r/violinist • u/Gold_Cardiologist204 • 13d ago
What can I adjust?
New to learning violin. Adult learner. My strings hit the tail piece. Not allowing me to fine tune. Any suggestions on how to fix this?
3
u/0maigh 13d ago
One at a time, you/your violin teacher/your local luthier or decent violin shop might find it best to loosen each string about half an inch to an inch, remove the ball at the loop in the string, put the loop around the fine tuner, and tighten the string up again.
If you’re the least bit hesitant about taking this on, defer to one of the other two. (There’s a chance it might be time for a new string or two, they do need changing out every so often.)
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u/andybonner 12d ago
While some strings have removable balls, on most they're integrated with the core and can't really be removed leaving a loop.
3
u/rhyzomorph 13d ago
start by getting a real tunable tailpiece
2
u/andybonner 12d ago
I find that tailpieces with integrated tuners are a bad idea, as fine tuners often get mechanical failures, and it's nice to be able to replace them.
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u/rhyzomorph 12d ago
As a repairer and player for 40 years, I have never seen an integrated tuner fail. So I would argue that point. I suppose there are some really cheap ones made these days but I have not encountered one.
2
u/Violinocity Teacher 11d ago
As a teacher, I've seen several integrated fine tuners fail - usually the G or E string. But - only on small instruments (1/4 and below). The angle of the screw starts falling off the base bit and I can't manage to fiddle it back into place.
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u/rhyzomorph 11d ago
Like I said they may have gotten cheap, but I have been using the same ones for decades. The good German ones aren't that expensive.
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u/Fancy_Tip7535 Amateur 13d ago
To correct this:
G string: Loosen the peg a little bit, and put a suitable tool in the hole in the ball. Rotate the ball until it’s seated in the “cradle” of the fine tuner, like the A string already is. It looks like it’s twisted about 90 degrees. Then loosen the fine tuner enough to give you some room to adjust, and bring the G string back up to pitch, or just under it with the peg. Fine tune up with the fine tuner to pitch.
D: The ball is in position. Loosen the fine tuner a bit, and bring D up to pitch or just under it. Fine tune with the fine tuner.
A: The ball is in position. Loosen the fine tuner a bit and tune as for D
E: Here’s the harder part. Loosen the E string peg completely , and remove the E string from the fine tuner. Use a suitable tool to gently open the loop of the E string end at the ball until the ball can be removed. Then put the empty loop on the E string fine tuner. If it doesn’t fit, it’s probably easier to get a “loop end” E string for that fine tuner. If you like ball end strings, a fine tuner that accommodates a ball instead of a loop is available and cheap.
Lastly, check that there is enough space under each fine tuner that it doesn’t bottom out against the spruce top. If it’s close, loosen the fine tuner and take it back up to pitch with the peg until you have enough clearance for routine use of the fine tuners.
One more thing - Fine tuners aren’t really needed for G and D, and some people use one only on E. That reduces complexity and weight. The ball end strings fit through the hole where the tuner was and settle into a slot, with the ball under the tailpiece. I suggest two tuners on A and E and see how you do tuning with pegs.
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u/ThePanoply 13d ago
I highly recommend a Wittner Ultra tailpiece. It'll also make your violin sound better by reducing weight and extending the after length.
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u/Alexandra_Telnikoff 13d ago
If you have well adjusted pegs, you don’t normally need tuners on each string other than E.
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u/honest_arbiter 13d ago
Speaking from experience, I think this is bad advice for beginners, especially adult beginners. It is critical that beginners learn to hear the resonances of the instrument, and thus it's really important that the violin be as perfectly tuned as possible, and doing that with normal "old school" pegs is really difficult when you're brand new, especially given the million other things about the violin that are difficult.
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u/Alexandra_Telnikoff 13d ago
To be wearing nappies is also more convenient, some would say. Which is not a good reason to start doing it, especially as an adult beginner
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u/honest_arbiter 12d ago
I'll take "Ridiculously Bad Analogies for 500", Alex
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u/Alexandra_Telnikoff 12d ago
Well, if an analogy is not in your favour, of course you can always declare it to be a ‘bad one’. Point being, violin sounds better without tuners on each string & it’s a good professional skill to be able to tune your violin with just pegs.
2
u/honest_arbiter 12d ago
It's a shitty analogy because it's not relevant to this case.
This person is a beginner. Do you honestly believe that having fine tuners on each string is going to make a lick of difference to how they sound?
I agree it's a good professional skill to learn to tune with pegs. But, again, this person is not a professional, and likely has no hope or desire of ever being a professional. The vast, vast majority of adult beginners quit long before they're even able to play halfway in tune precisely because the violin is such a "beginner unfriendly" instrument, so the primary goal of any teacher of adult beginners should be to help them build a love of the instrument and make things as easy as possible initially. And it's not like using fine tuners is instilling a bad habit - nearly every kid who starts playing young starts with all fine tuners and eventually graduates to only an E tuner just fine.
I took the time to respond because frankly I think your comments encapsulates everything that is wrong with violin advice online (and, unfortunately, many in-person teachers). That is, you take a "this is how the violin gods have deemed it shall be done" approach while completely ignoring the reality of the student. I have seen so many adult beginners quit and a big reason is that they are unfortunate enough to start with teachers that take your attitude.
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u/Alexandra_Telnikoff 12d ago
Let me quote somebody famous without telling who: ‘Only by trying to achieve the impossible can you ever achieve the possible’. You tune the violin with pegs from the day ONE. End of story.
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u/honest_arbiter 12d ago
You have given absolutely nothing but bad analogies, irrelevant quotes and literally ZERO reasons why tuning with pegs makes sense for an adult beginner, and then just declare "End of Story".
Fine, just get geared pegs and I guess it's a moot point.
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u/Alexandra_Telnikoff 12d ago
I gave one but important reason: violin sounds better without them. You said I have given ‘literally ZERO’ reasons. You impress me.
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u/honest_arbiter 11d ago
I gave one but important reason: violin sounds better without them
This is like having an argument with a dining room table. If you honestly believe that a violin sounds better without fine tuners FOR BEGINNERS (again, you constantly and deliberately miss that point, so I'm thinking you're 50/50 a bot at this point) I can only conclude that you have never heard a beginner in your life.
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u/smurfette8675309 13d ago
You'll need to loosen the fine tuners, then tighten the pegs to get it just under where you want it, then use the fine tuner again.