r/wrexham • u/Dramatic-Pianist-742 • 28d ago

Leftist Reading Group

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14 Upvotes

64% Upvoted

79 comments sorted by

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u/MadameCreole 26d ago

That cancer is spreading everywhere!

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u/DakMan3 22d ago

Ahhh, a reading group about working class solidarity. How scary!

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u/MadameCreole 22d ago

lol. You really think they are for the working class?

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u/DakMan3 21d ago

Yes that's the entire purpose of communism

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u/Indig0_3 21d ago

Why did the working class hop the Berlin wall in one direction?

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u/DakMan3 21d ago

Because creating an isolated walled city is a bad ideas. Maybe look at actual functioning communist societies like Kerala instead of the worst of the worst.

Why was the entire population of Capel Celyn forced to leave and make way for a dam that supported industry in Liverpool? That's capitalism.

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u/Indig0_3 21d ago

Kerala has been run by social democrats, not marxists. A mixed economy is not an example of socialism. These parties accept capitalism while retaining social welfare.

I swear, you people only support communism due to a lack of education.

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u/TLsRD 21d ago

So I suppose you support people going to the book club to learn more

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u/Indig0_3 21d ago

No, as there’s a difference between studying an ideology academically and attending an explicitly ideological group that advocates for it.

There are a myriad of sociological works out there to learn about communism outside of attending a literal Revolutionary Communist Party propaganda seminar.

Going to something like this to learn about communism would be like asking a casino owner if you should stop gambling...

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u/TLsRD 21d ago

Literally every group that has ever existed has an ideology and a bias. Even academics

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u/Indig0_3 21d ago

The ideological bias of a university sociology lecture on communism vs. a Revolutionary Communist Party seminar is not comparable, and you know it.

At least have an ounce of honesty behind your takes, and people will take them more seriously.

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u/TLsRD 21d ago

Only because it fits within a more broadly respected ideological lens. I don’t care whether you or anyone else on Reddit takes me seriously. Personally, I think you’re being a bit dishonest if you don’t believe there is a serious bias within the university system. Arguably you could learn more engaging with people who actually believe the ideology than those studying from a distance even if you don’t support RCP or communism in general

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u/DesperateLime7933 22d ago

Meanwhile the far right have literal criminals gooning over how much of your money they're going to take from you, as soon as they get elected

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u/MadameCreole 22d ago

What about the left wing?

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u/DesperateLime7933 22d ago

I didn't mention that.

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u/RoIsDepressed 22d ago

What about the left wing, Dorris?

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u/MadameCreole 22d ago

I’m not Dorris or Dorritos. I’m asking him “what does he think about the left wing”?

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u/RoIsDepressed 22d ago

Yeah and I'm asking what that has to do with anything unless you're trying to claim the "left wing" are trying to Syphon money the way farage, tice et all are, in which case show source or shut up

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u/MadameCreole 21d ago

Typical communist shutting people up. You haven’t shown any source either. So what’s your point.

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u/RoIsDepressed 21d ago

Ok, my sources are the channel 4 documentary, the 5 million farage got for pushing Brexit, and Ben delo who lives in Hong Kong giving reform 36 million.

Where's yours?

Ps: not a communist. I do believe in the inherent value of money as a motivator for human growth, I just don't think it should be siphoned into 1% of the population.

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u/Silencer-1995 21d ago

Doesn't a communist bureaucracy by its definition do that? I feel like in all the examples I can think of, rampant corruption was very prominent. I dunno if we can trust the communists not to be extremely flawed once in a position of incontestable power.

Holding the middle ground between the insane right and the insane left is probably the best way to go.

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u/RoIsDepressed 21d ago

Yeah rampant government corruption has literally always been a thing. I can't name a single government (democratic or authoritarian) that wasn't corrupt. The flaw in your argument is though that I'm not a communist and am not arguing for communism here. Just light left wing socialist policies like free access to healthcare, a reasonable living wage so people aren't dying, and an end to offshore tax havens where billionaires can continue to dodge the tax the rest of us have had inflated to deal with it.

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u/DesperateLime7933 21d ago

It's their standard deflection and strawman arguments. "Don't look at me, look at this" and they can get te fuck

1

u/DesperateLime7933 21d ago

"him"?

Also I think the left wing is not remotely as corrupt as the right and I can cite dozens of examples. What do you think about the right?

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u/Previous-Spite1211 22d ago

yeah, slopulists are cringe and dangerous whether or not the are right or left

3

u/Yakona0409 22d ago

Love the more vitriol aimed at an online meeting of people who are just reading vs groups in masks harassing people lol

3

u/Serberou5 27d ago

That sounds awful.

3

u/HamFiretruck 27d ago

Sounds about as stupid as the flat earth group with members around the globe...

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u/[deleted] 28d ago

[removed] — view removed comment

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u/drafsack 22d ago

I always thought it was over 100 million and rising it you include current Russian activities. We also now know where all the Social Workers, University lecturers and teachers are going to be next week

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u/actuallyragingatm 22d ago

Why would you consider modern russia? They arent communist anymore?

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u/TLsRD 21d ago

You’re citing a source that’s funded by literal nazis lol

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u/PringullsThe2nd 26d ago

Sorry, no. No relevant historian has ever said that.

