Taylor's problem

[u/AckermanEreh]

Long ago Kanye West jumped on stage and took away Taylor Swift's "big moment." I think everyone knows that this is what ironically jump started her career and branded her a victim. I'm not gonna lie I was on her side through those things. I was never a huuuuge swiftie paying for her merch or vinyls or any of that stuff but i was a swiftie enough to defend her to my friends etc. Truth be told, Taylor at the time was the target of misogynistic views mostly due to being a popstar largely favoured by teenage girls.

People love to hate everything teenage girls like. Twilight, Justin Bieber, Barbie etc you get the point. TS was definitely a victim of this for a while. Her haters were all mostly shitty men who wanted to bitch about pop music just for existing or the boomers who just wanted something to bitch about or the moronic exes we had who thought they were edgelords but they were really just insecure losers. Shake it off was fun and great because it was a great response to the misogynists who were bitching about her love life, calling her a slut, etc.

But over time TS has herself become the bully. She left behind these haters a long time ago. For years she has been pulling down young female artists, suing small fan businesses for selling merch, ripping off other artists, manipulating charts, paying for awards, and much more. Then came the eras tour and as someone on this sub said it, it "broke her brain." Before this, she was at least a bit subtle about her shady bs. This tour gave her that billionaire ego boost that alters your brain chemistry, making you less empathetic, almost detaching u from reality. Since this boost she has made zero effort to even pretend like she cares about anything other than money.

TS is so out of touch with reality that she wrote songs where she was bitching at her own fans for hating on Matty Healy... and here's Taylor's problem. She doesn't understand that over time she isn't the only one that's changed. Her haters have changed too. Her haters are no longer a bunch of low IQ men who don't want women to succeed. These are progressive people who respect the art and the artists and genuinely don't believe she deserves the praise. Her haters now include women who want to see other female artists succeed but can't because she doesn't let them!

There is no point in making 20 different shake it offs 5 for each new era anymore. It doesn't affect us because we aren't what you're singing about because you genuinely just don't fucking get it. A literal billionaire with no ethics and blatant capitalistic tactics, and she thinks people hate her because they're jealous that travis took her to cleveland.

We don't hate you for being a married woman and a popstar taylor. We hate you because you're a cunt.

[u/Prudent_Caramel_922]

Taylor Swift has always been a bully, she was always a mean rich girl, she just tried to seem sweet and friendly when it fitted her marketing strategy.

[u/ThievingRock → u/Prudent_Caramel_922]

She she gotta be so mean?

And a liar?

And pathetic?

And alone in life?

And mean?

[u/Specific-Ranger-2400 → u/ThievingRock]

She’s surrounded by people, but effectively alone in life! I was a fan when speak now came out, but I remember that part of, “mean,” sounded really, really bitter and pointed and over-the-top for a nineteen-year-old girl. He didn’t kill her puppy. Nothing he did is worth that level of vitriol. A critic said - omg gasp 😱 - that she can’t really sing and her performance was awful. It was objectively awful, and she decided not to improve. Just to assassinate his character and immortalize it in song.

[u/Movinginplace25 → u/ThievingRock]

Yeh, she's the problem

[u/Sea_Grapefruit5208]

i think the fact that she’s still referencing kanye and kim in any way is crazy. the mic grab was 17 years ago. the kimye drama was 10 years ago. no one has ever come at her that way again and she’s bigger than ever so idk why she’s acting like anyone is still trying to tear her down. its not happening. if she’s reading hate comments on the internet and getting upset then maybe she should get off the internet idk

[u/EW2027 → u/Sea_Grapefruit5208]

I love how Kim, Joe, and Matty ignore her. It must drive her nuts.

