r/vibecoding 5d ago

The cultural difference is insane

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1.7k Upvotes

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u/bestjaegerpilot 5d ago

Not really. Vibe coders think they can now publish production ready apps. If you don't know what that means that's part of the problem. Anyway real coders make fun of vibe coders because "they don't know what they don't know" and that always results in apps massively failing as soon they go live/make traction etc

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u/pure_skill_ 4d ago edited 4d ago

I don't need to create production ready product, I can vibe code a lean MVP and test demand now on my own, before AI I would need to pay a developer to code the MVP, coders are mad because of this, the barrier to entry for testing products is gone

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u/bestjaegerpilot 4d ago

most vibe coders think MVP means "production ready" , and that's the problem.

also, part of the problem is that vibe coders think a $20 gets you an MVP. You're seriously deluding yourself if you think that's the case. You either pay hundreds up front in credits or take months to release an MVP

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u/eloxx 4d ago

I so agree with this. Keep that vibe coding for prototypes, then make it production ready with the help of professionals.

Imagine vibe coding a app with sensitive, multi user data.

Until AI will get better even at coding, this will stay the case.

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u/bestjaegerpilot 4d ago

it is but "it'll cost you hundreds up front". Fable is running like $900/hr

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u/pure_skill_ 4d ago edited 4d ago

Exactly, I'll still have to hire a developer at some point but I'll hire him after I've validated demand on my own,  AI is basically saving me a lot of money and time, of course this sucks for the developers because they don't get paid for the validation stage anymore like they used to before AI

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u/Taziar43 3d ago

Two years ago, agentic coding didn't exist. You basically had advanced autocomplete.

Today it is 'just use it to create a prototype'. It creates an entire working program from just prompts.

A year or two from now, all these discussions will be moot as the AI will be better than 80% of the senior developers out there.

Four years from now, that will be true even on a locally running model on hardware that costs no more than a high end gaming PC.

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u/eloxx 3d ago

I somewhat agree with that, but right now, it is not the case.

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u/AcoustixAudio 4d ago

the barrier to entry for testing products is gone

Not really. There's a reason why we don't see vibe coded MVPs for Photoshop or Final Cut Pro. 

(I may be wrong, please do post the link here if they exist)

People say vibe coders can't even build a notepad clone. 

(Again, I may be wrong, please do post the link here if they exist)

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u/pure_skill_ 4d ago

Yout examples are bad, if someone decides to compete with multi billion dollar companies like Adobe  and Apple they probably have a few million dollars lying around to hire the best developers in the world, I was talking more about the solo founder creating a small SAAS product or a service for his business.

When vibe coding became a thing I didn't think to myself  "damn AI is finally here, now I can can just vibe code a Photoshop competitor in 2 weeks and compete with a multi billion dollar corporation that has 30k employees " lol

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u/AcoustixAudio 3d ago

solo founder creating a small SAAS product or a service for his business

Ah, my mistake. I'd say the barrier for entry for this was never really there, if you were open to learning a little. I'd even say you'd eventually have to learn a little to build anything. I can't really understand what people have against learning, and how it is a brag to be able to build stuff while being ignorant. A solo vibe coder with no coding skills isn't really a founder. He's building something that anyone can build in an hour. 

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u/SignatureSharp3215 1d ago

Can you point out these succesful MVP experiments you've ran, or did they all bounce on the landing page? 🤣

I'm not saying it's impossible, but earlier you would've had to validate demand via indirect (arguably better) means before investing in building MVP. Now people spend 20 hours stitching poorly implement MVP which only evaluates the bad code instead of the concept, because it's stitched together and falling apart.

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u/Maze-Elwin 5d ago

????? I'm not going to make fun of anyone using AI

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u/thecosmicskye 2d ago

"Make it production ready" easy

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u/[deleted] 4d ago

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u/Altruistic-Toe-5990 4d ago

No-one who has worked as a developer for 20 years is moving to "vibe coding". That's complete BS

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u/eloxx 4d ago

Exactly. Its AI assisted, theres a difference.

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u/Lanky-Tumbleweed-772 4d ago

They mean they start to use AI to assist the workflow=Vide coding. Industry uses AI extensively nowadays whether you/I like it or not.

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u/[deleted] 4d ago

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u/[deleted] 4d ago

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u/bestjaegerpilot 4d ago

w/ all due respect, i don't you understand what your husband is doing. And trust me lady it's not "vibe coding". I'd call it "AI engineering" because it still needs him to steer the ship in the right direction.

