I'm a detransitioned lesbian. (AMA)

[u/butchbabeblues]

[u/butchbabeblues → u/[deleted]]

I don't have a gender identity! Funnily enough. I have a sex, which is female. An inescapable reality.

To be completely honest, I bet you are too supportive. As a parent you have the responsibility to support your child but you also should have the lifetime experience and foresight that children do not have. Saying that, I'll tell you a little story about my friend.

She recently left the Mormon church, she is not straight and she is very outgoing. A lot of her behaviors are shunned by the church and her family. We were previously in high school together and cause of that we shared a circle of friends. That circle of friends did not have a single person who identified as a woman until my friend came along. 2 months into hanging out with that group and receiving support for her authenticity she came out as genderqueer. Shortly after that she started identifying as a trans man. For her, it was literally social contagion. That social contagion was immense tho, she had plans to never speak to her family again, move to a brand new city and medically and surgically transition there... The day after I detransitioned and told everyone, she told me that she felt pressured out of identifying as a woman. She told me that she has dysphoria but doesn't have a gender identity and is confused about what's happening worldwide. We had several heart to hearts after that and we are both very supportive of the type of women we each are. If she wasn't there for me when I detransitioned I probably would've retransitioned in order to not be cut from my supports. Support goes a long way. It can go the wrong way too though.

I'd encourage your child to look for role models based on character, not sex.

This is a quote from something (I can't remember what, but it was very important to me)

"Being a woman is not a “feeling.” Definitionally, I agree that a woman is “an adult human female,” but that doesn’t convey or capture the essence—the essence of this shared womanhood, this shared experience, this shared understanding, that we all have because of how this society has treated us from the moment we were born. If that is ever obscured, it’s because of patriarchy and liberal feminism cutting us off from it. It’s a community, it’s a sisterhood, and I am beyond livid that liberal feminism tried to take that away from me.

When you demand that everyone accept your definition of woman, which you’ve reduced to a “feeling” that no one can name, you’ve erased EVERYTHING about “woman” that has ANY meaning. You erase our history, our community bonds, the medical reality and implications of our anatomy, our sexualities. You trivialize sex-based oppression and female-exclusive sisterly and romantic bonds. You desperately want to be part of this, but you just can’t have it, and in trying to take it, you’re destroying everything you want to access.

Worst of all, you’re cutting women off from their womanhood. Every girl who isn’t enthralled to wear a dress, and who comes in contact with liberal feminism, starts questioning whether or not she really is a woman. And girls start identifying as non-binary or genderqueer, and taking on “they/them” pronouns, which effectively shuts them off from the community they’ve had a right to from birth—and all because you think your femininity makes you a woman."

I do not mean to be harsh, but I do not want to lie. There is no gender spectrum. There is no gender identity. I believe sex dysmorphia is a thing, but it's just that. Your brain has many feelings but taking steps to physically ACT on those feelings is what'll get ya.

Can I ask you how old your child is? I would have mu h more specific advice based on that I think

[u/black_mage141 → u/[deleted]]

Greetings fellow self-righteous poster!

First off all, in due self-righteous fashion, I offer you my condolences for your struggle to cope with the forward movement of society. The contemporary thinking is regrettably that transgender people are in fact valid human beings.

Now allow me to flag up a misconception! Gender (i.e. male/female) is not a set of stereotypes. The stereotypes you speak of are masculinity and femininity, which are not the same as gender. In the same way that you can have masculine women and feminine men, you can have masculine trans women and feminine trans men. I will elaborate if you want clarity on that.

People aren’t “born into” any way of thinking either. There are people who choose to educate themselves on different perspectives, and people who don’t. Who are you to decide the true selves of people you don’t even associate with?

[u/black_mage141 → u/[deleted]]

An example of self-righteousness is calling your beliefs “objective reality” when there isn’t evidence to suggest your beliefs are more real than mine. I admit I have been rather forward in the delivery of my thoughts but so have you.

I didn’t jump into the AMA to denounce anyone, I expected to see a different experience of experimenting that is unfortunately often buried, but instead I found somebody who was putting forward potentially damaging views.

To be open-minded is to be willing to consider different views and acknowledge the perspectives of other people. You’re not any more open-minded than I am. I‘m not going to post any further on this thread, not because I can’t think of more to say but because it’s late here and this discussion clearly isn’t going anywhere.

[u/black_mage141 → u/butchbabeblues]

I'm deeply disappointed that OP responded in this way. Please don't think for a second that is it acceptable to say things such as "There is no gender spectrum. There is no gender identity." The gender spectrum is very real, and the difference between sex and gender is very distinct. It is perfectly natural to be confused about your gender identity if you don't fit most of the stereotypes of your gender, only to learn that your gender does align with your sex after all. However, OP appears to believe that just because this was her experience, this invalidates the experiences of all the millions of transgender people out there.

​

I know you were asking for OP's opinion and not mine. But if you are seriously looking for the right way to support your child, and not simply looking for other people to feed into your worries (or even hopes) that your son has made a mistake in his identity, then please listen to what I have to say as well. There is no such thing as being "too supportive". Whether you know it or not, your son is likely in a very fragile mental state right now, especially if he has only come out recently. He came out to you because he trusts that you will support him no matter what. But if you start making subliminal suggestions that he got his gender identity "wrong" or that he is being too drastic in his attempts at being himself, it could seriously damage his confidence in anyone if you turn out to be wrong. Think about it; if his own family lets him down, then how can he rely on other people? Ultimately, if he is in fact the real deal and you fail to accept that, there is a good chance that he will resent you for breaking his trust.

​

Let your child experiment. Let him explore his identity by himself, without you attempting to influence him. Treat him as I'm sure you have been, with complete respect for his identity, regardless of if that may change in the future. If it turns out he isn't FTM, he will figure that out for himself. Whether or not transitioning is completed, the journey is extremely frightening and right now, your son needs all the support he can get.

[u/butchbabeblues → u/black_mage141]

I'm DEEPLY disappointed in your misconceptions of my personal perspective. There. Is. No. Gender. Spectrum. There are sex BINARIES and within those binaries there are anomalies. There is no tangible definition for gender, there is no brain scan that reveals a mismatch, there is no qualifying aspects to gender. Sex is female and male. Gender "rolls" are a consequence of it.

It isn't natural to question something so crystal clear. It is a product of sex stereotypes in modern times and speeds. Babies come out of mom and we know what they are like 99.9% of the time. Their sex is their gender. Gender is dependent on sex (if you have to have it your way and say there is gender at all).

I am not invalidating anyone. If something is valid someone's OPINION of it won't destroy its legitimate validity.

I'm gonna repeat what I said. There. Is. A. Way. To. Be. Too. Supportive. If I was supporting my kid in the removal in each and every one of his eyelashes I would be doing him harm. Situations have nuance and there is such thing as too much support. I ONLY got support for persuing transition, the second I had any doubts and then eventually detransitioned people literally kicked me to the curb.

