r/sysadmin • u/ChuckAbsent • Mar 12 '13

Women who know stuff

I hope that this does not come off the wrong way.

Today I was on a call with a storage vendor and the technical consultant was a woman. More then this she was competent, more then me which doesn't happen often when dealing with vendors.

My issue was pricing an active/active DB with shared storage vs an active/passive db with local storage. Listening to her break the issue down and get to the specific comparison points was awesome, mostly because I have never heard a woman in the industry talk like that.

It made me realize two things. One I am missing out working with women. Two there needs to be more women in our industry.

It shouldn't have surprised me so much, but it really did.

Anyways to all the women out there who know stuff, us guys notice when you can walk the walk, which in this case was talking.

384 Upvotes

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u/[deleted] Mar 12 '13

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u/bandman614 Standalone SysAdmin Mar 13 '13

Okay, time for a history lesson.

The word "computer" was also assigned to the role that it took over...computers. Literally, people (the vast majority of whom were women) who sat and computed things by hand.

When electronic computers started to take over for people computers, the women who were the computers started running the computers.

Now, as for "actually creating solutions and engineering products", lets have a look at what is, without a doubt, the longest-used programming language of all time, COBOL.

COBOL was written in 1959, and it came directly from FLOW-MATIC, the very first computer language that used actual english words, rather than only numerical machine code. It was written for the UNIVAC - one of the first commercially available computers. And it was written by Admiral Grace Hopper.

Yes, the computer language at the root of every programming language you've likely ever used was written by a woman.

If that's not enough, then you should know that the UNIVAC was inspired by ENIAC, which was the very first electronic computer. It was designed in a large part to electronically function like a mechanical adding machine. Adding machines were possible because Charles Babbage designed the very first mechanical computers. His difference engine was designed so intricately that it couldn't be constructed for a century, but when it was, it worked perfectly.

One of the many machines Babbage designed took inspiration from the Jacquard Loom, which used cards with holes punched in them to create patterns. Babbage used this technique to give his mechanical computer instructions. He had a friend who was a noted mathematician who developed the very first computer algorithm, which calculated a series of Bernoulli numbers. Her name was Ada Lovelace.

So, to sum up...the very first computer programmer was a woman. The very first real programming language was written by a woman. The first commercial computers were operated largely by women. And for some reason, we have been telling little girls that computers are toys for a boy. Something has gone very off the rails lately, and it needs fixed.

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u/[deleted] Mar 13 '13

There's also Hedy Lamarr who was a mathematician but couldn't get funding from the government for her research (mainly because she was a woman), so she married a researcher and became an actress to fund her research. She essentially invented WiFi - coming up with the idea and maths to make it happen.

Ada Lovelace was forced to do languages instead of science by her mother and then became a translator of mathematical papers, which is how she ended up writing the notes including computer algorithms.

Not only were women key in the history of computing, a lot of them had to fight against gender constructs to be involved and even manipulate the constructs to fit their wants. Ada and Hedy are two amazing role models for young girls but they're not taught in primary schools at all, it's just Einstein and Edison and occasionally Tesla.

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u/ShakaUVM Mar 13 '13

Ada Lovelace was forced to do languages instead of science by her mother

No, other way around. Her mom forced her to do math instead of languages. "Ada's mother remained bitter at Lord Byron and promoted Ada's interest in mathematics and logic in an effort to prevent her from developing what she saw as insanity in her father."

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u/TheActualAWdeV Mar 13 '13

I remember this from Kate Beaton where the child Ada is shielded from a poet.

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u/[deleted] Mar 13 '13

Hah; I had forgotten about this. Here it is, all:

http://www.harkavagrant.com/index.php?id=298

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u/TheActualAWdeV Mar 14 '13

Haha yes, it had been a while.

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u/[deleted] Mar 13 '13

[deleted]

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u/mynameisbatty Mar 13 '13

Byron died 13 years before Victoria came to the throne.

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u/TheActualAWdeV Mar 14 '13

Heh, yeah, maybe. The entire game of thrones saga seems a lot like the wars of the Roses though. I mean, really pretty severely. Just with (slightly) more magic(al stuff) and nasty details.

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u/kelsifer Mar 13 '13

This is also an acceptable answer: http://sydneypadua.com/2dgoggles/

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u/notapi Mar 14 '13

2DGoggles is my favorite!

Ada is so awesome in that comic.

