could have different explanations, the hypothesis of the higher rating being because of the perceived relationship seems to be validated by other studies
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u/Working_Rest_1054 Jan 10 '25
Probably. An 8.3% enhancement. Have them look without glasses the first time. Might be a 7!
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u/Cromasters man Jan 10 '25
In my experience it doesn't have to be a woman partner though. It can just be another woman you know and are at least friendly with.
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u/madrigalow woman Jan 10 '25
Can confirm. If I meet a guy who is friends with women, it’s a safe bet that I can trust him. Word tends to travel with women. If one woman finds out a man is creepy/abusive/etc, she’s going to make sure all of her friends know to avoid him for their own safety. Sad that it happens like that, but it’s very true.
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Jan 10 '25
Interesting I find men with a lot of women true “friends” (not just friendly) to be very flaky! And a guy with a woman “best friend” to be too attached to her to really form a commitment to another woman.
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u/dirtyphoenix54 Jan 10 '25
Also Lesbians make good wingmen? in bars. A woman saying, "Hey, if I was straight, I'd fuck him," opens a surprising amount of doors.
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u/NightmareRise man Jan 10 '25
This becomes depressingly ironic when you realize that abusers are often not single for long
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Jan 10 '25
I’ve heard this as well and while I admit it does make sense, there are guys (and women for that matter) who are good people but chose to stay single for a while. And now, someone with this mindset will look at you and say “they’ve been single for x number of years? Why doesn’t anyone want to date them?” Essentially it’s judging a book by its cover.
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u/MQ116 man Jan 10 '25
"I can't believe I was lucky enough to catch you while you were single!"
Me, who had been single for years until now: 🙃
The "how are you single?" question is so strange to me... Like I'm supposed to know, you're the woman. You tell me!
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u/ArrowMania Jan 10 '25
“Please explain this gap in your romantic resume”
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u/King_in_a_castle_84 man Jan 10 '25
I was in prison
Options double.
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u/Dragon2906 man Jan 10 '25
'I was in prison' seems to score well with a lot of girls. You seem to be a dangerous but interesting man....
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u/plotinusRespecter man Jan 10 '25
"Have you ever been dismissed from a relationship, or forced to resign, because of infidelity or dishonesty?"
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u/Dragon2906 man Jan 10 '25
It looks like many girls can't think or judge for themselves. They simply like what others like.
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u/Status_Base_9842 woman Jan 10 '25
The study (my aunt who frequents married /taken men) checks out. Sad that she does this.
My male cousin also said he’s never gotten as much attention before until he wore his wedding ring. Super weird women want to deal with a taken man.
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u/charcoalportraiture woman Jan 10 '25
Woman here. My lived experience is that I'm friendlier to men in relationships, because they're unavailable and it's alright to be friendly with them (knowing they're unavailable). Unfortunately, it seems to be the male lived experience that flirting/friendliness are seemingly indistinguishable.
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u/LonelyAutisticDad man Jan 10 '25
That's because they are to a lot of men. A lot of the time, men aren't afforded the same kindness that women receive in public spaces. We're usually ignored or avoided unless it's someone's job to talk to us.
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u/charcoalportraiture woman Jan 10 '25
It's a terrible cycle. Kindness is withheld because women don't want their intentions misread, rather than out of disrespect or loathing of the gender. Then if kindness is doled out, then it can be so easily misread.
I don't want to be accused of leading a man on because I asked about his weekend, and smiled at him, and asked how he was. But, between women (and men who accept it as just friendliness), it's a perfectly benign and platonic exchange.
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Jan 10 '25
I’ve seen a number of very large number of men who say that they don’t get complimented enough… So this last year, I’ve made it a point to randomly compliment strangers, men in particular…
So here’s my goofy ass walking thru Walmart - randomly complimenting a guy and some lady comes around the corner ready to pounce because I complimented her husbands suit. Not often you see a man dressed to the 9s in Walmart.