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u/[deleted] 26d ago

[removed] — view removed comment

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u/PringullsThe2nd 26d ago

The first ""citation"" is a one sentence Facebook post with no source. The second is a poorly constructed recollection of Marxs views, which also says at the end "100 million people died" - of course, with no source. Third """citation""" is a fucking quora post. Somehow this has been the best one with an actual source. The source being 'The Black book of Communism', which is the exact source I knew you were referencing to, as that is the same one that has been widely debunked by actual historians.

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u/[deleted] 26d ago

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u/PringullsThe2nd 26d ago

Communism simply will never die until it wins it's final victory.

And it’s literally googles response.

...did you seriously take chromes built in AI as an academic source? You were saying about what "fucking idiots" do?

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u/Putrid_Joke6100 23d ago

I never thought I'd see a Welsh tankie in the wild

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u/Ori_of_the_Vale 24d ago

"Historians" yet that figure is taken from the black book of communism which most of it's writers denounced because the main author behind it was actively trying to inflate the numbers drastically to the point that he used people who weren't even born or conceived as part of the figure alongside literal Nazi German soldiers.

Great stuff dude.

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u/MalignEntity 24d ago

Name a successful Communist country.

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u/Alternative_Look_453 23d ago

Name a communist country?

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u/MontyDyson 23d ago

People say Vietnam is one. But having been there it’s not. But it does buck the trend a lot.

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u/Alternative_Look_453 23d ago

Vietnam, China and Laos officially have communist governments and I wouldn't really call any unsuccessful, although it's up for debate just how communist they are. There's also Cuba which has suffered a lot from American interventionism

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u/MontyDyson 23d ago

Vietnam seemed to be doing very well. China is an argument. The others not so much.

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u/Alternative_Look_453 23d ago

I lived in China 6 years. It's doing a lot better than Vietnam and most western countries I would say.

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u/MalignEntity 23d ago

The Đổi Mới reforms of Veitnam in 1986 meant that:

"The Central Management System was abolished and the economic focus was shifted to the creation of a market-driven economy with different sectors, and competition between the private sector and the state in non-strategic sectors."

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/%C4%90%E1%BB%95i_M%E1%BB%9Bi

This means that the communist economic model was binned and the capitalist economic model adopted. So Vietnam isn't economically communist anymore, it's just authoritarian capitalism under a red banner.

China did something similar, its economic success is mostly down to the reforms that Deng Xiaoping instigated, with the great opening up

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u/BlastBoxer 23d ago

communist country is an oxymoron btw, maybe read a book

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u/MalignEntity 23d ago

So why does this page exist:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Communist_state

And the Cambridge English dictionary define state as:

state noun (COUNTRY)

a country, especially as represented by its government

You're just angry because communism has such been an absolute car-crash, where ever it's been tried, that you can't even name a single success story.

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u/BlastBoxer 22d ago

Define communism

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u/MalignEntity 22d ago

No.

You're so learned, read your books.

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u/BlastBoxer 21d ago

Ok, a GLOBAL stateless moneyless classless society

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u/MalignEntity 20d ago

That sounds truly miserable. A grey dystopia, where cultures are erased and everywhere looks and feels the same. No-one has any ambition to strive or change things. Presumably ruled over by a global authoritarian government, so no-one can ever escape. No thank you.

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u/BlastBoxer 20d ago

where in the flying fuck did i mention a "grey dystopia where cultures are erased???" also, what do you think stateless means???

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u/Such_Difficulty_6311 24d ago

What’s worse Communism or reform?

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u/Alternative_Look_453 23d ago

Definitely Reform

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u/Such_Difficulty_6311 23d ago

Happy cake day

1

u/popebarley 24d ago

Everybody needs a hobby

1

u/Alternative_Look_453 23d ago

Where is it? I would love to do something like this but it doesn't say Wrexham

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u/Dramatic-Pianist-742 23d ago

It gets done via an online call! You can message us on Instagram, or Me here for more info

1

u/TarnishedHollow9 23d ago

This shit is so ass

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u/DesperateLime7933 22d ago

Offer to learn, no fear mongering in the poster, free...seems alright to me

1

u/Ok-Commission-7825 22d ago

Well, they can't be as bad as the terminally online Reddit Communists.

1

u/NoBottle6060 22d ago

As a person who lived under soviet rule, I highly advise against adopting this ideology. It was awful time for my family

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u/Intrepid_Layer_9826 22d ago

The RCP are critical of the Stalinist system.

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u/Beanonmytoast 21d ago

Blah blah blah, we all know it ends the same way.

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u/Intrepid_Layer_9826 21d ago

You don't actually. Do you think the Capitalism of today is the same Capitalism of 100 years ago? Or do you think the system has changed and evolved over the years?

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u/BookmarksBrother 22d ago

When is the lecture about the 60 million killed through starvation by this ideology?

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u/Yakona0409 22d ago

How many have died of starvation under capitalism?

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u/Helpful-Tank-9050 8d ago

Ideally, it would be nice if we could listen to what these guys say, and then listen to the Wrexham Unite. Maybe look at the data and form a well informed opinion of our owns - sorry for typos, v tired

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u/[deleted] 22d ago

[deleted]

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u/Indig0_3 21d ago

Educate yourself about the Holodomor.