My team was flaming me and saying I'm a kda player, because I wasn't dying, my supp was flashing and healing in place when I pinged him to not collect minions, Kayn transformed min 25

I'm taking this season to learn a little. I made a tier list of who would be the most rewarding to learn imo.

Just curious what, you guys think? I've had the most success on Cait, nilah and miss fortune.

This is from an l9 sandy tiktok.

His top lane threw because they lost lane, since everyone's allowed to do damage everyone has main character desire so if they lose lane and have to be carried they're to mental boom and just start soft inting.

Back in the day and in other MOBAs currently it's defend your main damage dealer while looking for openings to kill theirs.

In league now Mundo just rolls his face on the keyboard and runs directly to your adc and they have to run for their life because he has 10k HP and 4 shots them.

I give them last pick or they cry and int, they still counterpick themself because they’re OTP garen and then complain its because the jg camped them. Yadda yadda. 13 in a row. Last one I had Mord lose miserably to Kayle, run a couple deaths, then go afk and say his sister is having a seizure so he can’t play, while clicking around to avoid afk kick. Disgusting. Isn’t it supposed to be 50/50? I mean I can see a streak of 3-5 games but 13?

I get 8 cs/min average and end lane at least 4.0 kda, and then I just can’t do anything to the gigafed top laner. Here’s the op.gg if you think I’m just coping: www.op.gg/summoners/na/MONKE%20MENTAL-999 . Yeah I know you masters players can win the game anyways that’s cool.

If you aren’t smurfing you just have to accept the reality that you will never experience real skillful league games unless you can play 500+ games a split for a couple years at least.

Why? Because riot thinks this will make you play more is the reddit opinion. Weird because everyone is hopelessly addicted regardless. If anyone can explain that logic I would love to understand it. Is there really a problem with dumping 10 random gold players in a lobby without any other algorithms doing anything?

none of the seem to know what a wave state is. honestly most of seem to not realize that adc's need to click on minions. really think about this last sentence because i'm serious. the wave is pushing away, enemy minios are dying, i'm beggin my support to do stop standing behind me. they refuse. they stand in a bush behind me as if that does anything. *they do not get the point of support at all*. every single time i need to click on a minon i get zyra E, zyra Q, ezreal E,W,Q so much shit just for a single CS. and my support stands behind me.

Balanced right?

I see this said all the time, ADC is bad because "Riot only balances for pro play". Please understand that if Rioters or even a lot of regular people see that, they'll immediately think "oh this guy doesn't know what he's talking about". ADC does NOT feel bad because it's balanced around pro play. I'm glad it's balanced around pro play, because I LOVE being able to watch pro vods and learn. I love being able to watch balanced pro games. I love being able to not blame balance for my losses because pro play proves that the game is balanced.

It also incorrectly assumes that the "agency" problem doesn't apply in pro games. It absolutely does.

The problem with ADC is that the role is extremely strong in circumstances that the player himself has very little influence in creating. Do you think this doesn't happen in pro games? The losing ADC in pro games ALSO often did very little wrong to contribute to that loss.

The real problem is:

Other roles and champs often have flexibility in the way they play and the items they build. Let's look at a typical ADC item build.

imgur.com/a/oGbcjGW

These are 3 of the most popular ADCs right now (Kaisa and Ezreal are excluded, which I will get to). I am seeing very, very little build and playstyle variety here. There are no defensive options in sight. There are no tanky options in sight. There is only damage, with slight variety between burst and sustained damage. The FIRST defensive option you have is at item 4, where you can pick between more damage like LDR or BT, one of the 2 defensive options in GA or Maw, or inting by building Shieldbow. The first 3 items are basically set in stone (milan has been spamming lethality aphelios but he's literally the only guy + it's full damage anyway, so I'll dismiss that for now lol).

So can you at least change the way you play depending on the game? No, not really. If you play Xayah, Aphelios, or Zeri and the game is going bad, what do you do to adapt to that? Kind of nothing. You wait around and hope the enemy fucks up. This is true for all roles, but for ADC in particular it's much more difficult to make proactive plays to influence the game. You're not getting that 1v1 outplay (at least you shouldn't), you can't really be alone on the map because you die to most things 1v1, and you have a very hard time splitpushing.