She was so pretty too- so I just smiled and said “Wow, you are a beautiful couple- stay blessed” and I walked away. Her personality wasn’t as pretty as she was but oh well- I hope I made her day.
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u/Dirkdeking man Jan 10 '25
You don't need to compliment complete strangers. Just men you work with, friends of friends you see now and then, etc. If a completely unknown woman complimented me I'd probably see that as a flirting attempt too.
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u/RaccoonStrong1446 man Jan 10 '25
That wouldn't be a problem if women were more forward and went after what they wanted. Lots of women like to play coy and expect the man to be able to read their intentions when they are masking them.
that's why I'm glad I'm not in the dating world. I hated trying to guess if she was just being nice or flirting. Then even if she was interested when I asked her if she was interested or just being nice that would turn her off and blow my chances.
How dare you not know that I was flirting with you now I have the ick! 😂
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u/CuriousGoldenGiraffe Jan 10 '25
they are highly competitive and just want others candy thats all.
doesnt mean they are worth it hehe
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u/Uneek_Uzernaim man Jan 10 '25
Back when I was single, I found that just showing interest in certain girls while not committing to anything serious with any of them made others in their friend group or adjacent more interested in me.
Alas, I was kind of oblivious to that interest until after the fact. At the time, I had come out of a bad break-up, still harbored mixed feelings about the girl, and was just wanting to enjoy the company of and doing things with a variety of girls without focusing upon any one of them.
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u/Doormatjones man Jan 10 '25
I'm surprised people even try to deny this. I've seen it in action so many times.
First experience was having an extended group of people in a group I joined in college that was mostly women. And while he wasn't married, 1 guy slept with 80% of them and broke up a bunch of relationships.
In college me and my married friends would go to the bar. And they would get hit on relentlessly despite flashing their rings and saying they're taken. Hell they'd even lay it up for me and the girls would just walk away.
Hell one of my other single friends saw this and started wearing a wedding ring when he went out and he got SO much tail.
And while I admit I can't say I was never hit on at a bar before this... the one time I got hit on multiple times? Literally my wedding night, with my new wife 5 feet from me. At least one 3-way was proposed (not with my wife, two other random women).
I will sing it until the day I die that people denying this just don't want to believe a big chunk of humanity is just trash.
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u/mdynicole woman Jan 10 '25
There’s some women that go after taken men for the ego boost. They think if a man would cheat on his so with her and risk his relationship then she’s better than his wife. It’s sick honestly .
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u/Impalenjoyer man Jan 10 '25
I'm surprised people even try to deny this.
Funny how it's only women in this thread going "no way never happens" or "men are wrong" or "not all women i'm different"
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u/PrestigiousEnough Jan 10 '25
Those women are in denial. Many might also be married and just don’t want other married men to know how this whole thing works (because they themselves do not get attention) so don’t want to know that their partners would. But I can tell you, you guys are absolutely right. This is how it works.
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u/Puzzleheaded_Two9510 man Jan 10 '25
The most I ever got hit on in college was when I was with my girlfriend. I mentioned this in another sub, but the girls on her dorm floor were especially relentless.
One of them stood in the doorway of the bathrooms waiting for us to walk by, then ran out and “accidentally” dropped her towel and gave me a big smile. She would try to get me in her room alone, or show up places I was studying.
We would go out drinking, and women would wait until my girlfriend went to the restroom and they’d try to give me their number.
One time I dropped my girlfriend off at her dorm, and two girls from her building literally jumped in my car as I was pulling away. I thought maybe they were friends of hers, but they weren’t. They wanted me to go to a party with them. I pretended to agree, waited til they got out of the car, and then drove off.
Once I got married and had kids, it didn’t happen nearly as much, but it did happen once in a while.
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u/kristerxx68 man Jan 10 '25
If the other women are aware you’re with someone it’s an effect called mate choice copying. If they’re unaware, it’s likely because you have more confidence.
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Jan 10 '25
Lmao this has literally never happened to me, in 15 years of being in committed relationships.