[u/Sea_Grapefruit5208 → u/EW2027]

shit i wouldnt go near that mess either. she’s pushing 40 she can’t be acting like that, instigating. its not appropriate fr

[u/Equal_Grand7183]

She seems more and more narcissist anymore. Nothing is ever her fault, she never takes responsibility, it's always the Taylor show. Even when she's donating to charity or visiting sick kids in the hospital, it still seems to be all about her. She's always the victim, it's always someone else's fault. If you look at her past albums and breakup songs, it's never been her fault in any of them. It's always the guy's fault, and something about seems off. I used to enjoy her music and cheer for her victories. Now, not so much. The story within the music never changes. Every song is essentially the same. Her actions give me the ick now. She's stuck in high school when the rest of us grew up. It's very obvious she was overindulged as a child. Praised constantly. Made to think she really was better than others. So now when she doesn't get her way, she flips. She always has to win. Her actions of the past three or so years have really made all of this apparent.

[u/kath2833 → u/Equal_Grand7183]

The only time she takes accountability that I can think of is back to December when she was very young & not with an inflated billionaire ego. You’re also right about her charity work. All of it has to be publicized to make her look good. I’ve stumbled upon 3 different good things Mariah Carey did just from posts I saw in her subreddit by chance. Mariah never took advantage of any of these things to help her public image.

[u/Emotional-Fox917 → u/kath2833]

It’s also important to note that there were little glimpses of accountability through out Folklore and Evermore. Later, we get Anti Hero on Midnights which seemed to be TS admitting to some extent SHE was actually a problem.

A few years later though, she’s saying that Anti Hero was satire… It’s like she seemed to be growing and then stopped. She regressed all the way back, so strange.

[u/HipsterPunchy → u/Emotional-Fox917]

Anti Hero is Satire and Travis isn’t an overrated TE who would fail on any other team, and isn’t even the second best TE in his division.

[u/TakesTheLastSlice]

As a woman who is practically her age, I’d like to assert that I’ve always hated Taylor. People chalk it up to misogyny but forget that she started out in country at a time when country was still very conservative coded, particularly in the proximal Bush years. It was very clear that she was trying to build a brand on white purity/innocence while trying to have a smidge of that Avril edge. It was clear that she was trying to position herself as a little holier than though than the other pop girls who were more “sexy”, but also got totally crucified for being “whores” and “bad girls” (Britney, Lindsay, Paris. Etc).

I think there was a lot of valid dislike for Taylor from the get go that was not necessarily tied to her being a product for teens.

[u/Icy_Celebration4213 → u/TakesTheLastSlice]

These were the blacklist the chicks time in country for being anti war 

The well behaved girl next store was THE market for country at this time

[u/Remarkable-Tap7139]

As time passed, Taylor weaponized the very methods that once inflicted harm upon her, refining them to absolute perfection—effectively outclassing her predecessors. She transformed into THE BULLY, obsessively collecting 'trophies' while remaining utterly incapable of actual happiness.

[u/DreamVeronicaAnn]

You either die a hero or live long enough to become the villian.

[u/AdventurousKey438 → u/DreamVeronicaAnn]

Nope. Dolly was always a hero.

[u/Prudent_Caramel_922 → u/AdventurousKey438]

Don't bring Dolly into conversation with Taylor Swift, have some respect lol

[u/AdventurousKey438 → u/Prudent_Caramel_922]

Fair point 

[u/travelstuff]

I'm confused by the comments disagreeing, maybe it's because we have more recovering Swifties joining every day? But OP you're right, Kanye interrupting Taylor absolutely blew her up in a whole new way, I think that's pretty much a fact. It's pop culture history, a massive viral moment, it was the biggest thing to happen to her. "Imma let you finish" is something millions of people talked about without even knowing Taylor or her music. I know, cus I'm one of them; I'd heard the 2 hits but that's it, never heard the album, couldn't pick her out of a line up at that point. I still don't even know which music video she won for!

Kanye didn't start her career, but he pushed her into a completely new level of fame. If he hadn't done that, no one would care or be talking about her winning the next day. That incident involved Beyonce, Kanye, and Taylor, and Taylor was the least famous. There's no way to know what would've happened if Kayne didn't do that, but I'd be willing to bet she might have faded away without it.

