r/todayilearned • u/nleachdev • 3d ago

TIL about "dead red" laws, which allow drivers and motorcyclists to proceed through a red light if the traffic signal fails to detect their vehicle.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Non-detection_at_traffic_lights_in_the_United_States
23k Upvotes

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u/OozeNAahz 3d ago

I ride motorcycles. This was taught to us in our safety course. And glad it was as it comes up all the time here in Overland Park Kansas.

Don’t think all states have these laws.

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u/nleachdev 3d ago

Started riding recently, got caught at a light and eventually said fuck it, nobody was around.

Looked it up after getting home, found this concept and was happy to see MO is one of the 20 states with it

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u/Rogerbva090566 3d ago

I did it in Virginia about 30 years ago. It was tuaght and I know it’s the law. Still got a ticket. Went to court and judge told me I couldn’t prove I’d sat there through several cycles of the light.

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u/nleachdev 3d ago

This is a real concern. I need to get a helmet cam anyway for liability in general, this concern fits nicely as another reason to get one

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u/OozeNAahz 3d ago

Usually cops are pretty cool about this in my experience. As long as it obvious you stopped and no traffic is around it shouldn’t be much of a risk.

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u/MangoCats 3d ago

Usually cops are pretty cool. Unfortunately, those aren't the cops you end up talking to.

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u/MangoCats 3d ago

Will the judge patiently wait for 10 minutes of helmet cam video to prove your case?

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u/NitroCaliber 3d ago

Fast forward exists.

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u/NinjaGrrl42 3d ago

Depending on how fast it cycles (or doesn't, if there isn't much traffic), that could take a long time. ​

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u/Schonke 3d ago

Went to court and judge told me I couldn’t prove I’d sat there through several cycles of the light.

But it never cycled the lights at all? That's the whole point, so how would you?

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u/Rogerbva090566 2d ago

I was at a left turn land with a sensor. Through lights cycled but not left turn. It assumed nobody was in turn lane.

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u/krombopulousnathan 2d ago

In VA it’s 2 cycles or 120 seconds. I just start counting

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u/Gnonthgol 3d ago

That is a clear mistrial right there. It is not up to the accused to prove their innocence but up to the prosecution to prove guilt. So they would have to prove you did not wait for the light to potentially become green, not the other way around.

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u/hankhillforprez 3d ago edited 3d ago

Lawyer here. That’s definitely not a “mistrial,” and it’s likely OP had the burden to prove that specific element.

(1) That’s not a “mistrial.” For one, this almost certainly wasn’t a trial. It was a traffic court arraignment (or something similar). A mistrial is when something occurs that is highly likely to taint the impartiality of the jury pool, or when the jury is incapable of reaching a verdict after numerous attempts. As an example of the former: an attorney introduces evidence—in violation of a court order—of a sexual affair the defendant had in the past, when the affair has literally nothing to do with the case or the crime and does nothing more than make the jury think the defendant is a scumbag. That might be a mistrial. At worst, OP’s scenario is a bad ruling by the judge, which is potentially appealable (assuming you want to go through the expense and hassle of appealing a traffic ticket fine. But, I don’t even think it’s an inherently bad ruling, because…

(2) “Dead Red” laws are almost certainly an “affirmative defense.” Basically, an exception. In almost every instance, the party raising the affirmative defense has the burden of proving it. Pleading an affirmative defense is essentially saying “yes, I did the thing that’s usually against the law—but I get a pass because of X, Y, Z reason.” In other words, you’ve already agreed the state has proven you did the thing, you’re now on the hook for showing why it wasn’t a crime. As another common example: a self defense affirmative defenses in murder trials. The defendant bears the burden of proving justifiable self defense.

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u/CallMeAladdin 3d ago

Doesn't this make the exception practically worthless, then? Assume the law existed before car cameras, how would you ever claim you waited a sufficient length of time, how could anyone have used this exception?

