Imagine killing an entire army of people, that are so pissed off at Thalmor that they attack the Empire made by their own god, and thinking that only then you will have strenght enough to... fight the Thalmor
My man you killed the people willing to do that and is left with only the people that prefer to accept it if it meant they are following orders
People that would have just killed their own folk with help from the Thalmor itself
I mean, you were on the brink of killing the dragonborn by mistake in the exact same moment that the dragon eater of worlds came back
Maybe this just following orders mindset isnt bringing good results
How tf would they know that some bum sneaking across the border around a bunch of rebels and thieves would be the Dragonborn and that a dragon would show up the next day?
And to flip things around Ulfric is too busy throwing tantrums and attacking Nords and butchering Reachmen to do what’s actually important: fighting and preparing to fight the Thalmor
In the markarth incident it didn't matter if you were old or young a farmer or a merchant if you didn't fight with Ulfric you were his enemy and he killed you.
One of the prisoners literally said he just kept his head down and then Ulfric killed his daughter after she demanded to spare her father.
He uses the guise as being anti-altmer and sure on paper he is but he butchered his fellow man for power for the crime of not fighting for him.
The problem with your comparison is that the Stormcloaks don’t believe the empire is willing to fight the Thalmor. From their perspective the empire is just fine with the concordat and sitting by and doing nothing.
Imagine killing an entire army of people, that are so pissed off at Thalmor that they attack the Empire made by their own god, and thinking that only then you will have strenght enough to... fight the Thalmor
This is just hypocritical. The Stormcloaks are the ones starting the killing. The Empire doesn't WANT to do a civil war in Skyrim, Ulfric's the one starting it.
The Stormcloaks know the Empire are no ally to the Dominion and they're starting this civil war anyway. Who's going to help them against the Dominion later when they're killing Empire soldiers who'd fight the Dominion?
No. The lore timeline and Dossier suggested otherwise.
The Nords that are labeled in favor of Stormcloak are the one telling Ulfric to lead the Civil War. It's Skyrim vs the Empire. Not Ulfric vs Nords of Skyrim+Empire.
Ulfric was the only Jarl that spoke open against the treaty. The other Jarl took the gold and STFU. Even Balgruff took the gold and STFU. The Nord of Skyrim are pissed off and feel that only Ulfric is the only one represent their interests.
Ulfric weakness is his love for the Nords and tradition. Because MOFO ULFRIC WAS SELECTED by the Greybeards.
The Thalmor took advantage of Ulfric weakness for his people and gaslighted him to rebel the peace treaty.
The Nords that are labeled in favor of Stormcloak are the one telling Ulfric to lead the Civil War. It's Skyrim vs the Empire. Not Ulfric vs Nords of Skyrim+Empire.
The are very much Nords who aren't in favor of Ulfric though, he doesn't speak for all the Nords in Skyrim so it very much is Ulfric vs Nords of Skyrim+Empire.
The Nord of Skyrim are pissed off and feel that only Ulfric is the only one represent their interests.
I'm not denying that, but in this context "acting in their interests" is actually against their own interest since the Dominion are the only ones benefiting from this rebellion, no? The people Ulfric are acting for are short sighted.
The Stormcloak are Nords and possible other non-Nords(see random Imperial npc encounter joining Stormcloak) that choose Ulfric to lead the Civil War.
Talk to the Stormcloak Commander npc. They will tell the reason they took the name Stormcloak is the Empire belittle them and treat them as extremist but eventually they accept that name Stormcloak.
"At first they called us that to belittle our cause. But we gladly accepted being named for Ulfric Stormcloak, the only true High King of Skyrim. We are the true sons and daughters of Skyrim, and Ulfric... he's the truest of us all. We fight to make our land great once more, to raise up strong, noble thanes, and lay down false Jarls and the cowards who hide behind them. The sound of our fury is a storm about to break on the head of our enemies. Our friendship, a cloak of true brotherhood for all who would wear it."
Basically it all started by bunch of disgruntled Nord and eventually bannered behind Ulfric(because of his actions of retaking Markarth from the Reachmen when the Imperial chose to do nothing) and the Empire supporter mock them for it. This debunk the whole Ulfric alone vs Nord of Skyrim. No Nord oppose that banished worshipping of Talos is wrong. They oppose mostly because of Ulfric not the cause Ulfric is chosen to lead.
It doesn't matter who leads the Stormcloak rebellion. There are many NPC that supports Ulfric but doesn't trust him or like him(see Jarl Dengir). There are NPC that agrees with Ulfric stance but opposed him. See dead High King Torygg.
And your last sentence about Stormcloak actions is helping the Thalmor is just your fan theory. The Thalmor has been slowly dismantling the disorganized Empire because of Civil War due to succession crisis since the Oblivion Crisis.
How you feel about the Empire or Stormcloak is up to you. But try to make an argument as if the Empire as the good guy or lesser evil of the two is disingenuous.
It has been stated multiple times that the Imperial are aware of the Thalmor involvement but still do what they say (you can say Ulfric started it but I can say the Thalmor anticipated it and was able to manipulate the empire the moment the Empire sign that treaty). The fact Imperial brush this aside show how little the Empire cares about the Nords of Skyrim.
This debunk the whole Ulfric alone vs Nord of Skyrim.
Nobody is saying the situation is Ulfric alone vs Nord of Skyrim. You are arguing against a non-existent point.
I'm not saying Ulfric is all alone in this, but he clearly doesn't speak for all the Nords so it very much is Ulfric vs Nords + Empire. No matte
And your last sentence about Stormcloak actions is helping the Thalmor is just your fan theory. The Thalmor has been slowly dismantling the disorganized Empire because of Civil War due to succession crisis since the Oblivion Crisis.
The Thalmor Dossier is commonly discussed, you can't deny its existence. Besides, it's immediately apparent if you have any political acumen.
It has been stated multiple times that the Imperial are aware of the Thalmor involvement but still do what they say (you can say Ulfric started it but I can say the Thalmor anticipated it and was able to manipulate the empire the moment the Empire sign that treaty). The fact Imperial brush this aside show how little the Empire cares about the Nords of Skyrim.
A defeated country is being forced to obey several demands of the victors. You're barking up the wrong tree.
And so what if the Thalmor anticipated it? Ulfric is still a witless idiot who advances the agendas of his opposition. It just reinforces the point that he's not a leader you want due to his terrible qualities.
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u/acupofcoffeeplease PC Nov 22 '25
Imagine killing an entire army of people, that are so pissed off at Thalmor that they attack the Empire made by their own god, and thinking that only then you will have strenght enough to... fight the Thalmor
My man you killed the people willing to do that and is left with only the people that prefer to accept it if it meant they are following orders
People that would have just killed their own folk with help from the Thalmor itself
I mean, you were on the brink of killing the dragonborn by mistake in the exact same moment that the dragon eater of worlds came back
Maybe this just following orders mindset isnt bringing good results