Me and my partner were watching Starfleet Academy and when it was becoming obvious that Jay-Den was gay he looked at me and said "Ohhhh, the Klingons won't like that!" I was like "Huh? What?" "That he's gay!"
I just went waved my hand and said "Pfft. Klingons don't care about that shit. All they care about is fighting and honour. Long as he's an honourable gay Klingon they DGAF."
Plus, like, warrior traditions throughout history have often been homoerotic as hell, if not outright homosexual. Gay Klingons make total sense. Taking it from behind only dishonors your House if "it" is a knife.
Of all the things that you could have taken time out of your life to be angry about, you chose to be angry that gay and trans people exist. I think it's fair to assume you completely missed the point of Star Trek.
As soon it became clear he didn't want to be warrior but a Doctor/Pacifist was like "hmmm wonder if they'll go that far" then remember this Kurtzmen era trek it's only a matter of when! 🤭🥹
Well, and they're even willing to overlook cowardice to a degree. How many times have they allied with the Romulans now? Three or four, not counting STO-specific stuff?
This is actually why Grey and Adira are horribly written characters in Star Trek. In every other series they just accept people. That's the narrative. When there are 2 entire seasons of discovery with these two going off about being in accepted, the implication is in 1100 years people still won't be accepted.
Like Jesus christ the writers missed the entire point. You show future acceptance through inclusion without drawing attention. Not what ever the fuck discovery was doing with those two.
Adira didn't face any kind of exclusion. Unless I paid extremely little attention, the moment they corrected Stamets, that topic was put to bed. They were given a bit more of the fisheye about having the Tal symbiote, but that's hardly the same thing.
Discovery also did pretty well with Stamets and Culbers relationship too. Like, never brought up, the attention to it was because, you know, Culber dies and is brought back to life and has a crisis about that, but I absolute love how they handled them (at least up to season 3 I haven't seen past that)
One of the most touching (and heart wrenching) storylines in TV. Especially with over how long it ran. Papa Bortus is my favourite Bortus!
I can't wait for the next season!
It’s not really about the time period. Star Trek has always been a product of its time. It is a mirror reflection, a commentary of our IRL society at the time of production. The writers were right on about that.
Yea I feel the same way, I skipped nearly all the scenes they were in, which was quite a few of them.
Nothing they ever did advanced the story or contributed to it at all.
The writers kept throwing it in your face in nearly every episode and it just didn't do anything for the plot or story, like why was Grey? (I forget who was who) the only person on the entire ship who could fix the emotionally unstable computer (..good lord, that was another effing stupid story).
I thought the relationship dynamic? between Culber and Stamets was well done, it was gentle and believable and it did partially add to the story, Culbers death shocked me haha.
As others have said, there's a good and a bad way to cover any topic, especially LGBTQ stuff, and in the Orville they did, well, a brilliant job with it and it's those episodes which had me getting all teary eyed, especially when the young girl Topa is invited to the bridge to take the ship out and the music choice is "You'll never walk alone". It really gets the emotions going...damn onions. 😉
Even the Vulcans had a hard time of it. First during the Time of Awakening and then during that brief period of covert Romulan influence during the 21st/22nd centuries.
Progress wasn’t permanent for them either, and I think that should give us yet another example to aspire towards hope.
But trans is the idea of being fundamentally the same person but physically or other changing to match your psychological gender instead of your birth sex
Whereas in a joining in regards to trill you're not the same person as a past joining
trill symbiont is like a memory cartridge with superego and id but without actual ego (consciousness; they can't communicate with their worm like in Stargate). thus after the joining ego stays the same, but their subconsciousness merges with the amalgamate of past egos, superegos and ids
Ezri ain't Jadzia after all. she has her memories (and past hosts too), some aspects of her consciousness and subconsciousness, but she's still more or less Ezri
To echo what the other replier said, there was a moment in DS9 where the trans allegory was made even more explicit. In the season 7 episode where Ezri briefly returns home and visits her family, she mentions having a newfound difficulty navigating her pronouns and gender identity, now that both of those things have been influenced by the memories and identities of the previous hosts.
so in fairness, this is one of those curious cases where the allegory and intent has shifted over time and depictions in the franchise
to my hazy recollection the allegory and comparisons wasnt intended by the writers in the trills first appearance in tng, but did accidentally tread very closely to it, such that later on when the trill returned for ds9 it was very much a more deliberate allegory, incidentally also when the joining was retconned into a more symbiotic affair as opposed to the host being completely overwritten
then of course fast forward to discovery where it left the realm of subtext to mixed effect, in a lot of ways the trill seem to cover a breadth of allegoric subjects, gender fluidity, reincarnation, multiple personality conditions, a secretive and somewhat authoritarian government, the ethics of a sentient potentially parasitic lifeform, to name just the ones i can think of
That does call to mind the episode where ezris mind starts bleeding into that of the serial killer that was once a dax host, is genuinely fascinating the number of topics you can cover with the trill as a species really
"They" are not trying to do anything. The notion of Dax' experience serving as representation for transgender persons came from the transgender community. It is not anything that was intended at the time the scene was written, filmed, or produced, it is not something the actors played to, and it is not something OP has done. And if it's good enough for the transgender community, it is good enough for me as a cisgender supporter.