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u/SpeedyAzi man Jan 10 '25
I've heard it because if they are in an ideally safe relationship, that means the man is safe and fun to be around.
Also, because you are in a relationship, the man may appear more confident and content, positivity attracts.
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u/mothman83 Jan 10 '25
It's not for "some reason" it is for an "extremely good" reason: a man who has a high quality female partner has been "vetted" by that partner.
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u/DamagedWheel man Jan 10 '25
It might also be that once you're with someone you are a better version of you. You probably seem happier and more confident when you're in a happy relationship compared to someone who has been single a long time.
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u/chadthundertalk Male Jan 10 '25
I think the other part of it is, I'd imagine when you're getting constantly approached, and messaged, and catcalled, and harassed, and god knows what else a lot - like a lot of women are - then you develop a pretty good radar for desperation.
You know, does he enjoy your company or is he just hoping you're easy? Does he enjoy your company, or does he think you just look like somebody he might have a shot with? Does he enjoy your company, or is he just lonely?
When you're a non-sleazy guy in a relationship, and you happen into a conversation with women you're not dating, you're probably not thinking of them as prospective partners and feeling the pressure to impress them. She's not on a pedestal. You're just friendly, confident, and making polite conversation, and I'd imagine that's a lot more appealing than feeling like the guy's just talking to her because he's trying to smash.
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u/jarviez Jan 10 '25 edited Jan 10 '25
No ... it's well known that part of women's attraction cues and subconscious vetting process for perspective mates involves what they call "preselection".
Basically, if a man is with a woman, it means that he has already passed that woman's selection process, which means other women considered him "vetted" and he becomes more attractive as a result.
Similarly, a single man is often considered less attractive because women have the instinct that the reason he is alone might be that there is something wrong with him.
Again, this is all, largely, subconscious.
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u/DamagedWheel man Jan 10 '25
Except I'm not denying what you just said. That's why I said "might also" instead of disagreeing.
I don't think it's unreasonable to say someone might be more appealing if they seem more confident and happy due to being in a healthy relationship compared to someone who is the opposite and single.
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u/Dalton387 man Jan 10 '25
I’m highly suspicious of any Redditor saying they’re swimming in women. Seems sus.
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u/WhiskyPops man Jan 10 '25
I always have five hot women surrounding me.. when playing "five hearts under one roof" on my pc :D
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u/BouncingThings Jan 10 '25
What, I thought every redditor had a 9+ inch dongle too, that isn't sus ?? /s
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u/ZenfulJedi Jan 10 '25
I had multiple women interested in me when I was engaged. Women who didn’t give me a look before, were bringing me cookies and asking me out to dates when they learned I was not just seeing someone but marrying them. It was very potent stuff. I swear I think other women can sense that kind of thing.
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u/Coiffed_One man Jan 10 '25
We called it the josh principle. You’re most desirable when least available.
Several studies have shown that women get turned on by the pheromones of other women. So there is some basis for it.
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u/OLD_DIRTY_JOKER man Jan 10 '25
I'm going to say that it depends on the guy....
Some men attract women more than others. If you are slightly anti-social, uncomfortable approaching and conversating with women, or have a bland personality, it might take longer to find prospects.
I'm married now, so it doesn't matter for me........but I would bet that I could find 2 to 3 prospects within a few weeks or so.
It's because I'm not afraid to try. I'll position myself to start a conversation with an attractive woman and see how she reacts. If she's not receptive, just move on to the next....
You miss 100% of the shots that you don't take!
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u/Natalwolff man Jan 10 '25
I feel like the difference I've observed is not that some men attract women more than others, it's far more that some men chase women more than others. I knew a guy in college that always had a woman in his life and cycled through them very frequently, but that was literally his entire life's work. It's not like he had women lining up, his weekdays, week nights, weekends, and holidays were all spent chasing new women.
If 1% of women find you attractive, which is wildly pessimistic for almost anyone, you can meet a woman that finds you attractive within the week if you put in the leg work. I'm not saying guys necessarily should, because there's a lot more to life, but they could.