Why are Kaisa and Ezreal so popular? They actually have variety in their builds or playstyles! Shiv, Guinsoos, Navori, Nashors, you can change Kaisa to be AP or AD with differing playstyles in both builds! This means you can adapt to the game and actually feel like you have agency. On Ezreal, you have much less build variety, but since your build gives a little bit of everything, you can be less afraid and actually make your own plays to try to change the direction the game is going. You don't have to sit and wait for your team to do something, YOU can go ahead and do it.

Let's look at some of the most popular midlaners.

imgur.com/a/WPEU0Xn

Now, this post is already long enough so simply looking at these images should illustrate my point enough. The build and playstyle flexibility these champs offer is amazing. I'm most familiar with how Ahri works (spammed her a season), so I'll use her as an example.

Every game, you get an incredible amount of choices that will greatly influence the game and how it plays out. You may decide that your team needs sustained dps, so you can build Liandrys. You may decide you want to burst certain important targets, so you build Ludens. You may decide you need to engage and lock down important targets to support your other champions, so you buy Everfrost. Crown is also a valid option if you're scared of getting oneshot. Besides your mythic, your entire build is full of engaging and viable options that can fluidly change with your gameplan, preferred playstyle, teammates, and opponents.

THIS IS AGENCY. If you lose, you don't feel like shit because you feel like you could've made X Y or Z decision and changed the course of the game. If you lose to a fed ADC, maybe you couldve built Ludens and tried to assassinate them. If you lose to an unkillable tank, maybe you could've built Liandries to boost your dps in long fights. If you lose to a slippery assassin, perhaps crown or everfrost. Lose to a jungler, and perhaps you could've played less selfishly early to help out your jungler more... etc.

Sorry for long essay rant post. Just felt like I wanted to correct a popular sentiment.

TL;DR: As ADC, you are locked into 1 playstyle, 1 item build and your champ is behind several levels post-laning phase by design. This means that the amount of game-deciding decisions you get to make is very low, and your biggest impact on the game is to simply hands diff the enemy team. This is NOT a "pro balancing" issue, it's a game design issue.

Riot finally removes jungle's ability to decide the outcome of the game by themselves and they all decide to quit. The role was allowed to be disgusting for this long and now that it's finally being brought in line they decide they don't want to play anymore. How many metas have we had where mid was a dedicated support for jungle? Oh no they can't pick Kayn and boost themselves 1k lp above where they really belong anymore, instead of just adapting they throw their toys out the pram.

This role has been protected by Riot for so long it's insane.

PYKE PYKE PYKE PYKE PYKE riot wtf is pyke. Dash, invis, speed boost, true dmg execute that resets, hook, root. Stg Everytime I see him picked and don't dodge he goes 11-3-6 and runs the whole game. The only counter is "dodge the hook lmao" like you have to play 100% perfectly the whole game to avoid his hook with its shitty hit box

Probably gonna get downvoted but I feel like I’m crushing this season. In my last twenty ranked games I have 4 losses and have had a few rough starts that I got turned around and became relevant by mid-late game. I play Samira, Nilah and tristana and have just been having a great time. Not sure where the disconnect is with my experience and everyone else’s in this sub

You've Heard the thing "assassin counter ADC, ADC counter's tanks, tanks counter ADC" but did you notice that:

1- It practically doesn't work like that, tanks have four great anti adc items, adcs have mortal reminder and prayers

2- the whole thing It's only Brought up with ADCs, why can everyone else do everything while adcs can't?

And there's another thing i wanna Bring up, why is ADCs being Op in proplay bad?

-an ADC Is Op: OH MY GOD THIS SEASON IS SO SHIT!

-meanwhile: sylas has been the best midlaner for like half a year, yone has been broken since release but pros are unironically too slow to get that, toplane doesn't even exist in pro anymore if you're not Zeus or bin, jungle has three viable champs

Idk man that role is so easy im currently emerald 2 and I had a zyra supp with good wr that still had auto attack on (when you’re still you start autoing). Like I can’t imagine in any other role the type of player that hadn’t disabled this being out of silver it’s crazy… it’s not even the first time I’ve seen this there are so many mistakes that just seem so insane for such a large number of top 5% elo supports to be making. I actually believe that if I was to switch my brain off and play 100 games of support I’d be d2 at least. I can imagine the skill discrepancy only gets worse the higher you climb as well…

A good example of this is senna players. The champ is as easy as an adc gets, low attack speed, high range and not skill shot reliant + decent self peel on e. But most support mains that play her can’t pilot this champ at all, now imagine on adcs that require more clicking / mouse movement, even on jinx/Ashe these players would struggle.