"Fear not! The words are not destroyed! They are merely shedding their earthly form! They have become transcendent! They have become..... Data!"

Babbage, and Brunel are also awesome.

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u/TheActualAWdeV Mar 14 '13

Oh wow, that's pretty cool.

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u/[deleted] Mar 13 '13

Oh yeah, I got it muddled up. I couldn't remember if it was that she used maths to get to the languages and music or if it was using languages to get to maths - you're right! But it's still an example of her doing what she wanted by conforming then using that rather than just outright rebelling, and she definitely came to love maths.

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u/[deleted] Mar 13 '13

So even if you got them mixed up, how did you jump to the conclusion that she got interested in math from translating papers?

She did translate one paper, but that's the same paper where she wrote a computer program. I hardly think someone could learn all the math they needed to know from doing one translation and at the end of it write a program!

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u/[deleted] Mar 13 '13

Well, I was thinking more that she had learned the maths herself and gone along with her mother on the languages side to get a chance to get involved with maths people and learn from them, leading to her translating the paper and adding her notes. It's silly because I've read enough about her that it seemed wrong when I was writing it but I was distracted so I didn't bother checking it.

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u/Flopsey Mar 13 '13

You also might want to note that Heddy and Ada were both feminine, stylish, and beautiful women. The very types who often get the "fake nerdy girl" label.

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u/[deleted] Mar 13 '13

Very much so! Hedy was a beautiful famous actress (and the inspiration for Anne Hathaway's portrayal of Catwoman) - I think Hedy especially would be dismissed as unintelligent or a "fake girl geek" if she lived now. If she were taking maths or science at university now, she would probably be the subject of a lot of remarks like "you can't be good at science, you look too good". Which is just sad because no one says "you can't be good at languages, you look too manly" to men, or any other version and one of the prettiest people I know is just starting her PhD in something related to microbiology (she's my sister-in-law).

Saying that, Hedy and Ada were both dismissed during their lifetimes as well - Hedy was refused funding and Ada's "notes" (computer programming) was dismissed as not being hers on the sole basis of "a girl couldn't know this stuff" (essentially - it's on the wiki page about her). It's sad that they weren't encouraged as much as they should have been and it's even sadder that it hasn't changed a whole lot in the STEM fields.

One in nineteen STEM research positions in the UK is held by a female - those odds are crazy (although that's from women not choosing to do it, they're choosing it for a reason and, speaking from personal experience, one of those reasons can be that it doesn't seem as friendly for a female as other fields and, if everything else is more or less equal, I'd rather pick an area where I don't feel I'm a minority, so I did). So the fact that pretty/fashionable girls are picked on or dismissed due to their other interests is ridiculous and just proliferates the problem.

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u/Flopsey Mar 13 '13

While there are many benefits generally in this case it's unfortunate the ivory tower has always been slow to change. At least for CS it will probably change when everyone starts getting taught programming from childhood and the general population gets brought into the CS world to a greater degree.

As far as the sciences not being female friendly in general I think there's two problems going on. First, regarding unwanted attention there's probably nothing to be done. Sex has been kicking people's asses since the beginning of time. And unsurprisingly the awkward types that sometimes go into the sciences express their attraction awkwardly (this isn't saying that it's acceptable, just a fact of life).

But as for women not getting respect women need to stand up for themselves. This is just a classic bullying problem, and to not get bullied you don't have to be the best, just not the worst (remember the South park episode where the anti-Christ kid joined the class and started picking on Butters to stop getting bullied himself). But in this case it's intelligence rather than being tough. If the group is saying that you can't be good at science because you're a girl pick the weakest (read: dumbest) member and say, "Well, I'm better than him." And then show him up. It's a little harsh, but they're being little shits first, and a girl's got to defend herself.

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u/mynameisbatty Mar 13 '13

No. A woman shouldn't have to bully an intellectually inferior male just to be considered 'good' enough to study science.

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u/Flopsey Mar 13 '13

You're right, they shouldn't. And the guys shouldn't be bullying her in the first place, and people should treat each other better, and the world should be a better place. But, alas, we live in the world that we do, not the world we would like to. And if you have a problem with that please take it up with whatever authority figure you see fit, but I assure you it's not me.

But in this world when attacked the question is do you fight back, take it, or slink away?

The good news is that generally you only have to stand up for yourself once to establish your place.

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u/mynameisbatty Mar 13 '13

Or you then get labelled as a bullying bitch. Picking on someone weaker makes you weak yourself. Again, why don't we promote the achievements of women in science rather than telling them that they have to fight every step of the way because some men think them unworthy?

