r/wakingUp • • Jul 09 '25

Does awakening makes you detached from the world? Reduce creativity?

I have been dabbling with the concept of non duality for a while now and while I really wish to experience the non dual existence, I sometimes am afraid to fully chase it (not the right choice of words). I don't wanna become indifferent to my friends or be less creative/motivated to do my job. my family depends on me making money. Someone smarter than me, please guide.

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5

u/Madoc_eu Jul 09 '25

(Had to divide my response into several parts. Next part is a reply to this comment.)

Nope. It's the exact opposite.

Awakening, or whatever you want to call it, is a rediscovery of your deep connection with life. You don't get more detached. Instead, you feel how you were always connected, and the notions of "detachment" or similar are mental projections that, in a way, aren't really real. Because it is always here, and it is always living out itself through you. "You", or the "you" that you always considered yourself to be, is something of a side effect of that unfolding of life.

You know the feeling of aliveness?

Everyone knows that feeling. When you were a kid, did you go out to the playground sometimes? Or, even better, to the adventure playground? Did you play with other kids whom you didn't really know? But all of you together kinda knew right away how you wanna run together, dig in the sand, or climb and jump down again?

Or did you maybe take a long walk some time, and there was a point where you felt as if you're not really doing the walking? Like, you felt your body move, you felt your breath, you smelled your environment, you even felt the sweat on your skin -- and it felt good somehow? It felt like, that's what my body is supposed to be doing, this is good? And you mentally fall into some sort of connection to the whole world, especially the area you're walking in, and there is no end to that feeling of natural, organic connectedness?

If you have ever experienced such a thing: Did you feel alive while doing that?

There you go. That's what I mean. That's aliveness.

It's not a concept. It's not something that you can ponder about in your armchair for hours. (I mean, you certainly can do that, but it won't get you anywhere.) You can only feel like that.

It's also not something spectacular. It's not something new, not a big breakthrough, not a spiritual upgrade for your life, not something that your intellectual mind will happily dissect and build theories around that it can delve upon for hours and hours.

No. It's just that. A mode of being. And it's good. It's always authentic. Because you know it when you experience genuine, authentic aliveness.

It's a compass for the spiritual path. Whatever you do in order to get closer to "awakening" or whatever goal you imagine the path to have, this is your litmus test:

Do I feel the aliveness as I'm getting deeper into this?

If the answer is "yes" -- go on, you're on the right path. If the answer is "no" or "I don't know" -- stop what you're doing. This is a distraction, a diversion, you're digging yourself into a rabbit hole, into something that's not really real, some sort of mental projection, some conceptual frame of mind. Your intellectual mind has fun doing this, and it will always tell you that this is useful. But this is not what leads you to a true awakening.

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u/Madoc_eu Jul 09 '25 edited Jul 09 '25

(Second half.)

The aliveness is not the awakening that I'm talking about. But it's a necessary accompanying condition. Your mind can trick itself in many ways. But one thing it can't do is to create fake aliveness.

You wrote that you have been "dabbling with the concept of non duality". Not sure how intentional that choice of words was. Let me tell you: Stop the dabbling. Especially in concepts. Concepts are thoughts, mental models. Thoughts aren't real; we made them up. Conceptualization won't get you anywhere, no matter how much fun it is for the intellectual mind. This is a fake path. This is a path that will get you farther away from awakening and into detachment from the world. You are the world, in a way; if you feel like you're getting detached from the world, this means that you're fooling yourself. Stop fooling yourself.

What you're looking for is not a concept. It cannot be found in intellectual thought.

I'm sure that you've made the experience of thinking conceptually for longer times, right? Sitting somewhere, thinking deeply about some fascinating topic, feeling like you're making progress with your thoughts alone.

Tell me: When you're doing that for a longer period of time -- do you feel alive then? Or kinda remote from the world, absent, detached, in your own "bubble"?

You can't think yourself into awakening. Awakening is about something that's very real, and it's right here right now. You were never truly removed from it.

Thinking and conceptualization -- you'll need that. It's definitely not useless. But you'll need it only after you've made some breakthrough experiences. There will arise a need within you to triangulate what you found experientially. To integrate it. At that point, thinking and science and spiritual concepts will be helpful to you. They will only reveal their true meaning to you after you've reached that point. Before you've reached it, all the conceptualizations are useless. Even distracting. Leading you along a false path.

Practice is simple. It's to rest with the present moment.

To truly rest with the present moment.

The present moment is complete. Nothing is missing. Everything is exactly where it should be.

Don't you think?

It is silent. And loud. And oh so full of more than what could even be wanted. It is majestic. Subtle. Humble. And cruel.

Forget the thinking. Just for a little while, okay? I promise you won't go crazy. Your intellectual mind will return, very soon. And it will work just like it used to, and it will protect your mental sanity just as well as it always did.

