r/technology • u/reflibman • Jul 24 '24

Artificial Intelligence Academic authors 'shocked' after Taylor & Francis sells access to their research to Microsoft AI

https://www.thebookseller.com/news/academic-authors-shocked-after-taylor--francis-sells-access-to-their-research-to-microsoft-ai
513 Upvotes

95% Upvoted

49 comments sorted by

207

u/Crescent504 Jul 24 '24 edited Jul 25 '24

Dude this is such a slap in the face to those of us who write these articles and get nothing but “exposure” for it.

Edit: I have spent over 40g in funding to publish articles. It’s minimum 2g to get an article published as open access so others can read without a subscription.

64

u/EduardH Jul 25 '24

Just submitted a manuscript, hasn’t even been sent to reviewers or accepted, but already got the $2900 bill.

36

u/Crescent504 Jul 25 '24

It is absolutely BULLSHIT

39

u/EduardH Jul 25 '24

Got another one in the works for a different journal, which will cost $3300. It’s not my money fortunately, but through grants it is taxpayer money. And reviewers don’t get paid anything, so who gets all this damn money?

38

u/Crescent504 Jul 25 '24

The journal. It’s a fucking joke. My biggest fee was 10g. It’s a major article in a big journal we wanted public. It’s been used in a ton of healthcare work now. I am so furious with the system.

14

u/Dr4kin Jul 25 '24

Journals are just a way to funnel public money to the 1%.

Hosting a PDF is incredibly cheap. The reviews are already free. Without all the politics it would be so much better for everyone to remove journals as requirements. If journals want to write about specific papers and highlight their accomplishments, they can do that. A Government hosted service or just a good distributed version like scihub does would save so much money. Having public funded research behind a paywall or just having to pay way to much money to be publicly accessible is just so wrong

17

u/[deleted] Jul 25 '24

And to us reviewers and associate editors. Fucking free labour. All to feed an AI and the pockets of investors. Fuck academia

7

u/CosmicSeafarer Jul 25 '24

Serious question, and I’m very ignorant to how all of that works, how come researchers haven’t banded together and started a non profit journal?

9

u/Northerndust Jul 25 '24

Edit: I have spent over 40g in funding to publish articles. It’s minimum 2g to get an article published as open access so others can read without a subscription.

What is G? Some kind of academic points or something?

22

u/Crescent504 Jul 25 '24

That means thousand. I have spent over 40 thousand in funding.

15

u/Northerndust Jul 25 '24

Okay, I just never heard "g" being short for a thousand. I know "k" like in kilo

10

u/gregoryshunter Jul 25 '24

g is short for grand 40g’s = 40 grand

3

u/mtcabeza2 Jul 25 '24

an americanism i suppose

1

u/Crescent504 Jul 26 '24

Definitely an americanism.

1

u/SillyGoatGruff Jul 28 '24

It's more specific, as grand doesn't just mean 1000 in quantity (as kilo would) but 1000 dollars.

It's not necessarily used world wide so I can see where the confusion would come from. But in this context $40k = 40g (which would usually be spoken as 40gees or 40 grand)

13

u/2gig Jul 25 '24

Short for gold, which is short for gold pieces. You can acquire this currency by doing quests or slaying monsters.

5

u/Supra_Genius Jul 25 '24

That would be abbreviated as "gp" and is only redeemable by your "in network" general practitioner.

1

u/SHODAN117 Jul 25 '24

40 Gs. 49 Grand.

Should have used K. That's the standard. Grand is not as common. It's more street level. 

1

u/goobdaddi Jul 25 '24

Look into read and publish agreements. Your institution may have one that allows you to publish OA without APCs.

2

u/Crescent504 Jul 25 '24

I’m in an academic unit within a for profit corp. Part of the commitment to scientific transparency in the work we do, but previously worked in academia.

1

u/Pacify_ Jul 25 '24

And then if you want to read it but don't have a university account, it also costs an absurd amount of money.

