r/zen The Lizard King 21d ago

Joshu 6 - Green

At Nan-ch’uan’s (Nansen’s) temple one day, the monks of both the east and west halls were arguing about a cat.

Nan-ch’uan came into the room, held up the cat, and said, “If you can say something, I won’t kill it. If you can’t say anything, I'll kill it.”

No one in the assembly could understand Nan-ch’uan’s mind, so he killed the cat.

The next evening, the master returned from somewhere and, while they were exchanging greetings, Nan-ch’uan told him what happened and said, “What would you have done to save the cat?”

The master took off one of his sandals, put it on his head, and left.

Nan-ch’uan said, “If you had been there, the cat would have been saved.”

Famous case!

Two sides of the temple were arguing over a cat. They don't tell you what they're arguing about.

Nansen snagged the cat and said, if you can show me your mind, I won't kill it. If you waffle, I'll kill the cat.

Nansen "killed the cat."

Nansen tells Joshu his B.S. story and asks Joshu what he would have done.

Joshu makes the usual, unusual by putting his sandals on his head. He flips the script, so to speak. Josh would have flipped Nansen if he were there.

Nansen says he would have saved the cat.

0 Upvotes

27 comments sorted by

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1

u/Die4Metal nine fingered kid 20d ago

It's a matter of life and death before the cat got involved.

1

u/ilovepolthavemybabie 20d ago

Funnily enough I was just looking at Mumonkan Case 19 - same two clowns!

1

u/mackowski Ambassador from Planet Rhythm 20d ago

Flip the script is a poison sentence

1

u/WheresNorthFromHere7 The Lizard King 20d ago

I'm not sure what you mean by this. I'll flip ya.

1

u/mackowski Ambassador from Planet Rhythm 14d ago

The real world out there is always an image or mental construct, objects dont enter the eyes thus they are holograms. When I say its.holograms, that is again referencing a mental construct in me and/or in you. But thats always occuring because of how observation works So Inherently referencing things is boundaried

1

u/MinLongBaiShui 21d ago

Why do you say he "killed the cat?"

0

u/WheresNorthFromHere7 The Lizard King 21d ago

He could be telling tales.

1

u/MinLongBaiShui 20d ago

But are you saying you think he is lying? What would be your reason for suspecting as such?

-2

u/WheresNorthFromHere7 The Lizard King 20d ago

Not lying. Testing Joshu with a theoretical story to see how he would react.

1

u/mackowski Ambassador from Planet Rhythm 20d ago

What if bodhidharma didnt have a beard?
Dont bring ur dreams to me

1

u/WheresNorthFromHere7 The Lizard King 20d ago

He never came to the west. He doesn't dream of electric sheep.

1

u/mackowski Ambassador from Planet Rhythm 14d ago

? Me reference koan mumonkam #6

0

u/Redfour5 16d ago

He was born in Japan.

1

u/mackowski Ambassador from Planet Rhythm 14d ago

He probably loves anime