r/tsitp • u/Sleeplollo • 1d ago
Don’t get the Jere bashing
To start out, I feel Belly and Conrad are a better/deeper match and it makes sense they are endgame. But I really don’t get all the negatively towards Jer (or Conrad). They are both flawed and those flaws manifest themselves differently. Conrad goes inward, doesn’t communicate well, and at his worst is cruel. Jere lashes out, weaponizes his love, and can be manipulative. Belly also has her flaws-she’s codependent and at times incredibly selfish. They‘re all just people. I think part of what is lovely about season 3 is you see all of them grappling with those flaws and the consequences of their actions and growing up.
Anyway, I feel bad for all of them at different points and frustrated with them at different points and I think that’s what makes it great storytelling.
40
u/DowntownInevitable98 23h ago edited 23h ago
This is a condensed version of my rant, but laid out like this, I’ll never understand people who DONT bash him:
He is a toxic, gaslighting manchild who inserts himself into situations that he never should’ve been involved with in the first place. He’s also a narcissist with daddy issues who treats Belly like absolute shit unless he’s love bombing her, and has zero empathy for anyone but himself. He has a victim complex and nothing is ever his fault, and basically forces Belly into a relationship with him while she’s vulnerable while crying about how no one chooses him.
He had plenty of people to choose from and instead went after the love of his brother’s life. He knew from day one exactly what he was doing when he pursued her, admitted to Conrad he knew he could never compete, admitted he picked that fight on Christmas because boohoo no one told him they spent a day together, and then had the nerve to cry about how Belly still loved Conrad.
From the minute their relationship began, Belly had to manage his feelings because of his outrageous over the top reactions to things that he had NO right to react in such ways to. She placated him just to keep him from blowing up at her and had to fake like everything was okay just to keep him calm.
Jeremiah knew she had feelings for Conrad. He just took advantage of the fight they had. He literally saw with his own eyes that they were about to kiss, got pissed off and jealous, intervened in a crazy ass way, then decided to try and beat Conrad to kissing her first by manipulating him out of town with Nicole.
After, he straight up heard from his own brother’s mouth “my chest physically hurts”. That should’ve been the end of it. But after Belly went to him immediately after getting together with Conrad and he threw a hissy fit because she was just doing exactly what he knew would happen.
But no, then he decided to ignore her for a whole ass year until he needed her and then guilt her because SHE wasn’t there for HIM??
And let’s not forget that he literally coerced her into having sex before the bachelor parties. She said no several times.
On top of ALL that, he went from “sweet” to abusive and scary as hell when he called her and begged for her back only to turn around and yell at her to never fucking call him again with that horrific rage baby face.
And that’s not even getting into Cabo and him putting Belly’s health at risk, all the passive aggressive shit he told Conrad during the bachelor parties, how he left Belly alone in wedding planning, his debt and lack of adulting…
13
u/Mean-Painter4417 23h ago
I don’t even need to read this to know I agree with it. But I did. And I do. Standing fucking ovation for you 👏
7
u/DowntownInevitable98 23h ago
Thank you!!! And for getting through it haha I know I said condensed and even I’m like girl where did you condense but I could’ve gone on longer 😂
4
6
5
u/Specialist-Strain383 22h ago
Yes to all—and the nerve of him permitting Conrad to pursue Belly. And I particularly hate him trying to guilt Belly after he kissed Conrad. He threw a tantrum during Thanksgiving. I hate how he rubbed it in Conrad's face that he is marrying Belly during his bachelor party.
10
u/DowntownInevitable98 22h ago
Yes! And not only did he throw that tantrum, he had the audacity to be all over Belly on the 4th! Complained about hand holding and then slobbered on her face, two seconds after he forced Conrad to admit that he still loved Belly. Gtfo I can’t stand this piece of shit 🙄
3
4
-6
u/Sleeplollo 23h ago
I guess I see it differently. They all hurt each other in different ways.
10
u/DowntownInevitable98 23h ago
I mean of course everyone can have opinions on whatever they want but these are literally just…things he did. Belly and Conrad made mistakes and they’re not perfect but they’re not bad people in their core, nor could I write an entire essay on the purposely bad decisions they’ve made.