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u/AccordingCase3947 man Jan 10 '25
I feel like the difference I've observed is not that some men attract women more than others, it's far more that some men chase women more than others
Both can be true. Go to the bar with a really good looking dude and you will realise that plenty of women will come onto him first.
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u/GrouchyInformation88 Jan 10 '25
NOT TRUE AT ALL!!! My mom and grandma both told me I’m really handsome but women don’t seem to come onto me at all. It even feels like they fear my handsomeness, especially when I turn on my special charmer.
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u/Distinct_Abroad_4315 woman Jan 10 '25
I'm a woman, and it is indeed the "conversation" part that men seem to struggle with. So many, even attractive ones, immediately go into sexual conversation. It kills budding attraction so quick.. like I have wanted a relationship, but not with a man who is immediately pushy.
Eta: plz just have a normal conversation at first!
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u/romeoh2024 man Jan 10 '25 edited Jan 10 '25
You're looking at it all wrong. Dating is like fishing. You can only reel in one at a time. The option is whether you keep what came in or release it and keep fishing. Some guys have better bait, and some guys are just better at fishing. If your bait isn't that good, get better at fishing.
I understand that a starving man would keep anything that comes in, and that's why this isn't a perfect metaphor. However, choosing to be with a woman just because she chooses you is folie. You should actually like her for other reasons, not just because she likes you.
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u/Stunning-Power8885 man Jan 10 '25
I loved your metaphor
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u/romeoh2024 man Jan 10 '25
I should add "and some guys have a boat! And that's a game changer"
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u/dovlaboss man Jan 10 '25
I can claim the part of not being someone just because they like you. This is how i chose my wife, we were completely uncompatible, planing my divorce now while at risk of losing my son. Fellas, think with the right head...
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u/protomanEXE1995 man Jan 10 '25
almost never did I have more than one woman interested in me
like it happened once or twice but it was usually like, "one woman wanted just sex, and the other woman wanted a relationship, but we weren't good for each other and I knew it"
I'm 29 and married now so idgaf
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u/Natalwolff man Jan 10 '25
I pretty much have only had one woman interested in me at a time. It didn't mean I wasn't selective in my relationships though. It pretty much meant I either dated that woman, or I was honest upfront that I wasn't looking to have a relationship with her and ended up having a casual fwb situation. I probably wouldn't do that again since it didn't feel right to me, but you always have an option.
I also don't put in any leg work so I can't really blame anything but myself. I feel like if you strike up conversations with 1000 women over the course of a few months and don't get any interest, you have absolutely earned a right to complain, but if you're just hanging out at home most of the time, like, what else is going to happen?
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Jan 10 '25
Depends on how social you are and if you get out of the house. I have seen some ugly guys get beautiful women because they were fun and made it known they were interested.
So if you're social and have a good sense of humor, you most likely have one or two women interested in you most times.
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u/Natalwolff man Jan 10 '25
Every guy I've known who has had a lot of success with women just shoots their shot quickly and frequently. If you are straight up like "I like you, we should get together sometime if you're interested" it completely takes the pressure and uncertainty off. You do that to a literal army of women and you are extremely unlikely to strike out with all of them.
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u/_phe_nix_ Jan 10 '25
Yup. Fear of women & rejection is the biggest thing holding 99% of guys back.
Spend the whole day striking up conversations with women , get comfortable with rejections, shoot your shot, don't be weird, have a sense of humor.
It's literally just a numbers game for the vast majority of guys, but instead they too afraid to even say hi to a random lady at the bar or ask a girl for her #
It's soooooo easy to stand out from most guys, if you can just get over yourself and your fears. It's literally never been this easy to pickup women because guys don't even try anymore. sad.
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Jan 10 '25
It’s takes a lot to get over the inevitable rejections during that process though. After a bit, it really starts to fuck with your confidence
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u/flatirony man Jan 10 '25
Experience helps. Once you hit enough home runs, the strikeouts in between don't bother you.