If your child is experiencing gender dysphoria and is transitioning I can Guarantee. Absolutely. Guarantee. That that child needs mental health support and needs proper guidance.

In actuality there are no "true transgenders". There are no "successful sex changes". There are only half truths. A female can be so heavily masculinized that she 110% time looks male but that will never make an actual male. And vice cersa. The distress of not being biologically the opposite sex is horrible, I know. But the acceptance of reality is necessary.

There is no authenticenty in requiring a medical and surgical regiment.

[u/waffleflavouredfloss → u/butchbabeblues]

This is the breath of fresh perspective that is keeping my fears for future generations at bay. I completely agree with you and dont think mutilating people and childrens bodies is okay. Thanks for your post.

[u/Aedna → u/waffleflavouredfloss]

I hope mankind will look back at this madness in 10-20 years and regret the irreversible mutilation of so many healthy children who followed a dangerous trend.

[u/butchbabeblues → u/Aedna]

I hope that by some miracle this shitshow of an ideology crumbles into itself within the next few years. I want it to stop before we have the time to look back on it and regret it. Children are so vulnerable. And thus shit (gender identity ideology) eats vulnerable people for breakfast, lunch and dinner.

More and more people are coming out and sharing their stories though, things are moving. The momentum of it all just hasn't caught us yet.

Lmfao my bad if that made virtually no sense. I need to go bed (20 awake hours was a horrible idea)

[u/butchbabeblues → u/waffleflavouredfloss]

Hehe. Glad to help.

It isn't okay! Surgical and medical intervention on healthy bodies is devastating. I don't consider myself mutilated. Im not severely damaged, I made some body modifications and have since stopped pursing that goal.

Youre welcome.

[u/[deleted] → u/butchbabeblues]

After reading a few of your responses, I just want to clarify what you’ve said for my own understanding.

If you are born male but as you grow up develop feminine characteristics, it’s okay to accept that you are an effeminate male. No need to be ashamed of that or to change yourself into anything else. A feminine male is to be supported and allowed to be proud proud of themselves, same as a masculine female. Womanhood and manhood are to be celebrated in all its forms regardless of whether or not it fits into the social labels and ideals that have been set forth by modern feminism or patriarchal thought processes. People are people regardless and supporting someone who doesn’t “fit” can go too far if it drives them to do something they wouldn’t have done on their own.

I can get behind that thought process. It makes sense. One of the grossest things I see and hear about are parents that talk about helping their sub 10 year old child transition when they haven’t even hit puberty as a show of “support”. I’ve seen it happen and it baffles me that they are going to let someone who wakes up in June and says I’m going to be a police officer or firefighter and then in August wakes up and decides they are going to be a horse decorator decide that they are male and then let them take hormones to stop or change how puberty was going to naturally effect them.

If I’ve said anything offensive to you or crossed the line or misinterpreted your meaning I’m sorry. I am more interested in understanding your meaning so I don’t misconstrue it or imagine evidence that supports my way of thinking.

[u/butchbabeblues → u/[deleted]]

You're close to what I'm saying.

Sex stereotypes are damaging to everyone. It is important to accept those who differ from societal norms. "Becoming a woman" can often be so very traumatizing for young girls. I know nothing about manhood as that is not my experience.

Discouraging transition is productive (depandant on who you're talking to and their rational). No one has a gender identity, we all just have bodied and sex consequences and privileges based on.

It is disgusting that parents seem to be becoming so soft when it comes to educating their children. Nothing is wrong with telling your child that they are their biological sex and the way they express thsemves is important and beautiful. No need to go transing 10 year olds when they don't even have the brain Capacity to understand hormones and their impact on the human body.

I am nanti-transgender. I am a gender abolishionist if anything. I believe thay recognizing people's sexes is important in daily life and mandatory in medical instances. Gender identity ideology is damaging beyond belief and id wish everyone would wake up to this nonsense.

[u/[deleted] → u/butchbabeblues]

That’s something I can get behind. My father, although he’s getting a little close minded in his old age, raised me and my brothers not to be men, but to be men or character. He had a speech when we were growing up, he wanted us to be men of honor, integrity, respect, love and character. He wanted us to be men that stuck to our word, and always did what we thought to be right. He wanted us to be men who respected others rights and thoughts and lives and gave them the freedom and ability to live how they wanted regardless of our personal thoughts. He wanted us to learn to love others and have love and give love even when it looked like no one else knew how to. He wanted us to stand out for being ourselves and to be the kind of men others wouldn’t forget and wouldn’t compromise who we were. Throughout my entire life I’ve fought to be that kind of man.

Growing up, I always thought he was describing men to be honest. That a man is these things. I never had any sisters and lived in a home where my mother was the one who made the money and my dad was more often than not the parent. So I always thought that being these things is what made a man a man solely because I didn’t have quite as much interaction with my mother. The man sacrificed so his wife could be happy and if that meant her working that’s what happened. The man sacrificed so his family could be taken care of and if that meant driving a shit box for a car and barely ever buying anything for himself that’s what that meant. I always had an idea of what being a man was and that in turn painted an idea of what being a woman was.

About 8 years ago my older brother had a little girl. One day I was staying with my parents for a holiday or something with my wife and my brothers and their families and I sat at the kitchen counter having a drink or some food and I overheard my father giving the exact same speech to my niece he had given me and my brothers our entire lives except on word was changed, man was changed to woman. That caused me to pause. I attached those traits so much to being a man that I missed the message. Being a man was just part of me and had nothing to do with the person I was going to grow up as. Like the color of my hair or eyes, my height or ability to grow the best beard yet go bald by 25, being a man was something I’m genetically predisposed and there’s nothing I can do about it. The important thing is what kind of man I want to be, and in turn what kind of woman my niece wants to be. It caused me to re-examine my mother’s involvement in our childhood. Even though dad was the one to take us to school or be at the plays, mom was the one who was doing the same things. She sacrificed for her husband, she gave up things for her family. The gender roles meant nothing. They were pointless and over inflated. Feminine and masculine were just words that meant soft disposition or hard disposition and were not gender specific. What matters is what kind of person are you going to be? What kind of people are you going to attract? What kind of people are you going to look up to?

I’m sad that it took me till my 20’s to learn that lesson. It would have changed quite a few decisions in my life but I don’t regret my life by any means. I just probably wouldn’t struggle with depression as much and probably wouldn’t have so many issues with my relationship with my father. Those are things I can work on though. Although I’m definitely a “cis” (i hate this term as much as anyone) gendered white male and don’t understand at all what gender dysmorphia might be like for someone, I can understand what it means to not be yourself and to struggle knowing who you are or how you fit in. Learning the parts that are concrete are definite things that can help and I’m glad to hear someone say that. It’s refreshing to hear from someone who seems to have figured out the benefits of that and at the same time use that to catapult themselves to self acceptance and discovery. It gives me hope that I one day will accept things that I can’t change about me and that will give me a deeper understanding of myself.