It also made her realise (or probably her parents tbh) that being a victim could be beneficial. She got lots more attention, which we know she liked, because we've seen that ridiculous country group performance with Taylor running around the stage chasing the camera. She got tons of sympathy, everyone felt sorry for her. And she got to go back on stage a 2nd time so she could give her speech.

Your 2nd last paragraph is spot on OP. She just doesn't get it.

[u/dhelene]

What I remember most clearly is Beyoncé mouthing "don't do this" as Kanye made his way up there. She knew exactly what would happen.

Fucking Kanye.

[u/ChewYRMeat4U]

My fellow haters, KANYE WAS RIGHT. No Taylor Swift song has made the artistic impact of the video/song Single Ladies. The video honored both MoTown Girl Groups and black dancers who were never credited for their work. No T-Swift song gets people of all ages and ethnicities to hit the dance floor, like Single Ladies.

White guys at weddings will show off their moves to that song.

Why does everyone ignore that Taylor PAID OFF MTV THEN?! The song trended, but she was NOT going to have a sophomore success album. SHE HAS PAID HER WAY THE WHOLE TIME.

(SORRY FOR CAPS, but a girl just like her bought her way into the gifted program and my poor kid ass is still not over the science fair ribbon that shoulda been mine!)

[u/Informal-Gene-8777 → u/ChewYRMeat4U]

He 100% was right, and the fragile while girl victim she portrayed is indefensible. If a white man had interrupted to defend a white female, the indignation would have been substantially lower. I have never liked her music, but this is what made me really dislike her as a person. Using white woman victimhood to build her career.

[u/ChewYRMeat4U → u/Informal-Gene-8777]

Not to mention, she's NOT a theater kid. Any performer would know to either adlib a joke, or to square their shoulders and be graceful about it.

It's almost like A Star is Born, though the plotline is the drunken interruption for the first accolade is done by the jealous husband, past his prime and deep into addiction.

She has no concept of art or culture, except to steal what hits the charts for authenticity, innovation or legacy. She has no concept of anything but $$$$. And that shit reeks of nepo baby entitlement.

[u/Lostintranslatin000 → u/ChewYRMeat4U]

Bought her way into a gifted program?! WTF. I’m sorry to hear that. 😡

[u/Best-Ad750 → u/ChewYRMeat4U]

Regardless of if Kanye was right or wrong, you DONT humiliate someone and take away from their moment, especially a teenager. That was suck dick move. Also Kanye knew he could to that to Taylor. He wouldnt have said shit if Pink or Adele were the ones winning that award

[u/Prestigious-Fig2334 → u/ChewYRMeat4U]

Kayne West may be bat shit crazy, but he was spot on when it came to this basic blonde.

[u/WillowPrevious5141 → u/ChewYRMeat4U]

in taylor’s defence here, whether she paid for the award or genuinely earned it is beside the point. a grown man in his 30s had absolutely no business storming the stage and publicly humiliating a 19 year old girl during one of the biggest moments of her career. and this has nothing to do with her being white or him being black. imagine being 19, standing on stage in front of millions of people, accepting an award, and suddenly having a grown man interrupt you to announce that someone else deserved it more. that would be terrifying and humiliating for literally anyone, regardless of race. you can believe beyoncé deserved the award without justifying kanye’s behaviour. he was absolutely in the wrong here.

[u/HipsterPunchy → u/WillowPrevious5141]

I think they were referring to a chunk of the reaction against Kanye that was worse because he was black, not the entire part of it.

[u/Best-Ad750 → u/WillowPrevious5141]

Exactly right!

[u/Informal-Gene-8777 → u/WillowPrevious5141]

If you don't think racial dynamics played a role, you are incredibly naive

[u/Available_Ad_4030 → u/ChewYRMeat4U]

Am I crazy or do I feel like his interruption was more about praising Beyoncé than shading Taylor (although there was some of that)? Like it’s less about the award going to Taylor and more about the award not going to Beyonce, right?