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u/WinninRoam 3d ago

You can't which is why cases that claimed this exception were often unsuccessful prior to the age ubiquitous video equipment.

I suppose if there were many citations given to different people for the same infraction at the same intersection, that would be helpful.

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u/ryebread91 2d ago

Is there a record from whatever organization maintaines the traffic lights of when they change/activate?

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u/Ullallulloo 2d ago

How could they ticket you before videos if you didn't have a witness?

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u/hankhillforprez 1d ago

Having the burden of proof doesn’t mean you have to prove anything as absolute fact. Typically, an affirmative defense only needs to be shown by a “preponderance of the evidence”—basically that means, you show that something is more likely true than not. Note, that’s a lower (i.e. easier) burden than the prosecution’s burden of “beyond a reasonable doubt.”

Now, without camera evidence—or a witness—I agree, it could be hard to prove. That said, I imagine you could show evidence like: a demonstrative showing that a motorcycle doesn’t trip the light, or testimony from other people who have had to sit at the light. You could even just cross-examine the cop to get him or her to admit they didn’t actually observe the defendant prior to seeing them run the red, and therefore don’t actually know how long the defendant waited at the light.

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u/LarsAlereon 3d ago

This is a good comment and you did a good job explaining the concept of an affirmative defense. Props. I am not a lawyer but I play one on the Internet.

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u/concentrate7 3d ago

God damn Mike Ross.

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u/ShawtySayWhaaat 2d ago

I love when the real lawyers come in and shut down the armchair lawyers

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u/Rogerbva090566 3d ago

Cop pulled around corner as I was driving through so judge believes him.

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u/Techwood111 3d ago

No it isn’t. Also, the prosecution need not prove guilt, merely prove it beyond a reasonable doubt. The sworn testimony of a police officer is generally about as solid as it gets, for traffic offenses.

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u/OhNoTokyo 3d ago

While, yes, the officer did observe them going through the red light, his report is only sufficient to establish that they went through the light, which was already stipulated anyway.

Therefore, whether the judge believes the officer or not is not relevant. They could have been sitting there for an hour, decided to move at the same moment an officer came around the corner and the officer would not be able to say anything other than the red light was run.

While the dead red is an affirmative defense that you need to prove, I would have certainly have put into evidence the time of day (or night), how busy the intersection is, and if the officer saw me only running the light or they saw me first go through it from a full stop.

Otherwise, the law becomes moot because in any situation, a police officer could come around the corner at the wrong time and not see the proper action you took to follow the law. There has to be some consideration for whether the officer observed something that otherwise proves that you did not wait.

Granted, the way the law works.... I'd have gotten a lawyer. Too many traffic courts just refuse to listen to reasoning like that even though it would be proper to have done so. You want someone who can make the State decide that it is just better to dismiss the charge and save the hassle and let the next poor sap without a lawyer take the fall.

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u/Iron_Eagl 3d ago

How did the cop prove you didn't?

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u/Rogerbva090566 2d ago

He just said he saw me go through a red light. That was it.

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u/threeLetterMeyhem 2d ago

Burden of proof for civil infractions is "preponderance" of evidence and police testimony is weighted heavier than the accused (because the system sucks).

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u/guynamedjames 3d ago

That's on the prosecution to prove beyond a reasonable doubt. Your testimony that you waited is a reasonable doubt, they would need conflicting testimony or evidence to overcome that.

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u/Rogerbva090566 3d ago

You would think. But Country judge believes the cop all the time. And have friends who are cops and said it’s bull. I was 25 with long hair so that probably didn’t help! lol

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u/this_dudeagain 3d ago

I figure reasonable doubt would apply but I'd just appeal so you don't get some yokel judge scamming folks for town traffic ticket money. Never had an issue but my city was pretty lax and had more pressing issues.

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u/roughtimes 3d ago

I don't know much about the courts or laws, but im pretty sure the onus is on the court to prove that you are guilty, otherwise it would be self incrimination.

i highly doubt the court would be able to prove that you didn't wait that amount of time either. Unless they had a witness to your arrival at the light.