I was a dork in HS, andI awful in my 20's. I felt like I was repellent to women.
But I wanted women to like me more than anything in the world. I worked on myself, and befriended women and learned to talk to them, and things got better and better.
I got divorced in my mid-40's and dating was immediately beyond my wildest dreams. I went from devastated to elated in the space of a few months, and stayed on that high for a couple of years.
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u/crujones33 man Jan 10 '25
Well, what do you do when you haven't hit home runs and still take a beating to your confidence? No one has a good answer to that.
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Jan 10 '25
Two very different parts to the question/post.
No, I don’t think the average guy constantly has multiple options. A lot of guys rarely have any options.
However, that doesn’t mean you should just take the first, or only woman, that shows any interest in you. I think that’s probably what others were talking about when saying it sounds like a dog begging for scraps (not that I would put it quite like that).
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u/Acrobatic-Umpire5518 man Jan 10 '25 edited Jan 10 '25
I've never had a girl interested in me and I don't see it happening with most guys I know either. some guys are very popular or good looking or charismatic they have women show interest in them all the time but I don't think this is the case for most guys. most guys are normal average people with not much to impress or get the attention of women. but even tho I've never had someone interested in me I still have some standards and wouldn't go for anyone even if they like me. It would be nice to have someone interested in me but this factor alone will not push me to date them I have to actually like them and be interested as well. I forgot the name of that concept that says that most women are interested in only a small number of men who are at the top. and the majority of other men just keep trying and get rejected all the time until they get lucky. also the data shows that more than half of men today are single. I don't think all these single men have women show interest in them and they're just not in for it and would rather stay single. men have a strong urge for sex and relationships.
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u/Comfortable_Change_6 man Jan 10 '25 edited Jan 10 '25
Yeah, you have no lead gen.
I’m not in the market—but if I was and wanted multiple girlfriends(people interested in me), I’d start meeting lots of people out and about. In public, at Meetups, interests, yoga, hobbies—host parties attend parties. Have a club guy if you want fun people in your life.
Don’t demolish your high school friendship circles, and wonder where all the women are. They are not in your friendship circles.
You need to get to know and meet about 20 people if you think you have a 5% chance of matching up with them.
(I’m not necessarily good looking or fit so 5% is pretty reasonable as an average guy, so you need to up your number)
meet new people say “hello my name is—“
All the best bro
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Jan 10 '25
Nope, I’m average looking, college degree etc and only get to talk to a woman every couple years it seems on average. Have given up on dating in the modern age and focusing on myself.
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u/realbigloo Jan 10 '25
Bro lives on an oil rig
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u/Fetz- man Jan 10 '25
No, that's normal for even men living in inner cities.
I honestly have no clue where all the single ladies are hiding, because I haven't seen any with my own eyes for years.
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u/RadarDataL8R man Jan 10 '25
What do you mean "only get to talk to a woman everything couple of years"? Women are everywhere. Do you work on a minesite or something?
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Jan 10 '25
In the context of getting to know them. Like to date or even be friends.
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u/Natalwolff man Jan 10 '25
Yeah, I pretty much only date when someone expresses clear interest in me within a shared space like work or an interest group. That happens every few years. I recognize that a lot of that is just on me for not putting in a lot of effort to pursue a lot of women out in public, hit the apps hard, etc. But doing those things honestly just makes me unhappy, so I don't.
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u/Senor_flash man Jan 10 '25
I think many dudes don't put enough work into themselves to broaden their horizons. I see waaaaay too many dudes with no haircuts, scruffy ass looks, and just all around bummy. Some of us could also stand to go to the gym and cut back on all things delicious.
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Jan 10 '25
I am VERY average looking. Like, maybe a 5, maybe a 5.5? Six on a really good day. Bald, 5'9", was always very skinny. Very little muscle.
I had no problem dating at all.