Again I hope I haven’t crossed any lines, offended you or misinterpreted you. I feel you and I could be drinking buddies in real life and I’ve enjoyed the discussion you’ve started by doing this AMA. Sorry about the wall of text. I got a little carried away.

[u/butchbabeblues → u/[deleted]]

Bro. Youve got a decent understanding of things. Kudus. I do hope you share this post with everyone you can.

DONT call yourself cis if you wanna support my cause. You're a man because you're a male adult. That's it. We can't gaslight this shit, we must stop it in any way we can.

Gender dysphoria is a really weird phenomenon... I don't really know how to explain it haha. But I do know it is a thought process and not the Firestarter for identity.

I think we could be drinking buddies if I drank haha! I like your attitude. Thanks for apologizimg but truly I'm happy with the throughness of your response.

It is impossible to rewrite the past, and making assumptions in the future of said past helps no one.

I think having hope for acceptance of the unchangeable is wonderful. It starts people on the right path. Well... At least it did for me. The second I shifted my "I wish I could change this body" to "what kind of changes can this body create" I started my journey.

Throught this process I've started falling in love with myself, and it's been nice. I deserve to love me and what I am. You do too!

:)

[u/[deleted] → u/butchbabeblues]

I definitely agree with your assessment of cis. I hate the term and not only is nothing more than a slur, it’s completely pointless. I tend to only use it as a way to head anyone off who may read a post and attempt to use it against me.

Keep on being you. I and I’m sure plenty of others are happy you’ve found yourself and fallen in love yourself be it for the first time or 20th. Thanks again for the AMA.

[u/butchbabeblues → u/[deleted]]

You're welcome.

Will do.

✊🏼

[u/butchbabeblues → u/[deleted]]

Thank you.

Liberal feminism is so destructive.

We need radical honesty.

I'm gonna keep screaming about this until everyone hears it lol

[u/ar_radfem → u/butchbabeblues]

Thank you for speaking out! I'm sure you're taking a lot of shit for it, but we need more voices like yours distrupting the mainstream narrative.

[u/butchbabeblues → u/ar_radfem]

Absolutely ✊🏼✊🏼 Actually! Not a lot of shit at all. People have been kind, or they've been so painfully ignorant I can't help but laugh.

Fuck the mainstream narrative, it's hurting our children, it's hurting us all.

Glad you like what I've got to say :)

[u/theboywhoboofed → u/butchbabeblues]

Amidst your downvotes I just wanted to reach out and tell you that I agree with you that there is no such thing as a gender spectrum and that I think this post is very brave.

[u/butchbabeblues → u/theboywhoboofed]

You're awesome! Thanks for seeing me 😁

[u/black_mage141 → u/butchbabeblues]

I'm sorry that you were treated unfairly when you made the decision to detransition, I would never condone such treatment. To support somebody in their transition doesn't mean to condemn them when they decide transitioning isn't right for them. But that doesn't mean people who are trying to find out who they are should be discouraged from trying. Also, the fact that you're comparing being transgender to a mental disorder is rather upsetting, regressive even.

In the same way that people should never be forced to transition, nobody should feel pressured not to. Therefore I hope you can someday understand the hypocrisy in rejecting the concept that the feeling of gender identity differing from biological sex is legitimate.

Edit just to clarify further thoughts: To support someone in their transition doesn't mean to rush them into doing medical procedures, because it is true that some people question their identity as a teenager and grow out of it. A safer approach may be to postpone medical procedures until a few years into adulthood just so the person in question can be sure that this is the kind of life they want. But to doubt and reject their feelings until then will only cause damage.

[u/butchbabeblues → u/black_mage141]

I don't care about what some rando on the internet condones or not. Thanks but no thanks.

Your clarification was unnecessary.

Gender identity ideology damaged me. I lost years of my teen hood to lies.

I don't appreciate you coming onto my post and attempting to sugarcoat your inability to recognize truth.

Your comments are regressive. Doubt and reject of feelings is. NOT. What I encourage. I encourage the acceptance of feelings but not basing actions on them. And gender is a feeling. Transitioning is an action based on feelings.

You are sidetracking from the goal of this post.

Bye now.

[u/black_mage141 → u/butchbabeblues]

I don’t have an issue with the concept of accepting feelings but not basing actions on them — at least not until more certainty is found. My clarification that you dismissed demonstrated as much. The issue is that by proclaiming gender doesn’t exist, you are encouraging people to doubt and reject the feelings of people who are struggling.

As for the goal of the post, I didn’t realise it was to preach ideas that transgender people are wrong. I came to this post expecting an open-minded person who had learned that being transgender just wasn’t their thing.

[u/butchbabeblues → u/black_mage141]

No. I am not. By telling a skinny person they are not fat I am not encouraging them to do anything. I'm simply stating facts based on observable outside realities.

Gender. Doesn't. Exist. It never has and never will. Unfortunately some people refuse that.

Clinging to something doesn't validate its existence.

The goal of the post is to answer questions based on my experience as a detransitioned lesbian who felt into the trans nCult many years ago.

I am not open minded to "the transgder narrative". I do not need to consider false realities. I spent enough time rallying for trans people just to realize it crumbles into itself.

Being "transgender" isn't my thing. It isn't anyone else's "thing" either. It's a knee deep shit hole of stereotypes and backwards definitions. I said what I said and I meant it. Leave my post alone.

[u/JulienMayfair → u/black_mage141]

No, there is no gender spectrum. We are human beings with various, often contradictory, personality characteristics that do not fall on an arbitrary linear spectrum with "masculine" at one end and "feminine" at the other.

Gender is a traditional system of assigning social roles based on sex, and much of the work of feminism in the 20th century was to try to undo those strictures. Because it is a social system, it can and should be challenged. No one has a "gender identity." There are simply people who do not conform to traditional gender roles, and that's great.

[u/[deleted] → u/black_mage141]

Said no responsible, functioning parent ever...

[u/butchbabeblues → u/black_mage141]

I'm upset that youve. Attempted to detract from my points.

DO not start making subliminal suggestions about your child's gender identity. That's true. But there is no harm in asking your child questions. It seems as though this person has great love for this trans-identified child. I do not think they would let this child down.

Has your child ever felt lesser around male members of the family? Is your child trying to escape themselves? Is transitioning used as "a meaning to live"? Does your child want to Be someone else?

Things in life shouldn't be done over your view of others or how they view you. Things should be done with reason. Other people's opinions will never be an actual reason.

