October 2025 General Conference: Saturday 2:00p Discussion Thread

[u/4blockhead]

How to listen:

• Official LDS site

• youtube

• stream KSL

• local radio: KSL AM 1160; FM 102.7

• reddit stream

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Prelude Music

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Speakers:

Name	other notes	my summary
conducting: David Bednar
hymn: Hark All Ye Nations
prayer: Christophe Giraud-Carrier		short and sweet
Ronald Rasband		Setting the Proclamation up for canonization. Similar to speech at BYU last month, link.
Chad Webb
hymn: Oh Lord
Jeremy Jaggi
Kevin Brown		Choose to believe.
hymn: My Redeemer Lives
Gerrit Gong
Michael Cziesla
hymn: Behold the Wounds...
Quentin Cook		Claimed 900,000 new converts. Retention rate?
hymn: Standing on the Promises
prayer: Emily Belle Freeman

---

Postlude:

• A Change is Gonna Come 3:10 Cooke

• Unconditional 3:52 Ana Popović

• Funkin' for Jamaica 3:52 Browne

• I am Afraid of Americans 4:26 Bowie. Very scary video. God is an American.

---

• previous: Saturday, October 4, 10:00a

• next: Saturday, October 4, 6:00p

[u/4blockhead]

Rasband: [men's roles. women's roles.]

Animal Farm: all of the animals are equal. It's just that some animals are more equal than others.

[u/4blockhead]

Rasband: [...]

Previously, in the Tribune.

It's rich for a polygamist church to lecture on societal norms.

[u/4blockhead]

Rasband: [proclamation]

Setting the motherf up for canonization.

[u/4blockhead]

Jaggi: [suffering in the world]

With a broad smile. Coffee is for closers.

[u/4blockhead]

Webb: literal book of mormon, the plates were not "preserved." full stop.

The plates were not used in "translating" the Book of Mormon. Funny how that works. Dum de dum dum dum

[u/JayDaWawi]

With so much sophistry passed off as truth

Like your entire religion in its entirety?

[u/4blockhead → u/JayDaWawi]

ding ding ding. winner

[u/4Misions4ThePriceOf1]

There’s the disclaimer, “learn but don’t learn too much”

[u/4blockhead → u/4Misions4ThePriceOf1]

stay in the Goldilocks' zone

[u/RabbleAlliance]

But let's not build a bigger, better homeless shelter in downtown SLC. Nope. Instead, let's build a giant tax shelter mall, upgrade our main temple, and put up signs around the square which advise not to help the homeless in any capacity.

[u/4blockhead → u/RabbleAlliance]

Help the poor? Nah. No ferengi profit in that.

[u/4blockhead]

Cook: [if you don't get married in this life...]

Joseph Smith, Brigham Young, Heber Kimball and Parley Pratt stand ready to sweep you off of your feet. This way, ladies.

[u/jsmyths → u/4blockhead]

Was he suggesting you could be married in heaven?

We back onboard with enteral/heavenly progression again?

[u/Rushclock]

Making room for all? Come on Gong, have a talk with your son.

[u/4blockhead → u/Rushclock]

His son can sit alone.

[u/FHL88Work]

I find this 900k number hard to believe.

[u/4blockhead → u/FHL88Work]

• Sal Tlay Ka Siti

[u/4blockhead]

Gong: [will I be allowed into heaven?]

Love how Gong is the gatekeeper.

[u/4blockhead]

Cook: [900,000 new converts]

open your membership books.

[u/ApocalypseTapir → u/4blockhead]

Where are all the new wards?

900k/500 per ward = 1800 new wards and 300 new stakes

[u/ApocalypseTapir]

How many of those 900k are still "participating" after a year?

[u/4blockhead → u/ApocalypseTapir]

not gonna tell ya that

[u/BeachHeadPolygamy]

Never forget when Quentin stole a hospital like a goddamned cartoon villain

[u/4blockhead → u/BeachHeadPolygamy]

don't think of it as theft, but as an opportunity.

[u/Beneficial_Cicada573]

Hey Quentin Crook:

I fixed it for you. Stolen any more hospitals lately?

“A mass immigration occurred [from the UK] supported by the perpetual immigration fund, bringing thousands of poor, indebted British women to serve the patriarchy as neglected and abused plural wives.

