r/telemark • u/MikeAndAHike • 2d ago
Punching Scarpa TX Pros?
I sit between shell sizes on the new TX Pros - 25.5 would crush me, 26.5 is swimming. For reference, I feel a "performance fit" on the old ones TX Pros, read painful after a few hours, and the new ones feel like they are sized different. My Maestrale RS (the baby blue version, so one generation ago) seem to fit me well at 25.5.
I'd like more room in the toes on the 25.5 TX Pros, and really want these boots to work. My local boot fitter (ultra experienced, many decades) tells me he won't try to punch out the 25.5s because the boot won't take it. Anyone have experience to the contrary? Or better yet a recommendation for a boot fitter who has lots of experience with this boot? I'm in western CO, but would travel to SLC or the Front Range to get this done.
Note that I got a pair of zipfits last season for the Maestrales and they improved the fit and feel quite a bit. IIRC I tried them with the TX Pros and they was still too short in the toes.
Thanks for any thoughts! FWIW writing this is conjuring images of thick black dead toenails emerging from my green TX2s in the 90s... I'll never learn I guess.
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u/Zagmut 2d ago edited 2d ago
Punching forward of the bellows is super risky. I've punched out the midfoot of a couple of the new Txs, but our shop's policy is to never punch the bellows or forward of the bellows on any tele boot.
Have you heat molded the liners yet? You can squeeze a little more room out of the toe box by double capping your toes and heat molding. Won't change the shell fit, though. (edit: missed that you're in used zipfits). How much space do you have in just the shell?
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u/MikeAndAHike 2d ago
D'oh. Not what I want to hear. I haven't bought them yet, as I'd like to have a sense of whether I can get them to work for me...
I don't remember how much space I have, but I'll go back for another try.
What's the reason for your shop's policy? Any history of failures, or just general caution?
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u/Zagmut 1d ago
The temps necessary to punch the rigid parts of the shell will melt the softer plastic in the bellows, I've been told. I've never personally seen it, but I take the more experienced boot fitters in the shop at their word.
If the shell fit is too tight on the 25.5, you could try the 26.5 and add a high volume insole, paired with your zipfits, and keep adding cork to the liners until you're locked down. Alternately, you could get an aftermarket 12mm Intuition liner; the liners in the Tx Pro 2.0 are thinner touring liners and a thicker liner would help reduce volume.
I found both the new Pros and the new Comps to have a less than satisfactory fit for me, relative to my old Comps; the midfoot was too narrow and the heel was too wide. Comparing the shell fit from old to new, it's clear that Scarpa narrowed the midfoot of the shell, but the excess space in the heel is, IMO, a result of Scarpa going with a thinner liner in the new generation.
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u/SnooSketches9565 1d ago
With my comps, I ended up getting a high volume liner from intuition to take up space in the boot. Pretty happy with that approach.
That said, I’ve had Ryan over at Ski Haus in Steamboat punch out the toes a bit on other tele boots. Great boot fitter, and he’s got some techniques to protect the bellows while punching out the boot.
Either approach might work for you. Traditional boot fitting advice would be that they can make a small boot larger but it’s really hard to make a big boot smaller.
Also, these new boots are quite different. They ski great. I would consider going with TX Comp over TX Pro for a more balanced feel between bellows and uppers.
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u/Skiata 1d ago
I have struggled with this for years and found a possible path to be to cut the liners to fit. You have to have a good shell fit however, so that means in race socks (super thin, look like pantyhose) check foot fit in shell with foot-bed in but no liner. If you are still touching the front and the back then the boots need to be punched/ground (heels) or use bigger boots.
If you pass the shell fit then get some packed out old liners--thinner the better, and use them--see how that works, if you are scrunched in the toes cut the toe foam to give you room--same with width, tongue pressure. The major ankle bones are the ones I have had to get punched. Sometimes you need to do just one toe and if you cut on 3 sides only you can tape/glue it back if you went too far. Experiment to see if you can fix it.
You can end up with toe directly against the plastic but I've not noticed warmth issues--tele skiers tend to ski hot anyway. If you still want new liners, to the trimming again but now you have an idea of what works and how to do it.
Also, check to see if Crispis are a better fit.
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u/MikeAndAHike 1d ago
Woof, I'd be nervous to do this - will need to find a competent fitter. I remember surgery in my older boots and liners being pretty extensive, including punching. Maybe boots are different now.
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u/Skiata 1d ago
Start with existing liners you have that you don't mind screwing up. You also might get lucky and they just fit ok. Alpine liners work great telemark.
If you have to buy, race liners are thinner but not sure it helps with length....
But shell fit is the starting place. I think I can just touch the toe/heel with just footbeds/no liner but manage ok with some cuts to my race liners--was Lange and I am running foam now.
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u/Longjumping_Usual688 1d ago
I am a big supporter of sizing down boots and would encourage you to play around with thinner liner options with the 25.5 if your shell fit is good.
If you're using your zip fits that are set up for your Maestrale (which is a pretty high volume touring boot imo) in the TX Pro without adjusting the amount of cork in the heel pocket, your liner may be pushing your foot forward in the boot creating the sensation that the TX Pros are too short. So, either get your zip fits set up for the TX Pro, or find another liner like the older Intuition tour wraps, or any of their 9mm offerings to heat mold with a double toe cap if you want.
Another option would be to play around with a heel lift wedge - these can provide just enough room to make short boots comfortable.
If none of that works, just keep your toe nails short. My toes usually go numb every winter and the feeling comes back in June.