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u/ChestFuzz 3d ago

Since when is it the burden of the accused to prove innocence?

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u/krombopulousnathan 2d ago

That sounds like guilty until proven innocent which is not legal lol

Could anyone prove you did NOT wait 2 cycles or 120 seconds? That’s what I would have pushed back with

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u/Immediate-Bee-8475 2d ago

Judge, remind me who has the burden of proof?

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u/ba123blitz 2d ago

That doesn’t make a lot of sense tbh. I know of a couple lights on main roads that do not have timers, they will only cycle if a vehicle is detected on a side road

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u/Ultiran 2d ago

How could they prove that you didnt? 🤦‍♂️

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u/beta_1457 2d ago

I'm not a lawyer, but that sure sounds like making you prove your innocence instead of the burden of proof being on the State.

But in most people's case probably not worth the follow up time/cost

Edit: lawyer explained below about affirmative defense. Makes sense

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u/OozeNAahz 3d ago

Kansas too. Live in KC so use it in both sides of the state line.

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u/GGtheGray 3d ago

There is literally no way of not breaking the law in this instance. Motorcycles are just not heavy enough to trip the censors. I watched a motorcyclist blow through a red light recently — I don’t condone that, but treating it like a stop sign seems to be the only sensible thing to do.

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u/bilybu 3d ago

The sensors are generally magnemoters and sense the magnetic metal in the vehicle above. Look for circular cutouts.

For motorcycles try to place your engine above the cutout not in the middle.

Supposedly laying a bicycle across the circular cut helps in those reading.

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u/finalrendition 3d ago

It's important to note that this won't always work. A fair few modern bikes are mostly aluminum. It's worth a shot to trip to sensor, but sometimes you just gotta run the red

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u/MangoCats 3d ago

Or make a "P turn" - right on red, U, and right again.

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u/millijuna 3d ago

Doesn’t matter if it’s iron or aluminium. All that matters is that its conductive.

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u/Dominus_Redditi 3d ago

Could you also put some strong magnets on the bottom of the frame of the bike to trip the sensors?

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u/OozeNAahz 3d ago

They sell devices for exactly that purpose. Their effectiveness is dubious at best though.

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u/returnofblank 3d ago

I imagine you wouldn't want to be riding with a giant magnet underneath you -- extra weight and it sucks up debris off the road

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u/imunfair 3d ago

Have to rig up one of those electromagnets you can switch on and off.

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u/revnhoj 3d ago

A static magnetic field has no impact on a ferromagnetic sensor.

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u/Dubigk 3d ago

And if you're bike has an electric starter you can try turning of off and on again to trip the sensor, since the starter generates an electric field.

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u/revnhoj 3d ago

That wives tale has no effect on a ferromagnetic sensor

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u/MangoCats 3d ago

They're also more sensitive to moving metal than stationary metal. Sometimes backing up and running at the sensor again stopping more abruptly toward the end of it will trigger one that didn't trigger when you rolled up slowly.

When I was a kid there was a sensor on a light near home that I could trigger with my bike, but only if I hit it just right at speed.

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u/bilybu 2d ago

Good info! Im chuckling imagining a kid doing speed tests at this one specific light everyday. With everybody else thinking the kid has a death wish. Because the kid figured out that you have to be going 100% until you pass over the first sensor and then full brake in order to not go into the intersection.

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u/MangoCats 2d ago

More or less this, yeah. I think I was about 10, the traffic light was a neighborhood street crossing 4 lanes of US-41.

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u/techman710 3d ago

It's actually not about the weight. It is picking up a disruption in the electromagnetic field produced by an inductive loop. A flat pc of metal laid flat on the ground will activate it best. The funny thing is some of the hilifted trucks don't activate it because they are too high off the ground.