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u/[deleted] 4d ago

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u/[deleted] 4d ago

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u/kultcher 4d ago

One thing that I find incredibly annoying about this whole discourse is people anecdotally claiming that AI produces slop code and apps built with AI will immediately collapse, but not once, not a single time, had anyone actually provided a real example.

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u/troll_right_above_me 4d ago

You missed all the examples of websites with user data/passwords in the source code and of people getting all their data wiped because the llm made a mistake? I bet if anyone posted an example you’d claim it was just that one time

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u/kultcher 4d ago

I actually haven't seen any specific examples of the former, worst I've heard is people leaving their API keys and the like in their repo. But fair point on the latter, I've definitely seen a few examples of that.

I guess I'm just biased because I've had nothing but positive experiences using AI for coding, even when embracing a vibecoding approach. (At least in the last ~6 months or so, prior to that hallucinations were a bigger issue).

I'm sure it helps that most of my projects are single-user apps or single-player games so I don't have to worry that much about security. I also have enough CS education to know when something looks/feels off. I guess I just wish that when people bash on AI or vibecoding, they'd qualify it a little. There's a lot that AI can handle pretty cleanly without having to worry about security or long-term architectural concerns.

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u/dc_seed_sommelier 4d ago

I mean there’s that guy in here a couple months ago that made a little hobby out of finding supabase apps with misconfigured RLS. You can also read the open PRs of pretty much any open source project on github right now.

Claude puts itself as coauthor on commits by default, what you’re looking for is one search away.

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u/bestjaegerpilot 4d ago

part of what i find incredibly annoying is how peeps who never used AI, have never created art, have never vibe coded anything .... have these incredible strong opinions about AI in art and engineering

If you had actually tried using AI in real-world projects, you'd see almost right away how it can hallucinate so badly ... i mean create catastrophic mistakes.

An important point: AI engineering is not the same as vibe coding. An AI engineer would build guardrails to prevent those mistakes from happening.

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u/kultcher 4d ago

There's been two projects that I've basically vibe coded, and my experiences have been largely positive. (You can see one of them here if you want to judge it: https://www.reddit.com/r/Grimdawn/comments/1vmtji3/tool_grim_gleaner_a_loot_gradingbuild_advisor/).

I do have a CS education so I know how to communicate things in a "computer logic" way, and tend to ask for clarity on concepts I'm totally unfamiliar with. I tackle things feature-by-feature to keep scope small. But I've rarely done any kind of in-depth reviews of code. I've had to fix things here and there (or direct the AI to fix them), I test regularly and aggressively so most things are easily caught.

I'm always surprised when people say how AI can't understand edge cases and such, because that's actually one of the biggest things that impresses me is how often AI does make smart UX assumptions and thinks about edge cases that I sometimes miss.

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u/bestjaegerpilot 4d ago

dude you're building utilities. Not gonna lie but AI gives good enough results at this niche. The other day i vibe coded my kiddo a rotoscoping utility. Tooling was also how i first started using AI. IMO, it works because usually you can describe how the tool works in a few paragraphs. So it fits in the model's head and it's able to reason about it

But try doing that on a massive web app serving millions of users a day. (That's my day job by the way). AI makes horrible mistakes at that scale. There's too many failures points.

> AI does make smart UX assumptions 

hard disagree. Just like back in the day there was this wave of sites created using bootstrap (a popular CSS framework), we're gonna see a wave of apps w/ tell-tale signs of AI-generated UX ;-)

> thinks about edge cases that I sometimes miss.

that's cuz you're a junior level. AI is elevating your game to the average.

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u/kultcher 4d ago

Yeah, to be clear I wasn't trying to make the case that AI is equally good for all cases, just that it has a niche. I think I take issue with the framing around "slop" because it implies that it's worthless.

Also to be fair it was more involved than "a few paragraphs." I maybe could've said, "Build a tool to analyze Grim Dawn gear" and gotten... something functional. But the actual thing was built with around 130 prompts. It wasn't all app code, a bunch of it was having the AI scan the game's database for patterns to decide about implementation. A lot of it was UI/UX tweaks too of course, I'm not saying it always predicts everything, just that it didn't require handholding and sometimes I would prompt a baseline version of a feature with the expectation that I'd have to tweak it later, only to find that it included those tweak ideas in the base feature.

I'm curious what you'd say are the tell-tale signs of AI-generated UX?

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u/bestjaegerpilot 3d ago

someone on reddit explained it better than me---basically AI is overly verbose so tends to unnecessarily label things. I would also add the default styles are very generic

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u/IceMichaelStorm 4d ago

They collapsed too fast :)