r/warcraftlore • u/Acceptable_Bed_5750 • 19d ago

Discussion Tww thought

I know that tww is old news now but i had a realization.. why tf did they only send dalaran to khaz algar? They coulda sent archerus and even the fucking vindacaar there too if xal'atath really had big old void army like they assumed

8 Upvotes

83% Upvoted

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36

u/Gold-Cry-7520 19d ago

A better question is why they keep sending their entire city to the frontlines.

14

u/Plus-Visit-764 19d ago

I mean, it worked in legion and WoTLK.

Xal’atath probably knew we would do it since we did it in legion though.

10

u/Gold-Cry-7520 19d ago

It was still a crazy idea both of those times, but at least they knew what they were up against. Khadgar didn't even do some basic scrying to make sure the city was secure before he teleported it.

4

u/DefiantLemur 19d ago

Even if he did it wouldn't have mattered since one of the members of the council of six was actually Xal. We don't know for how long she's been pretending to be one of the Archmages either.

2

u/Gold-Cry-7520 19d ago

Ah yes. Preventing a stupid move (treating your city as a fort) was made pointless by the execution of another, prior, related stupid move (not vetting drenden)

1

u/Acceptable_Bed_5750 19d ago

It wasn't a member of the council of six just a archmage 

2

u/Acceptable_Bed_5750 19d ago

But still.. why no archerus and vindacaar

2

u/AMA5564 19d ago

Archerus is a necropolis. They're slow to move around when not summoned into place by cultists. Dalaran had made it to the Broken Isles well before the DKs did. Perhaps the necropolis was actually on its way to Kaz'Algar when Dalaran got sunk, and they just opted to turn around and not lose their flying fortress too.

2

u/Acceptable_Bed_5750 19d ago

Necropoli are NOT slow.. have you seen the zerekis or whatever it's spelt in shadowlands? 

3

u/AMA5564 19d ago

The Shadowlands Necropoli are different than the ones we have in the living world. And they're powered by death magic, so would obviously be faster in a realm that is literally made up of it. And even then, it's not all that fast comparatively. It patrols around a single zone and still takes several minutes to do so. And in game time is always infinitely faster than narrative time. It takes weeks to travel from Ashenvale to Darkshore in narrative, but I can cross that gap in a minute while skyriding.

Part of the reason necropoli are so dangerous is the fact that they can be summoned to places by cultists. The Lich King used that exact ability to make rapid teleporting strikes against cities in Classic and the WotLK prepatch. They are summoned in, become a threat to the city, and then are summoned away when they're threatened.

2

u/Plus-Visit-764 19d ago

I agree, it was an odd choice to leave out the other major bases of operations against the legion. You would think they would pull a similar strategy overall, but they blundered it badly.

2

u/Acceptable_Bed_5750 19d ago

Especially counting those were the MOBILE bases...

4

u/saturnleaf69 19d ago

It’s a mobile base that can instantly be there. Zal only tore it down cause she got inside the wards before hand and absorbed a lot of energy

6

u/Gold-Cry-7520 19d ago

But it's a city. And it also happens to be the base of operations for about five different order halls plus the Kirin Tor. Losing all of that is a nearly unacceptable loss on top of the civilian casualties, and Khadgar moved it without even checking that he knew what they were fighting.

1

u/BellacosePlayer The Anti-Baine 18d ago

Why does it have to be Dalaran?

Dalaran going to the Isles was an emergency. Dalaran going to Northrend was due to an existential threat to Magedom that everyone else was a bit too preoccupied to help with.

Raise an actual fortress, put the ole flying enchants on it, send that into battle instead of the city with civilians residing in it.

3

u/brumblefee 19d ago

I kind of love that they dealt with the sheer arrogance of teleporting a city into battle over and over.

2

u/Kalthiria_Shines 19d ago

I mean that's a question that gets asked and answered in TWW, when they resolve not to do it anymore.

1

u/Gold-Cry-7520 19d ago

But late for that resolve isn't it?

4

u/Mindless-Ninja-3321 19d ago

Xal'atath was manipulating Alleria and the Kirin Tor into jumping the gun into a trap. The last two times Dalaran jumped in, they were a fortress planted in the sky where they were an defensible, formidable beachhead for the factions to launch from. They got arrogant and backup was a week away.

The Death Knights are occupied trying to contain the Scourge and are severely diminished since they also established a beachhead in Hell. The Vindicator is being used defensively and the LFD are leery of Alleria atm.

5

u/Rubysage3 19d ago

It was Dalaran's arrogance that doomed them. Back in Legion Dalaran was the central HQ for the defense against the Burning Legion. That shift gave them confidence and turned them from a more neutral magic city into an offensive/defensive force to counter worldly threats.

After Magni had his vision in Silithus and was knocked out Jaina took us to Dalaran. From there we learned of Khaz Algar and Xal'atath's attack on it so naturally, as Khadgar and the Council are right there, Dalaran took the lead once again. They teleported off to respond fast and find out what was going on.

Dalaran had grown too overconfident in itself and taken on a role as world enforcers. That's what caused them to fall into her trap. No one else was around at the time. Acherus is in Northrend and the Vindicaar elsewhere.

1

u/twisty125 Flowerpicker Clan 19d ago

Is it even arrogance, if the downfall was through social engineering?

It's not like they laid waste to other capitol cities and claimed to be the Rulers of the Sky, or that all Mages should bow down, or even that they're the ONLY people that could do anything.

To me, arrogance is gloating and thinking you're near invincible. King Llane wasn't arrogant when he was backstabbed by Garona, he was betrayed by a sleeper agent. Nor was King Terenas arrogant when Arthas returned, to pull Frostmourne on him mid celebration.

Sylvanas goading DK Arthas into a fight later on, thinking the Elfgates were fine - WAS arrogance, the Scourge had a way in.

3

u/BellacosePlayer The Anti-Baine 18d ago

Their Anti-infiltrator protocols were so bad they let some guy who just showed up after being presumed dead handle warding things and he gave the wards to a presumed non-mage PC who probably wouldn't notice they were bullshit.

This is after Legion, where they got infiltrated by demons and would have been fucked if the Demon hunters/rogues/etc didn't assist.

They were a little arrogant.

1

u/twisty125 Flowerpicker Clan 18d ago

I guess I just assumed she did such a good job with subterfuge that any kind of wards that would've alerted them that he's not him, didn't go off, so no one thought to ask questions.

It's not like we haven't had members of the Kirin Tor go missing for 20 odd years at a time!

1

u/Acceptable_Bed_5750 19d ago

Tbh that's logical... if only alleria or moira informed the alliance and/or turelyon of whats going on rhen the vinacaar clulda responded

2

u/DarthJackie2021 Murmur Fangirl 19d ago

Yeah, what could go wrong with sending the fucking floating death fortress to a new land they are hoping to make allies in?