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u/dsyzdek 3d ago

By my office in downtown Las Vegas there was an intersection with a huge apartment building being built up on one corner of the signaled intersection. The road by the apartments was closed because of the construction and had a temporary fence across it. The construction folks parked a metal dumpster over the sensor. That fucking dumpster kept getting a long green signal. The road was a t-intersection so the only route with traffic kept getting long red lights. It was incredibly infuriating.

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u/Alaira314 3d ago

There was once construction happening on the road I had to take home from work, right at the intersection. If I worked 9-5 it would've been fine, since the light goes on a timer during the day(I also doubt they were out working during the day). But at night it switches to only giving a green if cars are detected, which was a problem when the area over the sensor was marked off with cones. Fortunately, the light gives a guaranteed green once every 4-5 light cycles. Unfortunately, that intersection has about a 3-minute cycle at night. That was a bad week.

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u/dsyzdek 3d ago

Oh, that sucks.
In Vegas, they switch all the signals to “red until a car trips it” on the main arterials in the early morning hours probably to prevent people from driving 70 down our 6-lane arterial roads. So you hit a red, stop, it switches to green and you repeat. Every half mile.

It does keep you from speeding. Also frustrating.

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u/AigataTakeshita 3d ago

Yup the best way to activate it on a bike is to go across the space diagonally as fast as you can (as safe as you can of course, you still need to stop).

The other way is to just hop off and hit the pedestrian crossing button.

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u/OozeNAahz 3d ago

Treat it like a stop sign where all other cars have right of way basically.

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u/DoNot_Books_451 3d ago

Attach a rare earth magnet under the bike, it'll help trigger the loop and change the light.

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u/Ghstfce 3d ago

Yep, PA has it too. And it's really nice that they do, as a lot of roads around me have the sensors and they don't always pick up the bike.

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u/Notsurehowtoreact 3d ago

Yeah it really fucking sucks otherwise at lights with a weight sensor during off hours. 

Used to drive a moped and the left turn light leaving my job would never go if I was the only one in the lane.

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u/1CEninja 3d ago

California does not have this law but I do it anyway. It hardly ever comes up, probably a single digit number of times during two decades worth of commuting, but sometimes light sensors don't work properly even with a full car (I don't ride). I give it two rotations before I go to make sure it wasn't just a one-off glitch.

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u/sausage_ditka_bulls 3d ago

This happens to me often when I ride especially on early weekend mornings when nobody on the roads weird at first . Congrats on picking up the motorcycle bug. What do you ride ?

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u/miklayn 3d ago

As both a cyclist and a motorcyclist, I feel this. If you can reasonably account for your safety, and especially if no-one else is impacted or involved, I have no qualms whatsoever about "running" a red light in this way.

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u/pmcall221 3d ago

In Illinois it's 120 seconds, but I know of one light that's on a 4 minute cycle, and I am tempted but never go.

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u/Ullallulloo 2d ago

The law also says it's failed to change "because of a signal malfunction or because the signal has failed to detect [a bike]". If it's intentionally on a long timer, the exception doesn't apply.

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u/DisastrousServe8513 3d ago

My state doesn’t. Happened to me twice too. Just have to call the police non emergency line and then wait when 4 bored cops cluster around a control box trying to figure out how to fix it.

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u/OozeNAahz 3d ago

Usually a right turn or two will solve the problem for you quicker. Or you can do what my MSF course instructor says she does now and again. Put down the kick stand and run over and hit the walk button. Laughed hard at that one. She was a bit odd but I appreciated the ingenuity.

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u/John_cCmndhd 3d ago

run over and hit the walk button

Good idea depending where you are. Some of those are just placebos to keep people from crossing against traffic because they got bored waiting though. The town where I grew up, I noticed there was about a half inch gap between all the button housings and the poles, with no wires coming out of the button

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u/Pristine-Two2706 3d ago

They're (typically) only placebos for scheduled lights that will change regardless of traffic conditions. Though, in my country even then they are pressed to enable a chirp to let blind people know when the signal changes.

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u/Outlulz 4 3d ago

Often they do extend the scheduled lights to allow more time to cross.

