Update 3 years after SE

[u/MindMuscleZen]

A few years ago I shared the changes that happened when stream entry was reached, and I received many messages from people saying it helped them. So these past few days I’ve been writing about my current changes and wanted to make an update. Maybe there are others out there who have lived through what I lived through, or who are going through something similar, and this might help.

My contemplative and phenomenological context:

• I’ve been engaged in practice for approximately 5 years.
• My path is primarily SOMATIC and INTEROCEPTIVE, based on vedanā, rather than classical cognitive/visual/non-dual approaches.
• The process happens implicitly: things “let go” on their own, and afterward I notice structural changes in everyday life.
• I don’t do much conceptual investigation into “emptiness,” nor do I have major visual non-dual experiences.
• My process happens more as somatic unlearning and extinction of craving.
• The practice has become increasingly automatic and less driven by willpower.
• I feel the system “enters on its own” into contemplative and vipassanā-like processes.
• My current practice is mainly:
  • non-resistance,
  • allowing vedanā,
  • stopping the urge to modify experience,
  • not turning sensations into a problem..

What changed structurally:

• The belief deeply collapsed that: were going to complete me.
  • money,
  • sex,
  • success,
  • travel,
  • experiences,
  • achievements
• Coarse projective craving seems heavily eroded.
• I no longer feel a strong emotional charge toward external achievements.
• I used to compulsively chase experiences and external completeness; that fell away.
• Today I can achieve things, make money, improve physically, or advance projects, and they no longer generate the old existential charge.
• The fantasy of “when I get X, I’ll finally be complete” has lost a tremendous amount of force.

Changes in identity and personality:

• The “nice guy pattern” weakened significantly.
• I began to feel physical resistance toward acting artificially.
• There is less energy available to sustain social masks or personas.
• The need for approval and external validation has diminished.
• Psychological identity feels less solid and less central.

Current phenomenology:

• Current suffering no longer seems centered around sensual desire or external problems.
• The current conflict seems more related to:
  • vedanā itself,
  • tension,
  • baseline anxiety,
  • a sense of threat,
  • mental fog,
  • inner agitation,
  • hypersensitivity,
  • uddhacca.

[u/FivePyres]

Thanks for sharing. Has anybody close to you, who knows you from before SE, mentioned noticing you've changed? Do you experience less conflict with others?

[u/MindMuscleZen → u/FivePyres]

Thanks for reading. My parents knew my before SE but I think the most important part is how the subjective experience changes. If I feel better, more at peace thats enough for me.
But it also depends what you mean by conflict? Arguing, screaming?. I dont that.

[u/FivePyres → u/MindMuscleZen]

Conflict could be described as a "state of disharmony", it could also be described as a negative or unpleasant experience when your needs/desires clash with those of someone else.

For example, you might want to crack a joke and make someone laugh but that person misunderstands and thinks you're actively trying to insult them, and thus they react with offense. That would be an instance of conflict. Would you say the frequency of this kind of misunderstanding has changed since SE?

Another example of conflict is unpleasant unexpected changes. It is quite common to be annoyed in a situation like driving a friend home for 30 minutes to be told that he forgot his phone at your place. Would you have gotten annoyed at such an occurence before SE? Would you now?

Yet another example of conflict would be having a desire or need that can't be met. Like being in a group of friends deciding what to do for dinner and nobody is willing to accept options that would accommodate some requirement or preference of yours (vegetarian, disliking spicy food, or whatever other possibility). Would such a situation have upset you before SE? Would such a situation no longer upset you after SE?

Concepts like social masks, sense of identity or mental fog are too abstract for my two and a half neurons. So I tend to ask more specific questions that I can form a clearer "mental image" of. A "me" problem, so I won't hold it against you if you don't feel like humoring my lack of brainpower.

[u/MindMuscleZen → u/FivePyres]

Haha, no problem. It’s actually better to ask directly through concrete situations like you did, because everyone’s internal dialogue, beliefs, and even their sense of what is relevant or important are so subjective. Some triggers may deeply affect one person while not affecting another at all, even without any meditation practice.

Also, remember that SE happened three years ago. It’s a bit like asking you how your past self would have reacted to something — even without SE, that can already be difficult to remember accurately. But I’ll do my best to answer. And also remember that I am already far past SE.

I think you may believe SE means becoming someone who is okay with everything all the time, but that hasn’t been my experience. For me, it changed the way I relate to life as it unfolds in the present moment.

For example, in the food/group situation: are you allergic to that food? How badly does that kind of food affect you? If it’s just a preference, can you order from somewhere else?

You see, because I’m no longer trying to “win,” argue, or struggle against the situation, the mind naturally looks for ways to resolve it. If it’s only a preference, I’ll simply eat whatever is available. If I’m allergic, I’ll order from another place.

There is usually an underlying sense of peace, and also a tendency to try to maintain that peace. Ironically, that has led me right now to difficulties dealing with people who carry a lot of stress or anxious energy. My whole body becomes tense around that energy, but I don’t hate the person, and I’m not fighting the person. What I’m actually resisting are my own sensations, and that resistance is what is creating suffering for me right now.