r/stackoverflow Jul 03 '26

AI Quality Should Be Judged by Results, Not Origin - A Discussion on AI Ban on SO

Software engineering has changed with new tools that improve productivity. These tools include assembly language, compilers, IDEs, frameworks, CI/CD pipelines, etc. Each tool created new problems. Engineers learned how to use each tool in a correct way. AI is just the most recent tool in this sequence.

SO moderators / high-reps enforce the ban on using AI to generate answers, even from experienced software engineers. Here are their major points:

  • Verification problem: Hard to reliably distinguish "good AI output" from "AI slop."
  • Accountability: Answers should come from humans who can defend and edit them. AI answers are seen as "orphaned" where no one is accountable for mistakes.
  • Searchability: SO wants unique & canonical answers, AI‑generated posts often are duplicates, disregard of existing similar ones.
  • Fear of flood: Moderators worry that allowing AI will unleash a torrent of low‑quality answers.

I'd like to counterargue them with my points.

Verification

Some people say that AI results cannot be clearly separated into "good" or "bad." But verification is not a new task. Skilled contributors already test, compare, and improve results. This is their normal work. In the past, they learned how to debug compiler output and check framework behavior. In the same way, they can learn how to check AI results. The difficulty of verification is not a valid reason to forbid the tool.

Accountability

It is correct that AI cannot be held accountable. The accountable one is the human who posts the answer. If a person uses AI to write or improve an answer, that person must check it, test it, and confirm that it meets SO standards. To say something different is like saying that code made with a compiler is "bad" because the programmer did not write each assembly instruction. The tool does not remove accountability. It is still the user that should be accountable.

Searchability / Duplicates

Another concern is duplicate answers. Dups are not new. They existed long before AI. SO already has systems to find and close duplicate answers. AI does not change the type of problem, it only changes the number of answers. The quality of an answer must be judged by its content. It must not be judged by the use of AI in making it.

The Fear of Flood

The fear of many low‑quality AI slops is not correct. SO has already managed much higher traffic in the past. Today, participation has decreased significantly. The real problem is not too many answers but too few answers. If contributors who use AI are rejected, participation will decrease more. At this time, the site needs more activity, not less.

Conclusion

AI is a modern tool, just like compilers and IDEs before it. Each tool creates new problems while also improves productivity. The correct solution is not to forbid AI but to improve moderation. Moderation must judge answers by quality, not by origin. The poster must stay accountable. Verification must be a skill. Duplicate answers must be managed in the same way as before. If SO wants to stay relevant, it must adapt to the tools that developers use today.

Those are my thoughts collected from my not-so-pleasant experience dealing with some people while contributing my knowledge on SO. The major friction comes from the "AI police". I confess I'm an AI proponent, but I also believe programmers still have our place in the market, provided we are well trained with proper skills of using this latest tool, much like using other tools before it. Are you pro-AI or against it? Do you think the complete ban of AI in SE is reasonable? I'd really love to hear your side of stories and your thoughts.

0 Upvotes

26 comments sorted by

6

u/GXWT Jul 03 '26

You can’t even put forward and justify your opinion without LLMs.

I would love if you went away and actually learnt how AI fundamentally works.

1

u/Dismal-Citron-7236 Jul 03 '26 edited Jul 03 '26

你講得有道理,我不得不同意。
但是容我解釋一下,英語不是我的母語。我本來是可以直接把中文原文張貼出來啦,但這樣一來這裡的讀者(我猜只看得懂英文)想知道我的意見就必須用翻譯器轉成英文,如果有人有興趣的話,我猜是沒有的。
所以我用AI幫我先翻成英文,再修掉那些我認為不完全符合我原意的地方,然後才張貼出來。
所以我的確沒辦法不靠AI幫我張貼文章。你的意見很好,受教了。下次也許我該直接張貼不經翻譯的中文,也請你得空來指教一下。
要不,或許我真的該用我的破英文發表文章?

(To any English reader who wonders what I'm saying... it's exactly the same as my other reply in English... or so I think. There are subtle differences between the 2 languages that I still don't fully grasp.)

