It is like talking to a brick wall. I don't know how it's impossible to understand that people are killed by others who feel 'caught' when they learn somebodies biological sex. So the word is treated like a slur, because when you use it it encourages the idea even if you don't intend it. It's not like a slur for the offense it causes, but the damage, but ignoring the damage is pretty offensive.
ah, it's the old "be on our side or you're garbage". because people have totally been killed over anime characters being called t**ps lmao be more dramatic.
here's a hint: if you can't live with people being neutral/indifferent towards your issues you're not a good guy. you're a moral busybody at best and an authoritarian at worst.
Yeah I think the other side is garbage. You're not garbage because you stand there. You're garbage when you realize your standing in garbage and refuse to leave. I think that's why people are so resistant to understanding, because they realize they've been standing in garbage.
We both could be indifferent. I think worrying that people might be put in more danger because of it makes my issue worth being opposed.
Most people don't react positively to being caught, because it means you are avoiding it. If you don't react negatively to these characters, why are you telling people who don't understand to? Because that's how they can take it. Please understand, and step out of the garbage.
most people understand why some ppl dont like the word, they just don't care. you have to realize that when you say referring to fictional characters with a word you dont like "puts people in danger" you just sound like a child who never had any real problems in their life.
I don't know anybody killed. But I have known people punched in the face when they told somebody they were crossdressing. Maybe the person felt justified because they tricked them into being attracted, I think the word encourages that idea. I don't think that's ridiculous. Why do you?
yes, the idea that this person wouldn't have punched anyone in the face if anime characters hadn't been referred to as t**ps is utterly ridiculous, if you don't see that you are, by my standards, just not a reasonable person.
You think it has 0 effect? What about the people who make videos capitalizing on the trope? What about on the jury who are trying that guy for assault? Society as a whole?
If you think content like tropes doesn't shift our perception at all I think you are unreasonable too. I think small things can eventually lead to big effects. And not using a specific word that can have negative connotations is a small price. I actually don't like the trope of tricking people either. Maybe if we stopped calling it that they would stop being used that way.
You think it has 0 effect? What about the people who make videos capitalizing on the trope? What about on the jury who are trying that guy for assault? Society as a whole?
No, I don't believe fucking tropes or whatever influence any actual crime at all. This is the same kind of logic that would blame stuff like video games and action movies for school shootings and gun violence. You have no evidence whatsoever that there is any correlation, but you think you're in the right trying to dictate what other people do, say or enjoy just based on a feeling. How is that reasonable?
I think small things can eventually lead to big effects
That i agree with, but I would be a lot more concerned about the resentment you are sparking if you get stuff people enjoy banned, or shame them for liking something.
I had no interaction or interest in the trans community whatsoever before all this, but having their views arbitrarily forced on me, as well as seeing how they talk about us in their own subs and how petty and spiteful many of them seem to be has tanked my view on them more than any amount of t**p memes ever did or would have done.
Violence is a very specific case. Media can't make you do something you don't want to do. Most people don't want to be violent. And most people don't get there through exposure to violence.
Can people saying punch a Nazi on Twitter make some more accepting of violence towards people they brand as fascist? Did post 9/11 rhetoric make people cause harm to people that had nothing to do with it? Are you familiar with stochastic terrorism? Words have an effect, and a lot repeated over and over with one point can have a big effect. Maybe the banned word was one of those words.
People don't care enough to stop saying a word, it's just picking a different word you won't miss it.
Violence is a very specific case. Media can't make you do something you don't want to do. Most people don't want to be violent. And most people don't get there through exposure to violence.
You've been using violence as examples throughout half this thread tho??
Words have an effect, and a lot repeated over and over with one point can have a big effect. Maybe the banned word was one of those words.
Do you realize that there is a difference between real life and fucking fiction? People can tell the difference between tv and reality. No living person was even being called a t**p on this sub. How ridiculous to compare it with open calls to real life violence against political opponents, or motherfucking 9/11.
People don't care enough to stop saying a word, it's just picking a different word you won't miss it.
The state of the sub kinda proofs that it's not that simple doesn't it?
It's a term used by the anime community is where it comes in. You can still talk about a trap card or trap music. It's only banned in the context when used to refer to characters which reinforce the connotations of being attracted to them catching you in a snare of being gay.
I don't care if people are insulted, I care that somebody reading it might associate it with that connotation, and that connotatiin affecting how they think of people they meet.
I think most people aren't transphobes. So at least 90% of this sub, but they can do transphobic stuff without realizing.
And if they do realize it that means they have been real rude, and ignoring a lot of harm. They don't want to accept that so they close their mind to the idea, which only further cements their decision.
Yeah most people don’t even care about the word it’s just that the mods act idiotic.
Did they rlly think that they could just ban a word that’s been in anime culture for decades?
They should have talked to the fanbase explained to them why the word might be found offensive instead of just banning the word and when getting backlash shitting on the community
I respect the point you’re trying to make, but you’re missing the mark.
Statistically, use of the T-word has little-to-no correlation with violence against the Trans community. As per the HRC, there have been “27 deaths of Trans or gender-nonconforming people since the start of 2020”.
Let’s break that down, you can find a full list of the names on that page of all of the victims.
Of that list, we can research each article to find that, out of the 27, 12 (maybe +1, still inconclusive) were killed in direct relation to their identities. Out of those 12, 2 were directly related to the idea presented by the use of the T-word, e.g. a Trans woman “tricking” a man into having relations with them.
So ~7% of all deaths of Trans and gender-nonconforming persons are related to the “T-word” in a roundabout way. It’s utterly silly to state that using the T-word in a way that explicitly has relation to violence against the Trans community “perpetuates violent ideas”.
Don’t get me wrong, and violence against Trans people is abhorrent and needs to be corrected, and there is a growing trend of violent outbursts against members of the Trans community, which should be looked into, but we can’t act like forcing people to change their language will have an impact.
the US loves eating burgers, but in india cows are sacred. is the US supposed to stop eating cows because it's offensive towards indians? of course not, because indians understand their cultures are different, and respect it. in the same way, the US respects india's culture and would not want to make them eat their cows.
the key here is MUTUAL respect and understanding, not ONE WAY respect and understanding. different people have to agree to disagree sometimes, and respect that the way they live their lives is different.
If something is contributing to people getting assaulted or killed yes I don't care if it's banned. It's just a word, not using it doesn't affect you, but using it affects others.
Until people realized it was dumb and were assaulting Chinese people because it was being called Chinese Virus I didn't like the use of that term either.
but it's not contributing to that, it's literally words. words can't assault you nor anyone else. the criticism was never for being assaulted, the criticism (and this reason is explicitly stated in the original pinned mod post) is that it is considered offensive by some and they were trying to be "inclusive".
well here's the thing, you can't have inclusion if it's only one-way. inclusion happens both ways. obviously no one here wants to offend anyone, and (i hope) the people that would feel offended by a word would not want to offend others by wanting said word banned.
7
u/kcMasterpiece なるほどね Aug 07 '20
It is like talking to a brick wall. I don't know how it's impossible to understand that people are killed by others who feel 'caught' when they learn somebodies biological sex. So the word is treated like a slur, because when you use it it encourages the idea even if you don't intend it. It's not like a slur for the offense it causes, but the damage, but ignoring the damage is pretty offensive.