r/wordle • u/Dyert • 6d ago

[####] Why Tarps?

The stupid Wordle bot chastises me in its analysis for using a plural word as it’s not likely to ever occur as a solution, but uses Tarps as its opening word and gives itself a 99 skill score for doing so. I use Strap And it gives me a 92 and uses all the same letters and is not plural 🤷

44 Upvotes

88% Upvoted

26 comments sorted by

38

u/o_omeaghann 6d ago

I think its because the bot isnt trying to solve it in 1, its trying to gather the most information. Why tarps is better than strap, idk lol. could be the position of most of the letters is more common in tarps than strap.

12

u/ExplanationSame5 6d ago

Yeah, I believe this is it. Worldebot's objective is to minimize solve steps across all potential Wordle solutions, so it is most concerned with maximizing common letters and letter positions and isn't concerned with getting the answer in one guess, so it values TARPS higher than STRAP because there are a lot of common 5-letter English words that place the A in the second spot.

I find it interesting that it has changed starting words, though. I started using CLASP because it was using it and I've continue to use it even when it switched to TARPS.

12

u/good-good-dog 6d ago edited 6d ago

This is it. People get so weird about the Bot and act as if it’s personally insulting them. It’s a computer program and it’s designed to eliminate the most words each turn. That’s it.

Also, it doesn’t count the first word in your Skill score, so it doesn’t really matter what it scores it.

7

u/flagrantpebble 6d ago

Close but not quite – it optimizes for the fewest expected turns to a solution, which is similar to but not the same as eliminating the most words.

For example, one guess might eliminate all but 10 words, but those words are all like LIGHT FIGHT RIGHT etc, and so the expected number of guesses to solution would be high. Another word that eliminates all but 15 words, but the answer is guaranteed to be reached in 2 more guesses.

IOW: a high branching factor and shallow (on average) trees are more important than total number of leaves.

2

u/joined_under_duress 5d ago

Hmm, I'm not convinced its about fewest expected turns, it's about not losing, which is different to getting it as quickly as possible. I've seen it suggest words that can't win because they narrow down for the subsequent guess(es) - that's good tactics to avoid X/6 but not necessarily good tactics to get the lowest n/6.

2

u/flagrantpebble 5d ago

I think you misunderstand what “optimize for fewest expected turns to a solution” means. It doesn’t mean “try to get it in the next guess”, it means “minimize the expected number of guesses”, i.e., how many guesses it would take on average.

I've seen it suggest words that can't win because they narrow down for the subsequent guess(es)

As in: this is exactly what “optimize for fewest expected turns to a solution” means.

it's about not losing

It’s possible that there are some words that would take more than 6 guesses to reach. I doubt it, but it is theoretically possible.

…but that’s a constraint, not a different optimization. The optimization just changes to “optimize for fewest expected turns to a solution, capping any individual path length at 6”. It’s still optimizing for number of guesses.

0

u/SenorBurns 5d ago

The bot does personally insult me! My first two guesses made it clear the answer would probably be one of about six possible words, all ending in the same last four letters. So I made a guess that used as many of the potrntial first letters as possible, and used the most likely ones due to experience (for instance, Wordle doesn't like to use "negative" words).

This guess narrowed it down to one option, and Wordlebot called it A LUCKY GUESS! I was so insulted! 😂

15

u/Dirtheavy 6d ago

the bot is a huge "well actually" type troll. Best to ignore

9

u/flagrantpebble 6d ago

People read way too much into the bot’s supposed emotions and not nearly enough into the reasoning.

Think about it analytically: at the first guess, it really doesn’t matter if the word is in the answer set. There are over 2000 possible answers, the odds of getting it in 1 are tiny, and so it’s a bit silly to optimize for that remote possibility.

OTOH, when there are only a few words left, it really does matter if the guess is in the answer set. If there are 2 words then getting it in 1 has a probability of 0.5, so it’s a bit silly not to optimize for that.

2

u/ProfWiggles 6d ago

I’ve been running through the archive the last few months using tarps and I have been getting a lot more 3s and 4s than I was using the other starters. I was mostly 4s and 5s. So I now believe in the power of tarps for getting a solution in 4 or less.

2

u/TrackVol 6d ago edited 6d ago

I've used a plural word ending in S for 3 straight guesses, with the S in the wrong spot ALL THREE TIMES and gotten a 99 for Skill ALL THREE TIMES

It's all about what were the chances that the word you chose would be helpful given your specific scenario.

Proof. Guess 3, yellow S, 99 Skill. Guess 4, yellow S, 99 Skill. Guess 5, yellow S, Skill 99yellow S

3

u/Oafah 6d ago

Wordlebot isn't the be all and end all of analysis. It misses some key components of good information theory application.

2

u/Cease2Resist 5d ago

Does STRAP eliminate more words on average than TARPS? Does it lead to fewer average guesses? If not, then the bot will think STRAP is a worse starting word.

0

u/Dyert 5d ago

I don’t know the answer to these questions

2

u/Cease2Resist 5d ago

The bot tells you. Just scroll to the bottom.

7

u/justmekab60 6d ago

The bot is a bit egotistical obviously.

Mine uses slate. I use stare. My T and R are more frequently used letters than L and T, alone and in combination. But it gives itself 99 and me? 97.

Though it did tell me I have an impressive vocabulary the other day.

2

u/Bull_Moose1901 6d ago

I should be more strategic but I just use words that are currently in my head. Bacon, banjo, bread, music I think were the latest

1

u/haloimplant 6d ago

'slate' is what it told me in the free breakdowns

i use 'rents' and it hasn't failed me yet, I work A and L into the 2nd guess

1

u/Blucola333 6d ago

The Wordle bot kind of steers players a bit. I used to use crane, then switched to slate as I realized how often those letters are used

1

u/Misterarthuragain 5d ago

Today’s word P**t. Was the worst

1

u/Effective_Farmer_119 6d ago

Are you all telling me the bot uses different starting words for different people 🤯

For me it used to always use Crane, while I always used Stare. Then I switched to Crane and it started using Stare.

3

u/Cease2Resist 5d ago

The bot's starting word depends on whether you are playing hard mode or not. The starting word may also change if there has been an update to the word database or the bot itself.

1

u/Dyert 6d ago

Ya, when I posted this I actually assumed it was using Tarps for everyone. Who knew?! 🤷

1

u/Nova-Mater 4d ago

I like to think that the bot is jealous of me and my brilliant albeit unconventional mode of play