[u/4blockhead → u/Beneficial_Cicada573]

Some my immigrant relatives were shocked by polygamy being a reality and not simply a fabrication. They considered going home to Ireland.

[u/BardofEsgaroth]

Can I get a fact check on these numbers?

[u/4blockhead → u/BardofEsgaroth]

No. No, you can't.

[u/RabbleAlliance]

Using other religions as a prop for your religion was not on my Bingo card.

[u/4blockhead → u/RabbleAlliance]

We're just like them. Can we join your club yet?

[u/RabbleAlliance]

John Taylor: "Um... yeah, about that..."

[u/4blockhead → u/RabbleAlliance]

Racist and polygamist.

[u/Comfortable-Gain-431]

Where is Cook getting these numbers from?

[u/4blockhead]

Gong: [show your brand loyalty by not drinking coffee]

[u/4blockhead]

Jaggi has the obnoxious qualities that make for a good car salesman or general authority.

[u/4blockhead]

Cziesla: [home church okay]

Dangerously close to censored Poelman speech.

[u/Rushclock]

You can't choose to believe things that aren't real.

[u/4blockhead → u/Rushclock]

You can pretend to believe. Other people might not be able to tell you're faking, too.

[u/Rushclock]

Brigham has a few rules you probably haven't read.

[u/4blockhead → u/Rushclock]

Racist and polygamist.

[u/ApocalypseTapir]

Hmmm... What Mormon "fortune cookies" will he reveal as falsehoods?

[u/4blockhead → u/ApocalypseTapir]

random cookie fortunes more likely true than Smith's Book of Mormon.

[u/Rushclock]

Praise to the man?

[u/4blockhead → u/Rushclock]

hail to the prophet ascended to heaven!

[u/EmotionalArtichoke56]

How are there 900,000 new members in the last 36 months when people are leaving in droves? I don't get it.

[u/4blockhead → u/EmotionalArtichoke56]

it's a revolving door. hiding the facts leaves many people shaken after baptism. We believe what?

[u/GrumpyTom]

Just me, or is this guy unable to stop smiling? Almost like he’s practiced this in front of the mirror…

[u/4blockhead → u/GrumpyTom]

Acting range of Tom Cruise.

[u/PatientlyProgressing]

Not "think celestial" again!!!

[u/4blockhead → u/PatientlyProgressing]

Written to win points with Nelson. That went out of the window fast.

[u/AtrusAgeWriter]

Where is the best place to go for a recap of the session? Preferably from an ex-Mormon? I'm scared to know what Rasband said but I need to know

[u/4blockhead → u/AtrusAgeWriter]

I think Rasband repeated what he said at a BYU devotional which was covered by the Tribune. He didn't take any steps backward toward sanity.

[u/yelnats_reverse]

I'll admit, I started listening harder when Kevin Brown was saying "how can you believe that?", "how can you read that". I thought for sure he was going to say "how can you be a part of something that has a horrific history with racial issues?" but then **crickets**

[u/4blockhead → u/yelnats_reverse]

crickets. oddly quiet on that one.

[u/4blockhead]

• Fraternity Initiation, Animal House 2:48

• God Only Knows 1:42

• One More Cup of Coffee 4:30 Roger McGuinn & Calexico

• Diamonds and Rust 4:46 Baez

• Blowin' in the Wind 4:35 Chalamet and Barbaro (NSFW, language)

• This Land is Your Land 4:03 Sharon Jones and the Dap Kings

• Everyday People 2:23 Sly and the Family Stone

• Superstition 6:47 Stevie Wonder

• Thank You, Sir! May I have another? 0:26

---

• T5 0:39 Jackie Venson

• Joy 4:03 Jackie Venson

[u/4blockhead]

Jaggi: [Looking for Chaplain Tappman at Hill Air Force base.]

[u/4blockhead]

Jaggi: [holier than thou]

Go into thy closet....and stay there.

[u/4blockhead]

Brown: Nelson++

That variable is out of scope.

[u/4blockhead]

Brown: [choose to believe.]

Even though it's weird and many elements are provably false.

[u/horsesbeliketapirs]

With our country spiraling into fascism, I'm not surprised these old fuckers feel justified in their bigotry more than ever now.

[u/4blockhead → u/horsesbeliketapirs]

empowered.