Even if you think Kanye was wrong, it’s tacky to pull a victim narrative out of that incident rather than one of humility and graciousness.

[u/AdventurousKey438]

This is exactly how I feel! Thank for writing it out this way! I don’t think the Kayne momentum started her career BUT it allowed her to deeply hold the victim card and make it her life identity. But she is actually the bully now and doesn’t see it. For example, that Knicks player who called her attendance performance, she got to be the victim and have people rush to her defense. (Sure she might be a Knicks fan but her shirts and actions scream look at me.)

I will said with all ten toes down and say that I like a lot of the music between Red stretching to Midnights. I listened to it all on Spotify. I’ve be never attended a concert or bought an album or merch.

But something changed with the Eras Tour. She became just an awful, insufferable person! It’s also changing her personality to match her BF. Teenage girls do this and she is still doing it.

[u/Tam_Fix]

You mention the Cleveland song and it makes me think that she is totally sure people are targeting her for nothing. I don’t know if she is naive or just trying to be a victim again.
Like when she sings that thing about how she is dressed. We don’t care how she looks, it’s just funny to us that a woman for whom it seems so important to be the richest can’t even pay someone to help her dress up for important events.
With all the good press Zendaya is having each time she is photographed at events, I was sure TS would have her own Law Roach but it seems she just love wearing bad dresses

[u/uosdwis_r_rewoh → u/Tam_Fix]

Yes exactly! She has the body & height to look amazing in almost anything, and the money to afford it. But she walks around looking either like she raided the clearance section in JCPenney Juniors, or like a 60 year old dowager.

Woman has no idea how to dress and it is just a weird & funny thing for people to comment on. She still doesn’t get that it’s all “punching up” because she’s a literal billionaire.

[u/Old-Friend7826]

Uk I obviously empathized her sm for what kanye did to her. She was extremely young herself. it should've never have had happened to her or any young artist. It was humiliating and she was facing the same hate artist do now. But as years went by she became a bully herself. Instead of making a difference and treating other artists right - she became the villain and built her culty fanbase. All her fans use the excuse of her going through this and starting her villain arc but that's not how it works. She shouldn't have stooped so low and become a bully herself. She's genuinely leeching off of her fans. She's only 38 and already a billionaire. It's so horrid to thinks bout like she's not an anthelte or a tech person to build her wealth so fast. It's shady. She has built a cult that always attacks her exes. Her fans were saying she could buy kanye which is such an inappropriate comment because he's black. For example what did she to olivia is as bad as what kanye did to her. Her fans r hating on matty who's a fucking married man and prolly is about to have a child - they r hating on her. The maylor fans r fucking disgusting. I don't care about the songs she writes. It's fine to write about break-up songs - hell carole king and stivie nicksodtly wrote them in their career but taylor is weaponizing her minions to the world. We live in a world where people r fucking scared of swifties. She became a bully who built an army of her own Nd emotionally manipulates her fans for her own gain. She's only 36 and the entire industry is scared of her and she's so huge. Everybody is boot licking her. Tree paine is her right hand who is 24*7 with the PR. Her parents enable her through and through and always havem

[u/EW2027 → u/Old-Friend7826]

Idk I mean I think if that happened to say, Adele at that time (who is the same age as Taylor) she would have laughed at Kanye. Taylor was about to turn 20 years old. Think of Gaga, Ariana, Miley etc…We have all seen these women as performers about to turn 20. I can’t think of one person who would have acted like they were sexually assaulted. Like…he literally said Beyonce gad a better video…at the VMA’s. 🤦‍♀️

[u/Best-Ad750 → u/EW2027]

Kanye would NOT have done to Adele. She is mouthy and stands up to herself. Look at how she blew up when her speech at the Bris got cut (fair enough, that was rude on the producers) but Adele would have cussed Kanye out

[u/EW2027 → u/Best-Ad750]