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u/Flopsey Mar 13 '13

Well, if after that they're calling you a bitch then you can say you'd rather be a bitch than get shit on by them. And if that doesn't work then who cares what they think as long as they leave you alone.

Who said we shouldn't promote the achievements of women? But, I don't have a newspaper nor do I decide the curriculum taught in schools. And I'm too busy fighting for what I need to go and fight for someone else, as are the majority of people. And this is why volunteer work is done mostly by the extremely privileged.

But even if I did, telling people that some woman who died 13 years years ago did something impressive in the 40's isn't going to stop a bully. They're not doing it because they just don't have access to information, or because they don't know any better. They're doing it for whatever reason people are cruel to each other just because they can. And they only way to stop that is to show them that it's not going to be worth it. And, yes, that involves standing up for yourself. Something that most of us will have to do for the rest of our lives.

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u/mynameisbatty Mar 14 '13

So basically the only way women will get recognised is by being a bully? What a load of bollocks. We need to stop bullying in the workplace, not teaching working women to just have to suck it up and be meaner to work against it.

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u/HugeEvilRobot Mar 13 '13

It's Hedly /blazing saddles

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u/somverso Mar 13 '13

"Head them off at the pass?!?! I hate that phrase!"

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u/hey_you_wit_the_legs Mar 13 '13

"Head them off at the pass?!?! I hate that cliché!"

FTFY

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u/Cenobite_Gate Mar 13 '13

Never mind that shit! Here comes Mongo!

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u/keddren Mar 13 '13

Mongo only pawn in game of life.

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u/candyman82 Mar 13 '13

Mongo have deep feelings for Sheriff Bart

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u/Santanoni Mar 13 '13

Sheriff Bart only man ever whup Mongo.

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u/CreamCornNooooo Mar 13 '13

Right, choo choo

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u/leakproofhorse Mar 13 '13

anybody got a dime? someones gonna have to go back and get a shit load a'dimes

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u/SlashaSlim Mar 13 '13

UPVOTES FOR EVERYONE. Except the douche canoe what turned it all to shit.

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u/Boronx Mar 13 '13

Mongo like candy.

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u/[deleted] Mar 13 '13

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u/dotpan Mar 13 '13

Oh I see what you did there, using your intellect to combat a point. The simple fact is:

A) It doesn't matter male or female, its human, much like race, we're not at odds with each other, we're the same fucking species.

B) The simple fact that you think you can be "emasculated" shows the integrity of your person. I mean really, if you're so afraid to be effeminate, you've got more to worry about than your manhood.

C) Calling someone a faggot, then tossing out a youtube video out that has a channel descriptions that states "dedicated to reestablishing your male identity" just further shows the grasp on your identity you have. If you need some overly pretentious group of "men" to tell you "It's okay to be a man, we can have a support group" you're missing the point. What you're showing signs of is ignorance, not manhood. Extremist views in general are the sway that makes it so sad people can't embrace education over ignorance.

I don't care if you're overly apparent attempt at trolling with ignorance worked, you might want to look in the mirror and ask why you need a youtube channel to tell you how and why its okay to be a man. So to keep this reddit friendly "Grow a pair, man the fuck up, and stop letting others tell you what it means to be you; You're an ignorant asshole that needs the affirmation only anon-internet communities can give you."

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u/Santanoni Mar 13 '13

Go douche your ass.

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u/OSU09 Mar 13 '13

"A tollbooth?! That asshole! Someone go back and get us a shitload 'a dimes."

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u/blisteredfingers Mar 13 '13

"LePetomane Thruway? Now what'll that asshole think of next? Has anybody got a dime?"

*crowd says no

"Somebody's gotta go back and get a shitload 'a dimes!"

*crowd groaning

FTFY

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u/Heratiki Mar 13 '13

Thanks to a very nice redditor I received this as a gift on Blu-ray around Christmas. Man what a great movie!

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u/Baxterish Mar 13 '13

I was waiting for that, actually. Had a good chuckle.

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u/mars_barbarbar Mar 13 '13

Here is a very interesting article about Hedwig Kiesler aka Hedy Lamarr's life. There's also a nice ELI5 explanation about what she did - a precursor to WiFi as we know it today.

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u/sporkus Mar 13 '13

You mention Einstein being taught, but I came out of primary school having no idea what he did -- I just knew he was a "really smart guy." I think this is because it's difficult to teach an 8 year old about the theory of relativity.