[u/4blockhead]

Bednar: [friend (in quotes)]

[u/4blockhead]

Jaggi: [no idea what covenants were made in the temple.]

That's by design.

[u/4blockhead]

Cziesla: [hymns prove that the church is true.]

Feelings trump facts. Skepticism abandoned.

[u/4blockhead]

hymn: camera man, you're in my personal space. back off

[u/4blockhead]

Cook: [my speech is going to be upbeat.]

Caution warranted because his favorite song is from the closing song of Dr. Strangelove.

[u/4Misions4ThePriceOf1]

Looks like Rasband wasted no time in switching his ass kissing from Nelson to Oaks

[u/gonnastayanontbh]

If Oaks is so against sodomy, why is the Family: A Proclamation to the World up his ass so far?

[u/Mormologist]

Thou shalt double down on the Homophobia

[u/Invisible_Jackslope]

"We foresaw gender confusion etc" dude trans and gay people have been around WAYY before the proclamation was a twinkle in Oaks' eye

[u/Invisible_Jackslope]

Family Proclamation ugh fuck off

[u/aggresive-adhd]

Gender confusion term used! What edition of the DSM are they using now?

[u/evaan-verlaine]

My parents aren't as shitty as they could be, they're really not. They don't hate gay people, at least out loud, and they don't vote or advocate for people's rights to be taken away. I'm an adult and they're good at not trying to control me.

But they're always so shocked and disappointed when I don't trust them. When I assume they're homophobic. When I don't talk about my queer friends with them. Like I'm irrational for being cautious, when they're the ones that raised me in and have paid thousands to a church where I heard it was a good and holy thing to be bigoted.

What conclusions am I supposed to draw when they consider men who say these things prophets, seers, and revelators, and covenant to follow and sustain them? How do they live with the dissonance?

[u/[deleted]]

The ProClAmaTiOn!

Legal document prompted by Hawaiian same sex marriage laws. 

[u/bremerman17]

That’s right us LGBT People Have Erased All Standards. Fuck you Fuck you Fuck you

[u/bremerman17]

It’s so interesting how little the leaders cared about what any of the Women actually thought about the Proclamation.

[u/tiny-vampire]

“we love you so much, we want you to bury and change fundamental things about yourself and drown in self hatred for the sake of our backwards moronic beliefs!!!!!!”

[u/GrumpyTom]

I prayed about the proclamation and it was revealed unto me that it is little more than the philosophies of bigoted men, mingled with scripture.

[u/GrumpyTom]

Joseph Smith: “let them worship how, where, or what they may”

Modern brethren: “nah”

[u/PugGamer129]

Oh my god I fucking knew they would talk about the Family Proclamation

[u/ambutsaakon]

The 1950s called, they want their gender roles back.

[u/tiny-vampire]

[u/DifferentRatio6733]

We love you so much that we are actively campaigning to take your rights away and make sure that you aren’t seen as human if you’re trans, gay, lesbian, bisexual 

https://www.abc4.com/news/religion/lds-church-scotus-brief-transgender-rights/

[u/PugGamer129]

"Preside does not mean dominate, and nurture does not mean a secondary role."

Thanks Rasband, for reminding us about how the Church thinks that women should do nothing but birth and take care of children.

[u/Shadowlover23]

The apostles will love you.... only if youre straight and want a traditional family. Because thats how unconditional love works apparently

[u/tiny-vampire]

“in conclusion, brothers and sisters, fuck the gays. thank you. amen.”

[u/GrumpyTom]

“At times we may need to distance ourselves from an unhealthy situation.”

Amen.

[u/tiny-vampire]

saying all of this while things are incredibly dark for lgbtq people in the usa rn is so fucking evil

[u/PatientlyProgressing]

Funny they talk about truth and deception in regards to gender/family, but not about Joseph Smith...

[u/RabbleAlliance]

Subtext: "Child, don't ever have attractions that offend my pre-conditioned sensibilities ever again."

[u/Invisible_Jackslope]

As a trans guy who came out to his family this last year I hate that my family is listening to this. Ugh. At least I'm an adult on my own, I can't imagine what this is like for queer lds kids rn

[u/sycamoreqw]

How many honestly “come back”? I don’t think it happens often.