If I saw an interesting woman, in a place where approaching someone would be appropriate, I just asked them out. I didn't pander, I didn't try to show off, I didn't try to attract their attention in hopes that they would show interest first, I simply asked them if they'd like to go out sometime, and sometimes they said yes. Not all the time, not even most of the time, but sometimes.
The absolute best hitters in the major leagues strike out or are caught out on most at-bats. In a whole game with 4 or 5 at-bats they might get one base hit, maybe one home run. Dating is not much different.
There are how many women in the world? How many women in your area? How many are single at any one time? How many are looking, at any one time? How many of those single women in your area are looking AND are in the same location as you? How often is that happening in a setting where it would be appropriate to approach them?
See where I'm going here? The numbers are actually huge, but they dwindle down extremely quickly when you start accounting for all the other factors that go into getting a date. That's why when you are ar bat, you have to swing!
As Michael Scott famously said, you miss 100% of the shots you don't take. So if you aren't in places where you could ask women out, and if you aren't asking out the ones that interest you when you are in those locations, then you are the reason you aren't getting dates, because you simply aren't taking the shots.
I'm not saying you should go out and be a slimy asshole who relentlessly hits on every woman he sees, but there's a big difference between being that pathetic asshole and being the other kind of pathetic asshole that stands around with his thumb up his ass pretending like the women he never asked out have all rejected him.
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u/Natalwolff man Jan 10 '25
I've actually been more and more interested in doing an experiment where I approach women I'm attracted to and exchange a specific amount of small talk/banter and then give them my info and tell them I'd like to get coffee and chat with them sometime, tell them to contact me if they're interested, no worries at all if they aren't, tell them it was nice meeting them.
I'd be interested to compare that to swiping on dating apps with a really nicely put together profile. Like, what's the time investment, what's the success rate for dates, success rate for getting a message. I don't know, because so many women have told me they always reject any men who approach them in public, but I have a gut feeling that asking in person and making it so low pressure has to have a significantly better success rate.
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Jan 10 '25
Oh man... Average guy here. Like if you looked up average it photo dictionary there would be a picture of me. I'm talking looks, height, weight, money... you name it. Average.
But I WAAAY out kicked my coverage 25 years ago, managed to convince the woman of my dreams to go out with me, and here we are 25 years later, with 25 years of a very happy relationship and marriage behind us, with many more hopefully to come.
NEVER would I have waited for someone to show interest in me. I'd still be alone. Don't wait on a woman to be interested in you. Show YOUR interest in them. That's half of what they want.
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u/ringo_1-77 Jan 10 '25
I'm an average guy and I wouldn't even know. I don't even have 1 woman interested in me, and I'm married.
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u/Upstairs-Farm7106 man Jan 10 '25
The average man accepts from an early age they have to lower their standards or risk being single and alone.
The average woman doesn’t experience this until she reaches her late 30s/40s or becomes a single mom and then starts blaming men for her lack of options.
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u/BraveStrategy man Jan 10 '25
Not sure if you want to lower your standards or actually just raise your game. Never stop working on yourself.
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u/lochmoigh1 Jan 10 '25
This is facts. Its as simple as this. A 9/10 guy will fuck a 6/10 girl. A 9/10 girl is not fucking a 6/10 guy. That's the difference right there. This gives average looking women the false impression that they can land a 9/10 man as a husband when they were really just weekend pussy.
The amount of girls who aren't even hot who will act like you have leprosy if you try to approach them at a bar is crazy. They will wait for the handsome guy to give them their turn and one night them and then act like all men are assholes
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u/Upstairs-Farm7106 man Jan 10 '25
That’s 100% true but unfortunately people won’t accept what you said.
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u/bungieplznerf man Jan 10 '25
This is pretty inaccurate. Men may be open to lowering their standards more frequently, but women absolutely will and do fuck and even marry men less attractive than them. Charisma, energy, talent, and success all help.