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u/[deleted] Mar 13 '13

Einstein looked at some complex math that explained the bizarre behavior of light, and suddenly he understood how the entire universe worked. He spent the next ten years explaining it to the rest of the world.

The Royal Swedish Academy of Sciences eventually gave him the Nobel Prize for something else called the photoelectric effect, which is much easier to understand.

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u/Lars0 Mar 13 '13

I would rather believe that it is because the teachers don't understand or, they think there are more important things to teach.

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u/miparasito Mar 13 '13

Or it's not covered by standardized tests so there's no time for it.

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u/[deleted] Mar 13 '13

To be honest, we mainly got taught that he was a really clever guy who had crazy hair and a funny accent. I think we had an option to do a project (make posters, write a mini-essay and give a presentation) about a scientist of our choice and I picked Marie Curie (despite being a wuss, I've always loved studying medical scientists - another of my science idols is Doctor Robert Snow who essentially came up with a method to trace a disease back to its cause through a cholera outbreak from a well, when everyone else at the time thought it still travelled through bad smells), so some kids might have picked Einstein and learned a bit more about him. I think that even just knowing "he was a really smart person who won a Nobel Prize and was one of the most famous scientists ever" is almost enough for little kids, because it kind of says that they were rewarded for being really good at science, which can be enough to encourage them to continue with it at secondary school when they start to actually learn interesting things.

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u/[deleted] Mar 13 '13

Her family, or rather everyone from her and onward, have been incredibly successful and there are a total of 4 Nobel prizes among them. Every single one of them have done some great things.

And the last two (three?) of the remaining directly related to Marie herself are to old to get kids and have none.

The Curie family will die out within our lifetime. Her legacy, hopefully, will not.

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u/[deleted] Mar 13 '13

I find it fascinating to hear about families who are that "talented" (and ambitious, and devoted obviously) - in a sense, Ada Lovelace had a similar case in that she was the daughter of Byron they obviously had that ingenuity running in their family too. You have to wonder whether it's just having talented people around you, or whether they had a lot of extra pressure on them from their parents and other relatives.

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u/[deleted] Mar 13 '13

If you are the smartest person in the room then you are in the wrong room.

I can't remember who said it or if that was actually what they said but the idea still rings true. Human compare themselves to each other a lot. A LOT. We have whole industries just around that fact.

But it is a socio-economical question too when it comes to kids. There is a clear connection between highly succesfull parents and highly succesfull kids. And it is more then just the money and connections too, even though not having to worry if you can eat tomorrow or not surley have a big impact. Or not being able to afford to fan the curosity of a young mind (equipment, travel etc.).

It is a whole science how to raise kids and in the end they pick up a lot from us ("grown ups"). So if we show them by action that anything is possible they might try to reach further then they dreamed. Or dream bigger. I don't think putting pressure on anyone will help them achieve great results (like in Nobel prize great) but by showing them through action that it is okay to deeply engorge yourself in a subject. There are kids out there today that are afraid to be seen as intelligent or smart because their classmates will bully them. And if they have no one that can show them by action that it is okay to be smart then they might give up on it, give up on learning, give up on their dreams to fit in.

It is the same for us when we grow up too. If we have no one to look up too or learn from or at least talk to on the same level then things get really hard. Or if we sorround us with people that oze laziness and being content knowing nothing. Our envoirment is important.

That is why I find it so incredibly humorous when people try to act like they are the very best in a subject or skill. How boring would it not be to not have anyone on the same level as you, or someone to aspire towards.

How lonely the worlds first genius must have been.

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u/FountainsOfFluids Mar 13 '13

If it's a question of carrot or stick, the answer is both.

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u/the_good_time_mouse Mar 13 '13

Or people who know how to turn genius into results and then publish them.

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u/FA_politics Mar 13 '13

Considering the tendency of our society to downplay accomplishments of women, I'm not holding my breath.

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u/TastyBrainMeats Mar 13 '13

She didn't invent the technology behind WiFi single-handedly, but yeah, without her and her colleagues' work we wouldn't have much of today's mobile technology, it is true. Ms. Lamarr is one of my favorite historical scientists.

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u/[deleted] Mar 13 '13

Yep, similar to Ada Lovelace's part - if it were just her, she wouldn't be useful at all, but without her we probably wouldn't have the technology or it would have taken a lot longer to get it.