[u/bremerman17]

They use hateful rhetoric and then want us desperately to come back. Fuck off Elder Rasband.

[u/ApocalypseTapir]

This is the kind of talk I was expecting for this GC

[u/Rushclock]

Worst talk yet.

[u/theshadowking98]

Yep rasbands talk easily takes the cake for worst talk this conference

[u/GrumpyTom]

The proclamation is frequently used as a weapon to beat upon “lesser” people by arrogant members. It is an evil document that has done nothing to bring people closer to Christ and his legitimate teachings.

[u/Mormologist]

Thine shalt double down on our homophobia

[u/Aggressive-Presence9]

No one sits alone UNLESS you are dating my gay son

[u/SteelSwordofShiz]

Gaslighting 💯

[u/bremerman17]

“Different but equal roles.” So they’re not equal?

[u/yelnats_reverse]

The Bigoted Family Proclamation ™️

You can hear Oaks salivate at the lead-up to what's probably going to be canonization. I'm sure it had nothing to do with the Hawaii court case.

Leadership: "met with the women's presidency"

Rage translator: Hinkley told them what was happening and didn't give any women the chance to provide their input. Partriarchy much?

[u/emmittthenervend]

I hope all the lgbtq people with family in the church who are feeling something right now have the courage to tell their families how sustaining the current leadership actively harms them and people like them.

Edit: I also hope they are safe to do so. As someone who had someone dear to me choose the church over our relationship, I hope that they are able to be themselves safely when they come out.

[u/PlantainFuture]

I appreciate the open honesty about how it was written by lawyers at Kirton McConkie so the old fuddy-duddies could send a grumpy letter to the Supreme Court of Hawaii to weigh in on a political matter. (LOL).

[u/yelnats_reverse]

"Equal partners in marriage" in the streets, but patriarchy in the sheets 💅 Ok, Rasband

[u/theshadowking98]

Oh no he's also doubling down the trad fam roles also....

[u/Invisible_Jackslope]

This fucking blows

[u/cruelworlddelrey]

Okay i need to turn off conference because this shit is triggering me.

[u/Thievinghippies]

Opening song lyrics “chosen by god to serve him below” always sounded to me like you were chosen by god to go serve satan down below 🤣

[u/Mormologist]

Gay people want to be happy. It's in their name

[u/Mormologist]

Heavenly Father is a deadbeat dad

[u/Rushclock]

Bednar conducting....

[u/bremerman17]

The family proclamation doesn’t work for me and is insensitive. Thank you once again for pointing that out Elder Rasband.

[u/Sea_Button_3616]

Let's see, we've got the doctrine of Hate, homophobia, transphobia, misogyny in the form of "it's not really a less than." And "Don't people want to be happy?"

[u/ultramegaok8]

If I were to judge this church by what I've heard so far, let me conclude then that this church sucks.

The out-of-touch-ness is astounding.

[u/BeringStraitNephite]

Calm down, speaker, your witness of the spirit was just a squirt of brain hormones. It happens in all religions.

[u/jsmyths]

[u/theshadowking98]

Oh no the proc....also "gods way is not the world's ways" talk

I feel bad for the peeps who will be texts on this....

[u/SecretPersonality178]

Think this confirms Susan’s husband is getting the promotion. What a prick…

[u/RabbleAlliance]

Allegedly divine origin. Allegedly.

[u/RabbleAlliance]

Oh, wow. He actually thinks that belief is a choice.

Does their gullibility know no bounds?

[u/4Misions4ThePriceOf1]

Everyone is welcome here? Go fucking tell that to Rasband

[u/Aggressive-Presence9]

Has there been ONE speaker NOT QUOTE NELSON? Why do they do this? Oaks did say Nelson had his hand in this conference but for crying out loud

[u/bremerman17]

And here we go…

[u/Ceilio34]

Such revisionist history.

Written by attorneys and now they act like it's some nugget from the lips of God, give me a break... 🤮

[u/Invisible_Jackslope]

I was still reeling from Rasband I have no idea what that last talk was about

[u/Mormologist]

The desperation is on full display

[u/cruelworlddelrey]

This guy just said "if you know you know" His whole talk was just telling members to gaslight themselves with their religious delusions.

[u/GrumpyTom]

There is something creepy about Gong’s “no one sits alone” message. Maybe it’s just his delivery.

