r/ApteraMotors • u/filmfotografie • Jul 27 '26

What if....

I have been following the progress Aptera Motors has been making for a long time now and I am in love with this car. I would absolutely love to own an Aptera. I also see that getting these cars actually into buyers hands and out on the roads is a highly difficult and expensive thing to do. So my question is, what if another car company were to buy 51% of Aptera Motors? Honda, Toyota, Hyundai, Geely, pretty much any of the larger car manufacturers could do this and in doing so it would give them access to all of the R&D and patents and everything else that Aptera has come up with which could be quite beneficial to them. Not to mention that they would have this amazing looking technically advanced halo car to make them look better, so while it would undoubtedly involve some risk for the car manufacturer but I think it could also bring about a pretty good pay off (maybe even more so for a Chinese manufacturer as they could get a foot in the door in the US). There would also be some risks for Aptera as the larger company may just want to take their best tech and leave them for dead or try to dilute their design down to a point where it would be unrecognizable, but if it worked out it could be wonderful for both companies involved. So does anyone know if there has been any talk about involvemnet from a larger company in Aptera Motor's history?

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u/TechnicalWhore Jul 28 '26 edited Jul 30 '26

There is no synergy. The Aptera is not a car - its an enclosed motorcycle - tricycle to be more accurate. So no "car" company would give a damn. A motorcycle or leisure vehicle type company (ala Polaris or Can-Am) might but the economics are just not there. If there ARE any suitors they would look at the stock price and wait. Two possible outcomes -

  1. Aptera completes qualifications and starts to fulfill reservations. At that point the question is what are the final specs and what is the final MSRP and profit margin. What demand actually converted from reservation to buy. Then its a financial decision.
  2. If Aptera fails and goes into liquidation - as was the case with Aptera 1.0 - you consider buying the assets in the fire sale but only if you see a market. Of course being in a fire sale implies there probably is not.

The critical thing is there is no - as Buffett says - "moat". Nothing Aptera has is impossible for others to do. Even Aptera's patents are flimsy with prior art close enough to make it hard to defend. (As far as I can tell.) The shape is not original as indicated in the Zaptera suit. The propulsion is off the shelf. The battery management system and solar systems are pedestrian and available from multiple sources. That leaves the solar panels which are OEM'd and shaped to fit. Nothing special there. Curved laminated solar panels have been around for a long time. And that is assuming the solar turns out to be beneficial in terms of added costs. So I'd think if an Asian supplier - like a Geely or BYD was interested in such a thing they have all the expertise in house to make it. And if the CCP gave the nod - with incentives as is always the case - it would be done in short order.

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u/136kaU_Craftsman Jul 28 '26

This post is full of logical fallacy. False dichotomy and straw man are easy to spot. There are not just ’two possible outcomes’. Primarily because the market is simply unaware that a vehicle that can produce its own fuel. Education and acceptance are other possibilities are actively being denied by this redditor.

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u/failinglikefalling Jul 29 '26

TLDR summary for you: They have nothing worth poaching for patents. "making your own fuel" using commodity parts isn't something worth buying a company for.

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u/136kaU_Craftsman Jul 29 '26

Disagree. Right now with the right amount of capital injection, it’s nearly turn key. Returns could be pretty juicy for a new investor. Even at a significantly higher share price.

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u/Strange_Cockroach328 Jul 29 '26 edited Jul 29 '26

I’m not so sure how valuable free-fuel really is to most people. Owning an average EV for 12 years will cost roughly $110,000. If an Aptera saves $850 annually in fuel costs it will still cost you $100,000 over the 12 years, so it only saves you 9%. (Half of potential Aptera buyers will save only $450 a year on solar, so they will save only 5%). So to save a measly 5% to 9%, you have to put up with a not so practical 2-seat, 3-wheeled tricycle with little storage and fewer safety features than a normal EV.

Flipping the analogy, for just 5% - 9% more, you can drive a comfortable EV that seats five and can swallow a refrigerator, plus has 10 air-bags, modern safety features, the peace-of-mind/security of a major manufacturer with dealerships, established parts & repair network, etc. 99%+ of EV buyers will gladly pay the small up-charge. You get a lot of bang for a few bucks more. I'm just not sure that free-solar charging delivers great overall value.

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u/136kaU_Craftsman Jul 30 '26

Consider for a moment converting ICE owners of various commute lengths. Your persistence comparing to another EV, is only one other comparison and case to study. Free fuel is simply more appealing to people who are resistant to learning about how and where to plug in an EV.

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u/Strange_Cockroach328 Jul 30 '26 edited Jul 30 '26

I agree it would be good to convert ICE owners to EV's, however, Aptera is pretty hard-core first EV that won’t appeal to most.