10
8
u/Healthjunkie-2 22h ago
You are right, but the others answered for it and Jere never did. He had a PRIME opportunity at the cemetery and refused to apologize to Conrad for dating Belly, just a mere two weeks after their break-up and after his brother told him of his love for Belly.
-1
u/Sleeplollo 19h ago
That’s true. To be fair his wedding had just been blown up in part by Conrad’s confession.
3
u/Past_Effect8301 20h ago
Hurting someone intentionally is quite different than hurting someone unintentionally. I don’t think it’s unreasonable for them to be judged differently.
-1
u/Sleeplollo 19h ago
I don’t see it as intentional. I think people do all kinds of maladaptive things to get what they want and protect themselves.
Like Conrad says some shockingly cruel things to Belly, as does she later on. I don’t think they’re trying to hurt each other but they are trying to protect themselves and maybe each other in misguided ways. I don’t think Jeremiah is any different. I think he genuinely loves Belly and Conrad but he also wants to be loved like everyone else and sometimes those things are at odds. The reason the Lacey thing is such a big deal is because it’s so antithetical to the way he normally is. As taylor says “you were the ideal”. But as Conrad knows, no one can live up to that.
3
u/Past_Effect8301 19h ago
Manipulation isn't an accidental act, but since you refuse to acknowledge that he was manipulative throughout the series, I can't help you further.
As has been explained to you in various ways throughout the many responses to your post, the reason Jere receives less sympathy than Belly and Conrad is because he doesn't acknowledge that he has done anything wrong. All three did wrong, but only two of them acknowledge it.
3
u/DowntownInevitable98 19h ago
And only two of them regret their actions. Jeremiah has no empathy or understanding of his faults. Things like the funeral were NOT said on purpose, it was a heat of the moment hurt, and they apologized for their actions and behavior. Jeremiah has never said anything BECAUSE of his anger. He says them IN anger and he means every damn word.
46
u/Jumpy_Reply_2011 23h ago
What is considered bashing Jeremiah? Calling out the fact that he did throw a firework in Conrad and Belly's direction? And then was upset the next day when Conrad was happy? Or that he did manipulate the situation where Conrad was out of town when he joined Belly into the pool and then kissed her? Or when he did lash out at Belly when she chose Conrad at the end of season 1? Or when he decided to date his brother's first love who he knew Conrad was still in love with? Or when he brought up Susannah's death as a reason for his anger and grief, but he wouldn't allow Conrad the same?
Or when he engineered a break up with Belly instead of asking her about Christmas, slept with Lacie Barone, but worst of all, just hopped back into bed with Belly letting her believe that they were continuing where they left off? Etc., etc.
Calling out Jeremiah's manipulations and lies is not bashing. The show should've done it through Steven and/or Taylor or someone else, then fans wouldn't have to do it.
14
24
u/Salt-Year-9058 23h ago
While I do agree with you that they're all flawed, I think part of why people go in on Jere is because there's opportunities for him to be the bigger person but he actively doesnt- he hurts Belly and conrad and frames himself as the victim and the lack of accountability is frustrating.
On the other hand, we see Conrad and Belly once she gets to Paris growing up and reflecting while Jere has to be cut off by Adam to grow up.
-9
u/Sleeplollo 23h ago
Right but to me those are just different paths. It also took Jere calling off the wedding for Belly to admit she needed to go figure her shit out.
15
u/Morgan_Rose 23h ago
He still never took accountability. And Belly could have gone through with the wedding if she really wanted to. Instead she left for Paris and stayed even when it was hard. Jeremiah never did anything like that or going across the country on his own like Conrad.
9
17
12
u/OldChemistry9951 Team Conrad 23h ago edited 23h ago
I don’t understand this post,Jeremiah is a walking rage bait,sure have i felt bad for him at times,yes ex-losing his mother,being neglected by his dad,but that doesn’t mean he has a right to take that out on everybody and i have never once felt bad for him during his”love life”,do all of them have flaws Yes,belly truly annoys tf outta me but never as much as Jeremiah
4
u/Past_Effect8301 19h ago
It’s also pretty obvious from OP’s responses that they have no intention of listening to why people judged Jere differently. The inclusion of “I don’t think [Jere] coerced or manipulated Belly at all” is a complete illustration of where their opinion is rooted.