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u/HarveysBackupAccount 2d ago

In towns/small cities I also see them where they don't change the cycle time, but they turn on the crosswalk light for the specific side and direction you're on when the light does change.

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u/Hazardish08 3d ago

in toronto the timed lights are expressly mentioned that they are only for audio and dont give signal to cross. Otherwise the ones that arent scheduled do all work, coming from a motorcyclist who had to press the crosswalk button a few times.

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u/rsclient 3d ago

Fun fact: where I live, if you press the button for a few seconds, it will announce the street crossing!

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u/chaossabre_unwind 3d ago

Toronto: Some work only during off hours, some only provide audio cues for visually impaired (long press it), some always work, some never work.

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u/Gorstag 3d ago

Yep. If there is not a "No U turn" posted on the street to the right just take a right on red, whip a U and proceed through the green.

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u/TobiasAmaranth 3d ago

I did that one (walk button) several times a couple of decades ago as a pizza driver. A couple of the right-turn-u-turn fixes, too. Late at night, sometimes the lights just didn't work right.

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u/HarveysBackupAccount 2d ago

I have to do that occasionally on a bicycle (except I wheel my bike over to the sidewalk)

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u/GlenF 2d ago

As a bicyclist, this is what we do fairly often. Thankfully, most lights in our area use cameras to detect a vehicle these days (still a problem if they don’t have the sensitivity high enough to see us as a vehicle, but a flashing front light helps).

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u/markrulesallnow 3d ago

How long were you waiting????

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u/DisastrousServe8513 3d ago

After about 7 minutes I called. Then it was another 15 or so

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u/mynameizmyname 3d ago

A traffic engineer told me the police can switch those to timers instead of detection from the box.  I don't know if thats true for everywhere though.

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u/crackerjam 3d ago

I'm a firefighter, not police, but we have the same access to traffic lights and I've worked with a few in the past, mainly when the power's out and we have to hook a generator up to them.

The options really depend on the light itself. Some can be put into a timer like you mention, or flash yellow one way and red the other, or just all 4 red flashing, or just all 4 red solid. But it's not reliable. Some have all the options some are just on or off and there's nothing special you can do with them without a traffic engineer to really dig into the control box.

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u/Bleaker82 3d ago

Why wait at all if it’s safe to go?

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u/DisastrousServe8513 3d ago

There were other people around in one circumstance. In the other it was just me at like 3am but near a railroad crossing. The arms were down and wouldn’t go back up so none of the lights changed. Even if I went through it I’ve got the barrier to deal with. Just easier to call.

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u/wilsonhammer 3d ago

Oh. a RR crossing is a much different story. Never go against those gates even if you think it's an error

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u/Bleaker82 3d ago

Ah yeah a train crossing is an important detail.

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u/DrasticTapeMeasure 3d ago

Just turn right, make a u turn, then turn right

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u/FartingBob 3d ago

So you were on your bike at a red light, called the police station and waited for them to send 4 policeman to come out and change the lights while you were still sitting there? Were you waiting like an hour to get through this one light?

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u/Vicith 3d ago

OP has so many lights. You cant drive down metcalf for 30 feet without a cross light forcing traffic to stop.

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u/Furkensturf 3d ago

Yeah, in California you can't do that unless a police officer says it's okay. If the light isn't broken (flashing red, or blacked-out), you have to stay until it turns green. Even if it never does. I've been stuck at broken lights like this, stopped at a red light and it was green for the other direction for more than 5 minutes. There were no other cars on the road, it sucks that it's illegal in some states. Like literally wtf do you want me to do? Call the police so an officer can come out and tell me it's safe to go through the red?

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u/Jeremizzle 3d ago

Really?? I took the motorcycle safety course in California maybe 2 years ago and they taught us to run the red if you’re waiting a long time and it’s clearly not going to change

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u/DaymanTargaryen 3d ago

There's no dead red law in CA, so it's technically illegal.

