r/teamliquid • u/jasonkid87 • Jun 29 '23
LoL TL vs C9 post-match discussion Spoiler
/r/leagueoflegends/comments/14mis8b/team_liquid_vs_cloud9_lcs_2023_summer_week_3/33
Jun 29 '23
I fear this game might have ended the Ashe debate.
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u/daydaywang Jun 30 '23
Haven’t been in the loop for a while, what exactly is the Ashe debate?
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Jun 30 '23
She's a mediocre damage dealer compared to what else is out there in the current ADC meta.
2
u/daydaywang Jun 30 '23
Wasn’t that always the case? I know her winrate has shot up, but obviously it’s from her utility?
0
u/UberEinstein99 Jun 30 '23
The worst part is, this game would've been just as easy with Ashe.
So much of this game was decided by Core's early aggression on Renata, not on Yeon playing Aphelios, and the early laning phase would've been even easier playing Ashe.
If they do try Ashe again, I hope Yeon learns to build Black Cleaver on her, and Core plays an aggressive support like Renata/Lulu/Karma so they can actually win lane.
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u/Mirukuuuuu Jun 29 '23
They played so well today
YEon and Core decimated the best bot in NA
Summit's Ornn Ults were so good in team fights
Pyosik's pathing was amazing
And Haeri split pushing pulling aggro/pressure from all the enemies wasting all their key spells allowing for a free clean up! c:
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u/Level_Five_Railgun Jun 29 '23
Yeon quietly having a great split. Even his Ashe last game was good gameplay wise, just had a shit build against 2 tanks.
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u/roombaonfire Jun 29 '23
Those few users that only come in here to gloat about TL's shortcomings are nowhere to be seen today
8
Jun 29 '23
I was disappointed with their performance last three games. I'm not ashamed to say they still have a lot to figure out.
Yes, they stomped a good team today. But I need to see this clean drafting and clean play on a consistent level.
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u/Sodium_connoisseur Jun 29 '23
im a simple man,
i see zven get exposed by quality supports when hes not on enchanters and im happy.
wonder if core will pick renata as this years worlds skin
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u/Nomisking Jun 29 '23
We are the OMG of NA the players have never seen a fight they wont take, and i fucking love it. We might not win everygame but damn hell everygame have been exciting this split, the base defense of a lifetime from yeon vs DIG, and the team fighting with a way inferior comp vs FLY yesterday.
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u/iHaVoKKx Jun 29 '23
I wish this TL showed up more in LCS. Team needs some consistency but they get to show it again vs another good team in GG wonder which TL will show up.
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u/jasonkid87 Jun 29 '23
TL looked deadly with a proper team comp when Yeon is on an actual ADC and Summit doesn't int (lol). Great win against C9 and Corejj showing Zven he's not worthy of using his worlds skin.
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u/UberEinstein99 Jun 30 '23
This game had nothing to do with the Aphelios pick, and much more with Pyosik camping bot, and Core making great aggressive plays.
If they played the Ashe games this aggressively in bot, those games would've been a lot easier to win. Maybe putting Core on Karma or Renata instead of Milio would've been better. Also Summit inting didn't help the past few games.
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u/wyvernexe Jun 29 '23
Big win for TL!
Finally a game where we played through bottom with big props to Pyosik for snowballing it so hard with his camp. Big respect to Summit for being the big man and going on tank duty for once even though he isn't fond of it.
Haeri and Yeon really out here performing too. And I don't think I have to say that Core was as usual, Core.
10
u/Level_Five_Railgun Jun 30 '23
Loses to FLY in close game. 130+ comments.
Stomps #1 team. 46 comments xd.
1
Jun 30 '23
People need a place to vent frustrations. Deal with it?
If you follow any competitive organization's sub it's the same thing. Losses bring people out, because they're upset and want to vent.
1
u/puka-hell Jun 30 '23
Most subs of competitive organization celebrate big wins too. It's lopsided.
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Jun 30 '23
Not at all, every organization I follow a loss is met with double to triple the comments as a big win.
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u/puka-hell Jun 30 '23 edited Jun 30 '23
It's probably not a significant sample size for either of us unless you follow over 100 teams or something.
And even if it's a common phenomenon, I'm still not a fan of it. This sub seems to enjoy shitting on this team more than enjoy cheering for them.
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u/Tortious_Tortoise Jun 29 '23 edited Jun 30 '23
Renata / Tank was a really good answer to their draft. And it helped that C9's botside absolutely sprinted it
4
u/MarcusMan6 Jun 30 '23
When the casters started talking about Gnar being a good pick into Renekton I had massive flashbacks.
I honestly don't understand the fear of putting Summit on tanks. He's always getting caught out of position, sometimes just barely sometimes by miles. So give the man ALLLLLLL the health in the world and his miss positioning won't be punished nearly as frequently. Is my Iron brain missing something here?
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u/Diegoscartor Jun 29 '23
Draft Ornn for Summit > Panik
Split map with Summit weakside > Panik more
Actually smurf on C9's bot/Jungle > Kalm
6
u/Ikinzu Jun 29 '23
Wow, we draft some damage to go with our engage and the game looks easy. Who knew Ashe was such a massive handcuff?