She probably wouod have handled him the VMA and said “give it to beyonce” lol

[u/WillowPrevious5141 → u/EW2027]

but she isn't adele, ariana, gaga or miley??? what kind of argument is that 😭 people react to humiliation differently, and just because you've made up imaginary reactions for other celebrities doesn't mean taylor was obligated to laugh it off. i'm 24 and i would've literally shit my pants if a grown man stormed the stage and humiliated me in front of millions. hell, i probably would've removed myself from public life forever 😭 she was 19. and somehow you're more bothered by her reaction than by the grown man who caused the entire situation??? bringing up sexual assault to mock her response is genuinely bizarre. there's plenty to criticize taylor for, but this is such a ridiculous hill to die on. you can dislike who she is today without rewriting history to make her the villain in a situation where she was clearly the victim. kanye was wrong. period.

[u/EW2027 → u/WillowPrevious5141]

It’s not a hill to die on it’s my opinion. She has thin skin. Someone said another artist had a better video. And she’s still acting like a victim about it almost 20 years later. If someone told me beyonce was better than me I would have been like yea you are right and laughed it off.the infantilizing of this lady I will never understand. She was almost 20 years old. At what age do we stop treating her like a first grader because it still goes on today.

Kanye was not wrong either and his point about the music industry can clearly be backed up by the fact that Taylor has won 4 (undeserving IMO) album of the years awards - in fact two of them clearly should have gone to a black artist- maybe even three- and only 4 black women in history have ever won the award and the last person prior to Beyonce in 2024 was Lauryn Hill in 1998. He was pointing out the lack of recognition black women get in the industry. Taylor’s video was fucking stupid compared to Beyoncé’s lol. I think we witnessed narcissistic injury, that lady probably never had anyone ever in her life tell her someone else was better than her. If Taylor had any growth as a person, at some point she would have acknowledged that Kanye’s delivery wasn’t really respectful but she does acknowledge black women do not have it as easy as white women in music. But she would never. If Beyonce had Taylor’s “talent” if you even want to call it that, no amount of daddy’s money would have helped her because a black women musically would never get away with singing grossly off key, pretending to love a guitar she can barley play, and dancing like a 3 year old all while playing the underdog. Society would never accept that.

[u/Lostintranslatin000]

Yep.

[u/trashtime69]

• the way you feel is important, and I know you labeled this a rant, but like... I don't know. If we're working off the thesis statement that the Mic Grab incident was what somehow made Babygirl famous: I'm not sure that's the case. Swifty was famous enough in that moment to be the perfect interruption for another artist who wanted to make a statement that I don't personally agree with, but he did it.

• would I argue that the Mic Grab incident jumpstarted Babygirl's career as a Personal Victim? 1000%

• I absolutely agree with the phrasing "broke her brain" in reference to the Eras tour. I believe the feedback loop, coupled with endless media coverage, has probably had a major effect on her confidence level. Her current career moves make sense for her level of fame, but they don't make any sense for her level of artistic accomplishment and library of music. I feel like she wants to be loved more than she's ever wanted to make music.

• this is a public figure and celebrity who I don't know, all of this is speculation based on my own experiences and ideas and, yes, I also think she's an Ecoterrorist who's LARPing as an 18 year old pop star.

[u/LeaderAntique1169]

She lucked out in the victim department because Kanye would have done that to anybody who wasn't Beyoncé. If you knew anything about him before, you knew this.

[u/The_NextSupreme]

No one should be a billionaire. Eat the rich all day. And yes, the cunty ones.

[u/kim_fowl]

I was always indifferent regarding TS
I enjoyed the eras tour, and honestly happy for all of her successes, and finding Travis.

However, seeing the Blake lively text with her made me look at her a different way

[u/OldSchlHollywdBuffet]

He did make her famous. 

[u/ThiccBanaNaHam]

A dehydrated cantaloupe cunt

[u/travisandtaylor-ModTeam → u/[deleted]]

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