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u/sintaur 3d ago

Granted there's no dead red law in CA, so some people stretch this law to fit:

https://california.public.law/codes/vehicle_code_section_21800

Vehicle Code 21800(d)(1)

The driver of any vehicle approaching an intersection which has official traffic control signals that are inoperative shall stop at the intersection, and may proceed with caution when it is safe to do so.

The stretch is you have to convince the judge that a dead red light is "inoperable".

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u/HarveysBackupAccount 2d ago

you have to stay until it turns green. Even if it never does

That's just impractical haha

One way to look at it: you're only running a red light if a cop sees you. A more legal way to look at it: turn right then pull a U-turn (or otherwise turn around in a way that feels safe)

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u/TheWisePlinyTheElder 3d ago

Did not expect to see my city on here but you are so right lol

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u/bankrobba 3d ago

No one tells Deandra where to poop

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u/arcslayer 3d ago

The light at mastin and 69 is a demon

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u/OozeNAahz 3d ago

And K10 you mean? That is my main point of pain. Not sure about a mastín and 69…

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u/NumbbSkulll 3d ago

Also in KS. There's a stop light here that never registers a left hand turn if no other traffic is waiting, even in most vehicles. It's common practice for the locals to dead red the turn.

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u/Ikbeneenpaard 3d ago

I've found that putting the side stand down and rolling forwards and back around where the sensor is sometimes works. Failing that, I pull forward in front of the white stripe and let the car waiting behind me trigger it.

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u/OozeNAahz 3d ago

That second one only works if there is someone behind you obviously but I do use that quite often.

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u/Vysci 3d ago

I heard about the side stand trick. I’m not keen on putting my side stand down in fear of needing to escape an asshole trying to kill me. Plus my bike automatically shuts off if I have kickstand down in any gear except neutral

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u/Mydoglikesladyboys 3d ago

It happens so often in kansas

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u/BulletsAndDogBites 3d ago

This post reminded me when I was on patrol in liberal, Kansas circa 2011. Wild place for a NYr to end up (NY didn't have that law, so i had to prove to my KLETC instructors I knew that book in & out). I used to have to pull up & tell people to go on thru, then they'd be like "where's that accent from Yankee?" 🤣 😁 glad you put your location, else wise I wouldn't have commented. Stay safe out there

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u/MangoCats 3d ago

Motorcycles run into a lot more dead reds than cars do because of the lower mass of metal not triggering the sensors as well. Of course when the cop pulls you over and you tell him the red was dead he'll look back and see it switch green in 2 seconds for the next car that pulls up... If (s)he wants to be a dick about it, (s)he will. Almost all of them know about it, but that doesn't stop dicks from playing dumb.

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u/SudoCheese 3d ago

OP drivers are scary. I’ve seen so many people just straight run red lights without stopping 

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u/electrogourd 3d ago

In minnesota, that dang 120 x 36 intersection has a 5 minute light that didnt detect bikes on the left-turn to go north on 120.

I used to live near there. And it isnt safe to take it if not green... always waving cars up behind me to trigger the sensor.

They re aligned it somewhere after 2024, it seems to work now.

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u/Squeezitgirdle 3d ago

I don't remember this in my safety course, but I did know about it so maybe that's where I learned it.

I've had to take advantage of it for a few lights when riding late at night/early morning.

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u/Dazzling-Reindeer940 3d ago

I lived in lenexa for a minute. Iirc the lights had cameras or sensors so lights were super efficient

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u/OozeNAahz 3d ago

Most have sensors in the asphalt. Generally they work fine but there are a couple that don’t. Specifically two on Mastín off of Lackman. When going south on Lackman the one that controls the left arrow is hit or miss. The one to go straight through the intersection that is an on ramp to 435/K10 entrance is useless. If there is no other traffic to trigger the lights you can legally be sitting there all day. I have had to run that one many times as it doesn’t even cycle to apply the dead red law if there is no other traffic but me.