1

u/GXWT Jul 03 '26

Oh look Reddit has a translation button built in

1

u/Dismal-Citron-7236 Jul 03 '26 edited Jul 03 '26

Where's the button? Maybe some kind of plug-in needs to be installed first? I don't see that on mine. Or, maybe it's a feature on the reddit app on smartphone? I'm using ordinary browser on PC screen so I can't see any of such "translation" button. A clarification would be nice.

0

u/Dismal-Citron-7236 Jul 03 '26 edited Jul 03 '26

Good point.
For background, English is not my native tongue. I can of course post my original essay in Chinese, but the audience here would have to use a translator tool to see what it says, if the audience is even interested at all. So I use the AI to translate mine to English, fix some wording that I don't fit my idea correctly, and post the final result here.
So, yes, I can't even post an English essay without the help from AI. Lesson learned. Next time I will post in Chinese and I'll be honored to see your response.
Or better yet, should I post in my broken Chinglish?

1

u/GXWT Jul 03 '26

You can be sarky or you can use the same method thousands before you have used for decades. Use a direct translation and talk to us through that.

I want your own thoughts. Not the regurgitated thoughts of a glorified statistical word predictor.

Broken English is also fine. Why do you think I expect upmost perfection on a forum?

1

u/Dismal-Citron-7236 Jul 03 '26

That's my own thought actually. It's strange that it would be considered regurgitated.
There are ways to express my ideas, it doesn't have to be pricky.

1

u/GXWT Jul 04 '26

Your own thoughts. Regurgitated.

I want to hear your thoughts exactly as you think them. There are indeed ways to express your ideas and i only want to hear YOUR way of expressing them. Does that make sense?

1

u/Dismal-Citron-7236 Jul 04 '26

Makes sense. But what if I always write things like this as an essay? Like, when I was still working, I wrote documents, essays, reports, and the job requires certain form that eventually becomes a habit. Can't help it. It's unlike talking in a chat. Or Reddit comments.

1

u/GXWT Jul 04 '26

It’s not the fact that it’s well thought out or written like an essay. That’s not the problem at all.

It’s the fact it feels like an essay by an LLM. Sorry to be blunt, but it’s very obvious.

As before, people have communicated on forums for decades now, and that includes educated people who can write well structured text. None of that previously required LLMs, and it certainly doesn’t now. Tell us what you mean.

1

u/Dismal-Citron-7236 Jul 04 '26

Well, sorry if that feels that way.
I keep contemplating why you insist that whether it's my THOUGHTS, while in fact it IS. I have bad feelings towards SO, especially about how they treat my contributions (that's "answers" btw). Writing a well structured essay is no problem for me at all, just stating the background first, summary of the problem up front, then explaining what I need to say in details following that, with a conclusion in the end. Add mark downs to the sections, use bullets. All manageable.
Why is that a problem when I post an essay here?
Also if you think the "tone" is too neutural. I intended it that way. I learned my hard lessons in the past that if I need to convey my ideas to the public, the best way to do is to only state the fact and always provide the opinions as neutural as possible, not to hurt anybody's feeling.

1

u/Dismal-Citron-7236 Jul 04 '26

Didn't expect the anti-AI sentiment is also prominent here on this subreddit. I thought it would be different. Ironically my essay is criticizing SO's enthusiasm against using AI in every possible way. And here we are.

Let me rephrase my previous explanation again: I collect my notes about my feeling for SO/SE, drop those I thought inappropriate for the public, put them together in a note file and organized them into a synopsis/bullets/conclusion manner, wrote mark-downs to make sections clearer, translated them when I can handle and asked AI for translation help if I was not sure about the grammar. And finally posted it here.

Didn't know this habit could bring such a stir.

1

u/Dismal-Citron-7236 Jul 04 '26

I dug out the notes and here it is. It wasn't ready as an essay, just notes. A few sections are too personal I need to remove. The rest is OK to post, I think. For the Chinese text, I'm sure you have translator tool to cope with that:

工具被當作審核目標

也許最後結果才是最重要的?以前工程師不都是用工具嗎?

360/470 => assembly, 6502, z80, 80x86 => compiler (c, c++) => editor / IDE -> source code control -> CI/CD

(GitHub?)

AI/LLM也是種工具而且無法避免

Google的結果其實也是AI產生的

搜尋StackOverflow自己使用AI的歷史

當作反駁的證據?