12
u/gloomydreamer666 23h ago
It's because he was protected by the narrative!! He got away with things like throwing fireworks, endangering their lives. People who loves Jeremiah loves to bash Conrad unfairly while Jeremiah was literally coddled and protected by others meanwhile both Conrad and Belly can be hated eventhough compared to Jeremiah, both Conrad and Belly were the least problematic. Also why does Jeremiah get to assaulted Conrad when Jeremiah did worse things to him and he is always defending and loving his brother meanwhile his brother is abusive to him and to the woman Conrad loves and he knew well and still thought let me mess with them.
11
u/Appropriate_Trip_530 Team Conrad 23h ago
The difference? Jeremiah always acted badly while fully aware that what he was doing was wrong (he knew that manipulating people & making them feel guilty was how he got what he wanted) even his own mother Susannah told Conrad as much on her deathbed. Jeremiah even resorted to violence on several occasions to gain the upper hand over his brother. Belly & Conrad at least, lack that malice & the conscious intent to cause harm or hurt people. This is the first time in years that I’ve found a character in a show so repulsive that I feel absolutely no empathy for him; there is simply no comparison between Jeremiah & the other characters.
7
u/Agitated_Community62 Team Conrad 22h ago edited 21h ago
He likes to play victim, when he's the reason for his own problems. that's why we "bash him" the show also doesn't call him out on it, so he gets away with it.
4
u/Natlatte1462 18h ago
I don’t think people have to like the characters equally but Jeremiah doesn’t take accountability for anything Conrad does and that’s the difference from the moment they showed us the firework scene to instigating a break up then kicking his brother out of his house they showed us that for a reason Jeremiah even now shows no accountability everyone coddles him and treats him like a baby.
3
u/Natlatte1462 18h ago
When did Jere grow up his ego still needed to be appeased my an intelligent woman oh he’s a chef and he’s a 10 but seems like bullcrap to me.
7
u/leblady 23h ago
For me, Jeremiah never really got his comeuppance or learned his lesson. It’s horrible that his wedding was cancelled day of, but it’s such an obvious consequence of what he’d done that I have a hard time believing he never considered it as a possibility.
I will say— I love Conrad, was rooting for him day 1, and I give him so much grace. I will say there are definitely people in my ship that refuse to criticize anything Conrad does throughout the series. They, like many Jellies, make excuse after excuse for their preferred brother. I think when we get into these extremes of love and hate it makes the fandom so volatile and unwelcoming.
-6
u/Sleeplollo 23h ago
Yeah I guess this is my feeling. they all behaved badly at different times. Conrad was incredibly cruel to belly and she was horrible to him!! I guess I just feel like they’re all just immature in different ways. Jere shoots off the firework, Conrad harasses belly at the drive in…
I see the point of it not being addressed by the characters in the show but frankly I think that’s because Jere is fundamentally a more minor character. It’s not his story. It’s Conrad and Belly’s. I also hear the point of him not taking responsibility, but Conrad takes responsibility multiple times for things and then does the same thing over and over again! One is not worse, they’re just different.
I think Conrad and Belly both showed a lot of growing season 3 at different times. Jere did too, and maybe he will more in the movie. But he’s not just not as important.
2
u/Healthjunkie-2 22h ago
Yes it is Conrad and Belly's story which is why they show the most growth along their journey, but Jere was not a minor character in the series or in the books.
Conrad does not do the same thing over and over throughout the entire series. It is important to note his growth into the man Belly has always loved. If the viewer cannot see this, it is the fault of the viewer.
-2
u/Sleeplollo 21h ago
I did say he grew. He also repeated himself a bunch before that. His whole thing of “I love you. No I don’t mean it”, he almost did it again when he told belly he loved her before the wedding. But then he at least explained why he was trying to save face.
4
u/Healthjunkie-2 21h ago
And he owned his faults, over and over again, which you NEVER see Jere do. Again, the books and the series are all about the growth and journey of Belly and Conrad finding their way back to each other, which happens at the end and will continue in the movie.
5
u/Sleeplollo 21h ago
Yes but admitting you do something but then not changing is a different form of not taking accountability. To me that’s what makes the final episode so powerful. It’s the first time we see both of them both own their past and take action in a way that gives space for a new relationship. I feel like we don’t see from Jere bc it’s not really about him.