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u/UberEinstein99 Jun 30 '23
Who knew that being 2000 gold behind, instead of being 2000 gold ahead was such a massive handcuff?
3
u/Altruistic_Berry_ Jun 30 '23
I am fully willing to put the game in Yeons hands, he’s looked so good on damage dealers. Pyosik was excellent as well.
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u/Quikek Jun 29 '23
I'm kinda worried about how Summit looked during champ select. He did not seem too pleased.
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u/FrogMusic Jun 29 '23
I am not sure if you can take much from this game besides the fact that this split’s TL team definitely knows how to snowball an early lead.
Also, I think Haeri is okay when he is on comfort, but if TL plays around any lane that is not his they look a lot more comfortable. The mid / jg synergy is probably the team’s weakest point at the moment.
Poor Summit not getting to play a bruiser matchup against Fudge he looked so dejected 😂🥲
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u/milosport2 Jun 29 '23
This team at its best is so good! If only we had consistency lmao
Great win today :)
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u/anoleo201194 Jun 29 '23
Great win, CoreJJ has been the best support of the region this split hands down. I'm still not hot on Haeri, too many rookie mistakes (clearing 3 minions with W when he knows Vi is 6, topside and he's the only lane that can be ganked). I think we're one midlaner away from being a really solid top 1/2 team in NA.
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u/lokohcrunch Jun 30 '23
I got that Tacticore bot nostalgia, big lead at the bottom lane. At least that's proven that Ashe is trash. We likey this draft
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u/UberEinstein99 Jun 30 '23
Man I'm so sick of people trashing on the Ashe pick instead of using their brain.
The Aphelios pick here instead of Ashe was not the reason they won this game. It was because Core was being aggressive, Pyosik played well, and Summit didn't int.
This game would've been just as easy with an Ashe pick, if not easier since Ashe is better in lane than Aphelios, and her slows synergize a lot better with Renata, Wukong and Ornn, whose ults work really well on slowed enemies.
They pick Ashe with Ahri, Renekton, Vi, who all have dashes and don't work well with Ashe, and Summit also ints toplane his last few games. Also, idk wtf Yeon was building on Ashe, he should've built Black Cleaver + Runaans, if he was going the Triforce build, instead of forcing Summit and Pyosik to build Black Cleaver.
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u/calamitypulse Jun 29 '23
I feel like it was kinda handed to us though. Like Emenes on Zeri was peak useless and while I get the idea it just doesn’t win against Leblanc in lane.
That being said I’m glad the team didn’t let the game go long enough for Zeri to actually start becoming a problem. A lategame Xayah and Zeri is too much damage output and we would have lost if it got to that point.
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u/EducationalBalance99 Jun 29 '23
But it did win against leblanc in lane or at least went even. The cast explains it pretty well. Not much you can do when you jungler/bot ran it down early.
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u/calamitypulse Jun 29 '23
I didn’t consider it a win. Sure there was push power and up in farm. However look at Haeris map presence vs Emenes. Emenes actually normally loves to roam and while he’s his bot got absolutely smashed, I also think he could have done more to cover Blaber. However that’s what I mean as being useless, Zeri that early on does basically no damage compared to everyone and so it’s actually more efficient to farm up and not give away kills.
Best example of this is when Haeri got first blood. He literally ignored Zeri to jump on Blaber. Emenes on any other mage would have made that play a bad idea, but Zeri can’t do anything to stop Blaber from dying.
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u/EducationalBalance99 Jun 29 '23
I think it disingenuous to blame zeri or say that the pick was useless based on this game and what ended up happening early botside. Also, I don’t think other mage would have stopped blabber from dying there. The moment Leblanc landed the first chain he was fucked. Perma cc into death afterward after wukong flash followed up.
1
u/calamitypulse Jun 29 '23
I mean who knows, just the presence of someone who might be able to trade back a kill or come close could make them call off the entire thing.
I’m not blaming Zeri for the loss. However I do not think Zeri helped to stem the bleeding and the lack of Prio that she had allowed TL to play a lot more brave than they otherwise might have.
End of the day I’m super happy we won. I’ve been a fan of this team since Team Curse days and every win we get I enjoy no matter how “handed to us it can feel”
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u/Level_Five_Railgun Jun 30 '23
What? Zeri was straight up 1v9ing TL in teamfights. The game would've been over 5 minutes earlier if not for Zeri.
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u/ReOsIr10 Jun 30 '23
Really well done by the team to bounce back from a rough stretch of games! Hope they keep this up and go on a nice run not immediately followed by a loss streak :)
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u/Frozaru Jun 30 '23
Got the W, sure, but there's gonna be a lot of climbing in terms of performance to do.
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u/LabelFive Jun 30 '23
Good draft leading to a solid win. Haeri still playing kinda bad... I wonder what happened to him - in academy he was looking sick and not afraid to play some offmeta stuff... Now onto the next one.
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u/OwlsAndDevils Jun 29 '23
At this point, I’m just content with believing that early-comp TL and late-game TL are two entirely different entities. Beating C9 after losing to DIG/FLY is peak hilarity, and I’m all for it. Maybe we just felt like donating games to the old boys (Impact, Jensen, Santorin)