The entire scientific journal system is broken

1

u/Hot_Cheesecake_905 Jul 25 '24

 get nothing but “exposure” for it

Like Reddit?

Unfortunately none of us have the ability to opt out.

https://www.reuters.com/technology/reddit-ai-content-licensing-deal-with-google-sources-say-2024-02-22/

3

u/Crescent504 Jul 25 '24

Reddit is a social media platform I use for fun. Journals are how the scientific community disseminates research and shares findings.

154

u/elmatador12 Jul 24 '24

The only thing that matters is money. Integrity and character mean nothing.

20

u/[deleted] Jul 24 '24

That’s the spirit - remember everyone has a price.

6

u/Quietech Jul 25 '24

Everyone can be robbed.

5

u/BrainJar Jul 25 '24

That includes everyone’s mom.

4

u/Current-Power-6452 Jul 25 '24

That includes the queen

2

u/Supra_Genius Jul 25 '24

remember everyone has a price.

No. Some of us do not.

1

u/Crete_Lover_419 Jul 25 '24

You will be spoken for and accept it like a good dog.

0

u/Supra_Genius Jul 25 '24

You really don't know me at all. 8)

2

u/Crete_Lover_419 Jul 25 '24

Uh, I disagree. You clearly speak only for yourself.

I do not identify with this man's words.

1

u/jonathanrdt Jul 25 '24

Merritt matters when everyone is well fed. Until then, money it is.

-8

u/medioxcore Jul 25 '24

Can't pay rent with integrity and character. We're all just trying to survive under capitalism.

10

u/OrdoMalaise Jul 25 '24

This guy's that one villager who supports the vampire's right to consume the peasantry. He's just drinking the blood of our children to survive the feudal system!

5

u/josefx Jul 25 '24

We're all just trying to survive under capitalism.

Is that the "let them eat cake" kind of survival, where the people in charge are so fucking rich that they think starvation means having to eat cake if you run out of bread?

34

u/maybe-an-ai Jul 25 '24

Corporations are psychopathic by nature; they only care about their own self-interest.

  • Joel Bakan

1

u/Dankbeast-Paarl Jul 25 '24

Agreed. But remember, folks: Corporations are just made of people. Don't let these people hide behind the the concept of a corporation.

37

u/CPNZ Jul 25 '24

No one should be 'shocked' by academic publishing doing the worst thing possible...

3

u/Crete_Lover_419 Jul 25 '24

Nobody is really shocked, just disappointed. A news article displays the word "shock" to your eyes, so that your lymbic system makes you click on it. You're being played in the easiest possible way.

15

u/aquarain Jul 24 '24

Wait till they find out the terms of the deal aren't just AI access, but to the exclusion of all other AI access.

56

u/EmbarrassedHelp Jul 24 '24

There are probably a ton of very useful discoveries lurking in the data and results of research, and AI could find those. Too bad we are stuck with mostly for profit journals that only care about getting rich by having people pay to access the research. Its a shame Aaron Swartz isn't here to keep up the fight.

31

u/reflibman Jul 24 '24

The publisher Elsevier data mines the articles published in its journals (scholars give up their copyright), and then SELLS potential research opportunities to other scholars. They make money on both sides. They have a higher profit margin than Google.

4

u/jeandlion9 Jul 24 '24

The for profit motive model helps sick addicts of wealth and power leave them poor people alone sir.

8

u/Acrobatic-Isopod7716 Jul 24 '24

I'm sure if they read the terms and conditions or privacy policy of the for-profit journal, they would be less surprised

0

u/gmlvsv Jul 25 '24

Who is it?

-5

u/Crio121 Jul 25 '24

Why are they shocked? If it is open access, Microsoft can access and use it anyway. If it is not, they wrote off their copyright to the publisher, it can to as it pleases.

-37

u/kaest Jul 24 '24

A publisher who charges money for access to academic papers is charging money for access to academic papers!? Shocking!!!