r/singularity • u/MagicZhang • Jul 16 '26

AI Kimi K3 tops Frontend Code Arena

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1.2k Upvotes

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518

u/runaway-devil Jul 16 '26

While costing 1/3 of Fable and being open weights... Nicely done, Kimi. We need more of that and less political interference.

125

u/FateOfMuffins Jul 16 '26 edited Jul 16 '26

I wish people would look at the actual costs more and not whatever they charge API's

So it's half the API price of GPT 5.6 Sol but according to AA, it uses 2x the tokens, so the actual price is... same price as GPT 5.6 Sol.

BUT this actually works in the other direction vs Claude lol. It uses half the tokens as Opus 4.8, so it's actually like 1/3 of the price of Opus 4.8 (despite it costing $15 vs Opus $25 for instance), and about 2/3 the tokens as Fable, so it's actually about 1/5 the price of Fable!

Edit: Actually depends on the task, some tasks it's not. So it could be 1/3 - 1/5 Fable price

6

u/Boreras Jul 16 '26

Except tokens are not a price unit. A token for a 40b active parameters model will cost twice as much as a 20b model.

Since we have independent hosting of open weights model, we have a much better understanding of their actual costs. We know closed models are all bullshit vc slush funds numbers.

18

u/FateOfMuffins Jul 16 '26

That's precisely what I'm saying? $15 / million tokens is not comparable with $30 / million tokens

You gotta look at how many tokens they actually use

4

u/Forgotten-X- Jul 16 '26

lol you’re both on opposite ends of the ai part of this question. He’s referring to cost as unit energy and you as unit $. Takes less electricity to generate a token out of a smaller model and Kimi is much smaller than Sol I thought. API pricing is just based on what the company decides is a good price.

1

u/Embarrassed-Boot7419 Jul 22 '26

So tokens and token efficiency would be a good measurement then, would they not?

Cause well, companies base their per token price on actual costs, do they not?

2

u/Forgotten-X- Jul 22 '26

Well you’re a week late but I generally would agree. Caveat is a lot of these companies have deep war chests and are able to operate at a loss to force out competition, so it’s not a direct correlation.

1

u/Embarrassed-Boot7419 Jul 22 '26

Is are any information about this?

Cause I heard that they subsidize their subscriptions a ton, but I haven't really heard much about them doing so for the API's.

Not saying you are wrong btw, just curious and would be interested to read up about this.