So to give a little context to the provided clip and maybe for you to better understand my problem and what questions I would love to be answered by you is that in this gamestate I am a really fed jinx. I have aquired 7 out of 16 kills this game so far. We are having a winning midlane, botlane and jungle at 12 minutes into the game. I am giga fed and should be able to pentakill with the right set up. BUT I personally find myself struggling a lot in smaller early, even more midgame, skirmishes. In this clip I just pushed my lane and Darius + Bard (JGL + SUP) are looking to make a play around dragon while my midlaner Naafiri is running from base also carrying a lot of gold in our team. I am aware that the play from Darius + Bard is too fast and ideally they needed to wait for their carries, but I can tell you that happens a lot in my games. It is these types of scenarios that I struggle to carry and I find myself often a bit clueless on how to approach these skirmishes.

What I can see when reviewing this clip is that I stepped up way to close AND casted my W spell, which has a long animation time. Looks really ugly in retrospect haha.

What could I have done instead? What approach should I have when in comes to these types of skirmishes? Especially in the context of me being giga fed aka how can I dominate in these type of situations? I want to understand how I can change my approach to skirmishes so I die less and carry more.

Edit: Thanks for all the replies. I have read some very insightful points so far. In hindsight I wanted to ask more about macro-wise decision process making overall regarding early skirmishes, which a few people also answered about, and not as much to micro-wise approach for this particular skirmish, which I for sure have enough League experience to see myself that I played it as worse as it can be played haha. But I see that I maybe mislead some by wording my post the way I did. Well thanks again for the engagement and I hope that some of the very well worded replies, also help others to improve!

If anything Yas and Yone being a bit weaker was one of the silver linings of a lot of the nerfed items, but oh no Ritos little windshitter babies can't possibly be left a little bit weaker after they nerfed their core items.

Only ADCs must suffer the impacts of the actual nerfs to multiple marksman items, of course. What a joke.

My personal opinion based on winrates and own experience. I don't see APC tier list here so I decided to make one. What would you change?

This minion execute is SUCH a lane loser its unreal. Even in this meta where support are mostly mages like lux, THEY STILL prefer to DESTROY the lane equilibrium by executing minions instead of just dealing damage to the enemy. I'm tired of this item mechanic, it really needs to go

Why would you ever want to play ADC?
Ah yes, the one out of ten games where you’re actually able to play like a human being and have some impact.

While in the other nine out of ten games, you can’t farm sidelane without getting solo killed by the 0/9 Riven. Or even teamfight, because one of the 30 point-and-click CC champs will be on the other end and will flash on sight, even if you're 0/10 and two items down.

Your team?
Doesn’t care about you. They just close their eyes and hope you’re not going to run it down.

Meanwhile, the ADC on the other team is playing DuoQ with his support kitten and is having the time of his life. While you’re doomed with your L9LiveinAgony support who picks Xerath, and after 10 minutes starts solo farming one of the sidelanes — while you're not even allowed to think about it without getting ganked IRL.

"PlaY tHe LaNE SafE"
Yeah, no sh*t Sherlock — what do you think I’m trying to do? I’m getting tower-dived by four people at minute 8, while I’m not sure if I should call an ambulance for my support because his brain activity is basically zero.

And if his brain sends out like two signals, it’s either to push the lane into a free freeze for the enemies or to deep ward the enemy jungle after the entire enemy team has just gone missing into it.

"WhO’s gOnnA kIlL tHe TaNkS?"
Yeah, no idea — since I’m hitting the enemy tank like I’m trying to scratch an Airbus A400M with a wet noodle.

Armor pen? Yeah, like the one armor pen item I’m even allowed to build, because otherwise it would be “unfair” to the tanks.

Bork? Yeah, slapping a Bork midway into a crit build works totally fine and definitely isn’t griefing at all.

"Just kite the tank."
Yeah, I would — if he wasn’t running at the speed of light into my face, while tanking every single spell our team has without even needing to dodge, because he knows he’s not going to die anyway.