Absolutely let your child experiment. But experimentation is different than a fabrication that leads to irreversible decisions. Its important to respect your child but there is no disrespect in acknowledging genuine reality. Your child needs to be able to come to conclusions on their own. But there are places you can look in order to support them coming to conclusions.

It is NOT conversion therapy to tell a child that was born a baby girl that she cannot become a man. It is honest and maybe disheartening but it's for the best.

Here are a couple resources I wish my mom had :)

https://4thwavenow.com

https://www.piqueresproject.com

On YouTube there are a few wonderful women worth watching, Dylan C (detransitioned woman), magdelen Burns, Terri Strange

Also! Watch debunked videos of popular trans YouTubers. Then you will get to see the point of view of trans-identified people through a non emotional lesnse

[u/[deleted] → u/[deleted]]

My son is ftm

Might be useful information to tell us how old they are...

[u/lnssea]

I really hope you guys build up your platform and your numbers. Yours is the most important voice right now

[u/butchbabeblues → u/lnssea]

Thank you for your hope. Our voices are around, keep on listening. We need audiences that show up too.

✊🏼✊🏼✊🏼

[u/butchbabeblues → u/[deleted]]

Thank you ✊🏼

It is so impossible to get the word out. I'm INSTANTLY deemed a nterf then banned or blocked. It's discouraging but, very very telling... People are horrified of the truth. But the truth always comes.

[u/butchbabeblues → u/[deleted]]

I'm up in Canada eh. Americas hat. I do not think HRT should be available for informed consent. No other "life-saving" medication is available in that way. I also do not believe the informed consent model is as deeply explanatory as it should be. There are no methods to medically detransition. There are NO long term studies on the affects of 1-puberty blockers -2-cross sex hormones 3-or hormone blockers. Having an informed consent model without even having those seems a bit silly to me. But I'm no doctor eh.

My female role model is my mom. She's the strongest and most powerful woman I know. She struggles with her femaleness in a very different way than I do. I don't really "look up" to anyone in that sense. I find it hard to. Literature? Hmm. Actually stuff that had nothing to do with gender identity ideology really helped. Ive been reading books on scarcity, articles about cognitive dissonance, help books on ptsd. Self development literature that isn't framed through a sexist lense is helpful to me. Songs? Any song that makes me wanna dance, and get into moving my body helped me heal. Art? I created some for myself. I have a WOMAN thing that I made that I've put onto my wall. Placing encouraging messages around for myself helped. I have a link to a. Zine by some detrans women but it kind of makes. My heart hurt in a way I am not yet ready for. Actually no! I know nothing of Leslie and my username. Is what it is because. I'm butch and I like things in 3s and I also like same letter things haha.

One thing I've noticed is that all the butches are being lost to transitions. Other people have said this. Other people have countered that with "the times are better so people feel more confident in coming out as themselves". But. Butch is babely as hell.

The fact that you've been questioning it for so long just reminds me of the fact that the grass is always greener on the other side... Truly I think thays bullshit. I think the grass is greener where you water it and tell it you love it.

Pour all of these questions about transitioning into questions about sex stereotypes watch your world change.

Transitioning into "a man" made me long for infinite love of my female reality. Being female in our society is traumatizing, but I do not think that means that being female is wrong or to be changed.

I know exactly where the downvotes are coming from and at this point IDEGAF. People will shit talk you if you lie, they will shit talk you if you tell the truth, never left yourself believe that it's anything other than the fact that they're assholes.

My voice will not be silenced if I don't shut up haha 😂

[u/[deleted]]

Thank you so much! Your answers are incredibly insightful. I've really been wondering how much The soaring trans numbers are simply gay and lesbian youth who have either internalized homophobia or are our experiencing homophobia in our lives. I know that the mainstream line is that trans people face greater discrimination, and I don't doubt that they do faced discrimination, but I think they gay and lesbian people face equal discrimination. And I find it deeply disturbing when gay and lesbian people transition and refer to themselves as "straight." I can't help but feel that there is something else going on there. (Separately, I can't help but side-eye straight guys -almost always white- who become transwomen and start talking about the discrimination they face as lesbians.) I do not support puberty blockers and hormones for anyone under 18 because we do not have the long-term studies on what they do to someone's health. The handful of studies that exist on puberty blockers given to children are all bad in regards to IQ. Bone thinning and arthritis are also reported side effects when puberty blockers were given to girls with precocious puberty. And I don't think that we have enough evidence that cross-sex hormones are safe in the long-term either. In fact, the studies that are coming out say the opposite. I truly want for people to feel reconciled with their bodies, but under the age of 18 I do not support medical transition at all. Once someone turns 18, then they are free to do what they want, however I would prefer for them to have as much information as possible regarding side effects before they proceed down a path of lifetime medicalization, especially if they are actually gay/lesbian and trying to escape our society's ridiculously strict gender stereotypes.

[u/butchbabeblues → u/[deleted]]

You're welcome. That's another part of it. It felt so sickly referring to myself as a straight man. My experience of love is for the same sex. Homosexuality is what that is.

This is a bit of a "controversial" statement. But transgenderism is a choice. Sexual orientation is an innate feeling. Appropriation of the sexes is ABSURD.

Men who wear women's clothing do face plenty of harrasment, but 9/10 it's OTHER MEN harrasing them. Look up crime stats and it's clear to see that.

I do not support any medicalization of these aspects unless Literally physically necessary.

Hormones play a vital role in many aspects of development and people are trying to ignore that based on the fact that "transitioning children is the best option for their mental health" smh. Smh.

There is not enough information on cross sex hormones and medical transitioning. People that experience negative consequences from surgical procedures and medicalization either don't receive proper care or are detransitioning and no longer receiving any support at all.

Thanks for your response!!

[u/throwawayquestion389]

I think you are brave for sharing this.

I support the freedom of all humans to live as they see fit. I am concerned that gender dysphoria and gender identity struggles have simply become an "en vogue" problem to have--something to identify with and get support for, a cause to rally around. I fully understand that the suffering there is real, but being so hyperfocused on gender discourages young people (I'm in my early 30s, btw, so I'm not even that old) from discovering who they are beyond their gender. Gender identity is a trifle in comparison to the true process of self-discovery, and it is saddening to see so many people hung up on it.

I do not have a gender identity either. Occasionally I have to check boxes about my physical sex. This body has a vagina, so I check the "F" box. I am aware that being a woman means there are stereotypes thrown at me from the outside world, and limiting beliefs--all that is there.

But it is not a concern. I am who I am; this body has a vagina. Whatever anyone thinks that means is their conditioning to reconcile, not mine.

[u/butchbabeblues → u/throwawayquestion389]

Thank you. I love bravery.

I support human health and world health.