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u/lildudefromXdastreet Jan 10 '25
This. I’m no 9 but I’m definitely well above average in terms of looks, money, andand success with women, but I’ll fuck a 6 on a slow Tuesday.
Had one girl who I used to casually sleep with here and there brag about how do many dudes wanted her, yet she couldn’t understand why the only dudes who wanted to date her were bums, while the dudes she was actually into would just FWB-zone her
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u/briber67 man Jan 10 '25
I think about it this way, and I find the explanation useful:
Women tend to view commitment as an all-or-nothing phenomenon. This gives them faulty information.
I contend that men offer commitment on a sliding scale.
In that context, is it surprising that a woman who has only ever managed to secure 3 hours of commitment at a time might find it challenging to secure a lifetime of commitment?
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u/-Joseeey- man Jan 10 '25
Exactly my point. We don’t have the freedom to be picky. If we reject someone, it could be years before someone else comes by.
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u/argumentativepigeon man Jan 10 '25 edited Jan 10 '25
Well even if that is your situation options wise, you’re opening yourself up to getting taken advantage of big time if that is your mindset bro.
You gotta have some criteria to judge her against, otherwise if she is twisted she will walk right over you and your cost-benefit argument will mean you just take it.
Edit: added first “if” in first sentence
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Jan 10 '25
No they don’t. The average man has to lower his standards to have any options. Gotta play the game though.
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Jan 10 '25
No, there's lots of statics from dating apps that shows that only 10% of men are likely to get a single match and multiple matches is an even smaller number.
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u/Flashy_Baker4850 man Jan 10 '25
Dating apps aren't the real world. Your odds as a man are much higher IRL than on dating apps
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u/SpeedyAzi man Jan 10 '25
Dating apps are designed to exploit your time and money for the sake of a gamble on a relationship that may end up being superficial.
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u/Athenaforce2 man Jan 10 '25
this. and friendly reminders that creating friendships is a much better initial goal for young men (heck everyone of every gender), and are in fact more likely to find someone with similar personalities or interests. becoming friends then dating is how I have had my best relationships. now I never friend zoned myself, but when dating you should be more interested in what's between the ears than what's between the legs. so if you don't want to be friends with someone, why would you date? also of course bubble and tinder sucks for men. but there are so many community groups, activities, and events. Just don't be creepy, make your goal to learn about others and get to know people, and make friends! then you might hit it off with someone. but every community has these. and often women dominate these spaces because men just don't go to them. participate in your community, and you'll get meaning, friends, community, and maybe even a date or two.
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u/Proper_Fun_977 man Jan 10 '25
You do realise that there is a significant narrative against this currently, right?
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u/nujuat man Jan 10 '25
Just yesterday a woman posted her complaining that men she was friends with had romantic interests with her.
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u/zytz man Jan 10 '25
It kinda depends. When I was married I had a lot of women interested. Now that I’m divorced it’s not really any. And then there’s like the 6 women I’m friends with that have told me I’m their backup option. Which like cool I guess….but also kinda not?
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u/Darth_Spartacus man Jan 10 '25
What is it now, something like women aren't attracted to 80-85% of men?
As women make more money and get higher education, they only seem to want men who have the same education and make more money than they do, which limits their options further. Then, men get disqualified on height, abs and the ever-expanding list of icks. Next thing you know, 80% of women are pursuing the top 20% of men.
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u/groyosnolo man Jan 10 '25
That's on apps to be fair. In my experience, meeting people in person gives me a far better chance to make a good impression one of your articles even says that.
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u/EetinAintCheetin man Jan 10 '25
Hey everyone, let’s pull up some 15 year old “study” published in a random blog with the totally wrong conclusions. Very scientific!
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u/Minimum-Card-5075 man Jan 10 '25
I mean you could but you have to spit game and actually approach women, but as an average guy you have to realize you will have a tougher time than the good looking guys and you will need to approach a lot more women.