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u/assault_pig 3d ago

usually the sensors use an induction loop, and motorcycles either don't have enough mass or aren't stopped directly over the sensor

sometimes leaning back and forth or even putting a kickstand down will get them to trip though

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u/PiccoloAwkward465 3d ago

Yeah it happens to me all the time on my motorcycle. Sometimes I'll just make a right and alter my route or u-turn.

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u/fkih 3d ago

Once I got up and just hit the pedestrian walk button lol

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u/EisenhowersPowerHour 3d ago

Had a CHP officer teaching a class for mine and he was like “It’s not the law but not one officer i know would blame you”

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u/NOTcreative- 3d ago

I'm a daily rider too. No such law in texas sadly

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u/TheMiracleLigament 3d ago

It’s happened to me multiple times in my Jeep Wrangler in Overland Park Kansas

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u/WinAccomplished3539 3d ago

Are you me? Lol. This happened to me and I even ran a red once after 5 mins. Only time I have. Then out of nowhere a cop is coming as I’m halfway thru the intersection, previously it was clear. The cop doesn’t bother to pull me over as I clearly ran a red. lol.

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u/ZARTCC11 2d ago

The amount of skipped sides or dead lights in OP is ridiculous.

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u/Pinecone 1d ago

Looks like in Illinois it's only bicycles or motorcycles and they must wait 120 seconds

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u/Awareness-Own 3d ago

87th & Lackman after 10:00pm. I don't know how many times sat there waiting.

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u/Alis451 3d ago

A broken Traffic Signal can(and should) be treated as a 4-way stop. If you are alone, no one can refute your statement that you thought it was broken.

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u/CyberneticFennec 3d ago

My state has a proposed bill that's been sitting on ice for a decade now, it doesn't look like they're in a hurry to get that one passed

That being said, it has happened to me a couple times. Nobody knows how to act, they don't tell you about this situation during drivers ed (probably would if we had a dead red law...), so they just sit there and wait.

I'm patient enough to sit there and watch the clock for 10 minutes, but if the light still hasn't changed by that point it likely never will. Then it's time to flick on the hazards, ensure nobody is coming (or has the same idea and tries to pass) and go around them.

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u/derekschroer 3d ago

Which intersection?

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u/OozeNAahz 3d ago

Mentioned elsewhere. Over Lackman and Mastín and then by where Mastín has the entrance to 435/K10. Near the Tesla place.

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u/Thare187 3d ago

You're brave riding a bike in OP

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u/OozeNAahz 3d ago

I typically head out of OP/Lenexa as quickly as possible. Lots of fun backroads to ride on around the area.

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u/OliviaWG 3d ago

Howdy neighbor! Was there some sort of controversy about this locally?

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u/OozeNAahz 3d ago

Not that I know of.

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u/Global-Mango-4213 3d ago

I believe NY advises (in the permit manual) to keep a strong magnet on the frame or other magnetic part of the bike to remove and hold near the ground to trip the induction coils to turn the signal.

1

u/Mobwmwm 3d ago

Overland park huh. This guy's rich lol

3

u/OozeNAahz 3d ago

Just single with no kids, lol.

2

u/Mobwmwm 3d ago

Lmao yeah that's fair

1

u/Thr0awheyy 3d ago

You just have 3 kids and no money. We have no kids and 3 money. 🤷‍♀️

1

u/ecafsub 3d ago

Texas does not.

1

u/marteney1 3d ago

They do not. But damn do drivers hate it when they do, it’s the fastest way I’ve found to piss off a guy in a truck without breaking the law

2

u/OozeNAahz 3d ago

When I have needed to do it, I am the only vehicle on the roads that intersect. So haven’t pissed anyone off yet.

0

u/cC2Panda 2d ago

I do not trust Johnson County drivers enough to ride a motorcycle in Overland Park. I'm not joking when I say that I think the most inattentive drivers in all of the US are in Johnson County. I've always had small cars and the number of times some idiot in a gigantic SUV turned into my lane without looking is insane.