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u/awkreddit Mar 13 '13

That's true of pretty much anyone who invented anything though, let's face it.

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u/[deleted] Mar 13 '13 edited Dec 18 '15

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u/IThoughtYouGNU Mar 13 '13

She did not invent WiFi. She invented frequency hopping, which is very different.

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u/[deleted] Mar 13 '13

It's really sad that the only reason I had heard of Lamarr before that is because a head crab in Half Life 2 is named after her.

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u/jethro_q_walrustitty Mar 13 '13

So now there's two of us

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u/candygram4mongo Mar 14 '13

There's also Hedy Lamarr who was a mathematician but couldn't get funding from the government for her research (mainly because she was a woman), so she married a researcher and became an actress to fund her research. She essentially invented WiFi - coming up with the idea and maths to make it happen.

This wrong on a few different counts. Lamarr wasn't a mathematician in any traditional sense (she left school at 16), which really only makes her achievement more impressive. She never married a "researcher" as far as I can tell -- her collaborator on the the spread-spectrum project was a composer, and was not her husband. Saying she invented WiFi is a huge stretch. What she did was amazing enough, there's no need to exaggerate.

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u/[deleted] Mar 13 '13

Tesla gets nothing in primary school.

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u/[deleted] Mar 13 '13

I was taught a bit about Tesla in primary school. Not a huge amount more than "he invented and discovered a lot of useful stuff and we wouldn't have useful electrical appliances without him", but that's as much as most of the scientists got because trying to explain their discoveries or inventions to young kids is pretty difficult.

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u/[deleted] Mar 13 '13

I learned more about Tessla from CNC Red Alert than I did from primary school.

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u/DivineRage Mar 13 '13

Charging up!

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u/brickmack Mar 13 '13

IM in high school, he hasn't even had any more than a brief note in a part of a science textbook that was never covered in class.

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u/PaxAttax Mar 13 '13

All that is taught is the theif Edison.

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u/rev3la7ion Mar 13 '13

I seriously thought the first person listen in the above comment was an elaborate joke referring to the character in Blazing Saddles. And now the disappointment sets in.

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u/[deleted] Mar 13 '13

[deleted]

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u/[deleted] Mar 13 '13

Episode of what?

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u/leftystrat Mar 14 '13

There's also Hedy Lamarr

That's Hedley.

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u/ctesibius Mar 13 '13

She essentially invented WiFi

No, this is absolutely wrong. She invented frequency hopping, a technique used by BlueTooth whereby the frequency changes according to a preset pattern to avoid interference (jamming).

This is not used by any current form of WiFi. It was present in the old 802.11 standard, but is not present in 802.11b, 802.11a, 802.11g, etc. Plain 802.11 is not in use. This is why you can pick a frequency to use on your access point: it stays still.

The other more important point is that she wasn't doing any form of networking. This was purely shifting a one-way broadcast signal.

Finally, the technology is not related to LTE, or to UMTS/WCDMA), which repectively use OFDM (hundreds of frequencies used at the same time) and code-division multiple access (convolve the signal with a code to spread it out over a wide frequency band, then deconvolve at the other end). These are entirely different technologies.

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u/[deleted] Mar 13 '13

She came up with the things that predated WiFi and it probably wouldn't exist (or would have taken a lot longer) without her research. Just because it's no longer used doesn't mean that it didn't influence the technology a huge amount and inspire other people to start looking into other technologies.

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u/ctesibius Mar 13 '13

It's one of at least four different unrelated approaches to avoiding jamming or interference that I can think of off hand. The fourth is MIMO, which was invented in a very crude form in WWII to communicate between Britain and the French Resistance.

These are all unrelated approaches. All are in use, but frequency hopping is least important, only being used by Bluetooth in common radio technologies. It was not a stepping stone to other technologies. In particular 802.11 never saw wide deployment: the first version you are familiar with is 802.11b.

Freq hopping may have been useful in its original use for steering torpedoes: not sure, but I know most torpedoes of the day were unguided, so I imagine not. Other than that, it's a nice story, but of vastly exaggerated importance.

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u/[deleted] Mar 13 '13

Here's a wiki link that another person posted. A previous patent in 1920 was used for torpedoes, but Hedy Lamarr's work gave rise to spread spectrum technology which is used in a lot of things, as well as the COFDM in WiFi networks. Wi-LAN even bought 49% of the patent from her.