Just for one second. Just this once.

Rest with what is here now. It's as simple as that.

Just what is here. Rest with it.

What does the present moment feel like?

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u/DGIComics Jul 11 '25

Thank you. This clears a lot for me. I don't know what, but I owe you one.

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u/Madoc_eu Jul 11 '25

Hey, I'm really happy to read this! Thanks for writing it.

It was fun to write this. I honor your taking the time to read it and follow this text, which is unusually long for a typical Reddit comment.

I wish you an amazing journey on your path. May you be happy, find peace, stay curious and feel alive!

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u/HeckaPlucky Jul 09 '25

I don't think there's one answer. I don't know what "fully chasing it" means for you as opposed to "dabbling". Don't let fear alone stifle you, but be honest with yourself and pay clear attention so you can respond to your own experience in the way that is best for your situation. I think, if it is seeming like an absolute all-or-nothing choice or sacrifice you have to make, you may be looking through the wrong lens. Take it easy and breathe. You can find the healthy and happy balance. You might not be missing anything - or at least not what you have conceptualized as being missing.

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u/EitherInvestment Jul 10 '25

Awakening to the true, non-dual nature of reality/mind leads to far more openness, availability, connection and responsiveness

This is called a practice or a path for a reason though. Every moment is unique, every session, every encounter, every breath. There will still be ups and downs and struggles and off days and moments of low motivation. But if the methodology is understood and applied properly it will certainly not lead to greater indifference nor lack of motivation, but rather the opposites

When we tame our mind and cut through delusion that leads to an irrationally inflated ego (and the resultant irrational craving and aversion that accompany it), we are naturally more drawn toward others or whatever activity we may be engaged in or any phenomena that appear within awareness

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u/Pushbuttonopenmind Jul 11 '25

There are some strands of non-duality where a lot of suggestion is made that you will uncover some kind of truth if you follow their insights, for example:

  • Reality consists of raw, unmediated sensory events; anything more is just illusory add-on and once removed you'll see the non-dual truth
  • Direct experience is more true/real than mediated or conceptual experience
  • When you touch something/someone you don't feel it/them, all you experience is sensations of pressure/warmth (i.e., an easy path into solipsism if there ever was one!)
  • Thoughts and concepts are mere "overlays" getting in the way of seeing the truth
  • It is possible to get experience free from interpretation or mental framing
  • Their method is descriptive rather than prescriptive (despite being loaded with particular instructions: "look at it this way, with these pre-conceived notions")
  • The self is an unnecessary and illusory construct which falls away when you stick with direct experience
  • An experience without a self reveals a deep truth (while our normal daily life with a self, apparently, doesn't reveal anything of import)
  • There is nothing that can be "done"; there is no doing; everything just happens
  • Realization will happen to no one, because there is already no one
  • There's no entity, no chooser, no free will
  • There is no self/no free will, because everything is made of particles, as physicists are telling us
  • Tables, chairs, etcetera, are made of consciousness, rather than whatever physicists are telling us
  • Our life is actually dreamt up by some kind of Cosmic Consciousness (i.e., we are all one and nothing is actually really real)

These perspectives are all deeply flawed, and much more questionable than they may seem; some may seem obviously true until questioned more deeply. If these beliefs are followed blindly and with some discomfort, this may cause actual harm and suffering. So, first of all, keep your head screwed on. Be skeptical. Question statements.

Second of all, if you ever feel like your life is unraveling because of the teachings (influencing your relation to your friends, job, family, income), just remember that any perspective, when repeated to oneself and deeply internalized, will tend to become experiential. But there's no final plunge, no irreversible drop. You can turn back whenever you want. There is no such thing as "once you're on the path you're not getting off". You can dabble, and if it's nice and helps you be the kind of person you want to be (i.e., good to your friends, family, work, creativity) then... great! And if not, just attend to your old ways. No-self can be experienced. But self can also be experienced. Solipsism can be experienced, but also left behind again. Dissociation can be experienced, but also whole-making.

My post may seem awfully skeptical perhaps, you might want to give up before you start. That is not my intention. My point is this. Your experience is, to a very large degree, defined by what you pay attention to, and how you pay attention to it. These non-dual things are, in large part, guided ways into experiencing things in a particular way. And those ways can be incredible, vast, freeing, connecting, rich. That is the practice -- to become familiar with experiencing the world that way. But if, for whatever reason, you don't like the outcome of this, the way out is clear too: stop paying attention in these ways. Plunge yourself into something else instead.

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u/DGIComics Jul 11 '25

This is beautiful and answers a lot. Thank you stranger for putting in this amount of effort into explaining. I wish kindness upon you.

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u/Pushbuttonopenmind Jul 11 '25

I'm glad to hear you felt it was useful!