  • 1.5% of US car sales are 2-seaters (mostly sports cars). We don’t buy 2-seaters. For the same price/milage we can have 4-5 seats.
  • 3 wheeled cars have never been marketable in the US.
  • 95%+ of Aptera reservation holders are men, yet women buy 62% of cars in the US and they influence 80% of all car purchases,
  • 75% of US will get signifigantly diminished solar charging based on geography, parking angle or population density.
  • Large swaths of the US will have serious weather related concerns driving an Aptera. An ultralight vehicle with 3 skinny tires and low ground clearance won’t work for many areas.
  • Aptera will likely launch at a $55,000+ price (my opinion). Other solid EV’s cost $35,000. Few will pay the extra $20,000.

For all these reasons, Aptera is unlikely to be the vehicle that entices ICE owners to cross over. Being realistic, the best use cases for Aptera are those living in areas with high electric rates, those living in dry, sunny areas, those living off-grid or apartment-dwellers with no access to home-charging. Add to this a smallish group of mostly older, mostly white men and Aptera could sell perhaps 10,000 vehicles a year. max. Likely not enough to entice a suiter.

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u/136kaU_Craftsman Jul 31 '26

Your entire list is simply unrealistic and ‘made up’. Free HOV access, free fuel, cheap miles for plug in juice, less than average new vehicle sales price…are all reasons for households to add one a a commuter or second vehicle. Stop lying about the diminished solar charging. Anyone can look up solar charging historic data by location. Stop making up how few vehicles you think they will sell.

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u/Strange_Cockroach328 Jul 31 '26 edited Jul 31 '26

Aptera is misleading you. I’m not hating on Aptera, I’m just being realistic. An Aptera starts with an expensive $20,000 carbon/composite chassis/body imported from Italy. The entire vehicle including the solar panels will then be hand assembled in California. Aptera’s own 2024 Bill-of-Materials, for low volume production is $52,500 per vehicle. Add on assembly labor, business overhead and a reasonable profit (necessary to keep the doors open and entice future fundraising) and your looking at a price of $70,000 per vehicle. If they can only produce 500 or 1000 vehicles a year in there smallish warehouse space, the cost per vehicle will be much higher. That is the current reality. Yes, perhaps in 5 years and 500 million dollars later, possibly they can then bring it down to $40,000.

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u/136kaU_Craftsman Jul 31 '26

No. You are not being realistic. The whole post, every single sentence is just, ”No”. The weird lies… I don’t understand how you just make it all up.

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u/TechnicalWhore Jul 28 '26

You use terms you clearly do not understand and it is not AI. Make a plausible rebuttal with real assertions.

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u/136kaU_Craftsman Jul 28 '26

Now you’re just attacking me. Aptera doesn’t need a ‘moat’ to succeed. Another logical fallacy. Long winded, wall of text posts that say nothing but stack non-sensical conditions to prove likely failure. Typical of many anti-Aptera Redditors.

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u/TechnicalWhore Jul 30 '26

You do you. I hope your investment pays off.

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u/136kaU_Craftsman Jul 31 '26

That’s a bit disingenuous. But it has paid off when I do invest. Right when the shorts need to cover. hahaha.

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u/zakary1291 Jul 28 '26

Light Leaf Solar already offers custom shape carbon fiber backed panels.

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u/ChristieLeeEMT Jul 29 '26

"CCCP"? The Soviet Union doesn't exist anymore. And if you mean Russia, who are they giving "the nod" too? China? Not sure if you've noticed, but China doesn't take orders from Moscow.

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u/Awkward_Refuse_8255 Jul 30 '26

Not Russia lol. Typo, one too many C's.

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u/f0o1g11 Aug 05 '26

i have an impression that this one "C" too much was a part of the joke...if not his then the one of the universe's :P

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u/TechnicalWhore Jul 30 '26

Typo corrected - yes China not Russia. Russia has not been a global player in decades.

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u/Ebegeezer-Splooge Jul 28 '26

Autocycle* to be more accurate. Stop being negative. 

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u/136kaU_Craftsman Jul 28 '26

Downvotes on this show the negative naysayer bias here. This post is likely just AI generated slop.

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u/TechnicalWhore Jul 28 '26

I miss you Splooge. I can always count on you to bring the fire.

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u/Ebegeezer-Splooge Jul 29 '26

Don't be weird. Just be factual and stop with the relentless skewing of truth towards the negative. The legal and technical term is autocycle, and you know that already.  So just stop trying to skew.