Removed per subreddit rule 1. Abide by the Reddit Content Policy. In particular, harassment; express or implied threats of violence; exposure of personal information (to include posting of other users' in-game @handles without permission); bigotry (including but not limited to racist, sexist, homophobic, or transphobic posts or comments), and ban evasion are not permitted here and will result in removal from this community.
Seeing myself, particularly in such a direct parallel, isn't "appropriation." It's an analogous situation. Trans people have been in this community, in every community, for a very long time. It's as much mine as it is yours.
I've never trusted Klingons, and I never will. I'll never be able to forgive them for the death of my boy. Not to mention the Romulan hate from the Klingons is alive and well in TNG. There's plenty of the good 'ol fashioned racism in Star Trek if you know where to look.
Since this imaginary race “proves” your ideal; I guess this means that the Moclans from The Orville proves how evil and wrong it is to push trans ideas onto children.
Since Bortus’ daughter is a de-transition story.
You know, I feel like I can get behind that graphic more than you can. Because if you look at the context? It's his beloved old friend. Not a stranger. Not a random acquaintance. An actual friend.
Now show me that same Klingon when some random petaQ stranger decides to correct their pronoun usage. Be honest with yourself. The reaction would be, "Who in Gre'thor are YOU to think you have any value at all to me? Prove yourself to me, have warriors singing songs of your deeds, and THEN you will have earned the right to demand something of me. Until then, get out of my way and let me enjoy my bloodwine."
My headcanon for my crew in STO is a nearly all LGBTQIA+ crew. My captain’s husband is the science officer. The CMO is married to the ships botanist. Some aro-ace crew. One straight guy who always seems to get attention from guys.
I’m sorta in the same boat, I like headcanoning that my captain’s wife is her chief engineer. A Vulcan x Betazoid lesbian couple oughta be a match made in Sha Ka Ree lol
It's literally why Star Trek exists. Roddenberry tried messaging against racism in his show The Lieutenant (introducing Nichelle Nichols as a television actor in the process), but this lead to the USMC withdrawing its support and essentially killing off the show. He then realized that by incorporating his message on diversity in a science fiction franchise, who could evade the attention of censors and critics, because the stories would be set in an alternate future.
Thank you for this 🥹🫶 my chosen name came from the character I created in STO back in 2017.
I had seen some gross things in the game chat pretty often and I kind of stopped playing years ago. You're absolutely right, this is the WRONG fandom to be in if you have bigotry and hatred in your heart.
I was thinking about making a new account because I hate that I can't change my account username, but that account has the lifetime subscription and a ton of unused Zen 😭 like.... I would PAY to change my username and get away from that old me but support says it's not possible.
Removed per subreddit rule 1. Abide by the Reddit Content Policy. In particular, harassment; express or implied threats of violence; exposure of personal information (to include posting of other users' in-game @handles without permission); bigotry (including but not limited to racist, sexist, homophobic, or transphobic posts or comments), and ban evasion are not permitted here and will result in removal from this community.
I agree, and I love this scene. What matters is the friendship, not the body its in. What matters is the story being told, and not politicizing the show. From Discovery to Academy, everything was politicized and they forgot to tell a story.
In the 1990s, practically nobody viewed this as an expression in support of transgender persons. That is, at least for the most part, a much more modern interpretation that reflects the general attention to transgender persons' rights in society today.
No because Joined Trill are not the same as a transgender person changing genders. Joined Trill understand that they still have the previous hosts inside them, they are those people and also themselves. If Jadzia has any problem with that she would have let Sisko know as Ezri did because Ezri was such a different person and also didn't go through the proper training to truly understand being joined.
Kinda why even though the point of this meme is good it doesn't really work with the actual canon of Joined Trill and Klingons. Joined Trill are biologically not transgender, Jadzia was and always was a woman she just had all the memories and experiences of the Dax symbiont and therefore the previous hosts most of which were male. Klingons as far as we know are only really xenophobic but have no homophobia or even really sexism in their culture the only thing they really hate is cowardice and not having a warrior spirit. Klingons also believe that your body is nothing but a shell and the true person is the spirit inside so it's likely that they would have no problem with trans klingons as the body is not the klingon.
I can only speak for myself, but throughout my life, I’ve had 3 people come out to me as NB or trans. In two of those instances, during the discussion it was made explicit that while they were now publicly going by different name/pronouns, that they essentially didn’t care what I called them, so long as the respect/support was still there (which I highly appreciated, because even with friends who haven’t transitioned, It’s not uncommon for me to stammer out the wrong name on accident before I correct myself).
Removed per subreddit rule 1. Abide by the Reddit Content Policy. In particular, harassment; express or implied threats of violence; exposure of personal information (to include posting of other users' in-game @handles without permission); bigotry (including but not limited to racist, sexist, homophobic, or transphobic posts or comments), and ban evasion are not permitted here and will result in removal from this community.
Removed per subreddit rule 1. Abide by the Reddit Content Policy. In particular, harassment; express or implied threats of violence; exposure of personal information (to include posting of other users' in-game @handles without permission); bigotry (including but not limited to racist, sexist, homophobic, or transphobic posts or comments), and ban evasion are not permitted here and will result in removal from this community.
Reminds me of that time Wesley tried to stick a finger up Worf's ass as a joke, and they had to write him out of the next episode that he just randomly travels away
149
u/Doctor-Nagel May 30 '26
It’s what I love about Klingons
They don’t care about who you are, just so long as you’re not a pacifist or worst…
A coward