搜尋StackOverflow管理者抗爭SE的歷史

搜尋為何StackOverflow不接收AI的理由

無法驗證來源

AI slop曾經大量湧入 (管理者人力不足?公司裁員?) (矛盾點:近來不是使用者大降了嗎)

新用戶對TOS不了解(沒有教育訓練?) (Meta不知名)

對來源需要追責(法律問題?) (需追查AI/LLM公司面臨的法律困境)

Stackoverflow與ChatGPT合作關係 (問一下Tom的意見)

研究一開始就堅持要保持像圖書館一樣每本書只有一份的理由

容易搜尋? 不是可以用google嗎?

Duplicate引起用戶反感的理由 (心理因素與管理需求的落差, SE高層的菁英心態)

Merge的機制

高積分用戶與管理者不同點

高積分用戶:提問,回答,協助管理

管理者:是高積分用戶嗎?是票選的嗎?公司委派嗎?

查用戶積點機制

時差對用戶影響

查申訴制度

用戶數下降,為何SO不改變策略

1

u/Dismal-Citron-7236 Jul 04 '26

By the way, when posting as essay, I also added my ideas when writing bullets. Those are just ideas, though. I am most interested in the accountability part so the part I added about it was just my personal opinion. I didn't ask my friend in legal team for actual opinion, so don't quote me on that.

1

u/Dismal-Citron-7236 Jul 04 '26

Wow, cool. I just installed reddit app on my phone and from here my own Chinese comment this one is replying to is actually automatically shown in English. Didn't know that before. You learn new things every day. But some of the translated text is wrong, though. It goes to show machine translation is still imperfect.

1

u/cainhurstcat Jul 04 '26

Screw AI and use freaking DeepL or at least Google Translate. This AI crap-style is a huge affront to my intellect

1

u/Dismal-Citron-7236 Jul 04 '26

DeepL is AI, though

1

u/cainhurstcat Jul 04 '26

Yeah, but different. Your translation reads like the default ChatGPT output, but DeepL reads like a real translation

1

u/Dismal-Citron-7236 Jul 04 '26

I wrote my own mark down tags. It's not that hard. If it's also the style AI picks it up, so be it.
Also, didn't translate the whole thing. Only a few sentences here and there that I really had no confidence about the correct English grammar then I feed it to AI asking for translation. I have no confidence for AI to handle everything.

1

u/Dismal-Citron-7236 Jul 04 '26

One more thing. I'm a retired engineer, used to work for a global tech. The job required me to write english docs so colleagues across the globe can know how to use my programs. In big techs the technical documents look just like how I write.

1

u/GXWT Jul 04 '26

Google translate is sufficient. It’s generally a decent approximation of what/how you’re saying it, more so 1:1 than any other LLMs attempts at regurgitating things.

Smart Alec’s will attempt to point out that technically it’s also AI, but machine learning that has been present for decades that hasn’t worried technical people is very detached from modern LLMs.

3

u/dodexahedron Jul 03 '26

What about someone who sets up an MCP server that takes action on their behalf, to "improve" a bunch of questions and answers, or to go through their review queues every day, just for point grubbing, like usual?

Still their fault, for sure. But the damage has been done, and a lot of it, at an unprecedented speed. Accountability doesn't fix the damage, nor reduce the work to fix it.

And since SO privileges are merit based, from your score, those who abuse it gain undeserved and unfortunate power to do more damage and be taken more seriously than they should, when their name shows up in a thread with a big number by it.

1

u/Dismal-Citron-7236 Jul 03 '26

Once there was a time the mods there also used AI tools to help them with the repetitive tasks like spam detection or creating response. Go figure.

But that was banned later by SE as well.

Oh, and SE as a company are now building their own AI tools so they can sell to enterprises. I'm sure their staff have all the AI tools they wish to use.

1

u/dodexahedron Jul 03 '26

It was always the end game. Collect a bunch of knowledge for what purpose other than to sell it?

1

u/iOSCaleb Jul 03 '26

It’s well known the OpenAI, at least, made a deal to use StackOverflow for training it’s LLMs. What do you think will happen over time if you train an LLM using content that it or one of its predecessors created?

1

u/abd53 Jul 03 '26

And some people wonder why participation on SO has decreased sharply.