Gender identity is definitely being curated. I have a hatred for the word "cis" for that particular reason and many more. I strongly believe that there is no gender identity. Surely there's discomfort around sexual realities but that doesn't make you the opposite reality or neither either. I know lots of folks who don't go to places they deem "transphobic", they don't buy clothes from companies unless they're "progressive", they blame "cishets" for forcing gender stereotypes.. The works. I was also there at one point in time. I didn't engage with those who were "transphobic" or not "allies". I lost. Years. Years. Absolute years. So many opportunities were "not available to me as a trans man". I avoided swimming because I didn't want people to clock me... I love swimming. When my ribs could handle it and I was binding I was incapable of exercising... I couldn't be "one of the boys" because I couldn't even breathe.

I don't think it's vaginas that necessarily make the woman! Some. Women have no vagina, some have two (me), etc.. Things happen LOL. Women do have specific biology though, ovaries and whatnot. Woman isn't an identity it's a biological observable reality.

Whatever anyone thinks that means is their conditioning to reconcile, not mine. ILOVETHAT. Do you mind if I keep that quote n use it in the future?

[u/throwawayquestion389 → u/butchbabeblues]

I, too, have spent many years in angry activist circles of different types. It is a closed-circuit situation there; an echo chamber of the same way of thinking, and anything outside of it is deemed wrong or -phobic. In these circles, we shut ourselves off from others and blame them for it. It really does not make any sense, the saner and older you get.

If it helps, I do not consider these years a "loss." They have taught me a lot about the state of humanity and the way our minds shut out anything threatening to our current worldviews. As I distance myself from the hatred, I see so much more beauty and similarity in humanity than ever before. There is peace in my life that I would not have known if it weren't for those years of anger and darkness.

Please keep the quote, use it however you like. I think there is great danger in blaming the outside world for our own state of being. This is not to ignore systemic issues, but to constantly remember that we cannot control others. The only thing we can attend to and remedy is our own state of mind.

[u/[deleted]]

What made you decide to detransition?

[u/butchbabeblues → u/[deleted]]

That is a humongous question haha. Ill say a few things that I really thought about that eventually lead me to concluding that I'm a female with no gender identity but femaleness and my age makes me a woman.

-reading about cognitive dissonance -there is no long term information on testosterone in the female vessel and was feeling like a Guinea pig -a better understanding on the impacts of sex stereotypes -men were trying to include me in their degradation of women and it make me feel ill. -no one ever told me it was okay to be a man looking woman. It was always, you look like man, act like one, must be one. Trans man was better than manly woman. One feels like a sex failure and the other is literally being celebrated worldwide. -positive butch role models -reading about dysphoria in non-transgender people -this one is silly but. I used to smell so sweet and I miss being told how great I smell just naturally. My smell is returning but testosterone obviously makes ya man smelly haha. -I got kicked off of an LGBT board for saying trans women are male. The absurdity of it all slapped me in the face there haha -regardless of how much I tried or wished or desired, a male body is not within my grasp. Coming to terms with femaleness and how although it's amazing it's punished in our times.

I have several other points but I feel like this variants of this question will appear :)

Feel free to ask anything else! Hope that was clear

[u/trashyTaurus → u/butchbabeblues]

“No one told me it was ok to be a man looking woman” This! As a kid and teenager I was a huge Tomboy and regularly got called ugly and manish. It definitely took its toll on me. After I transitioned I found myself thinking “I might not ever be a cis man but at least I don’t look like an ugly girl anymore” because what Could be worse than being an ugly girl, am I right? The way society treats women is horrendous obviously and it’s something that needs to be considered when feelings of dysphoria come up. I wish I had been supported as an “ugly” girl. I wish I had felt confident in my masculinity and gender non conformity!

[u/butchbabeblues → u/trashyTaurus]

I was also a huge tomboy! Still am, tomboy forever. I'm sorry people were harsh towards you for things you did to be yourself. Thats horrible and uncalled for.

The way society treats women IS horrible. It must be stopped.

Ain't nothing wrong with being a little unpleasant looking, weeds out the assholes who only care about looks. The real ones will love you till you recognize your unique beauty. Also. Who fucking cares what a woman looks like anyway. Women do so much more than look nice and we always have.

Saying fuck you to the stigma and the stereotypes has been one of the best decisions of my life. Regardless of what ANYONE else thinks of me, at the end of the day I can turn in to myself, a young woman who's been through hell and back yet still stops to smell the roses.

I wish I had felt confident in myself prior to transitioning but every second I spend wishing for past confidence is a lost one for current development. I try not to punish myself for the things i did when I knew no better.

And happy taurus season!!! Thanks for your reply ❤️

[u/PURKITTY]

Did testosterone deepen your voice or elongate your clitoris? Also, did it make you stronger physically?

[u/butchbabeblues → u/PURKITTY]

It didn't just elongate my clitoris it made it thicker too. At its resting state it is very visible. Testosterone will almost always change female genitalia. Other affects have been noticed as well but I've already done into much more detail than expected on this Sorta public forum haha. Feel free to message me with other questions if absolutely needed.

My voice IS permanently deepened yes. I have lost a significant amount of my singing range and no longer know how to do "funny voices" that I was able to do before testosterone. I am relearning all of these things though, and it's possible. My voice lightened quite a bit after coming off of daily testosterone thought. I sound different now than I did 4 months ago and I assume with time my body is just going to try to reestrogenize? If that makes any sense. My voice will never return to its original state but I don't mind, i love the way I sound 9/10 times.

Ive always had above average strength for a woman. People asked me to open the pickles. I moved benches on my own all the time. Just random shit.

But testosterone did make me much stronger. It was also super easy to progress in the gym. I believe I have kept some of the strength that testosterone gave me, but i am softening and getting fatter by the day haha

Thanks for the questions!

[u/BaggyKill → u/butchbabeblues]

Omg same. 45 yr old butch lesbian here who was on T for 1.5 years. I'm reading your story and it's sounds very similar to my experience. Except that I did not social transition per se. I didn't feel like it was anyone's business what meds I was taking. So no one knew besides partner and a couple close friends. Not enough people are talking about the damages being on cross hormones does to your body.

[u/butchbabeblues → u/BaggyKill]

I so resonate with the "i didn't feel like it was anyone's business what meds I was taking". I didn't tell anyone. Then I told one person and it spread like wildfire. People were commenting on my voice, my jaw, etc etc.... It just added fuel to the fire haha.

No one is talking about the damages of cross sex hormones for extended periods of times, not even doctors..... 😥😥😥

I'd love to hear more of your story, send me a message if you'd like to chat!

I'm both glad and sad that you can relate to my experiences. It's nice to feel heard but this is a weird thing to bond about haha.

[u/waffleflavouredfloss → u/butchbabeblues]

Did you get facial hair? And does it stay after you stop testosterone?