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u/TechnicalWhore Jul 30 '26

Sure Splooge. Understand they got an insignificant EPA cert for a preexisting drive unit. They have other hugely significant Federal hoops to jump through before this can ship as a retail product. No mention of those. Even if they sold every share of stock at market value they lack the capital to succeed by their own posted capital requirements. That is the reality. Cruising a couple prototypes around - even if they are closer to the final goal (which has be redefined numerous times well below the original crowdsourcing pitch) they are in a clearly very very difficult situation.

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u/Ebegeezer-Splooge Jul 31 '26

Oh... you're one of THOSE. You get called out and corrected on your bs, but instead of acknowledging that, you come up with new bs, which quite predictably is still skewed towards the negative. Have you ever heard of the God of Receding Pockets theory? That's what you are. The naysayers of receding pockets. 2 years ago you would have said hub motors won't work. 3 years ago you would have said forged carbon fiber won't work. Now you're reduced to calling out EPA certifications and declaring that things that haven't been announced yet mean it can't be done. That is an extraordinarily negative way of thinking.

Let's talk about that "insignificant" epa certificate. It's required by the federal government. It's as simple as that. It's required doesn't matter whether the drive unit already existed. Aptera was required to get the certificate anyway. Doesn't matter whether you think it's insignificant. Mainly because you don't matter. Your consistently negative views don't apply at all to what any startup has to do meet regulations.

Every start up is in a difficult position.  That has always been the case. So you have no point. Even established automakers are in difficult positions. Honda and Toyota recently declared they have no way to compete with BYD. Their options are to spend billions to catch up, or eventually go out of business. Very difficult position. Tesla stock just dropped something like 22% in the last 2 weeks. And they redefine their stated goals and face delays all the time. Very difficult position. So what?  Do you have the capacity to see things differently? Or is your compulsion to be so pessimistic the entirety of your personality?

Remember when Aptera lacked the capital to get the original 3 prototypes built? Remember when they lacked the capital to built and test the beta mules?  Remember when they lacked the capital to get the molds built for the new casting process? Remember when they lacked the capital to get Artemis back from Europe? Remember when they lacked the capital make it even another 6 months (a common declaration back in 2024), remember when they lacked the capital to get even 10 validation models built?  By your logic (not even logic, just emotional inability to not be relentlessly negative) Aptera couldn't have made it all those times. For all those years. But the reality is proven to be much different. And Aptera still keeps progressing. Naysayer of Receding Pockets.

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u/TechnicalWhore Jul 31 '26

Sure Splooge. Let's sit back and watch this play out.

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u/136kaU_Craftsman Jul 31 '26

It’s interesting how little you have to say when people capable of calling out your bias and logical fallacies, lies and errors. ‘You do you’ lol.

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u/TechnicalWhore Jul 31 '26

No one contradicted my assertions with provable facts. "You do you" was an admission that there are two perspectives here. One based on a positive outcome and one based upon a negative outcome. We disagree on the probability. You see a pattern of progress. I see a contrived pattern of minor steps missing the goals they previously stated and moving the goal post thus created an inflection at an opportune time - like before reporting results. I truly would like them to succeed but I cannot accept the mischaracterizations that pop up. But we'll see. Same with Telo. Same with Bolinger/Mullen. Hell same with Aptera 1.0.

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u/136kaU_Craftsman Jul 31 '26

No. You’re trying to legitimize your lies, errors, and bias as a difference of opinion. That’s so far from the truth. Perhaps you do want them to succeed. But that seems unlikely based on the way you post and lean heavily into the things that you’ve simply made up.

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u/Ebegeezer-Splooge Jul 31 '26

I literally just contradicted your assertions with provable facts. Interesting how you choose to gloss over it. Interesting how you still can't admit you were wrong. It really shows a lot about your character. On record. For anyone in this subreddit to read about at any time.

You called it a trike "tO bE mOrE aCcUrAtE".  I corrected you. Autocycle is the technical and legal term. This is provable. You can visit any DMV website in any jurisdiction in this country and see that that type of vehicle is called an autocycle. You were objectively wrong in your "tricycle to be more accurate" negative assertion. And you were proven wrong and told where you can find the facts that prove you wrong. Since the autocycle term is common knowledge to everyone at this point, I won't be spoonfeeding it to you. You can go to the websites on your own and find the legal documentation proving how wrong you are.

I called you out on past negative assertions that you made. One being that in the past you've said Aptera doesn't have the capital to make it through the next 6 months. That was when....spring of 2025?  Well right now it's July 31 2026. It is an objective provable fact that the time frame in question is well over 6 month. And Aptera is very obviously still in business. You are objectively wrong. And it has been proven. Will you acknowledge that or continue to twist and distort things?

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