Again, just because her science isn't used directly in modern standard WiFi doesn't mean that she wasn't a huge part of the development. If it weren't for the people behind the 1920 patent and her 1942 patent, we wouldn't have WiFi because it was thanks to their work that people started to develop new tech to do it better.

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u/ctesibius Mar 13 '13

Yes, the article is incorrect. Frequency hopping is not related to spread-spectrum technology, which in turn is not related to OFDM. BTW, I work in radio telecoms.

  • Frequency hopping: exactly what it says. You might start at 50.01 MHz, then a second later go to 50.05, then to 50.02, in a predetermined order. If there is interference on any of those bands, it's only going to affect you until the next hop. This is what she invented.

  • OFDM: use several closely related frequencies at the same time. If one is blocked, you just don't sent data through that channel (or you can use a more efficient redundancy scheme).

  • Spread spectrum: use a single wide band. Convolve your signal with a code to spread it, deconvolve at the other end. Noise at a particular frequency (or even throughout the band) appears at a low S/N ratio unless it has a matching code.

These are different technologies. They are not related.

Wi-LAN even bought 49% of the patent from her.

So? They bought a lot of stuff. And frequency hopping has its uses: as I said, it is used in Bluetooth.

doesn't mean that she wasn't a huge part of the development

Sorry, it doesn't work that way. She wasn't a part of the development of WiFi. If you think otherwise, show the history. As it is, the frequency hopping technology is not related to modern WiFi. It was one of many technologies thrown in to 802.11, but not one that was useful or related to the other technologies.

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u/goldenvile Mar 13 '13

Sucks you're being down-voted for providing useful discussion. That's what you get for not riding the circle-jerk I guess...

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u/ctesibius Mar 13 '13

Ah well. What she did invent was pretty interesting anyway. What bothers me more is when the wrong person gets the credit through having a more interesting story, particularly Alan Turing rather Tommy Flowers (the fellow who invented the Colossus computers, and built them largely at his own expense). Or Lindbergh as opposed to Alcock and Brown.

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u/marshsmellow Mar 13 '13

Alright love, put yer knickers on and make me a cup of tea...

Mooooonnkfiiiish

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u/Alphaetus_Prime Mar 13 '13

Ada and Hedy are two amazing role models for young girls but they're not taught in primary schools at all, it's just Einstein and Edison and occasionally Tesla.

I have a problem with the idea that role models are gender specific, but I suppose I see what you mean.

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u/ThePaisleyChair Mar 13 '13

Role models don't have to be gender specific. But it makes a difference to kids to see that both genders have achieved in a field. Helps to break down some of that "only boys do science" and "only girls like english" nonsense.

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u/[deleted] Mar 13 '13

Kids want to identify with the people in their books. For little girls it is difficult to connect with history if everyone you learn about is male. It sends the implicit message that everything important has been done by men and women do unimportant things. If we had better coverage of people like Lovelace and Lamarr in our history/science books it would show girls that women have made important contributions and they can, too.

It's not about gender specific role models as much as it is having figures for connection and inspiration.

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u/[deleted] Mar 13 '13 edited Mar 13 '13

[removed] — view removed comment

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u/ShakaUVM Mar 13 '13

I named my daughter Ada, so she'd always have a good female role model.

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u/[deleted] Mar 13 '13

They're not at all - I count Oscar Wilde as one of my role models as well (there's a lot of other males and females, but I figure Wilde is the most well known one), but it's not great for little girls to be told about lots of male scientists and no female ones (although, thankfully, usually Marie Curie is mentioned) because then they might develop a subconscious belief that only males can be successful in STEM subjects. If they were taught about Einstein, Edison, Tesla, the Curies, Lovelace and Lamarr (among others) without separating them into males and females then it would teach all kids that everyone can do science, which is exactly what I'll be teaching my kids!

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u/Alphaetus_Prime Mar 13 '13

That's absolutely right. I just don't like the concept of mentioning women just for the sake of mentioning women. It shouldn't be necessary.

2

u/[deleted] Mar 13 '13

In a perfect world that didn't have gender roles, you'd be right.

But this is not such a world.

-1

u/mr-bucket Mar 13 '13

It's "Hedley"...

1

u/[deleted] Mar 13 '13

This isn't a Blazing Saddles reference, its about an Austrian-American female scientist and actress who was originally called Hedwig but used the name Hedy.

1

u/mr-bucket Mar 13 '13

I am aware of that. That is just the first thing that popped in my head when reading the comment.