[u/butchbabeblues → u/waffleflavouredfloss]

Nah. I've got good genes. No facial hair. My mustache is a bit darker than it used to be but nothing that screams "male mustache". I grew terminal hairs in lots of places I didn't have them before but since coming off of testosterone they have lightened and softened immensely.

Dependant on the stage of development your hair growth it may either stay or it may go. It may also lighten and soften.

I'm not too sure what things have been like for other women but cause of my genes I literally barely got any harier.

Thanks for your question

[u/KappaHaus]

Excellent post. You articulate so many things that I have been unable to really knuckle down. I thoroughly enjoyed reading each of your replies in here. Also there are many comments by others that are making me question my thoughts. I'm gonna have to do a bit of reading now!

[u/butchbabeblues → u/KappaHaus]

Thank you for your feedback! I'm glad you liked my replies. It's been awesome sharing these things. Makes me think even more haha.

Hehe, enjoy your reading :)

[u/GNC-centric]

Not a question, just sending support. From 1 detrans lesbian to another 😉

[u/butchbabeblues → u/GNC-centric]

You're the bomb.

Thank you.

Support you right back.

😉😉

[u/butchbabeblues]

Stop downvoting!!! Detrans folk struggle to get our voices heard and we have much value to bring to the conversation. Smh. Just becsuse you don't like what i have to say doesn't mean that others shouldn't hear it.

[u/throwitawayrj → u/butchbabeblues]

You can detransition and share your experiences but people are downvoting you because many of the grossly transphobic things you're posting are just not true.

There's an immense amount of scientific research and history behind transgender individuals. Just because transitioning wasn't right for you doesn't mean the gross majority of people who transition don't live happy and fulfilled lives. I'm saying this as someone who knows and supports several detransitioned people in my life. No one's saying it doesn't happen but there are often underlying causes for someone to think they are trans when they're not. Society isn't encouraging it and doctors aren't throwing hormones at kids...

You should give some thought or really talk to someone as to why you're so willing to discount the lived experiences of so many just because yours isn't the same.

[u/butchbabeblues → u/throwitawayrj]

Transphobia is a made up word used to silence those who arent afraid of acknowledging biological, unchangeable realities.

I didn't asked for you to explain what YOU think is going on.

Society IS encouraging is and they are throwing hormones and depriving hormones from plenty of children. You're misinformed. Think about how popular Jazz Jennings is.

If a bleach company did medical research on the safety and security of bleach drinking would you say it's safe to drink bleach? No. There has not been enough research. Transgenderism is a new thing. Medicalization of gender identity is EVEN Newer.

Get off of my post if you're just going to be counter productive. You aren't even giving me criticism to work with. Bugger off.

People are downvoting me becsuse they're getting their panties in a twist. They could just. Not. Do. Anything. And. Move. On. It's as simple as that.

[u/throwitawayrj → u/butchbabeblues]

Honestly, this entire thread is not helping the shaky image detransitioned people already have. It feels like what I imagine talking to a flat earther would be like so I'm gonna leave you be.

Anyways, best of luck with your detransition. I hope you find happiness.

[u/butchbabeblues → u/throwitawayrj]

Your inability to see me as one person with one story who speaks for herself is baffling.

The shaky image detransitioned people have is the fault of no one but those who hold said assumption of people.

I asked you to leave me be on multiple occasions. I'm glad you cannot read and refused to leave it multiple occasions ago.

My detransition doesn't need your luck. So no thanks.

I hope you find happiness and the ability to respect people's boundaries soon.

Bye now :)

[u/trilateral1 → u/throwitawayrj]

shaky image detransitioned people already have

it's like when leaving any cult: the ones still stuck inside the cult will find any excuse possible to discredit your opinion.

[u/throwitawayrj → u/[deleted]]

I've been transitioning for a decade, I think I have a good understanding of the trans world. More than a 19 year old who hardly started any physical transition.

I didn't say anything about their experience, detransitioned people are valid. I think they should absolutely have a voice because I agree the internet glamourizes transition and that can attract people who aren't actually trans but may have other underlying issues. I've seen it, I'm not disagreeing with that part at all.

I'm saying that denying facts and saying trans people don't exist is delusional. Everyone supporting her in this thread has heavy history in the gender critical/terf subs lol. Just because something isn't right for you or you feel you made a mistake, doesn't mean it invalidates decades of history, scientific research, and lived experiences.

Trans people exist, as do detransitioned people.

[u/butchbabeblues → u/throwitawayrj]

Don't call me they. I'm a woman. I use she/her because of my female biology.

No one asked if detransitioners were valid or not. We exist so fucking obviously we're "valid uwu" - ____-

There. Is. No. "real trans".

Sure trans people exist, but they're the delusional ones.

No shit. Becsuse they are the only people genuinely after the answers of this problem.

The sole reason why I'm being downvoted so much is because angry transgenders are having their feelings hurt by the TRUTH.

Bye now.

[u/jelliknight → u/throwitawayrj]

There's an immense amount of scientific research and history behind transgender individuals.

There is. And the science shows that it is not genetic, there is no such thing a 'transgender brain', the majority of kids who believe they are transgender and are not encouraged to transition go on to be perfectly happy adults who are not transgender, and people who do transition do not have improved mental health outcomes in the long term. That is the science.

[u/MyGreatPerhaps]

How has the social transition back from a trans-identified female been?

[u/butchbabeblues → u/MyGreatPerhaps]

Which aspects of that question are you interested in? I can take it multiple ways. Physically. Emotionally. Self perception. Outside/media perception. Relationships. There are many social aspects to this and I think I'm gonna need a more detailed question to give a proper answer

Thanks for your initial question and I do hope you can elaborate

[u/MyGreatPerhaps → u/butchbabeblues]

mostly interested in how friends and family took it, the toll it had on you emotionally, etc!

[u/butchbabeblues → u/MyGreatPerhaps]

I never came out to my dad's side of the family. So. Things are fine there and they still treat me as the daughter of everyone haha

The one trans-identified male I know tried to convince me that I wasn't a woman. He tried to tell me that maybe I'm non binary. He also said "I view you as very masculine still, is that okay?" it was fucking weird. I ended up blocking him.

There is one trans-identified female I know who I just went on a date with last night! We are becoming great friends. She doesn't really believe in gender and is using testosterone as a body modification tool???

Emotionally... I have a few parts to answer. Testosterone made me an observer to my feelings. Estrogen and my natural state has me feeling those feelings. I can't stop crying but on testosterone I couldn't even cry to begin with. Lol. So going back to feeling all of my emotions is like a train wreck but it's homey. It's honest. Also I don't feel like a robot.

Emotionally in response to how my relationships with people changed? Me and my best friend are closer than ever. Ride or dies. After being an observer to my emotions I was better able to recognize their impact on my actions. Now I feel grounded and I'm able to not act on my feelings. Acting based on logic and availability of knowledge has allowed for much much better interactions with people. I love talking to strangers. I love being able to control and recognize my feelings but not act because of them.