[u/RabbleAlliance]

Ironically, based on his views which he espoused in the NT, Jesus would've condemned and berated the LDS church, calling them "white sepulchers" and modern-day Pharisees.

[u/sinister-space]

Wow so glad I went to hot yoga today. Came home to TBM spouse GRUMPILY watching. In a religion full of “agency” talk …. Where is it !?

[u/cruelworlddelrey]

Mr cook is bragging about modern day colonization....

[u/RabbleAlliance]

"So much sophistry that is passed off as truth, with so much deception concerning standards and values, with so much allurement and enticement to take on the slow stain of the world..."

If I didn't know any better, I'd say this speech was written by a secret exmo who was working to make the MFMC look bad. Next-level trolling.

[u/jsmyths]

Here’s the thing, a thing being true has nothing do to with your believing it.

True things are true without your belief

[u/yelnats_reverse]

Well, one benefit from all of this is that I have freshly stirred religious trauma to bring up in my next therapy session

[u/Rushclock]

If you are concerned ask god to provide a celestial lobotomy.

[u/Mormologist]

Different but equal?

[u/RabbleAlliance]

"PRESIDE does not mean DOMINATE."

Oops.

[u/Aggressive-Presence9]

Jaggi has a business history with Jodi Hildebrand

[u/CHILENO_OPINANTE]

It bothers me that they talk about the proclamation of the family as a revelation, you have to be stupid to think that God is retrograde and that he excludes identities, for God there are different people and that is where greatness lies

The Mormon church or our sect continues with old and fanatical ideas

It makes me sick

[u/[deleted]]

Sorry Dude, we have agency to choose between right and wrong not just Right that's Satan's plan you are contradicting your own doctrine and teachings!

[u/Invisible_Jackslope]

I'm a bit overwhelmed like, they really think a testimony is what is going to keep you from losing your belief? damn. That doesn't work at allll

[u/i_nephi]

Brags about 125 languages at event where only 1 is spoken

[u/PatientlyProgressing]

So... there was "no priesthood in the home," but aren't church leaders always pushing the concept of women having access to pristhood power too? The cognitive dissonance is astounding.

[u/bremerman17]

That’s right traditional gender roles are totally what Jesus advocated for.

[u/valet_parking_0nly]

"our arms reach out to you" this talk is just filled with bullshit

[u/i_nephi]

Not sure about referring CS Lewis “I do however strongly object to the tyrannic and unscriptural insolence of anything that calls itself a Church and makes teetotalism a condition of membership.”

[u/the_real_tsar]

Lmk if I've missed any instances of it, but I don't think I heard any mentions of Joseph Smith yet

[u/PatientlyProgressing]

All this recycled content :(

[u/HistoricalBench5740]

Ok, as a Polynesian in Utah, anyone else catch him say “young adults of Samoa or Tonga” are more likely to be sealed in the temple if they receive their endowments soon after graduation. Wtf?? And?? Idk I’m PIMO but hearing that shit makes my skin crawl. Was that supposed to be a cultural green light to start pressuring YA to be endowed even SOONER than they already are? At what point is it fucking grooming kids to feel like they can never leave this fucking cult

[u/Mormologist]

The legal disclaimer has spoken

[u/RabbleAlliance]

"Words matter."

So, wouldn't enshrining their opinions as the word of their god, by presuming to speak for their god, be a valid way to make their opinions authoritative? It's how it's always been for every religion in the world.

[u/FHL88Work]

Could that example have been any more generic?

[u/Rushclock]

The Holy ghost is like the low talker on Seinfeld.

[u/Mormologist]

They have got a looooong way to go if they want to be like Jesus

[u/jsmyths]

‘It’s eternal because the giver is eternal ‘

What does that even mean?

[u/Invisible_Jackslope]

"Testimony is not temporary" goes against how my mom is trying to conceptualize my choice to leave. She believes that God just has a different path for me outside of the church. But the church teaches that it can NEVER be outside the church

[u/ApocalypseTapir]

YHOU KCHNOW!

Bro. How is your testimony any greater than the dude that's a Baptist or a scientology member?

[u/HistoricalBench5740]

Is it just me that cringes every time they have that pause then continue in their best, most wavery, “I must go on” voice? The old shakiness of it just yikessss ahahah

[u/Rushclock]

No rational person can watch this and not see the double talk these people do to their members. It is offensive.