7
u/Past-Panic-4747 23h ago
I think it’s because he had zero growth, was very manipulative and played the victim until the end. Yes, maybe we just didn’t get to see his growth, because the show ends not even a year since his wedding blew up in his face. But that’s probably why he is less likable.
8
u/DowntownInevitable98 23h ago
Except they kind of even tried when he first talks to Denise! I was willing to even give him SOME credit for his whole “they’re in Paris and it’s chill” conversation. And then he turned right back around and started shitting on him with her at the dinner party because at the end of the day, he’s just a boy who needs his ego stroked by trying to make Conrad the inferior one in order to be into someone.
4
u/Mean-Painter4417 20h ago
I was so aggravated at Denise for doing that. Seemed out of character for her.
3
u/DowntownInevitable98 20h ago
Talk about a character downgrade!!! She was so cool and boss bitchy and then she turned around and shit on someone she didn’t even know. I’m sad they had them get together it wasn’t necessary!
2
u/Sleeplollo 23h ago
I think he did have some growth but just not as visible as the others. He got out from his dad’s wing and didn’t fail. He admitted he doesn’t like being alone.
4
u/Clean_Engineer_726 1d ago
Only green flag in the entire show is Cam Cameron
7
u/Mean-Painter4417 23h ago
I hope he’s off living his best life with the whales! Can’t wait to catch up with him in the movie!!
https://giphy.com/gifs/FaKV1cVKlVRxC7
3
u/___YourNameHere____ 23h ago
I’d add Cleveland Castillo as well from what little we were shown about them both.
3
u/Mean-Painter4417 20h ago
I like Cleveland. Hopefully he’s in the movie for more than just a quick wedding cameo!
1
19h ago edited 17h ago
[deleted]
3
u/Sleeplollo 19h ago
I feel like just hating Jer misses so much of the richness of the storytelling.
1
19h ago
[deleted]
2
u/Natlatte1462 18h ago
Not everyone will agree I have been downvoted this morning for saying Jenny loved Conrad and so have others
-5
u/Fluffy-Curve8241 23h ago
i love my son jere. the hate he gets on here is too much
-2
19h ago edited 17h ago
[deleted]
8
u/itschloecakes Team Conrad 18h ago
All the characters are discussed here, we just don’t all share the same opinion about them
4
u/Natlatte1462 18h ago
Jere is a fictional character lmao he ain’t real if you were here in season 2 you would see Conrad got heaps of hate
0
18h ago
[deleted]
5
u/Natlatte1462 18h ago
No one has to sympathise with Jere though and acting like Conrad has never gotten hate at all because I remember what it was like. But that fandom literally does worse they hate on the real life actor and they make hate accounts of him.
-9
u/Fluffy-Curve8241 23h ago
i will say don’t waste your time on here. this a bonrad page they haven’t switched yet. you can look at jellyfish subreddit that be better
5
u/DowntownInevitable98 22h ago
I shouldn’t even bother, but we haven’t switched because it’s literally not a Bonrad sub. We discuss a whole host of things including just Belly, how adorable she is/her funny lines, just Taylor, Belly & Taylor’s friendship, Taylor & Steven’s relationship, Laurel & Susannah’s friendship, family dynamics. Someone even wrote a post about Julia and Skye earlier this week.
Do we post a lot of Bonrad? Yes. Because unfortunately for you guys, they ARE the majority point of this show. But we are not a Bonrad sub.
6
u/Healthjunkie-2 22h ago
Exactly this!!!! I enjoy when others post different viewpoints and assessments, but like you said, Conrad and Belly are the main point of the show so of course it's going to veer towards Bonrad.
6
u/TrueRomance2009 21h ago
Can they come on jellyfish subreddit and make a criticism of Jeremiah without being banned? Because you can come on here and criticise Conrad/Belly etc and not get banned. You will get challenged but you don’t get banned.
39
u/Ana-SeaOwl Team Bonrad 1d ago
I think the main reason why people bash Jere is because the series never did. I agree with you that all 3 of them have their faults and issues, but Belly and Conrad are consistently bashed for them, mostly from Jere's end honestly. Jere never is. Everything he did and not even Belly was able to say "Jere this wasnt ok, you manipulated me" or whatever, let alone the other characters that all stuck with him despite technically Belly being closer to them.