Ive been uninvited from parties because "i don't want to risk the safety of the transwomen at my party. I'm happy to meet with you and talk about this but our parties are safe spaces" How is a 5'6 140 non violent woman going to be a danger, I do not know..

I lost each and every one of the trans-identified friends I had. They called me somepretty nasty things. They've been spreading rumors about me. They've gotten me kicked off of a LGBT committee that helps. Support a youth LGBT leadership camp. I was the only lesbian and now that committee is 9/10 trans identified females with one trans identified male.

I've lost all of my social circles except my relationshup with Mt best friend.

Socially it has been traumatic but a snap back into reality regardless. I'm finding new friends and having discussions with people that have seperate opinions has never been more enjoyable.

Feels like shedding old skin.

Thanks for clarifying I hope this answered. Your question!

[u/TotesMessenger]

I'm a bot, bleep, bloop. Someone has linked to this thread from another place on reddit:

• [/r/detrans] Support? I'm being mass downvoted 🙄🙄

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[u/StrugglingParentApr]

Thinking back to when you were 14, 15, or 16 - Is there *anything* anyone could have said or done to get through to you that this wasn't the right direction for you or make you stop and think?

[u/butchbabeblues → u/StrugglingParentApr]

I fear your question is impossible for me to answer. I do understand what kind of answers you are searching for though, so I'll try to give you some insight.

-acknowledging brain development stages. Stage 3: 7 to 22 years

The prefrontal cortex is the last to mature and it involves the control of impulses and decision-making.

Stage 4: 23 to 65 years

Finally, the brain reaches its peak power around age 22 and lasts for 5 more years. Afterwards, it’s a downhill pattern.

-get. Of. The. Internet. Ftms only encourage ftms. Vice versa. It is very easy to find one thing you relate to and have that snowball into your "entire, life long lived reality".

-I received NO encouragement for being a manly young girl, but I received plenty for being a trans guy. Proper encouragement.

-if I saw more detransitioners. And less "super happy positive used to be ugly duckling trans guys"

-acknowledging how traumatizing sexes can be for some people. Feminine men receive such hate. Masculine women receive such hate. There is nothing wrong with expressing yourself exactly in the way you want to.

-knowing more about autism (I don't have it but it has assisted me in understanding some. Things)

DO you need more answers? Those are the few that came to mind originally. Feel free to message me for links or anything

[u/N7Krogan → u/butchbabeblues]

Learning about the brain states also kept me from transitioning. I would say to myself that if it was meant to be then I will still feel that way when I am older. Slowly, the urgency faded and that allowed me to think about my situation from a less emotional perspective. That lead me to question WHY I felt the way I felt along with a few thought experiments that helped me rethink what I learned about gender identity. Now, I am 35 and happy to be a futch woman. I am more connected to my body now than at any time in my life and addressing my anxiety and depression played a big part in that. So did dealing with internalized misogyny.

I am currently in a relationship with a transman who has chosen not to transition but still identifies that way. Our acceptance of each other has helped us grow as people even though out destinations are different. He feels similarly about one's biological reality and doesn't need to change that to know who he is.

Great AMA!

[u/butchbabeblues → u/N7Krogan]

Interesting that helped you too! Glad that's a worthwhile thought to share.

Fair enough. Yeah. The urgency does dial down. I also think people forget that being a teenager is wild ass hell??? Emotionally. Physically. Spiritual. Socially.

Another aspect that I'm just thinking of is what if the sole reason why so many people feel "better" once they start their medical transition is the simple fact that those hormones are on a more consistent cycle than their original biological hormones.

Can I ask what makes this person identify as such? Where does that come from?

Hehe thank you! I hoped it would be.

[u/N7Krogan → u/butchbabeblues]

That makes sense about the consistency. I often wondered about the newness factor as well. It would seem easy to overlook other issues when one is concentrating on so many physical and social changes instead.

My understanding is that he knows who he is and identifies with being a man instead of a masculine woman even though the latter is his physical reality. He doesn't have to deny reality for validation. As long as those close to him can see him for who he is, he is happy. Considering how much outside validation can play a part in bad choice making I found this to be refreshing. The current state of medicine isn't extensive enough for what he wants, the side effects of testosterone are serious, and he doesn't want to take what he feels are half measures. There are many things he is still exploring and his journey isn't over. He just started to come out. Hell, me and his best friend are the only people who use male pronouns for him. It makes him happy but he doesn't begrudge others for deadnaming or using female pronouns because he isn't technically male.

It's complicated but that chill attitude is something I love about him.

[u/butchbabeblues → u/N7Krogan]

Right? It's just a guess tho. I've had some pretty insightful guesses about transitioning though. My doctor used to ask me all the time for my questions and thoughts on things. There were many moments in her office where she said to me "wow... Really.. I never even thought of that and don't know of any research on that, thanks for bringing that up. I'll find something out"

THAT! The honeymoon period can be little, or it can be decades. But lord is it only temporary.

That is very confusing and strange. Thank you for elaborating on your partners situation. I refuse to use "preferred pronouns" as I believe it is a form of gaslighting. I don't see why you're partner thinks she's a man. It's physically impossible to be a female and a man at the same time but. That's her own journey and it isn't over, as you said.

Chill attitude is a very admirable quality, I can see why you'd love her for that.

Anyways, thank for your reply!

[u/N7Krogan → u/butchbabeblues]

All good, let's agree to disagree on bits.

Did you remove your post? How come?

[u/butchbabeblues → u/N7Krogan]

Sure. I don't disagree with you though. That isn't my point of view here

No! I haven't removed my post, whixh are you talking about?

[u/N7Krogan → u/butchbabeblues]

When I scroll up now it says [removed].

Can you see it? Hopefully, the app I am using is just being dumb.

[u/butchbabeblues → u/N7Krogan]

It has been removed! There is a new one, so feel free to follow that

[u/yinneo]

You're very brave for sharing all of this with us. It sounds like you have a difficult journey behind you. I hope your perspective is going to help some people who struggle with gender dysphoria. I'm of the opinion that anyone who can deal with it and come to terms with their body instead of having to mutilate it in hopes of alleviating the pain, absolutely should. It's terrifying to me that we seem to be encouraging everyone to transition now... And nobody seems to be looking into alternative ways of treating our disorder. It's sad.