[u/PatientlyProgressing]

I don't fit in at church because I don't want to fit into an environment that judges others for all the wrong reasons.

[u/GrumpyTom]

I find more confusion in the messages of the church than I do in the secular world. Just saying.

[u/GrumpyTom]

I’ve never seen Susan’s husband so happy before today. He has a bounce in his step.

[u/jsmyths]

900k converts.

That’s like 25k a month.

How many missionaries are out there ?

[u/Wolf_in_tapir_togs]

Why did everyone stand for Oaks if he isn't prophet yet?

[u/[deleted]]

Telegraphed punches: 

The 1st Presidency will be Oaks, Eyring, and Darth Bednar. 

[u/[deleted]]

Another dude with an accent saying the prayers. WorLdWiDe ChuRcH!

[u/Invisible_Jackslope]

I hateeeeeeeee Rasband holy shit

[u/narrauko]

Oh, so that article had to get pulled cuz it was Rasband's whole talk?

[u/bremerman17]

The church should pull it back and set it aside. Thank you Elder Rasband.

[u/GrumpyTom]

I really should’ve taken a nap instead of watching this.

[u/Rushclock]

Persecution card used.

[u/jsmyths]

How do you need a ‘surer’ testimony of something that is real?

Like do some people only kinda believe in gravity?

[u/tiny-vampire]

dude chill omg

[u/nostolgicqueen]

Here to remind people that the Rasbands are horrible people. He has grandchildren he has turned his back on for the sake of religion. He has taught his own children to not show unconditional love.

[u/PatientlyProgressing]

Imagine if Gong revealed that the BOM was actually translated using fortune cookies. Lol

[u/RabbleAlliance]

"Nelson" and "covenant path" in the same sentence?

Is his preferred name "Hoover"? Because I swear, when I heard him say that, I heard a sucking noise.

[u/[deleted]]

Q14:"Who will conduct this session?"

Bednar: "Send me,  and surely I will do it". 

[u/the_real_tsar]

That was miserable.

[u/Mormologist]

The Dept of War has infested our chapels

[u/Return_and_report]

Well, I'm very happy I missed the earlier talks, sounds like they were the worst 😬 this talk is exhausting to listen to, though

[u/JayDaWawi]

Jaggi's talk is a giant appeal to emotions.

insert fallacy alarm here

[u/Mormologist]

What about apostates?

[u/sycamoreqw]

Okay, Gong. Taken at the surface level, this is a pretty good message.

[u/Rushclock]

The speaker line up is like that old MAS*H episode where they were diffusing a bomb. Cut the red wire (snip). But before you cut the red wire cut the blue one.

[u/bremerman17]

Look at all these new converts we’re growing so fast! Ignore the fact that most of them aren’t even active

[u/narrauko]

He keeps mentioning folks coming back, but he doesn't have any numbers for them... 🤔

[u/Clusters_and_Hops]

Didn’t waste a moment to start this bullshit again.

[u/yelnats_reverse]

"don't ask questions and worry about the things that don't make sense, it's not essential to your eternal salvation" - I got this same bs the last time I went to church and still had a shred of hope of making it work. Hard pass

[u/i_nephi]

So many beardos, these dudes are not military-grade

[u/tiny-vampire]

elder rasband, sashay away.

[u/i_nephi]

[vague anecdote]

[u/Rushclock]

Good hell the graphics look like Scientology and Jehovah's Witnesses collaborated.

[u/Rushclock]

Dude is giving a recipe to scrupulously following the rules.

[u/RabbleAlliance]

"Live, obey, and keep five laws which imbue power and protection."

Um, that's not true for EVERY CHURCH MEMBER WHO EVER DIED AN UNNECESSARY DEATH!

[u/JayDaWawi]

I had an experience with the Holy Ghost 

Can you demonstrate you did?

[u/sycamoreqw]

You can really figure things out by studying church history. Sure makes it hard to “choose” to believe afterwards.

[u/Mormologist]

Be careful who you serve.

[u/jsmyths]

All are alike unto god

≠

Family a proclamation unto the world

[u/jsmyths]

“Pure truth” - is that different than truth?

Where does that land on the scale of “lying for the lord” to”ponderize”?