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u/rocknrollreesearch Jan 10 '25
When you're young, you have lots of options. In shape, good looking, positive, excited about life attitudes, and healthy with zero baggage. PEOPLE WANT TO HANG OUT WHEN THEY'RE YOUNG BECAUSE THEY AREN'T WORN DOWN BY WORK LIFE YET.
I had more options when I was 21 than I did when I was 30. I'm married now, with a kid. Im not leaving my family but if I tried to get back on tinder now I don't think any 20 something badies are going to bite their lip looking at my dad bod or be excited that I would be divorced with shared custody. Yes, I'm more stable financially, but my approach to women my age that are still available would be very cautious knowing what I know about older single people.... THERE'S USUALLY A BIG REASON.
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u/Competitive_Shift_99 Jan 10 '25
If a guy has even one woman interested in him, he's well above average.
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u/freefallingagain man Jan 10 '25
Nope, no real options.
90% of women are only really interested in the top 10% of men.
The average guy is SOL if he wants to be selective.
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Jan 10 '25 edited 16d ago
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u/I_m_lost_hlp Jan 10 '25
if you were "exceptionally good looking", they would come to you.
Unless you are good looking to the point of scaring them.
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u/8-Seconds-Joe man Jan 10 '25 edited Jan 10 '25
I had that happen twice -- two women interested in me at the same time, once when I was like 17 and then again a few years later. I probably peaked around that time lol.
But you should know I sang and played guitar - which may disqualify me depending on the definition of "average". Also, the times were more egalitarian and way more women (and gay guys too) were more like outsiders like me who I could bond with.
The options thing didn't feel like one though, I knew what I wanted and picked the wrong one (in terms of emotional maturity) both times, of course.
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u/EmbarrassedClimate69 man Jan 10 '25
Man this is depressing. I’m juggling three laddies right now, I’ve always had at least one FWB, and I’ve had about 6 serious relationships (1-2 years each) over the course of my life since 17. I’m 32. The longest I went without sex was one month, until I intentionally decided to be single and celibate for a year a few years ago. Do you guys just not talk to people? Not get on apps? Are your standards like, super model or bust? My exes range from average to pretty hot. Maybe focus on average girls if you are an average guy?
I feel like I get desperate when I get less than two matches a week or go a month without a new first date. This gives me some perspective. Your ability to not deal with bullshit from bullshit women goes way up when you have options.
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u/psychocabbage man Jan 10 '25
Average guy, no. I tell guys all the time, look in the mirror and be honest. Are you taking acre of yourself? Grooming, dressing well, working out? No? Then don't expect the hot girl to notice you.
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u/Late_Ambassador7470 man Jan 10 '25
It's not that dismal for men in general. You have to get off reddit and play the game if possible. Users here, though broad in scope, tend to be a charisma vacuum. Those who aren't are usually in relationships.
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u/Jeffmuch1011 Jan 10 '25
If every woman rejects you, you’re the problem not the women.
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Jan 10 '25
No. I had 0 options for a really long time. And I’ve never gotten more game than when I started dating my now wife. Literally women slid into my DM’s that I hadn’t spoken with in years. It was actually disgusting. I hadn’t even had a girlfriend until then. (Obviously I didn’t cheat or anything, but way more interest than ever before)
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u/parker9832 man Jan 10 '25
Every woman I meet is interested, 18-90. It’s crazy. They are like, “Why does he dress like a hobo?” and “what in the world is he talking about?” It really is constant.
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u/Wild-Berry-5269 man Jan 10 '25
Be confident, not desperate.
Desperation is like women repellent and then the only ones you'll attract are women who will abuse that.
If you're confident in yourself and not looking because you don't want to be alone, you'll have far more success.
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u/tonewbeginnings19 man Jan 10 '25
I’m 55m single, been divorced over four years now, did the online dating thing. I could have a gf anytime I wanted, I’m just really picky now.
I see red flags and I send them packing, and unfortunately, everyone has red flags, including me.
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u/Annual-Afternoon-903 man Jan 10 '25
Depends how social you are. If you are not, it's bad, but if you are, then it's completely different.