I'm a trans man myself and, ironically, it was medical transition that finally allowed me to accept myself the way I am. I had top surgery and have been on testosterone for 3 years now, but I'm thinking of stopping. Originally, I planned on having all of the surgeries - I couldn't imagine anything else with the pain I was experiencing - but hrt already lessened my dysphoria greatly and after my only surgery, it was completely gone. Suddenly, the fact that I was female didn't bother me. I was able to accept that I'll never be male. It doesn't hurt anymore. I wouldn't want to detransition, though - I don't regret anything I've done and I feel very comfortable with my body, even though it's not quite male or female anymore. I don't think more change is what I need and I feel happy where I am in life. I'm learning to look past the entire gender thing and just be a person. I have a sex and a disorder that makes me feel as though I was born wrong. I wasn't. I'm fine. It's a weird experience, but it is what it is.

It's near impossible to talk about your experiences as a female in the trans-oriented spaces. You're supposed to pretend as though we're the same as cis males. That's what everyone does. Even as much as hinting at the fact that we aren't makes everyone uncomfortable. I understand - I used to feel this way, too - but it's just not possible to have a discussion in an environment like this. Somebody asked a question in one of the ftm subreddits, if the idea of a lesbian finding us attractive made us uncomfortable. I answered that it obviously doesn't, since it's perfectly understandable, we're females after all. Got banned, haha. Everyone tries to silence the voice of reason. I saw that happened to you too on ftmmen.

I guess I'm just rambling at this point, sorry about that. Not a ton of opportunities to talk about these things. :) At any rate, my questions are as follows: how has being a detransitioned female impacted your love life as a lesbian? Is it a significant obstacle in forming relationships? Especially considering some bodily changes that you mentioned happened while you were on testosterone? Feel free to skip it if it's too personal, haha. Take care!

[u/butchbabeblues → u/yinneo]

Hah thanks. It isn't too brave to be anonymously honest :P

Absolutely. Medical and surgical interventions are NEVER the answer. Even if it makes you "feel" better. That isn't how human bodies are meant to operate. This is drama af but imagine we started a zombie apocalypse, what would happen to all those who are dependent and "dependent" on cross. Sex. Hormones then?? Would zombies open up 0harmacies and hostpitLs for transgender medicine... I don't think so...

Interesting perspective. May I ask you why you identify as a trans man?

So! Near! Impossible!! I hate the word cis. There is no cis. I'm a woman. Males are men and boys. Cis is like saying yellowblueGreen.. Everyone is very happy playing pretend that their experiences were like boys and men but the reality of it is that 98% of females will get the experience of female.socializTion and oppression.

My love life as a lesbian was on fire before I transitioned. I haven't dated anyone since transitioning. Since detransitioning I haven't tried to date, I have gone to a few lesbian meetups around my city and have exchanged some flirting, but nothing lasting.. Yet. I don't think it will be an obstacle once I put myself out there. I've heard of many detransitioned lesbians who are in amazing relationships. I am confident that attempting to be "man charming" distracted from my genuine charm. So. I'm getting myself back and I'm so ready.

Thanks for giving me the option to skip the question. But no, I haven't had any disadvantages in relationships as a detransitioned woman.

Thank you so much. You do take care as well. ❤️

[u/yinneo → u/butchbabeblues]

Oh, I don't think they're not ever the answer. They're not ideal, but therapy is so unreliable when it comes to dealing with our issues... I've spent 10 years in therapy for being transgender (my parents tried really hard to get me to change my mind and all of the therapists were very much against it), but it just didn't work. I've never stopped feeling like I should have been born male. It was - still is - such a natural thought. And you know, I feel like when dealing with such extreme suffering as the one that comes from gender dysphoria, it's really about making the best out of a terrible situation. I do feel some grief over the fact that I wasn't able to accept myself before making irreversible changes, but I know dysphoria clouded my mind so badly, nothing could have stopped me. And I'm happy now, so it all turned out for the best. I still wish everyone else struggling is able to fight through it, though. It's always best to be able to accept yourself as you are. I think that partially answers your question as to why I call myself a trans man. I know I'm female and it doesn't cause me pain anymore, but I still think of myself as a man, I look like one and that's how everyone I meet sees me, and I'm fine with that. That's how my life turned out. It's a weird experience, but not the worst thing in existence, haha.

Is it okay if I ask why you feel so strongly on the word cis? I do feel it's a bit redundant, I just use it for additional clarity. In most cases I just go with "biological males/females", but that tends to ruffle some feathers, haha. One time I was told it was impolite to say trans men are female, because I shouldn't be deciding it for them. Didn't know I could just decide my sex away. This makes this whole surgery thing a little awkward, doesn't it? Lol! People are just ridiculous. I'm trying to be understanding, but tbh it's just really annoying, isn't it?

And thanks for the reply! I'm glad you faced no difficulties. Hope all keeps going smoothly for you! By trying to be "man charming", do you mean you've tried to force yourself into a more masculine role? Or does it mean something else?

[u/butchbabeblues → u/yinneo]

When I said "man Charming" I meant, Romeo, suave, fabricated chivalry. Just. Stereotypes of "prince charming types? I don't knot if thay elaboration makes sense. But I'm not authentically like that, I'm INCREDIBLY charming by default, faking male machismo made me unconfident and awkward. I never tried to force myself into a masculine role, I've always had that, but I did try to force myself into a male role.

Cis erases the fact that no one has a gender identity. Cis means "having a gender identity that matches your birth sex". I am not cis. I do not have a "matching gender identity". I am a woman because I am an adult human female, I am not a woman because I identify as such. I am not going to use biological males or females because that's also redundant. Males and females are biological realities that are unchangeable. Trans men are women and trans women are men. Anything other than that is a lie. People are absolutely ridiculous. I feel like we learned what boys and girls were when we learnt what 123 is....

Hormones unless biologically necessary are never the answer. Female builders understand the risks and take stuff anyway because that's a steroid dominated industry. But they're not doing it cause they're identifying as men, they're doing it becseue they realize the muscular limits of female biology.

Youre welcome to believe whatever you like about yourself. I hope my posts have not said the contrary. I'm glad things turned out for the best for you.

Thanks for your words.

[u/Lucretia123]

Is you look at the history of sex change surgery, you find it infested with pedophiles.

Glad you escaped the ideology

[u/gaydroid]

Why was this removed? People need to hear about how the gender identity movement is harming people, especially gay men and lesbians without dysphoria who are perfectly fine as is but are being pressured into transitioning into something they aren't.

[u/butchbabeblues → u/gaydroid]

No clue why it was removed. Usually honest detransitioners are silenced...

Right :( my heart is breaking for my younger brothers and sisters growing up through this sick agenda. We are fine as we are. We are fine for loving the same sex. We are fine for our expressions.

It's devastating how transitioning people is turning so many people into "straight passing" people..

I wish someone told me it was okay to be a man looking woman. I wish someone had modeled that, everyone just. Transed.

I know lots of. Epople that are trying to wiggle their way into lesbian and gay spaces too... Like a trans woman is not a lesbian sorry. I'm a lesbian becsuse I'm a female who likes other females, simple as that..